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Stop-Hunting Question

  • #61
  • May 29, 2012 5:03pm May 29, 2012 5:03pm
Quoting KumoDragon
LOL, you child. I run a business outside of forex where I take home 300K+ a year. I've been trading for the better part of the past decade or so, making and losing more than you make in year. So, no problems with my life or lack of knowledge.

You on the other hand, I would bet money that you work in retail or a fast food restaurant and watch the screens for hours at time with your pitiful little micro account and dream of turning it into millions one day.

Guess what. Not going to happen, go to McColledge so you can be the manager one...

HAHAHAHHA

stop it... your a moron there is no way in hell you make 300k a year unless it was handed to you from your pops.... but hey you know what they say the apple doesn't fall to far from the tree so i dont buy it.

and why are you claiming how much money you make on a public forum? if you really did make that loot, you would not be wasting your time here right now. so your just one big sick f*ckin joke.

You wanna come talk sh*t and settle this face to face, just private message me. on a 300k a year salary, that plane flight is nothing for you.


ps - I am a full time trader.
  • #62
  • May 29, 2012 5:05pm May 29, 2012 5:05pm
Quoting Monroe
dude your a joke, hang it up. Pick a new hobby. everything you utter is complete dogsh*t, and your breath reeks.

I never said stop hunts don't happen, its part of my strategy, but you can't effing read so hey thats not my problem.

Oanda has never stop hunted me, ever.

I am sure you will keep looking for systems until you die cause you have no chance in hell.
O so stop hunts happen? But your market maker broker who loses money when you win, wouldn't ever stop hunt? Sure that makes a lot of sense.

And how the hell would you know if getting stopped out was stop hunting or not? What? when you asked they spouted the standard reply, " we don't stop hunt." Sure, sure, the spread just happend to widen by 5-10 pips when it was by the stop. Sure that little spike that hit your stop by 1-3 pips then immediately went back strongly in the direction of the trade, that wasn't the broker, that was the natural market movement......right.
  • #63
  • May 29, 2012 5:06pm May 29, 2012 5:06pm
Quoting KumoDragon
O so stop hunts happen? But your market maker broker who loses money when you win, wouldn't ever stop hunt? Sure that makes a lot of sense.

And how the hell would you know if getting stopped out was stop hunting or not? What? when you asked they spouted the standard reply, " we don't stop hunt." Sure, sure, the spread just happend to widen by 5-10 pips when it was by the stop. Sure that little spike that hit your stop by 1-3 pips then immediately went back strongly in the direction of the trade, that wasn't the broker, that was the...
Do you think I am actually going to tell you anything now besides the fact that your an idiot?

Yes stop hunts happen i said this a long time ago but your just too damn dumb.... and you can't fix dumb man, that sucks.


I am done on this thread if you have any beef, message me and we can handle it. Don't try and redeem yourself publicly.... its too late.
  • #64
  • May 29, 2012 5:09pm May 29, 2012 5:09pm
Quoting Monroe
HAHAHAHHA

stop it... your a moron there is no way in hell you make 300k a year unless it was handed to you from your pops.... but hey you know what they say the apple doesn't fall to far from the tree so i dont buy it.

and why are you claiming how much money you make on a public forum? if you really did make that loot, you would not be wasting your time here right now. so your just one big sick f*ckin joke.

You wanna come talk sh*t and settle this face to face, just private message me. on a 300k a year salary, that plane flight is nothing...
The thing sheeple like you, who don't ever make any real money, is that people who have money keep trying to make more and diversify. I actually have several small businesses I either own or am a partner in. Forex is just another venture for me.

LOL, ya now your an internet tough guy huh? lol what a child. Must have hit a nerve with the McJob comments.
  • #65
  • May 29, 2012 5:10pm May 29, 2012 5:10pm
LOL, so I'm a chode KumoDragon for pointing out the obvious? I'd be mad, but I did not know what a chode was, and after googling, I have now added a lovely insult to my vocab LOL so we have a love-hate relationship so far.

The thing is, besides a few niche inefficiencies specific to different markets, your trading methodology, if robust and profitable, should allow you to apply it to any market with positive expectancy. The fact that you claim to have been trading for more than a decade in stocks and forex, and are still trying to install indicators, reading Ichimoku threads and what not seems to imply that after all that time, you still have not come across that elusive method. Perhaps you have found 1000s of ways that don't work, so you're almost there, bro.

The simple fact is that maybe your experiences with brokers may have been at a time where forex trading and the like were new to retail. In today's modern age, brokers do not have the incentive to "hunt stops". Why would they be concerned about the stops of an individual retail trader? Let's assume you have the largest account at the broker. All it takes is a simple screenshot and transaction log, and a similar screenshot of another customer of the broker, and you could easily charge approach regulatory brokers with a pricing discriminatory case. Not only would it attract negative publicity, but it would also cost them.

The fact that you have witnessed markets turning to the pip, is not a feat of market brokers, let me assure you. For each time you have seen one of those instances, I can bet my bottom dollar that the stop was simply in a foolish place. The markets do not reward stupidity. Instead of complaining about price ALWAYS reversing, why don't you view things from another angle instead?

PS: When did this thread turn into one about money management?
  • #66
  • May 29, 2012 5:10pm May 29, 2012 5:10pm
Quoting Monroe
Do you think I am actually going to tell you anything now besides the fact that your an idiot?

Yes stop hunts happen i said this a long time ago but your just too damn dumb.... and you can't fix dumb man, that sucks.


I am done on this thread if you have any beef, message me and we can handle it. Don't try and redeem yourself publicly.... its too late.
Sorry, kid, but you are the only one who looks like an idiot. Better get changed and get ready for your shift behind the frech fry cooker at McDoogles. ahahah.
  • #67
  • May 29, 2012 5:11pm May 29, 2012 5:11pm
I think maybe a paradigm shift is in order.

Let's start with the assumption that all brokers stop hunt. Now let's assume that brokers do not stop hunt continuously. That is to say, there are places where and times when brokers are not stop hunting.

So where would they not stop hunt? Perhaps where there is a large amount of orders in the opposite direction. For example they might want to push price down, but every move down is met by an order to buy. Another way to say this would be, where there is a predominance of order flow in one direction, the brokers will not be able to stop hunt in the opposite direction.

So what does our paradigm shift lead us to?

We only want to be buyers where there is a predominance of buy orders and sellers where there is a predominance of sell orders. In more practical terms, we should only be looking to get long in Demand Zones and short in Supply Zones. By definition we would be taking our trades in the direction of the dominant order flow. Will we still take losses? Will our stops still get hit from time to time? Of course, but our paradigm shift has told us that there should be an edge by simply entering trades in defined zones as opposed to "random" entries. By "random" we mean anywhere where there is no reason to believe there is an order flow imbalance in the direction of our trade.

Our next step is to not enter trades when brokers are most able to manipulate prices. News events are such a time. Simply, we do not want to enter on a news event. We would want to look to trade the reaction to the news, but not the news event itself.
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #68
  • May 29, 2012 5:12pm May 29, 2012 5:12pm
Quoting xXTrizzleXx
LOL, so I'm a chode KumoDragon for pointing out the obvious? I'd be mad, but I did not know what a chode was, and after googling, I have now added a lovely insult to my vocab LOL so we have a love-hate relationship so far.

The thing is, besides a few niche inefficiencies specific to different markets, your trading methodology, if robust and profitable, should allow you to apply it to any market with positive expectancy. The fact that you claim to have been trading for more than a decade in stocks and forex, and are still trying to install indicators,...

he stole the insult i called him... in a post prior... a effin CHODE
  • #69
  • May 29, 2012 5:13pm May 29, 2012 5:13pm
Quoting KumoDragon
Sorry, kid, but you are the only one who looks like an idiot. Better get changed and get ready for your shift behind the frech fry cooker at McDoogles. ahahah.
do you have anything else in your bag of tricks or is that your one liner?
  • #70
  • May 29, 2012 5:14pm May 29, 2012 5:14pm
Look what I stumbled across....

http://www.nfa.futures.org/basicnet/...px?seqnum=2963

Very.... on topic.

Wow.
  • #71
  • May 29, 2012 5:14pm May 29, 2012 5:14pm
Quoting xXTrizzleXx
LOL, so I'm a chode KumoDragon for pointing out the obvious? I'd be mad, but I did not know what a chode was, and after googling, I have now added a lovely insult to my vocab LOL so we have a love-hate relationship so far.

The thing is, besides a few niche inefficiencies specific to different markets, your trading methodology, if robust and profitable, should allow you to apply it to any market with positive expectancy. The fact that you claim to have been trading for more than a decade in stocks and forex, and are still trying to install indicators,...
I just mentioned money managment becaues when a discussion like this ensues usually somewhere along the line someone mentions how they think money mangagement will save even a mediorce method.

"The fact that you claim to have been trading for more than a decade in stocks and forex, and are still trying to install indicators, reading Ichimoku threads and what not seems to imply that after all that time, you still have not come across that elusive method. Perhaps you have found 1000s of ways that don't work, so you're almost there, bro."

Yep, I have I've learned what doesn't work and come across things that seem to somewhat work. IME if a method doesn't work like gangbusters, it's not going to do very well over the long haul...even with moneymanagment.

It's not that I don't make money trading. I just havn't found/devised a method so far that makes me believe in it enough to think it will work, year round, year after year.
  • #72
  • May 29, 2012 5:15pm May 29, 2012 5:15pm
Quoting xXTrizzleXx
LOL, so I'm a chode KumoDragon for pointing out the obvious? I'd be mad, but I did not know what a chode was, and after googling, I have now added a lovely insult to my vocab LOL so we have a love-hate relationship so far.

The thing is, besides a few niche inefficiencies specific to different markets, your trading methodology, if robust and profitable, should allow you to apply it to any market with positive expectancy. The fact that you claim to have been trading for more than a decade in stocks and forex, and are still trying to install indicators,...
your the man trizzle, dont even stoop down to this level. there much better things we can be spending our time on. screw this.
  • #73
  • May 29, 2012 5:16pm May 29, 2012 5:16pm
Quoting HiddenGap
I think maybe a paradigm shift is in order.

Let's start with the assumption that all brokers stop hunt. Now let's assume that brokers do not stop hunt continuously. That is to say, there are places where and times when brokers are not stop hunting.

[color=black][font=Verdana]So where would they not stop hunt? Perhaps where there is a large amount of orders in the opposite direction. For example they might want to...
Exactly, what do you know a good thing came out of all the bickering.
  • #74
  • May 29, 2012 5:16pm May 29, 2012 5:16pm
Quoting KumoDragon
I just mentioned money managment becaues when a discussion like this ensues usually somewhere along the line someone mentions how they think money mangagement will save even a mediorce method.

"The fact that you claim to have been trading for more than a decade in stocks and forex, and are still trying to install indicators, reading Ichimoku threads and what not seems to imply that after all that time, you still have not come across that elusive method. Perhaps you have found 1000s of ways that don't work, so you're almost there, bro."...
LOLOL
  • #75
  • May 29, 2012 5:27pm May 29, 2012 5:27pm
Quoting Lightrain
Look what I stumbled across....

http://www.nfa.futures.org/basicnet/...px?seqnum=2963

Very.... on topic.

Wow.
thats conclusive enough,

but anything close to truths are generally ignored in this forum
  • #76
  • May 29, 2012 5:45pm May 29, 2012 5:45pm
Quoting xXTrizzleXx
The simple fact is that maybe your experiences with brokers may have been at a time where forex trading and the like were new to retail. In today's modern age, brokers do not have the incentive to "hunt stops". Why would they be concerned about the stops of an individual retail trader? Let's assume you have the largest account at the broker. All it takes is a simple screenshot and transaction log, and a similar screenshot of another customer of the broker, and you could easily charge approach regulatory brokers with a pricing discriminatory case....

I've heard this argument before in terms of, "do brokers stop hunt." And IMO yes they do have incentive. Add up all the mini, micro, fractional lot account across a broker, that adds up to a lot of money, that adds a lot to a brokers bottom end. Even if all they are trading is micro lots, mutliply that by all the thousands of people just messing about in forex, it adds up to a lot, even more if they stop hunt.

If they don't stop hunt and all those micro account win or break even, they are out a lot of money. One of the things you learn when running your own business is that the pennies, nickle and dimes count and can hurt you a lot if your eyes are only on the big money. I'm sure brokers realize this. why in the world would they even allow micro traders if they didn't think they could make money off of them.
  • #77
  • May 29, 2012 5:49pm May 29, 2012 5:49pm
Quoting Lightrain
Look what I stumbled across....

http://www.nfa.futures.org/basicnet/...px?seqnum=2963

Very.... on topic.

Wow.
Looks like the actions of a bucket shop to me. And this is how these borkers stop hunt. They don't move price as a lot of people think. They do it through manipulation of the price they quote. Sudden widening of spreads, slippage, re-quotes, etc.
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #78
  • May 29, 2012 5:54pm May 29, 2012 5:54pm
Quoting spzd
Looks like the actions of a bucket shop to me. And this is how these borkers stop hunt. They don't move price as a lot of people think. They do it through manipulation of the price they quote. Sudden widening of spreads, slippage, re-quotes, etc.
is that really stop hunting by the brokers? or is that just idiots getting swept cause they have no idea how to trade or place stops or limit risk heading into certain times?

If you know how and why prices are quoted and why the spread widens you would think otherwise. As I said this is not 2003 anymore.

don't think brokers are out to get you. Just stay with a reputable broker. They dont need to stop hunt, they make a shitload without it. Its much more regulated now. The stop hunting is done by the BSD's....

There is also some great advantages of using retail brokers over trading interbank.
  • #79
  • May 29, 2012 5:58pm May 29, 2012 5:58pm
Quoting KumoDragon
I've heard this argument before in terms of, "do brokers stop hunt." And IMO yes they do have incentive. Add up all the mini, micro, fractional lot account across a broker, that adds up to a lot of money, that adds a lot to a brokers bottom end. Even if all they are trading is micro lots, mutliply that by all the thousands of people just messing about in forex, it adds up to a lot, even more if they stop hunt.

If they don't stop hunt and all those micro account win or break even, they are out a lot of money. One of the things you learn...
This is why they do allow less than mini accounts. One thing most traders do not understand, is that anything less than 10,000 units (mini) is handled in house. All those 0.05, 0.10, 0.02, and so forth trades never see the light of day. They are either countered by the borker or by the other traders of the same size, opposite direction.
Mark ... Everything you have been told is a LIE
  • #80
  • May 29, 2012 6:00pm May 29, 2012 6:00pm
Quoting spzd
This is why they do allow less than mini accounts. One thing most traders do not understand, is that anything less than 10,000 units (mini) is handled in house. All those 0.05, 0.10, 0.02, and so forth trades never see the light of day. They are either countered by the borker or by the other traders of the same size, opposite direction.
those nickle and dime positions are played off each other on their books... they hedge the net risk on the interbank market. They bring in the cash just on commissions or spread and a little statistics. It's a nice business.

do you guys know what the real pricing they are getting on eu for example before they pad the spread?
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