Jacob, Skenobi answered but I have to ask you too..do you trade Futures and what is your take on it vs spot Forex...are they better or worse in terms of making money daytrading? (because of the ability to see depth of market)
Is anyone here an institutional trader?
{quote} It is some very interesting information that you and Skenobi is relating here. From a psychological and fysiological perspective i think to work with something like that for 6 hours a day, 5 days a week is about enough. More then so is truely detrimental to physique and mental processis. Meaning to work that much as you did makes you a worse and worse trader. Of course you learn more and more and just hope your learning curve can compensate for your worsening physical and mental condition. I see, based on this information, just as i thought...
- #503
- Edited 5:45am Jul 18, 2014 1:42am | Edited 5:45am
- Joined Jul 2010 | Status: Determined | 5,346 Posts
{quote} What did you just smoked???
My signature is: "Classified".
- #507
- Edited 10:06pm Jul 20, 2014 9:55pm | Edited 10:06pm
- Joined Oct 2007 | Status: Former institutional dogsbody | 1,253 Posts
Hi Skenobi & JacobFordFX, What is it that you have (as an institutional trader) that you no longer posses now (as a retail trader)? Something you consider as an edge I mean it could be something like tools, ability to view order flow,etc. etc.
Nope... my edge hasn't gone missing... it's still there.
And btw, I would not consider the "ability to view order flow" as an edge. More of a crutch, to be honest.
In any case, "the ability to view order flow" does not necessarily translate into the "ability to make money from order flow".
(To any who asks, no I will not explain myself on those last points. I think I've already explained enough in the earlier posts of this thread, if I'm not mistaken.)
I'm not trying to convince anyone. I'm not in the "convincing" business.
- #508
- Jul 20, 2014 10:33pm Jul 20, 2014 10:33pm
{quote} *checking pockets for my edge*
So ... in general, do you think institutional and retail trader have a fifty-fifty chance to succeed?
i worshipped... Momentum
- #509
- Jul 20, 2014 10:58pm Jul 20, 2014 10:58pm
- Joined Oct 2007 | Status: Former institutional dogsbody | 1,253 Posts
I'm not trying to convince anyone. I'm not in the "convincing" business.
- #510
- Edited Jul 21, 2014 12:50am Jul 20, 2014 11:07pm | Edited Jul 21, 2014 12:50am
- Joined Jul 2011 | Status: Winning | 1,859 Posts
I can approach that question from a few different angles. To save time, give me your own points why you want to become one, and I will shoot down each point one by one.
I just saw this post, and I know it's a little outdated, but I found this to be very, very funny (and yet true)
I have tried my hand at professional trading (daytrading, prop firm, to be specific), not exactly market making or creating the spreads, but REAL trading.
And as you have suggested, it is NOT easy, and it is NOT for everyone!
But then again, I am almost too aggressive to the extent that it hurts me almost every time... lol. Can you say greed, or what?!
Still, after all these years (I dunno, 5'ish, maybe?)... I still have a lot to learn.
But do not be mistaken. I am determined to succeed and I will do so eventually. Never quit, don't tolerate BS or be bullied, and learn, learn, learn, as much as you can. Knowledge is power, my friends!
Unfortunately I am no longer a daytrader, but I learned a lot from it, sharpened my skills and technical strategy, and would like to return to it as soon as my FX trading becomes a bit more stable.
Of course, your comments Skenobi would be very welcomed.
Please check out my blog at https://from-zero-to-hero . net
- #511
- Edited Jul 21, 2014 12:57am Jul 20, 2014 11:18pm | Edited Jul 21, 2014 12:57am
- Joined Jul 2011 | Status: Winning | 1,859 Posts
*checking pockets for my edge*
I know how to read order flow, but I can't make money from it. I'd rather trade the technicals.
But then again, the top traders at my old prop firm were stellar tape readers and relied on it solely. I don't know how, exactly... you need to be able to process information VERY fast.
And I always thought that I could... but apparently, I'm still not fast enough... at least yet.
But making money studying order flow CAN be done. It's just very hard, imho.
Anyways, these guys were all-stars. Tape reading ONLY, find the held bids and offers, go long or short accordingly, and be OUT about 5 minutes later with an easy $0.50/share, maybe 20k shares average. These guys made millions each year and that is trading very modestly.
I can only hope to get to that point someday.
Thank you, and I am very much looking forward to your response, Skenobi!
Please check out my blog at https://from-zero-to-hero . net
- #512
- Jul 21, 2014 1:07am Jul 21, 2014 1:07am
- Joined Jul 2011 | Status: Winning | 1,859 Posts
So you want to be an institutional trader because you want to make a lot of money. Money from what? From trading? From management fees? The Banks won't give you that expensive office chair, a phone bank, some squawk boxes and a Bloomberg terminal and pay you big money bonuses for nothing. You have to PERFORM, and if you don't perform, you get fired. The only way to make money from trading FX for an employer Bank is from the bonuses. You earn the big money bonuses by making sure you exceed your annual profit-taking targets. These targets increase...
This man speaks the truth, and seems to be very honest and nice. I would listen to him if you are considering a career in trading/daytrading/gambling lol (like me)/investing/management/prop firms/whatever, because I know and I agree with him, and I have been doing it for 5 years and still trying to make it work.
I am now very anxious as to what he will say about my personal history with trading
The one thing you MUST not tell me, though (I will warn you): is to give up.
I do not say this often, or ever, but God Bless you sir.
Please check out my blog at https://from-zero-to-hero . net
- #513
- Jul 21, 2014 10:36am Jul 21, 2014 10:36am
- Joined Oct 2007 | Status: Former institutional dogsbody | 1,253 Posts
Thank you, and I am very much looking forward to your response, Skenobi!
I'm afraid I don't (or no longer) provide feedback on the following:
1. other people's career choices in life, or career progression,
2. other people's trading methods,
3. other people's Systems threads on Forex Factory,
4. (this list is non-exhaustive)....
Over the years, I've been asked the above topics privately many times by FF members who will go ahead and continue to do their own thing anyway regardless of my feedback (and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that).
I also don't...:
1. teach an edge,
2. coach,
Interestingly, none of the junior Bank traders (now seasoned traders in their own right) I developed in the past had traded the same way as me. Even I don't trade the same way as my past mentors.
Long story short: I'm just tired, that's all. I only hang around the FF forums to vent some steam, with a secondary objective of sometimes learning new trading insights from non-institutional types who are uncorrupted by bad institutional trading habits.
What I CAN say forms the common underlying theme of my feedback: If you're continually losing more money than you're making, time to do somethin' else.
I'm not trying to convince anyone. I'm not in the "convincing" business.
- #515
- Jul 29, 2014 9:12pm Jul 29, 2014 9:12pm
- Joined May 2014 | Status: My Ideas Are Just That -- Ideas | 4,473 Posts
Fireworks are fun ... as long as you don't blow your fingers off.
Hi all
just to let you know ( see my posts in may) that i am still short and that 65% of retails are long( look bottom home page here) .
Isn't that the holy grail i was talking about ??
Ok it goes slow and boring but down More than 350 pips, that's in the basket so far .
My target is way lower but have now a stop in huge positive territory
just to let you know ( see my posts in may) that i am still short and that 65% of retails are long( look bottom home page here) .
Isn't that the holy grail i was talking about ??
Ok it goes slow and boring but down More than 350 pips, that's in the basket so far .
My target is way lower but have now a stop in huge positive territory
- #519
- Aug 14, 2014 6:41pm Aug 14, 2014 6:41pm
- Joined Oct 2007 | Status: Former institutional dogsbody | 1,253 Posts
{quote} Just finished watching "Spartacus" three seasons in a week. .
I'm not trying to convince anyone. I'm not in the "convincing" business.