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Firebird EA, please test this one, it is one of the greats

  • #241
  • Jun 22, 2006 7:47am Jun 22, 2006 7:47am
Quoting Yardie
Yep got hit with 8 losses from the European/Asian sessions as well. Looking to see how the US session trades perform today. If they have another good day then I will edit the EA to trade US session only.

I bet Wackena's settings is good for no losses. But isnt the floating loss very big?
I think it is important to see how it performs over a much longer period without tweaking things after every bad move. I guess it has answered my question about how it handles the big moves and if the USD keeps strengthening then my demo account will be history in one day. Just goes to show that a system can look really great sometimes then completely blow up.

That's not to say that it doesn't have potential and I am certainly no expert.

Regarding Wakena's settings. I have one position that is pretty close to becoming a loser. In addition to 4 others that are negative. If all of those turn into losers then yes it will be a problem. So far though the total floating loss still leavs me with substantial profit - ie. 50% of my total gross profit for the week.

Wiz.
  • #242
  • Jun 22, 2006 8:31am Jun 22, 2006 8:31am
Hey Wizard I agree with you about the longer time period. But Hendrick's data for the past 2 weeks or so is showing that most winning trades are in the US Session. I am using demo so I am looking to see how it goes. I am staying the course for now to see how it behaves.

So far 11 straight losses and counting today using Hendrick's settings.

Quoting The Wizard of Oz
I think it is important to see how it performs over a much longer period without tweaking things after every bad move. I guess it has answered my question about how it handles the big moves and if the USD keeps strengthening then my demo account will be history in one day. Just goes to show that a system can look really great sometimes then completely blow up.

That's not to say that it doesn't have potential and I am certainly no expert.

Regarding Wakena's settings. I have one position that is pretty close to becoming a loser. In addition to 4 others that are negative. If all of those turn into losers then yes it will be a problem. So far though the total floating loss still leavs me with substantial profit - ie. 50% of my total gross profit for the week.

Wiz.
  • #243
  • Jun 22, 2006 11:45am Jun 22, 2006 11:45am
A bumpy day. On my live account on eur/usd, gbp/usd, usd/jpy & usd/chf.

I swtiched it to M5 on the charts midday (EST) yesterday June 21,

Trade closings dated June 22. 9 wins and 2 losers. Net Pip gain/loss = (-60)

eur/usd - 3 wins & no loss
gbp/usd - 2 wins & 1 loss
usd/jpy - 2 wins & 1 loss
usd/chf - 2 wins & no loss

As of 12:30 EST - 6 open trades

eur/usd - 1
gbp/usd - 2
usd/jpy - 2
usd/chf - 1

Wackena<!-- / message -->
  • #244
  • Jun 22, 2006 12:21pm Jun 22, 2006 12:21pm
Quoting The Wizard of Oz
I think it is important to see how it performs over a much longer period without tweaking things after every bad move. I guess it has answered my question about how it handles the big moves and if the USD keeps strengthening then my demo account will be history in one day. Just goes to show that a system can look really great sometimes then completely blow up.

That's not to say that it doesn't have potential and I am certainly no expert.

Regarding Wakena's settings. I have one position that is pretty close to becoming a loser. In addition to 4 others that are negative. If all of those turn into losers then yes it will be a problem. So far though the total floating loss still leavs me with substantial profit - ie. 50% of my total gross profit for the week.

Wiz.
Hi Wizard!

What goes for real life certainly applies to Forex: "it's not all skittles and beer" (I'm Dutch and learned this phrase a long time ago at school. Never thought I could used it in something like this Forum!). What we really need is some kind of money management in Firebird. Among other things, start with small lot sizes and as your account grows start using larger ones. It will certainly prevent you from blowing up your account. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o> </o>
  • #245
  • Jun 22, 2006 2:12pm Jun 22, 2006 2:12pm
A major problem I see with Firebird is that it does not average the trades. If it averaged properly the large trending moves would not be as bad.

The Firebird document states, in the examples section, picture 3,

"In this example the trade goes against us.
After going long in the yellow circle the price keeps dropping.
Every 30 pips the price drops Firebird buys another lot.
The 4th lot is bought in the blue circle.
Profit is taken in the white circle.
--> The average buying price + 30 pips.
All 4 lots are sold at the same time.
Some will make a loss and some will make a profit.
On average 4x30=120 pips profit is made"

Now, obviously everyone has different pipsteps and profit targtes, but the fact remains that it does not close all open positions when an average T/P goal is met. Instead it treats all open orders independently and closes them when their individual T/P or SL is hit. If that can be fixed to work as it was supposed to, that would make a huge difference.
  • #246
  • Jun 22, 2006 3:26pm Jun 22, 2006 3:26pm
Hendrick, a little off topic, but I brew beer at home and have for 30+years as a hobby. Your skittles statement made me laugh, because I had heard that banter about 10 years ago and decided to take it to task. I brewed up some skittle beer. It was not nearly as bad a I thought it would be, but man if was a frightening rainbow of colors, depending on which colors I used..

LOL Scott


Quoting Hendrick
Hi Wizard!

What goes for real life certainly applies to Forex: "it's not all skittles and beer" (I'm Dutch and learned this phrase a long time ago at school. Never thought I could used it in something like this Forum!). What we really need is some kind of money management in Firebird. Among other things, start with small lot sizes and as your account grows start using larger ones. It will certainly prevent you from blowing up your account. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o></o>
  • #247
  • Jun 22, 2006 6:31pm Jun 22, 2006 6:31pm
Hi Guys

I have been testing firebird v63g from the begining of the week and so far no losses recorded.

I trade 6 currencies

EUR/USD
EUR/JPY
USD/JPY
USD/CHF
GBP/USD
USD/CAD

Settings

MA_length=10
MA_timeframe=30
MAtype=0
Percent=0.10000000
TradeOnFriday=1
slip=100
Lots=0.10000000
TakeProfit=30
Stoploss=300
Fast_Period=23
Fast_Price=1
Slow_Period=84
Slow_Price=1
DivergenceLimit=0.00200000
Use_V63D_Divergence=1
PipStep=30
IncreasementType=0.00000000
DVLimit=10
PipsGoal=500
PipsLoss=500
GMT=0
DST=0
OpeningHour=0
ClosingHour=24
writelog=0

Results below
Attached File(s)
File Type: zip DetailedStatement.zip   4 KB | 409 downloads
Mono
  • #248
  • Jun 22, 2006 6:37pm Jun 22, 2006 6:37pm
I just started testing yesterday and so far I have 6 losses and 1 win. I will try with parameters from the post above and will report back in a few days.

Dane
  • #249
  • Jun 22, 2006 9:42pm Jun 22, 2006 9:42pm
Quoting Hendrick
Hi Wizard!

What goes for real life certainly applies to Forex: "it's not all skittles and beer" (I'm Dutch and learned this phrase a long time ago at school. Never thought I could used it in something like this Forum!). What we really need is some kind of money management in Firebird. Among other things, start with small lot sizes and as your account grows start using larger ones. It will certainly prevent you from blowing up your account. <o></o>
You are certainly spot on there mate. i normally only risk 1-2% per trade but did not take that into account with my demo trades of firebird. I am using single lots with a $10,000 demo account. Using the 42 pip stop that's a per trade risk of 4.2% which is a bit too high for me.

In addition we need to know how a set of settings works out over the long haul, otherwise we're just blowing up our account at a slower rate.

Firebird gave me 13 losses in a row last night. Now to recover from that i need a lot of winners just to get back to where i started. Such is life i know.

i am testing a few other EA's from Forex TSD which look reasonable too.

Wiz.
  • #250
  • Jun 22, 2006 11:59pm Jun 22, 2006 11:59pm
Your record sounds good on paper until you check your floating positions. Lots of them open and the floating loss is pretty steep.

Quoting mono
Hi Guys

I have been testing firebird v63g from the begining of the week and so far no losses recorded.

I trade 6 currencies

EUR/USD
EUR/JPY
USD/JPY
USD/CHF
GBP/USD
USD/CAD

Settings

MA_length=10
MA_timeframe=30
MAtype=0
Percent=0.10000000
TradeOnFriday=1
slip=100
Lots=0.10000000
TakeProfit=30
Stoploss=300
Fast_Period=23
Fast_Price=1
Slow_Period=84
Slow_Price=1
DivergenceLimit=0.00200000
Use_V63D_Divergence=1
PipStep=30
IncreasementType=0.00000000
DVLimit=10
PipsGoal=500
PipsLoss=500
GMT=0
DST=0
OpeningHour=0
ClosingHour=24
writelog=0

Results below
  • #251
  • Jun 23, 2006 7:29am Jun 23, 2006 7:29am
Having fun anyone? I really wonder what can be done to improve this EA. My graph at the end of my statement looks really great if I turn it upside down.

I guess the initial excitement has calmed down a bit. The start of the week saw great profits but the last few days have have given even greater losses.

Such is life and such is the reality of forex trading.

Wiz.
  • #252
  • Jun 23, 2006 7:37am Jun 23, 2006 7:37am
and here's the statement in all its glory.
Attached File(s)
File Type: zip statement.zip   11 KB | 371 downloads
  • #253
  • Jun 23, 2006 7:38am Jun 23, 2006 7:38am
Quoting The Wizard of Oz
Having fun anyone? I really wonder what can be done to improve this EA. My graph at the end of my statement looks really great if I turn it upside down.

I guess the initial excitement has calmed down a bit. The start of the week saw great profits but the last few days have have given even greater losses.

Such is life and such is the reality of forex trading.

Wiz.
Dont give up yet, Wiz, still testing, next test will be to trade firebird only on the first 3 days of the week, I see if I can code Firebird to trade in the opposite in the last 2 days

Mono
Mono
  • #254
  • Jun 23, 2006 7:40am Jun 23, 2006 7:40am
Wizard you are right. The losses keep piling up in my account. Its a good thing its a demo. I still think the EA has potential, the settings just need to be tweaked. I think the 15 step may be a bit too low.



Quoting The Wizard of Oz
Having fun anyone? I really wonder what can be done to improve this EA. My graph at the end of my statement looks really great if I turn it upside down.

I guess the initial excitement has calmed down a bit. The start of the week saw great profits but the last few days have have given even greater losses.

Such is life and such is the reality of forex trading.

Wiz.
  • #255
  • Jun 23, 2006 11:14am Jun 23, 2006 11:14am
Another fine day for Firebird.. (joking). The results of last week gives a lot of stuff to think about. We will have to study the trades and try to discover the how and why of the behaviour of Firebird in a volatile market as we have seen in the last 2 days. In a stable market Firebird is doing its job: more winners than losers. But days like the last 2, gives us the opportunity to make some discoveries that can really improve Firebird.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o></o>

<o></o>

First thing we really need is money management. I've asked Firedave if he is willing to adapt Firebird in such a way. Another thing is time. I believe that preventing Firebird to place trades during certain periods of the day will certainly help to improve its results. At last I have my own little tool EDEA working. Feel free to test it, and please let me know if it's any help to you. <o></o>

<o> </o>
Attached File(s)
File Type: zip edea1_5.zip   533 KB | 421 downloads
  • #256
  • Jun 23, 2006 11:17am Jun 23, 2006 11:17am
The real problem is that the losers are much bigger than the winners. This goes against what we need to achieve to be profitable in the long run.

Quoting Hendrick
In a stable market Firebird is doing its job: more winners than losers. But days like the last 2, gives us the opportunity to make some discoveries that can really improve Firebird.<o></o>


<o></o>
  • #257
  • Jun 23, 2006 11:24am Jun 23, 2006 11:24am
Hendrick,

I haven't tried your tool yet, but it seems there's definitely a need for it or some type of filter.

I've spoken with the originator of Firebird (Traderseven) and he gave up on it due to programming difficulties. I'm not ready to give up just yet.

Firebird is supposed to average positions and exit all at the same time. I have not seen that happen. Pipstep works fine, but it does not exit all at the same time when the average profit is met. Is that your expereince as well?

Also, Firebird is supposed to reverse in heavily trending markets.

If either of those two rules were working, we may not have seen the negative results of the last couple days.
  • #258
  • Jun 23, 2006 1:03pm Jun 23, 2006 1:03pm
Quoting BenQ
Hendrick,

I haven't tried your tool yet, but it seems there's definitely a need for it or some type of filter.

I've spoken with the originator of Firebird (Traderseven) and he gave up on it due to programming difficulties. I'm not ready to give up just yet.

Firebird is supposed to average positions and exit all at the same time. I have not seen that happen. Pipstep works fine, but it does not exit all at the same time when the average profit is met. Is that your expereince as well?

Also, Firebird is supposed to reverse in heavily trending markets.

If either of those two rules were working, we may not have seen the negative results of the last couple days.
Hi Ben,

Some parts of Firebird are still a mistery to me. But I'm determined to discover as much as I can about all aspects of Firebird and to bring it back to its basics. It may take a while but I'm convinced that in the end it will be turn out to be a one of the best EA's ever made.
  • #259
  • Jun 23, 2006 1:11pm Jun 23, 2006 1:11pm
Hendrick,

What if we were to create an area where Firebird did not issue trades. What I have in mind is a second, wider envelope around the initial .05 envelope -- the thought being that if prices travels to this second enveleope it is more likely in a trend and contrary to the best use of Firebird.

As long as price ranges within a certain area, Firebird cannot be beat. It's when it gets out of this area that trading activity should cease until it returns.
  • #260
  • Jun 23, 2006 1:15pm Jun 23, 2006 1:15pm
Quoting lonespruce
The real problem is that the losers are much bigger than the winners. This goes against what we need to achieve to be profitable in the long run.
It depends on the relation between SL and TP. Until now it's still my opinion that a SL of 52 to a TP of 26 is still better than a SL=200 and a TP=20. Next week I will return to TP=18 and SL=42 and I will run 2 demo's: one without time filter and one with the following trade hours 8:00-12:00, 13:00-15:00, 16:00-18:00 and 19:00-22:00 (GMT+2). I will use EDEA for this. I think that this time filter is essential to improve the results of EDEA. Next Friday I will post the results.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o></o>
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