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Why do people use Fibonacci in trading?

  • #321
  • Apr 24, 2013 7:02pm Apr 24, 2013 7:02pm
Quoting GnarlyPips
{quote} So, when prices hits weekly S1, buy? What about stops? Should we place those? What if we buy at S1 and price hits S2? Should we stay in, or get out? What about monthly? What if price is at MR2, but WS1? What about daily? Hourly? Do you know the equation for your pivot points? Does it account for just the close, does it account for open and close?

Addendum: I can't/won't/do not wish to try and tell you how to trade.
All the answers to the questions you asked depend upon the individual and
his/her trading method.

How difficult is it to truly understand that ONE SIZE DOES NOT FIT ALL ???
Therefore, there is no real argument, only belief.

And when YOU have all the answers, please let me know

I'll be waiting............

Kindest of Regards
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #322
  • Apr 24, 2013 7:07pm Apr 24, 2013 7:07pm
Well, the Fed actually does announce what they will be doing. It's their fucking job. They never surprised anyone by buying up securities, they announced they would do so.

Quote
I can't/won't/do not wish to try and tell you how to trade.

You sure seem to be pushing the idea of trading pivots pretty heavily in this thread for you type that up.

The answer: play the players, not the cards.

Players = banks, corporations, hedge funds, etc...
Cards = charts, tech analysis, etc...

Admittedly, being retail makes playing the players a lot more difficult than being a bank, but it doesn't make it impossible to know what they are doing.
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #323
  • Apr 24, 2013 7:35pm Apr 24, 2013 7:35pm
[quote=GnarlyPips;6634250]Well, the Fed actually does announce what they will be doing. It's their fucking job. They never surprised anyone by buying up securities, they announced they would do so. {quote}

So from that, you can tell EXACTLY what's going to happen next in the Forex market. Right ??

Quoting GnarlyPips
You sure seem to be pushing the idea of trading pivots pretty heavily in this thread for you type that up.
One might say that I was "pushing pivots" the way a drug dealer pushes his wares.
OR.... someone with an open mind could say that I was offering an alternative to
to the conventional fib high. As stated, no size fits all.



Quoting GnarlyPips
The answer: play the players, not the cards. Players = banks, corporations, hedge funds, etc... Cards = charts, tech analysis, etc... Admittedly, being retail makes playing the players a lot more difficult than being a bank, but it doesn't make it impossible to know what they are doing.
So when you say "play the players, not the cards" does that mean that you pay no attention
to the cards that have (already) been dealt you ? And how do you intend to play the players
without looking at the deck and the "players" have most of the money??

Quoting GnarlyPips
but it doesn't make it impossible
Apparently, you like to bet against the odds.
Never know, it just might work.
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #324
  • Apr 24, 2013 7:58pm Apr 24, 2013 7:58pm
[quote=Slim Buffett;6634283]
Quoting GnarlyPips
Well, the Fed actually does announce what they will be doing. It's their fucking job. They never surprised anyone by buying up securities, they announced they would do so. {quote} So from that, you can tell EXACTLY what's going to happen next in the Forex market. Right ?? {quote} One might say that I was "pushing pivots" the way a drug dealer pushes his wares. OR.... someone with an open mind could say that I was offering an alternative to to the conventional fib high. As stated, no size fits all. {quote} So when you...

Knowing what the Fed is doing doesn't mean I will know exactly what price will do in the forex. I make my bets, not because I am trying to predict, but because I believe the odds are in my favor.

I am a poker player. I am not the only player in the world that can win a hand without looking at my cards. Annette Obrestad is known for playing tournaments completely blind and winning.

When you are under the gun, meaning the very first to act in a hand, if you bet, you're not playing the players, because you have no action from the other players on that hand to play against. This is akin to being a retail trader. You are first to act, you have the least information, and you give that information to the last players: the button, who I would say is the Central Bank, and the cut off or the hijack who would be the banks.
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #325
  • Apr 24, 2013 7:58pm Apr 24, 2013 7:58pm
Just another thought....

Please explain clearly and precisely why Fibbonaci #'s are
better than pivots.

To which, someone will reply "why are pivots better than......"

To which I reply "they're right there on a daily/weekly/monthly
basis and I don't have to try and connect the fibbo dots with
mind boggling possibilities.

Pivots aren't that simple but those who pretend that
fibbo's are , are JUST THAT

anyone???
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #326
  • Apr 24, 2013 8:26pm Apr 24, 2013 8:26pm
Quoting Slim Buffett
Just another thought.... Please explain clearly and precisely why Fibbonaci #'s are better than pivots. To which, someone will reply "why are pivots better than......" To which I reply "they're right there on a daily/weekly/monthly basis and I don't have to try and connect the fibbo dots with mind boggling possibilities. Pivots aren't that simple but those who pretend that fibbo's are , are JUST THAT anyone???

Never said one was better than the other. You should read my posts in this thread if you wish to know what my views are on fibs. I did ask you what equation do you use for your pivots a number of times in this very thread and have yet received and answer. Do you even know what equation you are using?
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #327
  • Apr 24, 2013 8:39pm Apr 24, 2013 8:39pm
Quoting GnarlyPips
{quote} Never said one was better than the other. You should read my posts in this thread if you wish to know what my views are on fibs. I did ask you what equation do you use for your pivots a number of times in this very thread and have yet received and answer. Do you even know what equation you are using?
You only ask more questions without providing any answers. Your thirst for
knowledge is admirable. Your rhetoric, worse than mine.

I hope to be forgiven that I haven't read your posts
in this thread because I don't really care what your views are regarding fibs.

Leonardo Pisano Bigollo (c. 1170 – c. 1250)[1] – known as Fibonacci, and also Leonardo of Pisa, Leonardo Pisano, Leonardo Bonacci, Leonardo Fibonacci – was an Italian mathematician, considered by some "the most talented western mathematician of the Middle Ages."[2]
Fibonacci is best known to the modern world for[3] the spreading of the Hindu–Arabic numeral system in Europe, primarily through the publication in 1202 of his Liber Abaci (Book of Calculation), and for a number sequence named the Fibonacci numbers after him, which he did not discover but used as an example in the Liber Abaci.[4]


We (you) believe in FIBS in much the same way people believe in Christ ???


There is no REAL (scientific) evidence and it all came about eons ago
.... and yet, we believe

I'm treading on thin ice..............

that's ok
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #328
  • Apr 24, 2013 8:52pm Apr 24, 2013 8:52pm
[quote=GnarlyPips;6634311]
Quoting Slim Buffett
{quote} I am a poker player. I am not the only player in the world that can win a hand without looking at my cards.
Of course you don't have to look at your own cards

but the cards that have been played

Your failure to even read the most remote hint....
(regarding what was in front of you)

reveals that you are to be easily beaten ?

I suggest this..... if you think you're going to win at (manually) trading Forex
without looking at your cards

let me know how you do that.

Meanwhile

"Not that you lied to me but that I no longer believe you has shaken me." - Friedrich Nietzsche, "Beyond Good and Evil" - Aphorism Number 183
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #329
  • Apr 24, 2013 8:53pm Apr 24, 2013 8:53pm
Quoting Slim Buffett
{quote} You only ask more questions without providing any answers. Your thirst for knowledge is admirable. Your rhetoric, worse than mine. I hope to be forgiven that I haven't read your posts in this thread because I don't really care what your views are regarding fibs. Leonardo Pisano Bigollo (c. 1170 – c. 1250)[1] – known as Fibonacci, and also Leonardo of Pisa, Leonardo Pisano, Leonardo Bonacci, Leonardo Fibonacci – was an Italian...

So, I'm going to go ahead and assume you don't know the equation to the pivot points you so gladly push. Hilarious.

The reason why the "fib" numbers appear in nature so much is because things naturally maximize efficiency while minimizing redundancy. Take a tree, the first leaf grows where it grows, it doesn't really matter. The second leaf will grow as far away from that leaf as possible, in order to maximize sunlight exposure while reducing redundancy. The next leaf will grow as far away from the second leaf as possible, while considering the first leaf, as well. Each leaf grows as far apart from the most previous leaf while considering previous leaves.

Again, if you took the time to read your opponents arguments, you'd know that I don't really believe that using fib rations in the markets will grant anything but gambling. Maybe, just maybe, if one took the fibs and applied it to the players, rather than the cards, results may come out, but again, as stated before, it's hard for a retail trader to know exactly what the big players are doing. They have a better idea of what they do. Maybe there could be an equation, something you wouldn't know about, that would combine all the players in the world using fibs, but then again, that's akin to trying to make an equation using every single piece of matter in the universe, or otherwise known as Gann. (Gann doesn't have an equation for that, but does try to use astronomical bodies.)

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #330
  • Apr 24, 2013 8:55pm Apr 24, 2013 8:55pm
[quote=Slim Buffett;6634408]
Quoting GnarlyPips
{quote} Of course you don't have to look at your own cards but the cards that have been played Your failure to even read the most remote hint.... (regarding what was in front of you) reveals that you are to be easily beaten ? I suggest this..... if you think you're going to win at (manually) trading Forex without looking at your cards let me know how you do that. Meanwhile "Not that you lied to me but that I no longer believe you has shaken me." - Friedrich Nietzsche, "Beyond Good and Evil" - Aphorism Number 183
One doesn't need to look at any cards to watch the players. I was watching the players talk about the fiscal cliff, and I believed that time to be the best time in decades to come to buy up the dollar, without having to look at a chart to come to my conclusion. Panama canal expansion, increase in energy exports, increase in tech exports, increase in food exports, etc... One doesn't need a chart to come to the conclusions that those various things will only increase the demand for the dollar.
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #331
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:06pm Apr 24, 2013 9:06pm
U've both lost in argument since u forgot what was the argument about and in your writing style it is clear that u come with prejudice - (it is clear since one asks the question and the other asks a counterquestion) but I digress...

I saw a sentence ''is fibo bettter than pivots''? . How can you ask that question...? I know ppl who don't trade without TA and they are doing 'fine' (by fine i mean 200% per year)... but again that is not an answer...the real answer lies in chaos theory and since noone mentions it here let me just tell u that the mathematics which stands behind fibo is very simple (it doesn't require proofing because it's axiomatic) - fibo works 100% accurate for the arabic numbers - duh! BUT...does that ratio work for something more than just the series of natural numbers and if it does, in which percentage? Of course it doesn't work in markets in 100% cases, but it does work in some % of cases (what, nobody knows) BECAUSE MARKET MOVEMENTS (until proven otherwise) ARE CHAOTIC.
You cannot describe a chaotic movement by an equation of 1st or 2nd degree and that's what fibo really is. No mathematician managed to make a magic formula (no matter how complicated formulas can be) which vaguely describes security movements
  • #332
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:09pm Apr 24, 2013 9:09pm
[quote=GnarlyPips;6634418]
Quoting Slim Buffett
{quote} One doesn't need to look at any cards to watch the players. I was watching the players talk about the fiscal cliff, and I believed that time to be the best time in decades to come to buy up the dollar, without having to look at a chart to come to my conclusion. Panama canal expansion, increase in energy exports, increase in tech exports, increase in food exports, etc... One doesn't need a chart to come to the conclusions that those various things will only increase the demand for the dollar.

Gee............... you're better than George Soros or Warren Buffett
So what does all your bragging have to do with FIBS or pivots

Answers only... please
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #333
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:09pm Apr 24, 2013 9:09pm
Damn! I pressed enter and managed to put only half of it and wanted to write more and now I've lost my thread...it's 4 am and I'm getting some sleep, tomorrow I'l share some of my insights with u2 (that is, if u like)

gn
  • #334
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:15pm Apr 24, 2013 9:15pm
[quote=Slim Buffett;6634440]
Quoting GnarlyPips
{quote} Gee............... you're better than George Soros or Warren Buffett So what does all your bragging have to do with FIBS or pivots Answers only... please
Only when you tell me what the equation is.
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #335
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:24pm Apr 24, 2013 9:24pm
[quote=GnarlyPips;6634450]
Quoting Slim Buffett
{quote} Only when you tell me what the equation is.
I don't need an equation. It's simply a matter of S/R

Haven't you ever encountered those who trade price action
or is that (obviously) beyond your comprehension.

SO TELL ME THIS
what is YOUR equation for "ONE doesn't Need to Look at any Cards to
Watch the Players"

Enough of your stupid questions... how do you answer your own words ???

Or you simply can't ???
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #336
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:26pm Apr 24, 2013 9:26pm
wuts the equation for this

"One doesn't need a chart to come to the conclusions that those various things will only increase the demand for the dollar." said sir gnarly
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #337
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:27pm Apr 24, 2013 9:27pm
WHAT is your equation for THAT

Sir Gnarly????
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #338
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:29pm Apr 24, 2013 9:29pm
[quote=Slim Buffett;6634456]
Quoting GnarlyPips
{quote} I don't need an equation. It's simply a matter of S/R Haven't you ever encountered those who trade price action or is that (obviously) beyond your comprehension. SO TELL ME THIS what is YOUR equation for "ONE doesn't Need to Look at any Cards to Watch the Players" Enough of your stupid questions... how do you answer your own words ??? Or you simply can't ???
If you don't need an equation, are you saying that you are putting the lines on your chart manually? Are you saying you have no idea what the equation is? How do you not know the equation to the indicator that you are using?
Play the players, not the cards.
  • #339
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:46pm Apr 24, 2013 9:46pm
[quote=GnarlyPips;6634467]
Quoting Slim Buffett
{quote} If you don't need an equation, are you saying that you are putting the lines on your chart manually? Are you saying you have no idea what the equation is? How do you not know the equation to the indicator that you are using?

It's obvious that you have no answers. What was the equation for.... "one doesn't need to look
at any cards"

I'm not hung up on equations and neither are you save for the (paltry) attempt to discredit me.
(i've done fairly well at that already)


Otherwise, your own statements would ring more true in your own ears.

I like it though, you're nearly becoming a projection of myself

(must have been studying)
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
  • #340
  • Apr 24, 2013 9:53pm Apr 24, 2013 9:53pm
[quote=GnarlyPips;6634467]
Quoting Slim Buffett
{quote} How do you not know the equation to the indicator that you are using?

And since YOU'RE the MAster

wut IS that equation again ????
When the Joker is in the deck.. fear not and play it well
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