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Why Simple is better in trading and Complex is not

  • #161
  • Nov 22, 2013 1:27pm Nov 22, 2013 1:27pm
Quoting TEB63
{quote} you said you trade on one chart - how do you trade
Are ok .

As the title of the thread suggests .simplify the huge amount of information.

I take all the participants positions and interest. Translate that information onto one time frame and only work on one pair.cable.i prefer to trade the most upto date information with concidration to the oower of larger interest.there are converged price points were market will react.regardless .averages of price are the most honest indication of price.
  • #162
  • Nov 22, 2013 1:33pm Nov 22, 2013 1:33pm
Quoting Forexgogo
{quote} If you make a big deal of candlestick formations (ig pin bars, engulfing ones, inside bars), it would be easier checking different time frames... Just my humble opinion....
If you combine that information.ie your pins and patterns into one time frame you will see the whole picture.the so called stop hunts ect.you will see the price do nothing more than collecting orders in its endless desire to find liquidity.albeit if allowed minipulated but only on occasion
  • #163
  • Nov 22, 2013 1:47pm Nov 22, 2013 1:47pm
Quoting diceman555
{quote} If you combine that information.ie your pins and patterns into one time frame you will see the whole picture.the so called stop hunts ect.you will see the price do nothing more than collecting orders in its endless desire to find liquidity.albeit if allowed minipulated but only on occasion
You sound pretty profound... (I'm no sarcastic). The way you read charts is vastly different from my way.
The thing is, I 'm not trying to get "the whole picture," but just hoping to spot a nice entry or two on charts. That is all.
(of course I'm aware of stop hunts around the big numbers).

Like you said, it all depends on your persona -- everyone has their own way.
  • #164
  • Nov 22, 2013 1:55pm Nov 22, 2013 1:55pm
The 200 ema is mentioned in many places on these forums .concider being afforded the 200 ema converged to mutiple timeframe aversges with the addition of a level allowing for drift of 10 to 13 or 14 pips.especially you guys trading 1 and 4 hour frames.its possible .if you combine the static with the lower tf moving u have all the information you need.i only wish I had the mindst to trade larger periods of time.or I should say a segment of price
  • #165
  • Nov 22, 2013 1:58pm Nov 22, 2013 1:58pm
Quoting diceman555
{quote} If you combine that information.ie your pins and patterns into one time frame you will see the whole picture.the so called stop hunts ect.you will see the price do nothing more than collecting orders in its endless desire to find liquidity.albeit if allowed minipulated but only on occasion

Interesting - I see it quite differently
I do not see one market at all but many
ie, Countries we see on the month charts - ie. interest rate decisions
on the week we see companies like GM or Nike hedging
on the day chart we see the banks and brokers positions.
on the 4 hour we see the pros.
below are "non pro"

each of them are different and trade for different reasons
so I to not see how I can see the full market from one chart
I think you are likely seeing your brokers charts and reasons for trading

lets say you are trading on the 1 hour or 15 min

but lets say your broker is moving down on the pound for what ever reason - the trend is strong
But you are coming into strong Support/Demand on the weekly charts
and a big trader for GM wants to hedge on the week charts - and you are going to be ambushed and you will never see it coming

or say your Broker is pushing in an uptrend
Again you hit a resistance/supply in a down trend for the pro on the 4 hour - you are dead in the water .

a lot of times what you call stop hunting - is the 1st run from a higher time frame to change direction.
in fact its a test not stop hunting at all
  • #166
  • Nov 22, 2013 2:06pm Nov 22, 2013 2:06pm
Quoting diceman555
The 200 ema is mentioned in many places on these forums .concider being afforded the 200 ema converged to mutiple timeframe aversges with the addition of a level allowing for drift of 10 to 13 or 14 pips.especially you guys trading 1 and 4 hour frames.its possible .if you combine the static with the lower tf moving u have all the information you need.i only wish I had the mindst to trade larger periods of time.or I should say a segment of price
EMA200 on 1h is not the same as EMA2400 on 5m, or even EMA800 on 15m. They can be similar, but not the same.
So, if I want to get EMA200 on 1h, I check on 1h. If EMA200 on day, I open a daily chart.

If you are saying lower timeframe can cover higher timeframe, I would not agree.
  • #167
  • Nov 22, 2013 2:14pm Nov 22, 2013 2:14pm
Quoting TEB63
{quote} Interesting - I see it quite differently I do not see one market at all but many ie, Countries we see on the month charts - ie. interest rate decisions on the week we see companies like GM or Nike hedging on the day chart we see the banks and brokers positions. on the 4 hour we see the pros. below are "non pro" each of them are different and trade for different reasons so I to not see how I can see the full market from one chart I think you are likely seeing your brokers charts and reasons for trading lets say you are trading on the 1 hour...
Exacty .were on the same page
  • #168
  • Nov 22, 2013 2:21pm Nov 22, 2013 2:21pm
Quoting Forexgogo
{quote} EMA200 on 1h is not the same as EMA2400 on 5m, or even EMA800 on 15m. They can be similar, but not the same. So, if I want to get EMA200 on 1h, I check on 1h. If EMA200 on day, I open a daily chart. If you are saying lower timeframe can cover higher timeframe, I would not agree.
Ill answer quickly before my bat runs out im mobile.its not the fixed point.its the converged point .longer term interest collides with short term money .this point can be located within a 10 pip stop.your misunderstanding me.the static point converged to the lower time frame moving average
  • #169
  • Nov 22, 2013 2:31pm Nov 22, 2013 2:31pm
Quoting diceman555
{quote} Ill answer quickly before my bat runs out im mobile.its not the fixed point.its the converged point .longer term interest collides with short term money .this point can be located within a 10 pip stop.your misunderstanding me.the static point converged to the lower time frame moving average

You see I do not agree at all - you are tying the two together.
I would say the Big money - could care less about the small money
ie. anymore then an elephant would care what way the dug beetle was traveling
but the dug beetle would care a great deal which way the elephant was moving
and for a few reasons - lol
(1) one not to get stepped by the elephant
(2) second to take the wife out for supper lol

in case you miss what I am saying we are the dug beetle lol
( but do not tell my wife )
  • #170
  • Nov 22, 2013 2:31pm Nov 22, 2013 2:31pm
Quoting diceman555
{quote} Ill answer quickly before my bat runs out im mobile.its not the fixed point.its the converged point .longer term interest collides with short term money .this point can be located within a 10 pip stop.your misunderstanding me.the static point converged to the lower time frame moving average
OK, sorry about misunderstanding. I just stick to multiple timeframes anyways...
  • #171
  • Nov 22, 2013 2:35pm Nov 22, 2013 2:35pm
As the original creator pretty much of the 200ema, give up on the 200ema, sorry, it looks great after, but live and real time, nothing but misery, sorry all.


Here is my method, but simplified, just the main lines, entries are where the arrows are, you'll get the idea.


The hard part is taking the entry, cause all entries look like it'll turn down, but most don't so it's got a pretty high win rate and a 1:2 RR easy

M5 only on this 1, you'd have to tweaks the ranges and ma's to cope with other TF's.
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Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #172
  • Nov 22, 2013 3:21pm Nov 22, 2013 3:21pm
Quoting TEB63
{quote} You see I do not agree at all - you are tying the two together. I would say the Big money - could care less about the small money ie. anymore then an elephant would care what way the dug beetle was traveling but the dug beetle would care a great deal which way the elephant was moving and for a few reasons - lol (1) one not to get stepped by the elephant (2) second to take the wife out for supper lol in case you miss what I am saying we are the dug beetle lol ( but do not tell my wife )
Your not understanding the point thats in question. To simplify. The big elephant finds the most fertile point of growth.the smaller eventually migrate to the feeding ground.the relationship is UUnfoundedTHE CONVERGED AVERAGE POINT IS THE ONLY KEY THAT OPENS THE DOOR
  • #173
  • Nov 22, 2013 3:25pm Nov 22, 2013 3:25pm
Quoting diceman555
{quote} Your not understanding the point thats in question. To simplify. The big elephant finds the most fertile point of growth.the smaller eventually migrate to the feeding ground.the relationship is UUnfoundedTHE CONVERGED AVERAGE POINT IS THE ONLY KEY THAT OPENS THE DOOR
When you get to your computer, please upload one of your charts. I'm sure it will explain your point right away. Please do.
  • #174
  • Nov 22, 2013 3:37pm Nov 22, 2013 3:37pm
Quoting diceman555
{quote} Your not understanding the point thats in question. To simplify. The big elephant finds the most fertile point of growth.the smaller eventually migrate to the feeding ground.the relationship is UUnfoundedTHE CONVERGED AVERAGE POINT IS THE ONLY KEY THAT OPENS THE DOOR

I am in fact not really sure what you are saying -

But I would say - using this ill.
The elephant needs no converges - A country or company when they move they need no help and there is no way to stop them other then a bigger elephant.

what I am saying it is not a partnership of the elephant and the hug beetle - you do not need the two to open the door
The elephant knocks it down (and make no mistake a trend change is a knock down of a door)
the elephants needs nothing !!
the dug beetle is smart to follow and not get killed lol
  • #175
  • Nov 22, 2013 3:50pm Nov 22, 2013 3:50pm
Quoting Turveyd
As the original creator pretty much of the 200ema, give up on the 200ema, sorry, it looks great after, but live and real time, nothing but misery, sorry all. you'd have to tweaks the ranges and ma's to cope with other TF's. {image}
I don't know if my way is relevant here, but FYI...

First off, I don't play with EMA200 on 5m. Only 1h, 4h, day, and week.
Say, 1h. I use 15m and put EMA800 and stoc. When a bar touches and closes on EMA 800, I check if stoc turns or not. If it does, I expect it to bounce, then I enter.
SL is tight -- pretty close to EMA.

Hope it helps
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  • #176
  • Nov 22, 2013 4:17pm Nov 22, 2013 4:17pm
Quoting Forexgogo
{quote} I don't know if my way is relevant here, but FYI... First off, I don't play with EMA200 on 5m. Only 1h, 4h, day, and week. Say, 1h. I use 15m and put EMA800 and stoc. When a bar touches and closes on EMA 800, I check if stoc turns or not. If it does, I expect it to bounce, then I enter. SL is tight -- pretty close to EMA. Hope it helps {image}

Let me understand what you are doing
1. so when you have unity on the number of other higher TF
2. Price does a move against trend
3. then price move back to higher trend confirmed by the Stoch ?
why would this not work? its simply -trend then retracement - right ?

I never used the 200 this way but I did use the 50 ema stoch this way and I can say it works
what we are really doing is having two time frames on the chart
the 200 ema is the higher time frame & the shoch is the lower time frame


by the way 50 ems on the 15 min is the same as the 200 on the hour and the same as the 800 on the 4 hour
for price spot and R/S will be spot on- if charts are consistent - Oanda you will have a small issue in how they do charts but it will not matter
but it will not be for angle - so you have no way to judge strength
  • #177
  • Nov 22, 2013 4:37pm Nov 22, 2013 4:37pm
Newbies with there high TF's and believing in indicators LOL
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #178
  • Edited 5:00pm Nov 22, 2013 4:44pm | Edited 5:00pm
TEB63
Let me respond one by one.

Quoting TEB63
1. so when you have unity on the number of other higher TF
Kind of. I just want to see EMA200 of 1h on 15m. It approximately EMA800 on 15m, right? (I often check on 1h chart if the EMA is correct).
So, it is for the sake of convenience.

Quoting TEB63
2. Price does a move against trend
I'm not sure what you are talking about, but I completely ignore the trend in this case. I just purely want to catch a bounce at EMA.

Quoting TEB63
3. then price move back to higher trend confirmed by the Stoch ? why would this not work? its simply -trend then retracement - right ?
Again I'm not sure what you are talking about, but I use stoc only to see if it turns. OK here is my assumption: when the stoc turns around, the price turns around. Of course, this is not science and very much "my assumption." But probability is not bad. So I just use a stoc turn as a beacon. I don't use stoc for any other purpose. I really don't care how high/low (above/below 80%) it is -- I don't believe stoc corresponds with actual oversold or overbought.

Quoting TEB63
I never used the 200 this way but I did use the 50 ema stoch this way and I can say it works
I used to do EMA50 with stoc. I've read "cornflower thread" and like it. I know you were there.

Quoting TEB63
Oanda you will have a small issue in how they do charts but it will not matter but it will not be for angle - so you have no way to judge strength
I know... I use two other brokers to compare charts.
  • #179
  • Edited 5:19pm Nov 22, 2013 4:46pm | Edited 5:19pm
Quoting Turveyd
Newbies with there high TF's and believing in indicators LOL
Meaning?? If you are talking about me, it's ok, you can deride me as much as you want. I don't mind, really.
All I want here is productive discussion with successful traders. Nothing more and I don't bother all others. Maybe you need a little better luck, no?
  • #180
  • Nov 22, 2013 6:38pm Nov 22, 2013 6:38pm
Quoting Forexgogo
{quote} Meaning?? If you are talking about me, it's ok, you can deride me as much as you want. I don't mind, really. All I want here is productive discussion with successful traders. Nothing more and I don't bother all others. Maybe you need a little better luck, no?

lots of great trades use tools
50 or 200 MA or Macd or BBands most common

I really do not know what he was saying either
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