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  • #1,181
  • Feb 25, 2013 6:00am Feb 25, 2013 6:00am
Quoting Trader MT4
Thank you very much.

Ishtana or FX-Trader

please, describe me Cycle and Level counting

This is very important for entries.



lp, dan
Dan, SM teaches us that there is a daily cycle with 3 levels, and weekly cycle with 3 levels. As to the truth of these theories, I have not find them to be consistent, and even when I seem to be able to find the levels, my counting are often turned out to be wrong.

I really believe that these two theories are inconclusive. Steve may be an expert trading his own method, but it doesn't mean he is a great teacher. There is no correlation between an expert and a good teacher. Teaching is a separate skill. I found his style of teaching as non congruent and non systematic. He mixes up topics in his presentation where I think he really should cover the basic before jumping all over the place with the hard stuff.

My recommendation is this: Don't give up on SM. He knows something most of us don't. But don't take in his teaching 100%.
  • #1,182
  • Feb 25, 2013 9:12pm Feb 25, 2013 9:12pm
1) Steve never teaches us how to handle gaps. He only says to avoid weekend trade in order to avoid the gap. Does a huge gap mean a total reset (PF reset and level counting reset)? Like what happens to the 3 majors this week?

2) Guys, please help me with this one. I think this is the key question to SM teaching application:

Is his teaching valid only when his patterns appear (trade only when 3 levels and PFs are visible on the chart) or his teaching is meant to explain every market movement (continuous level counting, PFs, and resets)?

It makes more sense if it is the former than the latter. But he claims that his daily and weekly cycles work continuously... Puzzled.

Anyway, I've done so mark up on what happened yesterday. All in 15M chart. Any correction is highly appreciated.
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  • #1,183
  • Edited 10:18pm Feb 25, 2013 10:00pm | Edited 10:18pm
Gaps are generally treated as Traps. Whether it be this method, sam's or anyone else's they all pretty much treat a gap the same way it's a place where they trap the traders and pull it back in close the gap and typically resume the move in the intended direction. Sometimes the gap created can extend so far that if filled in with imaginary candles it can equal your 3 intraday bursts or false moves. If your gaping into the 200 ema or 800 ema with indicators at overbought/oversold you almost always see price rip the other way.

In your chart G/U gapped down and was oversold so we can identify traders trapped at that open. Notice how they closed the gap and then resumed the move down again but left traders trapped at the open low later in the US session as they never went all the way back down. Then price proceeded to pull away to the upside. So now we know they really trapped them and will most likely continue the upward reversal til Wed where maybe well see a mid week reversal. There is a rythem you just have to follow the money trail, places where the novice get screwed and gamblers place their bets.

Also if you back your GU chart out to 10 day view you'll notice huge divergence on the chart against TDI, another classic tail the gap was going to correct. So take a picture and next time you see a gap with massive divergence go against the gap.
  • #1,184
  • Mar 7, 2013 8:02am Mar 7, 2013 8:02am
Can someone please... please explain what's going on in the past 2 days with the majors? ALL SM teachings went out of the window, fake M&W, fake TDI signals and divergence, total disrespect of S&R levels. Price action is on crack. It's gone wild like a b****. Of course it's the NEWS dummy. But I'm talking even before the news. Oh man, lost a good chunk of my equity. =( Cry me a river!!!!!
  • #1,185
  • Mar 7, 2013 9:13am Mar 7, 2013 9:13am
Quoting Ishtana
Can someone please... please explain what's going on in the past 2 days with the majors? ALL SM teachings went out of the window, fake M&W, fake TDI signals and divergence, total disrespect of S&R levels. Price action is on crack. It's gone wild like a b****. Of course it's the NEWS dummy. But I'm talking even before the news. Oh man, lost a good chunk of my equity. =( Cry me a river!!!!!
Only have time to do one review, but I think I am getting pretty good at the analysis.... for starters I don't think you quite grasp the method enough to be trading it live, so hopefully it's demo equity if not

Lesson #1 STOP TRADING something you don't know how to use. DEMO Only

Next review your notes and make a checklist of everything you know.

Here is what I see happening in G/U this week, E/U was very similar but G/U was more pronounced....
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  • #1,186
  • Edited 10:52am Mar 7, 2013 10:37am | Edited 10:52am
Thank you so much FX-Trader. Great analysis.

Steve never teaches us about fake M&W and fake TDI divergences, and to me his rule of never trade against level 1 consolidation rings so true only when the damage is done =( Yeah, I traded live with binary options and lost almost all of my balance. I got scammed by a binary broker so I trade live with it for now.

I think I just need to understand the levels. I've put this question a while ago but no one has answered it. FX-Trader, is the level counting supposed to be continuous? i.e. Level 1, Level 2, Level 3, possibly Level 4, then reset. Or maybe even Level 1, Level 2, reset, then Level 1, then maybe another reset? Meaning there is always a level present. When Steve said you always have to know where you are in the cycle, does that mean level counting is continuous?

OR, we act only when price randomly forms the 3 levels pattern and display level 3 behavior, then we trade the safety trade?

This is so tough to crack. But I'm determined to nail this down, whatever the cost.
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  • #1,187
  • Mar 7, 2013 11:05am Mar 7, 2013 11:05am
Quoting qtrader
Let me save you some money. I took this course and its better and the same concept. They have daily video outlook and a live trade room twice a week. They answer your email and have a skype room. You cant beat the price. http://www.daytradingforexlive.com/
Quoting qtrader
All I have seen the MMMethod videos and tried to trade with them. They are very vague and without live support and example you will fail. This site below is the best one and it is under $500.00. They do a video every night on the EU and GU. Tue and Thur they have a live trade room in London and NY. They have internal chat and countless videos of trades in action. These guys are the real deal.
http://www.daytradingforexlive.com/
qtrader,

Does Sterling and Chad get the level counts correct?
  • #1,188
  • Mar 7, 2013 11:19am Mar 7, 2013 11:19am
Ish- I'll try to give more later if I have time but the short answer is it is continuous but not always 123. Think of it like newtons law, a body will remain in motion til acted on by an external force, so if price exhausts itself in one level it's only going to be 1 level. Try to identify the key exhaustions points rather than the numbers. If it makes 3 levels before getting to that exhaustion point then look for the reversal or consolidation etc. make sense?
  • #1,189
  • Edited Mar 8, 2013 12:12am Mar 7, 2013 11:47pm | Edited Mar 8, 2013 12:12am
Quoting FX-Trader
Ish- I'll try to give more later if I have time but the short answer is it is continuous but not always 123. Think of it like newtons law, a body will remain in motion til acted on by an external force, so if price exhausts itself in one level it's only going to be 1 level. Try to identify the key exhaustions points rather than the numbers. If it makes 3 levels before getting to that exhaustion point then look for the reversal or consolidation etc. make sense?
Thank you, thank you, thank you FX-Trader!

It does make sense thanks to you my friend.

It's now a matter of accurately finding the levels and recognizing the resets (the key exhaustion points) + recognizing it LIVE. It always make sense when the damage is done. It is very subjective no doubt. Well, I think that's why they call it the art of trading.
  • #1,190
  • Mar 8, 2013 10:16am Mar 8, 2013 10:16am
Quoting Ishtana
Can someone please... please explain what's going on in the past 2 days with the majors? ALL SM teachings went out of the window, fake M&W, fake TDI signals and divergence, total disrespect of S&R levels. Price action is on crack. It's gone wild like a b****. Of course it's the NEWS dummy. But I'm talking even before the news. Oh man, lost a good chunk of my equity. =( Cry me a river!!!!!
Sorry to hear you lost a big chunk of your real cash account. The method didn't work for his paying students either.
No longer trading forex. Looking for full time job.
  • #1,191
  • Mar 8, 2013 12:12pm Mar 8, 2013 12:12pm
Quoting mmaker
Sorry to hear you lost a big chunk of your real cash account. The method didn't work for his paying students either.

It is noteworthy that in his recent bootcamps, Steve Mauro has rarely mentioned level counts. When he shows them they seem to be somewhat discretionary. As always hindsight is 20/20, and after the move is over anybody can go back and count the levels. If they are not crystal clear, ignore them or choose another pair. Stop focusing on levels and focus on "the pattern, the pattern, the pattern". I do very well without counting levels. Sure, I look for them, but I rarely see them. It sounds like Kim K. would agree. Also note that TDI repaints. I frequently see M & W patterns in TDI that disappear on a repaint several candles later.
Chance favors the prepared
  • #1,192
  • Mar 8, 2013 11:58pm Mar 8, 2013 11:58pm
Quoting JohnW
It is noteworthy that in his recent bootcamps, Steve Mauro has rarely mentioned level counts. When he shows them they seem to be somewhat discretionary. As always hindsight is 20/20, and after the move is over anybody can go back and count the levels. If they are not crystal clear, ignore them or choose another pair. Stop focusing on levels and focus on "the pattern, the pattern, the pattern". I do very well without counting levels. Sure, I look for them, but I rarely see them. It sounds like Kim K. would agree. Also note that TDI repaints. I...
Can I post your Holy Grail document here to help the people struggling to learn this Method? They may not have seen your thread. You are one of the rare successful students of Steve Mauro.
No longer trading forex. Looking for full time job.
  • #1,193
  • Mar 9, 2013 1:38am Mar 9, 2013 1:38am
Quoting Ishtana
Can someone please... please explain what's going on in the past 2 days with the majors? ALL SM teachings went out of the window, fake M&W, fake TDI signals and divergence, total disrespect of S&R levels. Price action is on crack. It's gone wild like a b****. Of course it's the NEWS dummy. But I'm talking even before the news. Oh man, lost a good chunk of my equity. =( Cry me a river!!!!!
Hi Ishtana!
I don't read this thread often but I have some grasp on what SM teaches. I also try to incorporate somethings in my trading.
I think that levels are not the most robust part on his teachings. By robust, I mean it is not very accurate and is not applicable to all pairs(try to find levels on usdjpy or audusd, for example).
But, the 2 most important things are:
1. the accumulation
2. where the volume is trapped -> where are the stop loss orders, because it is where liquidity is standing and are vulnerable to be taken.
Also, peak formations are very good ideas as well. Be aware that peak formations are recognized on after the fact. And, more important, don't think that a peak formation will lead to a fresh new 3 levels! It can be only a pause.
But here is an example on how to recognize and work with peak formations(this is a 1hr eurus chart): http://screencast.com/t/zyIyBXJex7o

Anyways, after you recognize the accumulation area, be aware where stops are. And, after you see the stop hunt done, the next step is to wait the second leg to enter.
So, to facilitate our job in using this approach, one thing that is very important is to keep your charts marked with levels that you think the great amount of stop loss orders are standing.
Then, if you see stop loss buy orders being hunted, the move is to the downside(because they sell into it) and if you see stop loss sell orders being hunted, then the move is to the upside(because the use this liquidity to buy into).

Here is an example of what happened with eurusd yesterday, before the NFP. The entry was difficult because there is no second leg but the stop hunting is clear.
Again, it will only be clear if you have your levels marked. Remember, mark your charts. This is your map. Without a map, we cannot read what are their intentions.

Here is the chart for your reference(eurusd 15min chart): http://screencast.com/t/PBZOCgBK7l

This pattern(accumulation, stop hunting and trend move) is very robust and consistent, among not only currency pairs but also in all financial assets. Because this is how things must be done. You have to accumulate first, remove all weak holders and then, mark the prices up or down. This cycle repeats itself over and over again. But, and it is important to remember, the form it will take varies a lot. Remember it: THE FORM VARIES A LOT BUT THE CONTENT IS THE SAME!
These words are from Martin Cole course, I have to say.
Keep concentrated on recognizing the accumulation phase and then, the stop hunting. Sometimes the stop hunting is not that clear.

Hope it helps a bit.

Also, never give up! Currency trading is an amazing job and business. Make all you can to learn and master it. You will get there, believe it. It is not hard neither difficult. It is just a skill that you have to develop(I am not a great trader but am in my way to be! :-)

And sorry if it is a bit confusing! I am not good to explain things out! :-)
Cheers!
Joao Paulo
  • #1,194
  • Mar 9, 2013 2:30am Mar 9, 2013 2:30am
Well done joaoborras for your simple tutorial. Any more update from you will be appreciated. Keep it up
  • #1,195
  • Mar 9, 2013 3:30am Mar 9, 2013 3:30am
Quoting joaoborras
Hi Ishtana!
I don't read this thread often but I have some grasp on what SM teaches. I also try to incorporate somethings in my trading.
I think that levels are not the most robust part on his teachings. By robust, I mean it is not very accurate and is not applicable to all pairs(try to find levels on usdjpy or audusd, for example).
But, the 2 most important things are:
1. the accumulation
2. where the volume is trapped -> where are the stop loss orders, because it is where liquidity is standing and are vulnerable to be taken.
Also, peak formations...
Hey Joao,
Do you have FF TradeExplorer or Myfxbook to show how these techniques work out in real trading? An example of Myfxbook statistics as below, it is free to join and easy to link to your MT4 account.
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/pips...service/344437
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/TPOT...urnalfx/410565
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/Nick.../haruea/397496
No longer trading forex. Looking for full time job.
  • #1,196
  • Mar 9, 2013 4:07am Mar 9, 2013 4:07am
Quoting mmaker
An example of Myfxbook statistics as below, it is free to join and easy to link to your MT4 account.
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/pips...service/344437
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/TPOT...urnalfx/410565
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/Nick.../haruea/397496
These are great links, MMaker. Proof of the pudding is in the tasting. To say that one doesn't use MT4 and cannot track account progress with a website as a result, is questionable IMO. SM uses MT4 in all trade examples I've seen. Studying profitable traders through MYFXBook or other such sites is encouraging and also the best way to verify profits/losses. There is no such thing as a perfect equity curve.
Sentiment: Short on cash. Long on hope.
  • #1,197
  • Mar 9, 2013 6:48am Mar 9, 2013 6:48am
Quoting mmaker
Hey Joao,
Do you have FF TradeExplorer or Myfxbook to show how these techniques work out in real trading? An example of Myfxbook statistics as below, it is free to join and easy to link to your MT4 account.
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/pips...service/344437
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/TPOT...urnalfx/410565
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/Nick.../haruea/397496
Hi mmaker.
I will have a look on it so.
But I am afraid that it will generate more critics than be constructive. Because I have big draw downs, not due to the inefficacy of my trading approach but mostly because issues with money management and trading psychology.

Even with the best trading approach in the world, at the end, it is the trader that makes it or not.
So, if you see big draw downs, don't be discouraged in relation to the approaching your are using. Draw downs tell more about the trader than the system, in my opinion.
Also, VSA is a big part of my trading. It helps a lot in 2 aspects:
1. identify accumulation/distribution earlier
2. to find very precise entries. My entries are most taken from the 1min chart, with very small stop loss. Well, again, sometimes I get wild and things become very ugly but it is more me than the system. :-)

With that said, I will have a look on myfxbook.

Cheers!
Joao Paulo
  • #1,198
  • Edited 9:16am Mar 9, 2013 8:53am | Edited 9:16am
Quoting NeoRio
These are great links, MMaker. Proof of the pudding is in the tasting. To say that one doesn't use MT4 and cannot track account progress with a website as a result, is questionable IMO. SM uses MT4 in all trade examples I've seen. Studying profitable traders through MYFXBook or other such sites is encouraging and also the best way to verify profits/losses. There is no such thing as a perfect equity curve.
I knew you would respond sooner or later. I was wondering for how long you can tolerate the renewed discussions about Steve Mauro's Method without coming in to take a jab or to promote your own Skype room again for the umpteenth time. You are going to say that Martin Cole is better or subtly getting people to contact you for your own B.O.B System. Why don't you stay out of this and let people discuss what they want to discuss about the Steve Mauro Method, and show Myfxbook as proof of success? Just go away, we know about your open invitation to your Skype room already.

Quoting joaoborras
Hi mmaker.
I will have a look on it so.
But I am afraid that it will generate more critics than be constructive. Because I have big draw downs, not due to the inefficacy of my trading approach but mostly because issues with money management and trading psychology.

Even with the best trading approach in the world, at the end, it is the trader that makes it or not.
So, if you see big draw downs, don't be discouraged in relation to the approaching your are using. Draw downs tell more about the trader than the system, in my opinion.
Also, VSA is a big part of my trading. It helps a lot in 2 aspects:
1. identify accumulation/distribution earlier
2. to find very precise entries. My entries are most taken from the 1min chart, with very small stop loss. Well, again, sometimes I get wild and things become very ugly but it is more me than the system. :-)

With that said, I will have a look on myfxbook.

Cheers!
Joao Paulo
Don't worry about it. There are so many 10+ vouches "gurus" in this forum who don't even dare to show FF TradeExplorer or Myfxbook statistics, with all sorts of lame excuses. Or if you want to see their Myfxbook, you have to join their Skype room or YouTube channel, using what we called funneling tactics to gain followers.

One of the Myfxbook link trader, TPOTrader has a thread where he discussed his recent drawdowns so it's normal that everyone experienced it from time to time.
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...93#post6501593

Please show charts using VSA techniques, we used to see that from hart3000 when he was contributing to this thread.
No longer trading forex. Looking for full time job.
  • #1,199
  • Mar 9, 2013 2:11pm Mar 9, 2013 2:11pm
MMaker, you are out of order.

NeoRio did nothing other than to applaud you for your message to this forum. He didn't take a jab, mention his Skype room, his system, or Martin Cole. What he DID say was:

Quote
Studying profitable traders through MYFXBook or other such sites is encouraging and also the best way to verify profits/losses.
You can't disagree with that!

SM~ couldn't show his trades/accounts via MyFXBook.com as his money-machine would dry up over night, and there would be even more lawyers getting their pockets filled by punters, unhappy with their lack of progress with the MMM4X, or BTMM or whatever he'll call it next, suing him.
  • #1,200
  • Mar 10, 2013 7:50am Mar 10, 2013 7:50am
mmaker is just tired, and tense. u need to relax a little, I am not defending Neo but, like what the other fella said. he didn't say anything wrong.

whatever it is... I still think it's a good deal bringing myfxbook up. This whole crazy forum needs to be cleaned up. Just two many good threads needs to be simplified, I'm sick of "do your hours on the charts" or "going thru 5000posts", we are sooooo better than that! why would you like others to suffer like you? it's crazy!! How can we ever progress if we all don't want something better for someone else?!

Simplified : How can we progress if we don't allow others to progress when we can't do it ourselves?

Sick and tired of how this world works already. Don't worry, I don't ramble all the time.

OK, thanks for the links of the three myfxbook fellas, I've already PM them, a "useless" PM to ask to share their strategy (Don't worry, I don't do stupud things all the time.) , but the least I could get is to trust the broker cause they've paid out those amounts (e.g. Withdrawn $11766.00[NocturnalFX].

Now, like I already said somewhere somehow, there's no holygrail, so I pick those "exceptions" from all these dumb strategies (including SM) and patch things up with another. People want something to work 100%, I just want many things to work 60% and then filter all those 40% failures out.

Come on already, flame me, ignore me, my life goes on...
bit . ly/fantestimonials
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