Jazz Live debuts

Some money managers and IB has been reaching out to us to share our trades. Thanks folks but let me say this here so everyone can read:

These are the rules.
- We take a profit share on the performance. This profit share needs to be settled at the end of the month via bank transfers mostly as thats the most convenient or paypal if possible. But if the profit fees come into a few ten thousand, the paypal cannot handle that so bank transfer is best . As we go along and build trust, you only need to pay profit share at the end of the quarter.

- The amount of profit share is generally negotiable. We prefer 30% of profits of a month
- There is NO upfront fees. So literally you get first month free. enjoy.
- Profit share of 30% is applicable above hurdle rate. So hurdle rate is the risk free rate of a country 10 year yield. For US it may be 1.5%. So 30% of all profits above 1.5% will be taken as our fee.

This is the general rule. Can vary a bit to accomodate.

We are not trading our personal biases at all. We are trading purely the trading algo. Even we are surprised sometimes at the kind of trades AWTS throws in because they are completely opposite to what some "forex gurus" suggest. So yes your account is being trade by an algo called AWTS.

PS: Please dont ask us to publish our personal trading accounts. Far too many things there and personally we dont want to go out of our way to convince you. Trade with us if you like. You get to trade what you see on the myfxbook link.

Long GBPCHF is now closed at 1.5260 but the potential to run up to 1.5280 and then 1.5330 is present.

Short line on EURAUD at 1.4422 stands with a stop 1.4433 for 1.4360. Aussie strength is building up.

GBPAUD less convincing but a trade exists at 1.8110.

AUDCHF long at .8407 stands for higher levels again as per AWTS indicated fall in CHF strength and AUD strength.

Dont miss out on EURAUD. Its has the potential to fall 100 pips.

We are now up 2% for the day after yesterday 1%. Pickup in volatility driving movements across. Aussie is the currency to watch.

On a long term basis USDJPY is ready to move much higher. Keep a stop at 101.9 and go long for 103.5. This is not part of AWTS but general thoughts on rejection of 102 and constant fall in yen strength

Our fees is very normal when you consider the return profile of Jazz is unmatched by anyone else. Nearly 400 trades and we are making 1% daily without a issue. Take some extra risk and you make 2% or 0.5% if the risk goes wrong The TSS has now improved to 3.95 from earlier 3.8. Next best we found was at 2.9 and they have fallen to 2.8.

https://www.myfxbook.com/portfolio/jazz-live/973479

Its is almost normal for most subs to make their fees back in 5 days of trading and then leave over 8o trading to make profits over 4 months to make some serious cash.
http://jazzforex.com/subscribe/

GBPAUD closed at b/e. Dont hold gbpaud because gbp on AWTS is showing new found traction. We dont know but this could lead GBPUSD to 1.6810 and then 1.6830. We are long gbpjpy.

Existing trades: EURAUD SHORTS,LONG AUDUSD, AUDJPY LONGS AND LONG GBPJPY

Rest are closed.

New GBPUSD trade. Very early play and bit a of a risk but trading with a 20 pips stop loss.

Be long Aussie.

Yen turning here EURJPY gets into the trade copier.

EUR is basing it seems on AWTS. we cut short positions on eur. GBP longs giving good rewards as it was a signalled as a long above posts.

One day before UK inflation hearing. GBP bases and a clear breakout on the strength meter. Every pull back on GBPJPY and GBPUSD and GBPCHF can be bought.

We close trading today with a 3% gain and total returns hit 54%.

https://www.myfxbook.com/portfolio/jazz-live/973479

TSS score at 3.8 (steady and stable) therefore the trading system is working exactly as designed

SQN rising to 2.65 which is good as well

We have started first cum first serve basis MT4 hosting for your MT4 which is using our trade copier.details here:
http://jazzforex.com/subscribe/

Hello,


Great performance over the last 27 days indeed. That said, some points remain highly suspect.

1. Where is your backtest? We absolutely need to see a backtest over several years to get a sense of how the algorithm behaved across various market conditions. Average statistics are poor indicators of system behavior. A few days worth of trading, even out-of-sample, mean little to nothing as far as what to expect in terms of return and maximum drawdown.

2. How much is your system affected by optimization? Your system's description lists at least 3 inputs (trend alerts, order flow, volume) which may be driven, each, by a myriad of parameters (and even some subjective decision-making as it looks like all alerts are not treated equally). This raises some serious concerns as to how much curve-fitting has been put into the system design. The more parameters are present, the weaker the system as the more prone it is to deteriorate as markets change. In fact, you mention "We monitor it all the time to see if there is any market condition which is making it go awry and hairy fairy" (post #79). A pretty telling giveaway. This is simple, if your system is sound, it is not optimized, then you should not worry about its relevance over time. One can only wonder how robust the framework really is here.

3. What about SQN and TSS being flawed benchmarks? You use SQN (and your TSS rehash) as THE benchmark to compare system performance. I am seriously questioning your mathematical understanding of the concepts that you use. You are clearly stating that "The avg win to Avg loss is what defines a system internal quality. Any system with this ratio above 1 means the system is deploying adequate risk management." (post #24) or "In forex trading, it is absolutely vital to have risk to reward on a trade as well above 1." (post #42) This could not be further from the truth. Risk/reward means absolutely nothing when not coupled with its related win rate. I could show you a hundred systems with high win rates and low risk/reward way under 1 that perform perfectly well. If you do not master the basics, how could one trust you with your system being the "most advanced evolved trading system in the world"?As a so-called institutional provider, you should know better. Or maybe you do... maybe you know that SQN is well known to be heavily biased by numerous trades which so happens to be a key characteristics of your system. But that's not all, your so-called "benchmark" is further enhancing your performance ranking as your TSS is multiplying again the SQN by your Avg.Win/Avg.Loss ratio which you know is high (oh, coincidence). No wonder you take the first spot. As far as providing a scale for assessing TSS, since this is not a normalized metrics, any system with a high N will rank high, everything else being equal. You keep boasting about other systems not matching your performance, but just for kicks, I computed it on one of my systems which I have traded for 6 years now, I got 15.5. Yes, this is ridiculous.

Again, this is all ground-zero of trading, 101 maths here, a simple first order partial derivative over N and AvgW/AvgL shows how undeniably biased your TSS is. I can't believe (if this is true) that CTAs, brokers and institutional clients are falling for it.

4. Why on earth would you sell signals after 7 years of trading your own system? Wait a minute, let's take your basic assumptions. You mentioned about 5-8% return per month (say 6.5%) and let's assume that it's the risk aversion that drove your 7 years of personal trading with the $50,000 that your test account started with (which by the way is NOT verified by myfxbook). You should have just short of $10,000,000 on your account by now. Why on earth would you go through the hassle of taking clients, let alone retail? Maybe because you have not traded the same "world's most evolved system". Maybe because it is the n-th iteration of the same failure for the same exact reason as mentioned in 2.

Now things start to look a little bit more objective and clearer, right?

Princeton
Good points. Lets take them point by Point

1. Answered in our FAQ. No backtest are published. No personal statements published. It what you see on myfxbook. Backtest are just a waste because they can be fiddled. They are what are used to do curve fitting. We prefer the system to be out in the open in full public view which serves as a day to day backtest. People can roll back this forum and see from the day we started we have putting nearly every trade here on the forum. But if some money manager managing serious cash needs to fill his tick mark in the investment form for that he needs 10 year backtest and personal statements, we are happily sending them over. A backtest test becomes valid test if 300 trades are completed. You can easily look at 400 trades of the last 27 days and see the live backtest. All you need is 300 trades to see the effectiveness of any system. We are now 400 trades old. So that is a more effective backtest where in it is live and in public view

2. Curve fitting is what happens when you BACTEST and twist the system around to get a "wanted/desired" result. Its dangerous and used many EA providers selling crap. We have not done any curve fitting. We have completed 400 trades and it should clearly evident that there is NO curve fitting. Curve fitting system will fall apart in 100 to 150 trades. We monitor it all the time to see if there is any market condition which is making it go awry and hairy fairy" So? Yes any system after 100 years of trading can still be presented by a situation which it has never seen. This is a system that learns itself and remembers market events. We are not promising you the moon here. Lets be clear. Any system is flawed. This too. We need to manage and b e on the lookout all the time. If you think you have the perfect system, you are sadly mistaken. All system will have drawdown and all systems will have bad trades.

3. SQN: There are valid points concerning SQN and TSS being biased to higher number of trades (N). This is a valid drawback. But on the other hand, a system which has traded for N trades which is greater than N-100 trades of any other system and yet maintains a "quality" should deserve a higher rating. For example a trader who has been trading 1000 trades has seen a lot of cycles in the market and so his rating should include the fact that he is survivor through more cycles than a guy who comes around with 100 trades. We are open to better metrics if you have one.

"I computed it on one of my systems which I have traded for 6 years now, I got 15.5. Yes, this is ridiculous."
Show us the myfxbook. You will be ranked higher. I hope you have cleared out all other symbols other than forex because myfxbook makes a hash of other symbols like SP500 etc.

Why on earth would you sell signals after 7 years of trading your own system?
4. Money: Answered as first question in our FAQ page. To make money. Its called cashing the system. Why else would any forex provider sell signals? make more money and more money. whether 10mil or 100 mil, any trader will want to test the sizing of a market. We want to see how big is the retail AUM when it comes to be given a quality system. If 1000 retail trades an average of $10k, it puts the combined AUM is sizeable . We are not yet disappointed at the response. At the same time we are accepting money managers as well. Keen to give them a try. Retail Traders have nothing to complain because they are making money faster than they have ever done. You will not see our subs complaining of the last 27 days.

Your questions while are good for discussions should focus on the performance of the last 4 weeks.

You should look at daily returns divided by the DD %. Its probably highest for any signal provider currently active. Daily returns is 1.5% and DD is 14%. No system can make 1% a day without going into some serious DD. Your questions are valid but I hope answered you.

Volatility dipping once again. Trades are few in number given hardly any volatility. Stay out of the system when vol meter says to do that.

AUDJPY and EURUSD are two trades open.
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http://copier.jazzforex.com

Yesterday late into NY we closed down GBPJPY trades which ensured a great return day = 2.9%.

The returns for aug stand at 27% and we are only 10 trading days into Aug.

In July, we made 25% but we started on 15th. So the system is maintaining its very high daily run rate.

Leaving aside all other metrics, even the simple daily returns divided by DD is a great way to measure the effectiveness of a system. We are making a 1.5% a day return and we are still maintaining that run rate after 414 trades into the system

New USDCAD trade added. Pickup in CAD volatility and AWTS warning it.

Closed AUDJPY for 0.8% gain while EURUSD was closed at breakeven

Open trades include CADJPY and USDCAD.

Slowly as London gets closer to opening, volatility picking up.

https://www.myfxbook.com/portfolio/jazz-live/973479

Returns cross 55% overall and 28% for aug

Since we began, every trade has been put up publicly and this is probably an occassion where a trader is on a live basis showing a backtest and why the system is superior. Cannot do curve fitting and run away when the stage is live

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An email we received from a client
How much should we start with?


Here our answer:
Assume you make 10% a month. We are currently making 25% a month but for safety assume you make 10%. Then 10% of 10k will be $1000 per month. So four months willbe $4000. We are not compound the profits but that will only add the profits. So base case without any compounding and taking any extra risk, you end up making easily $4000 on a $10000 account in 4 months.
Fees: $950 per 4 months

$4000 - $950 (fees.) = approx $3100 your profit.

So with 10k you can make 31% a return in 4 months on conservative basis net of fees.

Therefore I believe 10k is a good amount to start with. The greater the capital the more the returns. Then profits will add slowly to your balance. We believe a person starting with 10k should easily hit 20k capital base in less than 1 year with out taking any extra risk.
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