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HCR-LCS + SFP Research thread

  • #41
  • Edited 7:50am Jul 4, 2013 7:26am | Edited 7:50am
Quoting ghous
Hey Steve, Great job with this thread. Will be dropping in for sure. This thread allows a little more breathing space for me so I am going to enjoy here. g.

Great to see you here Ghous.


Yeah, that is why I thought about opening it, I was getting a little nervous posting small tf setups in the J16 thread.


Hey, feel free to introduce your methodology anytime Ghous.
I for one would love to see it.

Hopefully Jarroo will post a bit as well, I sent him a PM telling him I had started this thread.

Great how opening this thread has got me thinking even deeper about trading.
Actually, Jarroo once mentioned to me that helping others, also helps ourselves greatly. It is true.

Also, please feel free to correct and reprimand me when I am wrong.

Let's make this everyone's thread to research Non Indicator based trading.

Actually someone just asked a Great question about the J16, SFP and HCR methods, saying the different systems can be a little confusing.
I think people will realize like I did recently that really, they are all the same. Only the entry is different.
  • #42
  • Jul 4, 2013 8:02am Jul 4, 2013 8:02am
Hey Steve!

Thank you for sharing your method! It´s seems to be great! I like james16 thread and esprecially jarroo´s method of trading. I followed his posts, but on the other thread is some noise because of the other PA methods, so sometimes i got confused. Your method is similar to jarroo´s and I will follow you! Thank you again!

I took a short trade on eur/usd. daily lcs. 30 min candle closed under this lcs, so I entered the trade. SL was 10 pips about the PB on m30 (red line) and TP was at the last Swing low ( blue line). Is it right? Correct me if i´m wrong =)

Cheers

Andy
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  • #43
  • Jul 4, 2013 8:10am Jul 4, 2013 8:10am
Trading fake outs, or SFPs whatever you call them is more a mindset and a broader approach as opposed to something as confined and restrictive as a trading system.

What you need to understand is that you need your fake out bulbs to be lit if you expect something really obvious and the market isn't ready to deliver.

Price trying to break above a swing point, or below a swing point, or heading to a breakout of a consolidation box or a pattern and immediately finding trouble doing so, or just the feeling of unexplained hesitance and BINGO! You're sensing pro action. This is where the best fake out trades await you.

Of course to be able to pluck such setups out of ordinary ones is the true art which comes around a full circle to prove my point that trading SFPs is more a mindset and the ability to read order flow off price action, than a superficial system.

g.
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I believe . . .
  • #44
  • Jul 4, 2013 8:23am Jul 4, 2013 8:23am
Wow, I am impressed, you are playing it like Jarroo does.

A bit too tricky for me though, especially with the US bank holiday just started combined with the ECB news.
It rocked in your direction though. Good job.
I imagine you used that consolidation as the FTA?

The consolidation area on the left would have been a concern for me.
That said, I am sure Jarroo would have liked how you used that level.
He would probably tell me, I am using levels from too far back.
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  • #45
  • Edited 8:40am Jul 4, 2013 8:28am | Edited 8:40am
Quoting ghous
Trading fake outs, or SFPs whatever you call them is more a mindset and a broader approach as opposed to something as confined and restrictive as a trading system. What you need to understand is that you need your fake out bulbs to be lit if you expect something really obvious and the market isn't ready to deliver. Price trying to break above a swing point, or below a swing point, or heading to a breakout of a consolidation box or a pattern and immediately finding trouble doing so, or just the feeling of unexplained hesitance and BINGO! You're sensing...

Wow Ghous.
This post, has blown my mind.
It is almost like philosophy which I suppose it is as, market movement is really an expression of human emotion, fear, hope greed & despair.

So, the mechanics of the Fakey is basically like the SFP in trapping traders on the wrong side of the fence and giving the big guys a better price to buy or sell at?

As J16 says, "This is a Damn hard business"!!!
  • #46
  • Jul 4, 2013 8:56am Jul 4, 2013 8:56am
Ghous
I take it this weekly LCS in the consolidation area was the Level?
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  • #47
  • Jul 4, 2013 9:05am Jul 4, 2013 9:05am
Nice thread PB , will try and get through this week..

jon
PATIENCE... DISCIPLINE
  • #48
  • Jul 4, 2013 9:09am Jul 4, 2013 9:09am
Quoting g_j_hook@yah
Nice thread PB , will try and get through this week.. jon

Good to see you Jon.

Feel free to jump in and give us your advice.
  • #49
  • Jul 4, 2013 9:28am Jul 4, 2013 9:28am
Quoting Pinbar
We could see a Bullish SFP on USD/CHF but, the FTA is too close for my liking. Nice confluence with the First Time Back (FTB) to the 150 EMA. However, the swing point is not very large. We really want the larger SPs. Let's just watch it and see what occurs. {image}
Did not make it back to the level.
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  • #50
  • Jul 4, 2013 10:06am Jul 4, 2013 10:06am
Quoting Pinbar
{quote} Wow Ghous. This post, has blown my mind. It is almost like philosophy which I suppose it is as, market movement is really an expression of human emotion, fear, hope greed & despair. So, the mechanics of the Fakey is basically like the SFP in trapping traders on the wrong side of the fence and giving the big guys a better price to buy or sell at? As J16 says, "This is a Damn hard business"!!!
Absolutely!

g.
I believe . . .
  • #51
  • Jul 4, 2013 10:07am Jul 4, 2013 10:07am
Quoting Pinbar
Ghous I take it this weekly LCS in the consolidation area was the Level? {image} {image}
yes. It is not a coincidence that you'll often find HCR/LCS levels lining up with good looking fake out setups.

g.
I believe . . .
  • #52
  • Jul 4, 2013 3:43pm Jul 4, 2013 3:43pm
Would you look for SFP on GBPUSD tomorrow?
We are gettin really close to that Low... Or we dont do SFP with such "old levels" on 1H or 4H.

Cheers,
Stephen
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It's all psychology...
  • #53
  • Jul 4, 2013 6:02pm Jul 4, 2013 6:02pm
Quoting Pinbar
Wow, I am impressed, you are playing it like Jarroo does. A bit too tricky for me though, especially with the US bank holiday just started combined with the ECB news. It rocked in your direction though. Good job. I imagine you used that consolidation as the FTA? The consolidation area on the left would have been a concern for me. That said, I am sure Jarroo would have liked how you used that level. He would probably tell me, I am using levels from too far back. {image} {image}
yes, i used exactly this level thank you for your comment, steve. everyone of them ist helpfull for me. just need to practice.
  • #54
  • Jul 4, 2013 8:17pm Jul 4, 2013 8:17pm
Quoting LamerTrader
Would you look for SFP on GBPUSD tomorrow? We are gettin really close to that Low... Or we dont do SFP with such "old levels" on 1H or 4H. Cheers, Stephen {image}
Yeah, I will look for an SFP, may not trade it but, I will watch it.
Being Friday, I do not want to pay the swap over the weekend.
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  • #55
  • Edited 10:07pm Jul 4, 2013 9:13pm | Edited 10:07pm
Tricky levels
Sometimes when these levels are not clear, it can confuse me a little or, I tend to run away from them.
I feel that it is important to understand these unclear levels, even if we choose not to trade them.
Something I am working on at the moment. It is also important to note how on the H4 tf, price trickled back to the level thus, sort of creating a lack of space from the level to the FTA. This leads me to think that, momentum back to a level, is the key to creating enough space to take the trade, off the level.
Previously, I would see the momentum back to a level as a sign that the level would possibly not hold, this appears to be the reverse psychology or logic.
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  • #56
  • Edited Jul 5, 2013 10:21am Jul 4, 2013 9:59pm | Edited Jul 5, 2013 10:21am
VERY IMPORTANT.

Target areas.
I have not mentioned this yet but, it is probably time to mention how Jarroo will set his targets for any trade taken from these levels.
As we know, Price Breaking Through a level is related to the time frame on which this occurs and, so is the target area.
If we see PBT&CB on a weekly chart, we may go down to the Daily, 4H or even lower to enter the trade via a trigger such as small tf PA.
Jarroo uses the Price Breaks Through & Closes Below (PBT&CB) bar's CLOSE & LOW on the time frame it occurs on as the initial target areas for his trades.
He will also take note of any bar low wicks nearby to the targets.

Does this method of picking targets, ring a bell?

It should as, it is actually the SFP. This is one factor that got me so interested in the SFP &, showed me how inseparable the HCR-LCS & the SFP actually are!

So, in summary the Close & Low of a PBT&CB Candle, can be an area to take partial or full profit &, or move to BE.
As J16 says in "This is critical" "We must act at these areas by doing one of the above or a combination of the above.
We may also see reversal signals and reverse our position. A weekly PBT&CB bar low is a possibly an SFP on a smaller TF.
See how actually HCR-LCS & SFP can be both sides of the coin?

It can be a lot to get our minds around, when we are new to PA.

But what fun it is, learning.
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  • #57
  • Edited Jul 5, 2013 12:28am Jul 4, 2013 10:49pm | Edited Jul 5, 2013 12:28am
Quoting Helius
I love the thread!! I have been trading SFP, along with the rounded retests, for quiet a while after attending the_whizzard's webinars for months. I am looking for additional confirmations before taking a SFP as a SFP alone failed too many times in my trading. Looking forward to reading and exchanging ideas in here!! keep it up
Hey Helius.

Welcome and please give us some input on the SFP & RR.
My knowledge of them are limited and I have only recently come to understand the relationship with HCR-LCS.
I tried to join Tom's webinars but, because of the time difference where I am currently living, combined with not being able to log into the site, has thwarted my attempts.

I know that basically tom is taking the 20 period ATR on the daily tf, working out the range and then looking at both the swing in and swing out on the hourly tf, taking the shorter of the two and if it does not meet the daily range, he will pass on the trade.
  • #58
  • Jul 5, 2013 12:29am Jul 5, 2013 12:29am
How to verify a swing point for an SFP on the hourly TF.
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  • #59
  • Jul 5, 2013 12:40am Jul 5, 2013 12:40am
Quoting Pinbar
Tricky levels Sometimes when these levels are not clear, it can confuse me a little or, I tend to run away from them. I feel that it is important to understand these unclear levels, even if we choose not to trade them. Something I am working on at the moment. It is also important to note how on the H4 tf, price trickled back to the level thus, sort of creating a lack of space from the level to the FTA. This leads me to think that, momentum back to a level, is the key to creating enough space to take the trade, off the level. Previously, I would...
People tend to think of PPZs as doors. The stronger you hit them the more the chance that you'll break the locks and barge in. Whereas a lot of timesPPZs work like trampolines. The bigger the force you hit them with, the higher you will bounce.

One of the most popular myths revolving around with new traders is that bars with big strong ranges are always reminiscent of strong persistent momentum . Essentially, it all boils down to location. Such bars heading out and away from important levels hold true to what is believed about them. Such bars heading into important levels can be telling an altogether different, perhaps even the opposite story.

g.
I believe . . .
  • #60
  • Jul 5, 2013 12:50am Jul 5, 2013 12:50am
i down load the indicators and template but si not working on my chart
can some one help?
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