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Breaking News: Belgium bans all leveraged Forex, CFDs

  • #41
  • Aug 19, 2016 6:02am Aug 19, 2016 6:02am
Ok i am Belgian citizen and this is what i recived from my broker

Kindly be advised that due to the new regulations imposed by the Belgian Financial Services and Markets Authority (FSMA), the distribution of CFDs with leverage to Belgian retail Clients will be prohibited as from the 18th of August 2016.
As you are categorized as a retail Client, in order to continue your collaboration with FXTM, you should have the relevant expertise, experience and knowledge to assess the risks of trading in CFDs and proceed with trading as an eligible professional.
FXTM could consider you as an ‘eligible professional’, if you are able to provide proof for two of the three following requirements:

  1. A statement from any investment firm(s) that you have carried out transactions in significant size in CFDs, of at least 10 lots per quarter over the previous four (4) quarters.
  2. A statement from any investment firm(s) with which you have a portfolio that exceeds 500,000 Euros.
  3. A written email confirmation that you have work experience in the financial sector for at least one year in a professional position, which requires knowledge of the transactions or services in CFDs.

  • #42
  • Aug 19, 2016 7:17am Aug 19, 2016 7:17am
Somebody has to say to our Belgian friends and everyone else involved in all kinds of suspensions concerning Forex trading that:

It is the MONEY itself to blame, NOT the brokers, NOT the advertisements.
It is just the MONEY._
  • #43
  • Aug 19, 2016 9:14am Aug 19, 2016 9:14am
Yep you right,it is all about money
  • #44
  • Aug 20, 2016 12:18am Aug 20, 2016 12:18am
Quoting GaryKb
I'm shocked to when i receive the news yesterday from my broker and i'm still shocked now. After receiving the news i've been looking around for answers and reading the royal decree. And i agree what Lotuscode said. The whole law comes down to the meaning of the word commercialising. Because its stated that its forbidden to commercialising CDF, Forex,... product. On page 47890 in the royal degree it explain the meaning of the word commercialising. What the term commercialising means is presenting the product in anyway to a client that encourage...
Hi Gary,

I am from Belgium too. Do keep us posted on the reply from your broker.
One of my broker has already sent me notice to close account by 31/8 , while the second broker has not reacted yet.

-Z
  • #45
  • Aug 20, 2016 4:36am Aug 20, 2016 4:36am
Quoting Forexia
{quote} Like I said before: {quote} Or get out of Belgium. Lots of nice places to live in Europe or move to Singapore, the best place to trade FX.
Hello Forexia,

why Singapour is the best place to trade FX ?
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #46
  • Aug 20, 2016 10:42am Aug 20, 2016 10:42am
Quoting LDFX
{quote} Hello Forexia, why Singapour is the best place to trade FX ?

I am interested because I do live in Hong Kong which is 16.5% taxes on your earnings is all, why would be Singapour be better ?

all in all a very fair question.
LDFX Trading Ltd
  • #47
  • Edited 8:06pm Aug 20, 2016 11:50am | Edited 8:06pm
Quoting Forexia
{quote} Ok so I was right then. It doesn't matter that you are a Belgian citizen, it's just that brokers in Belgium are not allowed to offer leveraged forex products anymore. So WHY don't you trade with a firm that is NOT from Belgium especially a firm that even qualifies as an MTF which this ban does not apply?
No, you're not right.

From the FSMA page:
Quote
The Regulation applies to derivative contracts distributed to consumers in Belgium, usually from abroad, via electronic trading platforms.

Oh and that has nothing to do with the EU. Call it bureaucracy if you like, but it's actually just the very common problem that people without any experience or background in law usually lack understanding of the law. Even if it's written in their native language ...
  • #48
  • Edited 2:43pm Aug 20, 2016 2:26pm | Edited 2:43pm
I am from Belgium and I too shockingly can no longer trade with my broker.
HOWEVER, THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE IN DUTCH AND FRENCH (TWO MAIN BE LANGUAGES) EXPLICITELY STATES THE "COMMERCIALISATION" ("commercialisering" and "commercialisation"), WHICH GOT INCORRECTLY TRANSLATED TO "DISTRIBUTION". (http://www.fsma.be/nl/Site/Repositor...8_banning.aspx) Is this the same meaning, since I would think commercialisation has more to do with advertising or am I wrong?

Assuming I am wrong:

Quote
The Regulation applies to unlisted, or 'over-the-counter' (OTC) derivatives. It does not apply to derivatives that are admitted to trading on a regulated market or on a multilateral trading facility. The Regulation supplements the distribution ban that was already in force for certain products, such as life settlements (traded life policies) and financial products with a virtual currency as their underlying.

Fuck these hypocritical control freaks. When they can't oversee aka micromanage everything, they use force=power to ban it instead. That's what it's all about. Not protection of their citizens, but lack of control (which is why they specifically target OTC). Democracy they say, I have never seen it. I can not remember ever in my life my voice being heard. Politicians just doing whatever they please. I hate all these psychopaths. Pure dictatorship if you ask me. Unfucking believable this move. They basically spat on every small trader's face. Douchebag illiterate Kris Peeters also said:
Quote
This Regulation contributes to better protection of consumers of financial products. Henceforth, it will be clear to everyone that binary options and other speculative derivatives have no place on the Belgian retail market.

Binary option market makers sure, but the FX market (of which retail is a very BIG CHUNK) as a whole has no place in Belgium? Well, that's funny, considering EVERYTHING ECONOMY RELATED IS LINKED TO CURRENCY WHICH IS AGAIN LINKED TO METALS LIKE GOLD AND SILVER YOU STUPID FUCK! He's basically saying that the GBP drop with the Brexit had no effect on the Britain economy. Stocks? They're nothing compared to currencies. A drop in Facebook can't put your country in a depression you moron. (I really, really believe the average politician is a total illiterate moron with a mask of sanity that merely fakes any semblance of intelligence as they cannot even envision the consequences of their actions...)
Also, their hypocritical face again comes to the surface when you realize they ban binaries BUT not the local casino! And this I don't really mind but actual spot FX, THAT IS THE CHERRY ON THE FUCKING CAKE! Why ban FX/equities and etc. but NOT STOCK TRADING? This is the key of the whole story. Because it's not OVER-THE-COUNTER, AKA THEY CAN PUT THEIR NOSE IN THIS BUSINESS. That's what it's all about, aslong they can put their nose in it like the little pigs they are. FX is way too big of a market to oversee, which drives our little draconian overseers insane. Every year our neighbouring country the Netherlands looks more and more like heaven. I can't stand living in this shithole anymore. (Beer and fries are our so-called pride... Great, two poisons to drink and eat... Worst drink and worst food, jajaja...) I envision that I will be joining the Dutch soon. They even got weed.
  • #49
  • Aug 21, 2016 3:42am Aug 21, 2016 3:42am
This story has sparked my interest for obvious reasons. I am not affected by this development, but I would see this as a dangerous precedent.

I have read the French version of the decree (it's my first language) and it seems clear to me that it has been misinterpreted. I see nothing there that would forbid a broker from having clients from Belgium. It does forbid peddling the product by advertising means that are clearly stated such as bonuses, rebates, cold calling, affiliate programs, etc. It also prohibits the use of credit cards for deposits.

Now, this being said, it would not be surprising to see this act as a deterrent for some, or all brokers. It has happened in a similar way in other parts of the world. The idea is that it is easier to get rid of a few clients from a specific geographical area rather than to have to contend with complicated or ambiguous legislations. The world is vast.
  • #50
  • Aug 21, 2016 4:16am Aug 21, 2016 4:16am
Quoting LDFX
{quote} I am interested because I do live in Hong Kong which is 16.5% taxes on your earnings is all, why would be Singapour be better ? all in all a very fair question.
1) Due to the timezone it's in, you are able to trade in ALL three markets around the clock.

2) Last time I checked, you pay 0 taxes on business income or at least they have a very favourable tax system when it comes to business income especially from trading. You might need to do more research on that.

3) One of the official language is English so you get easier access to international array of economic platforms

4) The country itself is safe, low in crime, and still have relatively lower cost of living when you convert from a stronger foreign currency.
Make your losses in demo. Earn your profits live.
  • #51
  • Aug 21, 2016 4:36am Aug 21, 2016 4:36am
Retailing is going to take off in a significant way as capitalism globalises and deepens. We are still in a relatively early phase of capitalism, a sort of gold rush phase where attempts are being shown to be made to enforce ethics. This law will be reversed as economic conditions, force Belgium to comply. Due in large part to the market place becoming even more competitive for global liquidity.
The road to pipland is arduous and fraught with challenge.
  • #52
  • Aug 21, 2016 4:41am Aug 21, 2016 4:41am
Quoting traider
Retailing is going to take off in a significant way as capitalism globalises and deepens. We are still in a relatively early phase of capitalism, a sort of gold rush phase where attempts are being shown to be made to enforce ethics. This law will be reversed as economic conditions, force Belgium to comply. Due in large part to the market place becoming even more competitive for global liquidity.
I agree Retail FX is not going away. It just needs to be better regulated.
Make your losses in demo. Earn your profits live.
  • #53
  • Aug 21, 2016 7:00am Aug 21, 2016 7:00am
Quoting tradertje4
I am from Belgium and I too shockingly can no longer trade with my broker. HOWEVER, THE ORIGINAL ARTICLE IN DUTCH AND FRENCH (TWO MAIN BE LANGUAGES) EXPLICITELY STATES THE "COMMERCIALISATION" ("commercialisering" and "commercialisation"), WHICH GOT INCORRECTLY TRANSLATED TO "DISTRIBUTION". (http://www.fsma.be/nl/Site/Repositor...8_banning.aspx) Is this the same meaning, since I would think commercialisation has more to do with advertising or am I wrong?
What I do not understand is if it's a wrong translation (which I'm not ruling out), does no broker call the FSMA to get any clarification? Do they really drop "paying" customers so easily? Or is the problem more complicated? As a customer you see their webpage and they're on the hook for advertising? I mean the law is crazy sometimes, so perhaps that is actually all they need to do ...
  • #54
  • Aug 21, 2016 7:11am Aug 21, 2016 7:11am
Quoting JensG
{quote} What I do not understand is if it's a wrong translation (which I'm not ruling out), does no broker call the FSMA to get any clarification? Do they really drop "paying" customers so easily? Or is the problem more complicated? As a customer you see their webpage and they're on the hook for advertising? I mean the law is crazy sometimes, so perhaps that is actually all they need to do ...
I think the brokers do not really care about all the hassle to keep the their very tiny portion of clientelle which is Belgian traders. Probably doesn't matter to them like another poster pointed out... However, I also think that if they don't act now, other (bigger) countries will follow suit soon since the head of the EU is located in Brussels after all. This little (corrupt) country has more power than anyone realizes... I think the EU bureaucrats chose this country/capital for a reason, since not only is it very small (centralization of power), it is also very divided by a major language barrier of north and south. The more divided something is, the easier it is to rule over it.
  • #55
  • Aug 21, 2016 7:55am Aug 21, 2016 7:55am
if Belgium did ban forex trading it must be because the National Belgium Stock exchange
(what ever its real name its so small ) is loosing business.
Seems the stock exchange fellows gave a call to their political buddies and asked for the forex ban.

Centralised markets, the stock exchange like the reserve banks of the world want all the business.

I don't see why a Belgium trader wouldn't just open up an offshore company and trade that way as I don't think
legislation would apply to business . Its one law for the average joe , and another for the big end of town.

Another way is to use get someone overseas to open a brokerage account and operate through a VPN
so as to hide your IP address.. that way they don't know your trading from Belgium.

Traders don't need this crap from governments.
Avoiding paying taxes on profits you generate overseas to your own country is a hassle enough.

best regards
Peter
  • #56
  • Aug 21, 2016 4:25pm Aug 21, 2016 4:25pm
Got an reply from Keytrade and they say that the term commercialisation have a very broad meaning.
They say advertising is one thing, but it also mean that you cannot encourage/incite the customer to buy, open position, close position,... of the product.

They are also seeking advice with their lawyer and the regulator.


Reply from WHS:

"It is perfectly legal to open an account with a foreign branch. Being a company of impeccable reputation, WHS wouldnt suggest the possibility otherwise.
However, on your tax form, you will have to indicate that you possess a foreign account and fill out all the requested details. Since CFDs and Forex are neither subject to any speculation or stock exchange-tax, this should not have any financial consequences, though. "

After i ask them why its legal to open in they foreign branch, they reply:

"It restricts marketing methods for foreign brokers. If you as a client come to us, we feel that we are allowed to open an account."

Eventhough axibroker wil terminate my account at the end of the month WHS can open new account in their foreign branch?
And their reply is not very promising. Becaus they FEEL they allowed to open an account?!


It seems like not one of the brokers know how to interpret this law.
  • #57
  • Edited 5:32pm Aug 21, 2016 4:26pm | Edited 5:32pm
Quoting Maverick1974
I'm from Belgium, what can I do to still be able to trade? I am in shock pfffffffff!
Dont worry its only for binary options and CFD and other derivated products, i'm from Belgium and i may continue regular forex

Si tu lis bien: "Le règlement concerne les dérivés (de gré à gré) non cotés, également appelés OTC (over-the-counter). Les dérivés admis à la négociation sur un marché réglementé ou sur un système multilatéral de négociation ne sont pas visés."
  • #58
  • Aug 21, 2016 5:25pm Aug 21, 2016 5:25pm
Quoting tradertje4
This little (corrupt) country has more power than anyone realizes... I think the EU bureaucrats chose this country/capital for a reason, since not only is it very small (centralization of power), it is also very divided by a major language barrier of north and south. The more divided something is, the easier it is to rule over it.
No need to resort to conspiracy theories:
http://www.europeactive.eu/content/w...capital-europe

@GaryKb:
That would be WHS problem, not yours. Unless you keep your positions open for several days there is nothing you have to worry about except perhaps for changing your broker again.
  • #59
  • Aug 21, 2016 10:53pm Aug 21, 2016 10:53pm
Quoting Fernand
{quote} Dont worry its only for binary options and CFD and other derivated products, i'm from Belgium and i may continue regular forex Si tu lis bien: "Le rglement concerne les drivs (de gr gr) non cots, galement appels OTC (over-the-counter). Les drivs admis la ngociation sur un march rglement ou sur un systme multilatral de ngociation ne sont pas viss."
Hi Fernard,

Which broker do you use? My broker has already sent notice for account closure?

I am from belgium too.

-Z
  • #60
  • Aug 21, 2016 11:18pm Aug 21, 2016 11:18pm
Quoting dalanm
Ok i am Belgian citizen and this is what i recived from my broker Kindly be advised that due to the new regulations imposed by the Belgian Financial Services and Markets Authority (FSMA), the distribution of CFDs with leverage to Belgian retail Clients will be prohibited as from the 18th of August 2016. As you are categorized as a retail Client, in order to continue your collaboration with FXTM, you should have the relevant expertise, experience and knowledge to assess the risks of trading in CFDs and proceed with trading as an eligible professional....
Wow. Just wow.

The Nanny State is in full swing now gentleman. Wait until this cancer spreads.
Do you trade forex on an ECN account? DM me for $4.60/RT at Vantage FX.
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