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Trading without stop-losses

  • #501
  • Jul 6, 2016 12:52am Jul 6, 2016 12:52am
CURRENCY PAIR COMBINATIONS THAT CAN TRADE IN ANY DIRECTION
The problem of trading with or without stop loss can be avoided by combining complementary Forex pairs of the same currency.
Demo the following 1) AUD/CAD - long and AUD/NZD - short 2) EUR/GBP - Long and EUR/JPY - Short. See my live account charts below and note the red equator lines and green market price lines. (From top to bottom: AUD/NZD, AUDC/AD, EUR/JPY, EUR/GBP)
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: AUDNZD M1 (07-05-2016 2232) - with Equator red Line.png Size: 23 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: EURGBP M1 (07-05-2016 2235) with red Equator Line.png Size: 21 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: EURJPY M1 (07-05-2016 2237) with red Equator Line.png Size: 24 KB
Attached Image
Mecrandie
  • #502
  • Jul 6, 2016 7:36am Jul 6, 2016 7:36am
Quoting mecrandie
{quote} Show your own charts for June 23rd, or ad your trade explorer if you really know what you are doing. This forum is for adults only.

By the way fool you can see my LIVE trading accounts attached if you aren't blind you can see them all which includes 23rd of June results. I can tell you I don't have $175 in my live accounts lol
  • #503
  • Jul 6, 2016 10:27am Jul 6, 2016 10:27am
Quoting tradability
{quote} By the way fool you can see my LIVE trading accounts attached if you aren't blind you can see them all which includes 23rd of June results. I can tell you I don't have $175 in my live accounts lol
You know your employers will fire you if you show your face because you are stealing from them. Cheap Monk.
Mecrandie
  • #504
  • Jul 6, 2016 2:54pm Jul 6, 2016 2:54pm
Quoting mecrandie
{quote} You know your employers will fire you if you show your face because you are stealing from them. Cheap Monk.
Like they did you? Is that why you have no money to trade a live account?
  • #505
  • Jul 6, 2016 6:33pm Jul 6, 2016 6:33pm
Quoting tradability
{quote} Very close but you forgot to mention precisely how to do it.
Just like you shared your precise strategy when asked by mlawson71 huh?

Because I'm nice the general gist of it would be to look at buying GBP/USD puts with a right to sell at approx 1.39 and calls with right to buy at approx 1.55 a day or so before the vote. Would have cost $60 and $111 to buy those options (sorry I can't remember which was which as I was just having a look and don't normally trade options). Call option would have expired worthless. Put option would have been worth many times what it was bought for when price was below 1.33. Exact profits and whether you held to expiry or sold in advance could vary, particularly depending on what expiry date you chose for your options and what multiple of options you chose. Per multiple bought you'd lose your $171 if price didn't move much. Prices given here were for options expiring about midnight on the 24th. Options with a slightly longer expiry date should have cost a little bit more.
Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.
  • #506
  • Jul 6, 2016 8:13pm Jul 6, 2016 8:13pm
HELPFUL EXPLANATION OF CALL AND PUT OPTIONS FOR HEDGING
Quoting dab
{quote} Just like you shared your precise strategy when asked by mlawson71 huh? Because I'm nice the general gist of it would be to look at buying GBP/USD puts with a right to sell at approx 1.39 and calls with right to buy at approx 1.55 a day or so before the vote. Would have cost $60 and $111 to buy those options (sorry I can't remember which was which as I was just having a look and don't normally trade options). Call option would have expired worthless. Put option would have been worth many times what it was bought for when price was below...
dab,
Thanks for being nice enough to explain the call and put options hedging details.
Mecrandie
  • #507
  • Jul 6, 2016 8:22pm Jul 6, 2016 8:22pm
FXCM DISCLAIMER ON DEMO ACCOUNTS

Demo Account: Although demo accounts attempt to replicate real markets, they operate in a simulated market environment. As such, there are key differences that distinguish them from real accounts; including but not limited to, the lack of dependence on real-time market liquidity and the availability of some products which may not be tradable on live accounts. The operational capabilities when executing orders in a demo environment may result in atypically, expedited transactions; lack of rejected orders; and/or the absence of slippage. There may be instances where margin requirements differ from those of live accounts as updates to demo accounts may not always coincide with those of real accounts.

How does this suggest that demo accounts are completely unreliable? At worst they serve as a shadows of the real market. Hence demo accounts are used for strategy testing. Most demo accounts usually agree with real accounts on market direction even if they disagree on the size of PaL. For most traders, the critical issue is trading in the right direction for the chosen period.
Mecrandie
  • #508
  • Jul 6, 2016 8:46pm Jul 6, 2016 8:46pm
Quoting mecrandie
FXCM DISCLAIMER ON DEMO ACCOUNTS Demo Account: Although demo accounts attempt to replicate real markets, they operate in a simulated market environment. As such, there are key differences that distinguish them from real accounts; including but not limited to, the lack of dependence on real-time market liquidity and the availability of some products which may not be tradable on live accounts. The operational capabilities when executing orders in a demo environment may result in atypically, expedited transactions; lack of rejected orders; and/or the...

That's what bad traders always say. Hence your lack of proof of a real account traded for a long time and funds withdrawn.
Liquidity providers don't need to take you out of trades on demo's, they don't need to widen spreads on demo's, they don't need to reduce margins on news releases on demo's.
You have no clue what you are saying nor doing, like the 98% of losing traders. If/when you become a winning trader you will have opposing views BUT I am certain that's not within reach for you.
But please do prove me wrong.
  • #509
  • Jul 7, 2016 4:39am Jul 7, 2016 4:39am
Hey... as long as it works for you that's all that matters. I don't hedge but I used to when it was legal in the USA. Being in the USA has so many disadvantages for a trader it's rediculous because of the Barney/Frank laws, but so far thank God I seem to have been able to over come them. Keep the faith and good trading!

Quoting mecrandie
{quote} Thank you Trader Joe for speaking out on this issue. Some self-proclaimed experts have been going crazy about my not using the stop loss tool. I made it clear that I hedge my pairs with each other or by buying commodities hedge options, if I can't figure out the all-time zero line (equator line), which reliably predicts long term market direction. My personal experience with stop loss tool is that is quite often closes out positions prematurely, and has even failed to trigger some times.
Charts never lie! (everyone else does) ... now where's that FF Adult lounge
  • #510
  • Jul 7, 2016 4:43am Jul 7, 2016 4:43am
It depends on how you trade. I can only speak for myself. I could care less what the new's is, in fact these days I hardly spend any time trading at all. I think if you're trading in a fashion that causes worry regarding news times that a trader might rethink his trading methodology. I just wait till my trade is done and close in profits. That's all.

Quoting tradability
{quote} I'm not here to educate you nor do I get paid to educate you and others. With your experience if you haven't figured it out it's best to not trade during news events. Your biggest concern should be what should you do if you have open orders and news is about to be released not you shouldn't trade news events, but a good trader would have known that right. By the way I see your posts on mfb all the time and you seem to get around posting everywhere not that there's anything wrong with it.
Charts never lie! (everyone else does) ... now where's that FF Adult lounge
  • #511
  • Jul 7, 2016 4:44am Jul 7, 2016 4:44am
If a person can't make money in forex they will not make money in put and call options either.

Quoting tradability
{quote} Very close but you forgot to mention precisely how to do it.
Charts never lie! (everyone else does) ... now where's that FF Adult lounge
  • #512
  • Jul 7, 2016 5:02am Jul 7, 2016 5:02am
Quoting TraderJoe
Hey... as long as it works for you that's all that matters. I don't hedge but I used to when it was legal in the USA. Being in the USA has so many disadvantages for a trader it's rediculous because of the Barney/Frank laws, but so far thank God I seem to have been able to over come them. Keep the faith and good trading! {quote}
So what you're saying is you can't hedge in the USA right? But said anything about trading using USA brokers? It seems like an excuse. If one wants to hedge one can find brokers abroad.
  • #513
  • Edited 1:44pm Jul 7, 2016 6:13am | Edited 1:44pm
Quoting joldas
Hello, every one! i have a question that anyone trade without stop-losses, and successed? Trading without stop-loss can be done? has any opinion, plz comment here? thanks.
If u r don't using a stoplosses ur stoploss is 10%-25%DD called stopout.
Knowledge and skills turning to a technology
  • #514
  • Jul 7, 2016 12:20pm Jul 7, 2016 12:20pm
Quoting tradability
{quote} By the way fool you can see my LIVE trading accounts attached if you aren't blind you can see them all which includes 23rd of June results. I can tell you I don't have $175 in my live accounts lol
Cheap Monk,Show your personal account explorer with your posts, not your employer's account. Faceless fool.
Mecrandie
  • #515
  • Jul 7, 2016 4:33pm Jul 7, 2016 4:33pm
Quoting mecrandie
{quote} Cheap Monk,Show your personal account explorer with your posts, not your employer's account. Faceless fool.
I'm not here to please you low life. I am here on business not playing around with 2 cents like you are and besides my small accounts seems like it is more than your life earnings. So go back to you hut and eat mud
  • #516
  • Jul 13, 2016 12:52pm Jul 13, 2016 12:52pm
I don't use Stops, have been trading Forex since 2008 and have NEVER blown out my account. Major traders, hedge funds, banks and other high volume market participants don't use Stops either. The mark of an "amatuer" trader is one who uses Stops. Stops are weapons used by Forex deal desks to take traders out of trades. Some Forex brokers do what is called "stop hunting." The broker manipulates the bid-ask spread momentarily to clear out stops near key price levels.

Have you ever had a stop close your trade out, only to see the price of the currency pair suddenly reverse and go in the directon of your now closed out trade? Very frustrating. 99% of trading book authors always say "set a tight stop on your trades." These authors should receive commissions from Forex brokers for encouraging readers to use "tight stops" in their tradng. Rather than use Stops, new traders should learn how to "hedge" trades with a second trade. Hedges are the best protection of all against blowing up an account. Learn how to hedge your trades, and ignore authors and seminar gurus advice to "always set tight stops." I can teach a trader how to hedge in 30 minutes. It's not difficult to learn.
  • #517
  • Jul 13, 2016 1:30pm Jul 13, 2016 1:30pm
RFM, so please give some tips about hedging. I am really interested.
  • #518
  • Jul 13, 2016 9:32pm Jul 13, 2016 9:32pm
Quoting RFMagus1
I don't use Stops, have been trading Forex since 2008 and have NEVER blown out my account. Major traders, hedge funds, banks and other high volume market participants don't use Stops either. The mark of an "amatuer" trader is one who uses Stops. Stops are weapons used by Forex deal desks to take traders out of trades. Some Forex brokers do what is called "stop hunting." The broker manipulates the bid-ask spread momentarily to clear out stops near key price levels. Have you ever had a stop close your trade out, only to see the...
RFM, Thank you for this mature post. It help clear the the wrong notion about using stop loss being propagated by so self-certified experts.
Mecrandie
  • #519
  • Jul 13, 2016 11:37pm Jul 13, 2016 11:37pm
So everyone that says they don't use a stop loss actually just uses a mental stop and has the discipline (in public at least lol) to close the trade. Nobody actually doesn't use a stop and just holds until it goes your way. If you close manually at a certain point, that's still a stop.

Just remember, it only takes that 1 time!
  • #520
  • Jul 14, 2016 4:10am Jul 14, 2016 4:10am
you can trade w/o stop but not loss
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