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vsa with Malcolm

  • #23,321
  • Dec 6, 2012 10:01am Dec 6, 2012 10:01am
Quoting Sonofsin5
A lot of volume coming in on the EurUsd, time to look for a quick stab at a long with a tight sl.
Also keep a eye on 15 min audusd, if we break the daily highs look out!
You're braver than me!
Still looks a bit weak I think.
  • #23,322
  • Dec 6, 2012 2:11pm Dec 6, 2012 2:11pm
When I mean his explanations on VSA (Tom Williams) pertaining to Trade Guider software would be no benefit, his software would definitely be a benefit, but it costs more than I want to spend. I use Baby Pips quite frequently. But Baby Pips is aimed more at traditional trading, indicators and price patterns, very little volume analysis. Except for a thread with Petefader. He has some interesting videos and a thread on VSA but it isn't enough. I can see your explanations are a bit different than Petefaders. I am sure the same basics, but a bit more information, like the candlestick explanations. I guess if your reading a candlestick, you can read it the same as a bar. Same closings and openings, highs and lows only difference is the reference to lows and highs, as candlesticks use shadows but are the same as the high and low of a bar. I am sure. I'll get the hang of it with some practice. I feel VSA should be learned along with Indicators and the other stuff. If Smart Money is 80% of market action or movement, whatever you want to call it, then VSA must have a huge impact on trading.
  • #23,323
  • Dec 6, 2012 4:23pm Dec 6, 2012 4:23pm
Quoting sweatx
When I mean his explanations on VSA (Tom Williams) pertaining to Trade Guider software would be no benefit, his software would definitely be a benefit, but it costs more than I want to spend. I use Baby Pips quite frequently. But Baby Pips is aimed more at traditional trading, indicators and price patterns, very little volume analysis. Except for a thread with Petefader. He has some interesting videos and a thread on VSA but it isn't enough. I can see your explanations are a bit different than Petefaders. I am sure the same basics, but a bit...
Traditionally, VSA doesn't use candlesticks so unless someone on the forum has put something together you're not going to really find any literature pertaining to candlesticks and VSA. That being said, it's purely personal preference.

Read Master the Markets, there are a few mentions of TG but that doesn't matter. As Intel has already said, it'll be well worth reading this thread as well. You'll find a copy of Master the Markets if you search the attachments for this thread.

By all means ask questions and you'll find everyone will be more than willing to help but it does help if you have a grounding first so that the "easier" questions aren't being asked and answered all the time. That grounding is reading through Master the Markets.

Edit - I couldn't find it in the attachments, it is linked in this post though - http://www.forexfactory.com/showthre...30#post5420330
  • #23,324
  • Edited 5:23pm Dec 6, 2012 5:04pm | Edited 5:23pm
So did anyone get in short today?

Must admit I was a little surprised with the amount it moved. Then again, very little surprises me with EU these days.

PnF gave an indication but I didn't dare! I know this isn't a PnF thread so please let me know if you don't want to be seeing this out of control game of noughts and crosses. (Tic-tac-toe for those of you in the US!) If it was good enough for Wyckoff, it's good enough for me.

As I mentioned yesterday, there's an upside target of 3190 in play. This is still in play as the low of the count column hasn't been taken out. With this count still in play and it clearly trending upwards I wasn't too keen on taking a short.

I took the 7 box count at the top of the chart before the drive down as I noticed that the sell signal could form. This gave a downside target of 2910, which is still very much in play as well. With NFP tomorrow, who knows, we could hit both targets!
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  • #23,325
  • Dec 7, 2012 1:22am Dec 7, 2012 1:22am
Quoting Intel
You're braver than me!
Still looks a bit weak I think.
Had to take a crack at it. When that much activity comes into play its sometimes worth a small nibble.
Flipping through the charts I like what I see from the GBPUSD, waiting for one more sign of weakness to hop on the short bus with Gavin.
  • #23,326
  • Dec 7, 2012 4:07am Dec 7, 2012 4:07am
Just found the vsa club forum, you dont have to be a member to view only to post.

When you click on a thread change the settings on the right hand side form "last 30 days" to "all topics" otherwise you wont get much.

http://www.vsaclub.com/forum/default.aspx
Seek not to change the world; seek only to change your mind about the world
  • #23,327
  • Dec 7, 2012 12:35pm Dec 7, 2012 12:35pm
Quoting KinsaleForex
So did anyone get in short today?

Must admit I was a little surprised with the amount it moved. Then again, very little surprises me with EU these days.

PnF gave an indication but I didn't dare! I know this isn't a PnF thread so please let me know if you don't want to be seeing this out of control game of noughts and crosses. (Tic-tac-toe for those of you in the US!) If it was good enough for Wyckoff, it's good enough for me.

As I mentioned yesterday, there's an upside target of 3190 in play. This is still in play as the low of the count column...
Awesome, PNF definitely is part of many firms' tactical planning, but mostly larger perspective. For example a daily review of a longer term SPX PNF before the trading day to begin forming the plan for the day/week.
  • #23,328
  • Dec 7, 2012 5:19pm Dec 7, 2012 5:19pm
KinsaleForex- I tried the download link for the e book, but it looks like a spam site. It only showed a preview of the book and then a bunch of advertisements. Thanks anyway. I'll get it figured out. I think Tom Williams is more interested in selling his software than teaching VSA. No doubt that the information would be helpful, if it can be found.
  • #23,329
  • Dec 8, 2012 7:39am Dec 8, 2012 7:39am
Quoting sweatx
KinsaleForex- I tried the download link for the e book, but it looks like a spam site. It only showed a preview of the book and then a bunch of advertisements. Thanks anyway. I'll get it figured out. I think Tom Williams is more interested in selling his software than teaching VSA. No doubt that the information would be helpful, if it can be found.
Ah come on man, I can't help but feel you're making this a little more difficult that it should be.

It's not a spam site, just sign up for free and download it! Close your account after if you're that worried. You need to get the TG selling fixation out of your mind as well, yes there is an element of this but it is a book you must read. Tom Williams is a teacher, Gavin is a good trader / teacher and salesman.

Download it.
  • #23,330
  • Dec 8, 2012 7:40am Dec 8, 2012 7:40am
A quick chart dump for a set up on Friday evening. A lot of lines but just concentrate on the zone I've marked in orange as the starting point for the set up.
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  • #23,331
  • Dec 8, 2012 8:55am Dec 8, 2012 8:55am
Quoting KinsaleForex
Ah come on man, I can't help but feel you're making this a little more difficult that it should be.

It's not a spam site, just sign up for free and download it! Close your account after if you're that worried. You need to get the TG selling fixation out of your mind as well, yes there is an element of this but it is a book you must read. Tom Williams is a teacher, Gavin is a good trader / teacher and salesman.

Download it.
Maybe I am, but the book was only an introduction. I'll check it out again. Actually I've been searching on the internet, and I have found some really good material on VSA. Bunches of it. I am starting to get the hang of it. It does take some study, for me anyhow. I'll find a full version of the book and download it. I really want to get this down, because money is on the line, mine! Thanks!
  • #23,332
  • Dec 9, 2012 12:33am Dec 9, 2012 12:33am
Quoting sweatx
Maybe I am, but the book was only an introduction. I'll check it out again. Actually I've been searching on the internet, and I have found some really good material on VSA. Bunches of it. I am starting to get the hang of it. It does take some study, for me anyhow. I'll find a full version of the book and download it. I really want to get this down, because money is on the line, mine! Thanks!
Direct link to MTM: http://vsa.pipbuilders.com/mtmv3.pdf

Yes, MTM is an introductory book, even on the first couple of pages it tells you the purpose of the book is to teach you "the basic introductory principles of VSA methodology". MTM teaches you the foundation of VSA so you understand what you are looking at and tries to guide your thinking towards the market.

IMO I think you would be better off reading MTM until you have mastered the principles in the book and then spending the rest of your time starring at your own charts. I do not think people get that in order to be able to trade you have to make your trading style your own, even with VSA. If you have read any of the posts in this thread you will realize that everyone sees things just a bit different, has their own rules in which you can only get that from what you see on your charts.
  • #23,333
  • Dec 9, 2012 12:41am Dec 9, 2012 12:41am
4h EU chart.

Between Thursday and Friday we have quite a bit of volume come in, in the last leg up from 12/3-12/5 we see supply coming into the market, its not uncommon especially on down moves to see a quick widespread down bar on ultra high volume that is absorption volume after you have seen supply, but what catches my eye is the massive SO on Friday.
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  • #23,334
  • Dec 9, 2012 12:50am Dec 9, 2012 12:50am
Quoting SimpleDev
4h EU chart.

Between Thursday and Friday we have quite a bit of volume come in, in the last leg up from 12/3-12/5 we see supply coming into the market, its not uncommon especially on down moves to see a quick widespread down bar on ultra high volume that is absorption volume after you have seen supply, but what catches my eye is the massive SO on Friday.
Ryan, just the person I was looking for. I have attached a 720 minute chart. What are your thoughts now? I know you were previously bullish.

That last interval has not closed but it looks like a mini shake out type interval.
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Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #23,335
  • Edited 3:58am Dec 9, 2012 1:04am | Edited 3:58am
Quoting HiddenGap
Ryan, just the person I was looking for. I have attached a 720 minute chart. What are your thoughts now? I know you were previously bullish.

That last interval has not closed but it looks like a mini shake out type interval.
I have not been able to replicate your 12h charts.. I have tried using LO and US start times, you have a nice HV UT right at the top of yours that I do not.

Still bullish, I think that Friday was a SO, and looking for some testing at the start of this week. I also have 2925 as monthly support so Friday's SO is in the right spot.

The UT on weekly chart is very concerning, but with that 2 bar on monthly still behind us and the month of November closed as a test of sorts it seems as if everything is still coming together.

*Edit*

Here is my 12h, I marked off the last leg up in yellow, the volume is a bit less than average which I do not think there was a lot of actual selling, maybe a bit of profit taking?

The wide spread down bar from Thursday the highest volume in 3 weeks, like I said that could pass as absorption volume to tank EU, but then we have the SO on Friday. It does not make sense to me to have absorption volume and then followed immediately by a HV SO which leaves me to believe that Thursday was buying and not absorption.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #23,336
  • Dec 9, 2012 3:25am Dec 9, 2012 3:25am
[quote
Yes, MTM is an introductory book, even on the first couple of pages it tells you the purpose of the book is to teach you "the basic introductory principles of VSA methodology". MTM teaches you the foundation of VSA so you understand what you are looking at and tries to guide your thinking towards the market.

IMO I think you would be better off reading MTM until you have mastered the principles in the book and then spending the rest of your time starring at your own charts. I do not think people get that in order to be able to trade you have to make your trading style your own, even with VSA. If you have read any of the posts in this thread you will realize that everyone sees things just a bit different, has their own rules in which you can only get that from what you see on your charts.[/quote]
Thanks for the link. I'll go over the book. I know traders have different methods of trading. But if SM is 80% or more of market behavior I think it is good to understand it. I don' know who IMO is though.
  • #23,337
  • Dec 10, 2012 2:50am Dec 10, 2012 2:50am
Quoting f451
hull moving average (HMA.mq4)
hull moving average two color (Hull_MA_2color.mq4 - I wrote this one, needs HMA.mq4)
i-SessionsLn.mq4 - a useful sessions indicator that I significantly improved from the original - this puts boxes around each session so you can visually see how the sessions affect price, correspond with the start of moves etc
SDX-TzPivots v4.7.2 - coded in my preferred colours.
Is there a Ninja Trader version of the Hull_MA_2color indicator please? Thanks you
  • #23,338
  • Dec 10, 2012 9:42am Dec 10, 2012 9:42am
Quoting danjuma
Is there a Ninja Trader version of the Hull_MA_2color indicator please? Thanks you
Ok, I have found one on NT forum.
  • #23,339
  • Dec 11, 2012 10:46am Dec 11, 2012 10:46am
Intel if you're still around I have a quick question - or if anyone else knows the answer then please feel free to put me out of my misery.

I keep seeing mention of a confirming bar after an upthrust and am totally fine with this. What I'd like to know is where this idea of a confirming bar came from. I've read and seen pretty much every resource I can find on VSA over the last 6 months but can't see mention of this anywhere by Tom, Seb, Todd, Gavin or any of the other VSA experts.

Thanks in advance
  • #23,340
  • Dec 11, 2012 3:49pm Dec 11, 2012 3:49pm
Quoting Jonny 5
Intel if you're still around I have a quick question - or if anyone else knows the answer then please feel free to put me out of my misery.

I keep seeing mention of a confirming bar after an upthrust and am totally fine with this. What I'd like to know is where this idea of a confirming bar came from. I've read and seen pretty much every resource I can find on VSA over the last 6 months but can't see mention of this anywhere by Tom, Seb, Todd, Gavin or any of the other VSA experts.

Thanks in advance

They have always talked about confirmation, but there are a couple of things going on here.

On page 151 of Master the Markets, Tom states, " Up-thrusts are moneymaking traps that are designed to catch stops-they usually represent signs of weakness. If you have a distribution area directly behind you (to the left of your chart), and you see an up-thrust, this becomes a very strong indication of weakness. A sharp move down on the next day(bar) will confirm the weakness."

This is much the same with No Demand or any other sign of weakness, the interval after should be down.

The other aspect has to do with the Tradeguider signals. Many do not print unless or until the next interval confirms the weakness by closing lower. Although I do believe this can be turned off. If you look at a TG chart and see yellow boxes at the bottom of the chart, that means there was an indication of strength or weakness that did not confirm and therefore no signal was printed.........

**EDIT**: Just to be clear the Up Thrust does not need confirmation to be an Up Thrust. The confirmation is of the weakness an Up Thrust usually represents.
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
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