Broker Manipulation

I trade not the first year and I know that there are could be plenty of manipulations (different kinds of!) dealing with quotes, manipulation of traders fills, traders positions, etc.
So I prefer trade with reliable and long-term tested brokerage, moreover spreads are better that others have.

Have you managed to win back the €14,000 that you lost to IB? If so, what changes did you make?

No I havn't. I have lost more though trying alternative techniques. Forex trading is the biggest scam market on the planet, and I can not believe it has been allowed to go on for this long. No wonder U.S. is banning it's traders...

I have attempted other relatively safe methods and trials but nothing works.

The trash that controls this market WILL NOT ALLOW YOU TO MAKE MONEY!

If any particular account does make money, THEY WILL TARGET YOUR ACCOUNT UNTIL YOUR IN THE NEGATIVE!

If anyone is in a successfull trade and they know it, and they don't allow the MM's to fake you out or scare you out, the MM's will not move the market until your position is cleared. THEY WILL NOT MOVE IT!!! Instead they will push the market against your position is aggressive, agitated spikes.

And no, i'm not some negative trader who is pissed off. I love trading, but this game is severly rigged and anyone who beats it will be hand selected to be taken out...

Cheers!

But somehow you were able to make money in the months and years before this disaster two months. Something must be working when you made money.

Yes nothing changed before and after. The only thing that changed was IB started targeting my account, as I had made money from them. In forex either your own broker is targeting you, or the bigger manipulators are targeting you. In this case, IB started distorting my price feed by up to 14 pips against me as in the previous posts...

If you are trading somewhat larger account than the typical forex punters (e.g. US$500, US$5000, US$15,000 on nano, micro and mini accounts) but where you actually trade 7-10 standard lots on sizeable US$50K to US$250K accounts, then maybe there are other type of brokers like http://www.cfhmarkets.com/ where they don't entertain small accounts. Maybe such brokers don't hunt stops or play tricks to kill small accounts like your current broker.

lol it has nothing to do with his broker. Some people are plain suckers at this and it shows in their attitudes. It takes them several big losses to convince them this business is not for them. Even then they still blame it on brokers and even the entire forex market instead of taking responsibility for their choices and moving on.

This guy thinks just because he lost then the entire forex market is "rigged" and should be stopped. He even thinks the US is "banning it's traders" because of this. lol

Hey Eatmypips, come back anytime buddy. We love the cheap liquidity people like you bring.

Some of you might say this is immoral but as it's said in poker, "it's immoral to let a sucker keep his money". This business is not a charity. Players bring their money to the table and in the end only a few of them win. If you don't like that, don't play.

As for brokers there are a few thieves out there, but they aren't many. There are also those that will charge you more than they should and give you shittier conditions than you can get, now these they are everywhere. Don't be a sucker and learn how forex and brokers really work, then find a company that gives you a fair deal and has truly no conflict of interest with you (forget what it says, you have to find this out on your own by finding out what their trading model really is exactly). They exist. If you fail to do this however, and/or fail to ever find your edge in this market, then don't come back whining about forex being rigged and you being the target of the evil forces of the market, the world doesn't revolve around you. Take responsibility for your own choices and learn something from it, or move on.

Otherwise, like I said, feel free to keep that attitude and come back anytime.

Hey Marv, take up my challenge I posted under Steve Marau's thread > that is trade larger than 7 lots, proove you could hold the trade longer than 2 minutes without taking a loss in a market absent from news, and show us your results.

Otherwise, enjoy your scam!

Hello again...I asked this question before but did not get an answer, so I'll have another go: Do you think brokers are being dishonest just by manipulating the price/spread they show to you or do youthink they actually manage to move the market against your position?

Why not just trade with less than 7 lots, say 4 or 5 standard lots but took many positions. Or open separate smaller accounts and trade less than 7 lots.

I'll answer you EZ. The MM doesn't move the Interbank market, and couldn't if they did want to. They only have to change the price they show to their customers. There are many ways to do this, software in MT4 that will do it, or they can shut down their access to liquidity (something that is done in slow markets btw) so that their feeds are different.

But as to stop hunting - its fairly easy to see when it happens. I think some brokers simply don't like scalpers and news traders, while others (ECNs mostly) don't care. I'm wondering, if Eat's broker just decided to make it difficult to scalp. A 14pip difference would do the trick. However I can't say if this fits Eat's trading style, just an observation.

Yeah sure. It's not like I have anything more important to do with my time and money than prove things to some random loser on the internet.

If by "enjoy your scam" you mean trading in this great, predictable, and highly liquid market, then don't worry I'm enjoying it. And unlike you I'm grateful I live in a time where I have the privilege of easy and cheap access to it.

@ ez0770 As pidgeon says, brokers cannot move the price of the currency on the interbank market. What they can do however is show the customer false prices. There are two types of manipulation. First is manipulation by the broker of either MT4, or whatever platform you use. This is done by controlling the data feed to your charts and what you see on the charts. Giving you false data! They can also throw spikes ect, that are not real. They will only do this if they have taken the opposite side of your trade, therefore money you make is their money, and money they make is your money. If they are true ECN they won't do this. But... just because they claim to be ECN, doesn't mean they actually pass your trade on. If your a shitty trader like Marv, why would they pass off his money to the banks? They accept the risk and hold the trade. A decent and large forex dealer has the ability to take the risk of your trade against themselves, and profit from your loss, or pass the trade through to the actual market if the risk, or lot size is too big. If they pass it through to the "interbank market" it will most likely go to one of the big banks > Bank of America, Citibank, JP Morgan, Deutch Bank, and about 6 others. All in all there are only about 12 major banks which I know of which make up this market. At least this is supposedly where my trades go when trading through IB.
Second type of manipulation is done by the banks. This is when they do all the shitty things they do that you see, and hear people complain about. I am certain that the "4 trillion forex market" is controlled by computers, which are owned and operated by this consortium of banks.

These computers run off very complex algorithms to maintain the highest degree of profitability for those banks. These algorithms are not the same as algorithms traders talk about with regards to MT4 expert advisors and auto traders. Any currency input into these algorithms, instantaneously changes the output value of the algo, which causes the market to go up or down. As the desired goal of the banks is to take your money, when you place a trade long for example, the algo will push the price of the currency down. This will hold you in a negative trade. The only time the algo will allow your trade to be profitable is if it is a very small dollar amount (eg $1 000 to $50 000), or if the value of other orders at a higher price, is more valuable than the loss they would incur to you. Either way, if they move the market up to get those other orders, the algo's will then calculate the exact price the market needs to be at to trap the most dollar value from all the traders in that currency at that particular point in time.
The computers can also be manually controlled by the banking elite to take out individual traders, or individual trades by large institutions or smaller international banks. The bankers are only governed by the "rules" placed upon them every day by the world bank, in order to maintain international economic stability, as required. These rules may limit a currency to no lower or higher each day than a certain price. Within those boundaries though, they can do almost whatever they want, including spiking the currency below those price points temporarily in order to maximise there days profit.

@ Pidgeon Mostly I don't scalp, my trades are held for several hours to several days. But... I still scalp occasionally. My most recent scalping was off non-farm news a couple months ago with 2 or 3 lots. I managed to make 4k profit in a minute or two, before my platform miracuously started logging out. Logged out a total of about 4 times, before my profit was down to about $1500, at which point I quit for the day. As well as this, my orders were blatently delayed by 2 - 4 seconds. One other thing I have noticed about profiting in forex is, approx $1200 - $1500 per day seems to be the magical number that you cannot exceed before being targeted, at least by IB. Above this number is very rare and difficult to achieve. If you can make this much money in a day, the best thing to do is quit for the day, and be extremely carefull for the rest of the week, as every trade after you profit this much will probably go against you... Brokers can see everything on your chart, including IB, and if your net profit is too high for them and your up 50 pips for example on a long, and they know your going to exit the trade, its nothing for them to hold the trade 14 pips lower than actual price in order to give them a 14 pip discount. Same with buying, if the IB forex dealers know your style, and they know your going to place a trade short, they can push price lower so you go short 14 pips lower than you should have, then they bring price back 14 pips in opposite direction. On a 5 lot trade, 28 pips is $1400 bucks, they just raped you out of... Then they just gotta hold that as long as possible till you close the trade yourself at a loss, or till the bankers push the price back higher and your margined out/ stopped out ect.

@ Marv Put your money where your mouth is, and show us your profitable 7 lot trade, otherwise go f** yourself.

Hang in there Emp. You've a lot to learn for when markets move, an experienced technician knows that is happening irrespective of whose feed he is looking at. So study hard, get rid of the indicators and be patient. FX trading is a hard road.

I won't put my time and money to prove something for you so that you can feel better. Stop projecting your problems on everybody and everything else. The burden of proof is on you not us. You make the claims (that forex is "rigged" lol), so you go ahead and prove them with statistically significant data using several reputable DMA brokerages to demonstrate that the entire market is rigged not just one ECN (natural slippage due to the size of the order doesn't count btw). It is doable so don't say you can't do it or ask me to do it, I'm not the one who believes forex is a scam.

Maybe then you can make a case and act like you actually posses the dark truth and will enlighten us (you may even get famous for exposing something like this), and not just another sore loser justifying his losses.

$100 says you won't do this and will just keep whining and pointing fingers.

Well on some Points he is right, on some Points he is wrong.

First of all the forex market was never designed to let retailers be profitable. Retailers are only allowed to provide liquidity. Anyone that wants to make Money with forex is basically on the wrong place. The ones that win in this market are the Brokers and the Banks. But, for a Little bit of gambling as an alternative to a Casino it is more than OK. That's why the Primary objective of FX trading should never be to make Money, but to have fun.

On the other hand, when you are not happy with your Broker, why don't you simply change it?

There are hundreds of Brokers out there. I recommend you ICAP EBS:

http://www.icap.com/markets/electron.../ebs-spot.aspx

More bullshit from someone who just couldn't win.

It's clear these guys are gamblers at heart, no wonder they keep losing.

Useless advice.

First of all, almost no one here has the funds for that kind of account.

Second, this is like somebody who couldn't learn how to drive a regular car and so decides to buy a Lamborghini thinking it will make a difference. lol

You can make money in retail, I know this for a fact. If you can't do that, don't even bother go to tier 2 or tier 1 brokerages, pretending that will somehow turn you into a winner. The only difference you'll get is that your losses will be even bigger.

You're wrong. You can trade to a 100%accuracy but it is complex. Trading consistently accurate (as in 100%) can be done despite what anyone says here. But it is complex to the point where one pip can determine whether a move is for real or not.

You have to do your homework and it will take you down a rabbit's warren of rules. For example, todays euro buy was signalled well before the red news items.

I wouldn't venture to tech it as there are many variables to a good and bad move. But it is out there is my point which I occasionally remind people on here.

@ Pidgeon and Eaetmypips, thanks for your reply first of all. I wanted to raise a couple of points based on what you guys are saying here:

1) You agree that your broker cannot move the real market price against you, but they can only manipulate the price that they show you by shading it. The solution in this case is quite simple, get your chart data from a different and more reliable source and if you see a massive discrepancy in pricing in non-fast market conditions just change broker and maybe go for a stp broker ( I thought IB was stp by the way) as opposed to a broker dealer to avoid conflicts of interest in execution.

2) Eatmypips, you mention algorithmic trading in your post and this is where it gets potentially interesting for me. Assuming that you are dealing with a highly capitalized and technologically sophisticated broker/dealer, chances are they are using algos to manage clients' flow.
Now, a couple of weeks ago a piece of news caught my attention, check this out: http://www.advancedtrading.com/articles/240003536.
I've seen flashing before in the interest rate futures market. From the way I understand it, it's a way to spoof the market to try to change the order flow by and move the market by a couple of ticks, (but keep in mind that markets are dynamic and if the practice is succesful in attracting enough flow, 1-2 ticks can become 10-12 or more very quickly).
Could it be that at times, a broker/dealer that has the technology flashes prices ahead of one of their profitable clients to skew the order book and move the market against him/her? What do you guys think? It would be interesting also to hear the opinion of someone that has first hand experience with algos....