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The law of attraction and trading

  • #61
  • Mar 4, 2012 4:04am Mar 4, 2012 4:04am
Quoting 96flavors
Shows how little you actually know what trading is.

B. Schaefermeier, one of the most successful discretionary traders - "Trading is 100% psychology". Must be talking some bs as well..
well, since I am 100% not discretionary, I can't relate much to these psychological things you guys talk about.
  • #62
  • Mar 4, 2012 4:23am Mar 4, 2012 4:23am
IMHO, the law of attraction is misunderstood by many ,many people. Just positive affirmations or vivid visualization cant help much to achieve the goal be it in trading or any other aspect of trading.

The Law of Attraction is really Law of Realization.
When you say positive affirmations or visualize, the self within just KNOWS. There is awareness and knowledge. To know or to be aware and TO REALIZE are extremely different sides.

Whatever we are today is because of the Kind of Realization we are in. This realization can be of some material level or realization of Ultimate reality ( which they call Buddha-hood or Christ Consciousness or GOD REALIZATION )

Let's talk a very simple example in this view. A completely new trader is fascinated by the Technical Indicators ( I am sure we all were at some point of our trading life ). After a few trades with just overbought and over sold levels, he begins to lose the money. Now an experienced trader tells him that just trading on there indicators wont help you. Here the new traders just " KNOWS ".

But his trading wont change until he " REALIZES" that trading purely on OB and OS levels is non-sense.
So after Realization only he moves ahead. Hey, if he only visualizes or says positive affirmations while just trading OB / OS levels, can he make money?


So the point is Realization. Those who Realize Love for animate or inanimate things ( not just know love in their hearts ) change their life so peacefully and beautifully that the processes that make their life beautiful happen automatically and they need not worry consciously of being positive.

Many many people all over the world have Realized Negative energies in their lives and hence are automatically surrounded by those situations.

I wish and pray that we all may realize positive energies and beautiful levels so that the world would be a great place to live
Trading is a delicate balance of Strategy , Money management and Psychology
  • #63
  • Edited 7:10pm Mar 4, 2012 4:26am | Edited 7:10pm
Quoting Davit
May I ask a question?

How many of you posting on this thread with great insights are actually making profit in forex.
I mean real profit not wasting 300 hrs and only showing 50 dollars which after dividing 300hrs is in cents.
Are you worth cents?

This is important to me-Because I differentiate traders who are dedicated to trading and want to make it as a full time job vs part time hobbyists like weekend painters.
It seems to me lot of noise is made by hobbyists and its hard getting real information from pros.
To me pro is someone who can trade...
Davit,

You have asked a very good question and made some interesting observations. First of all, a professional trader hardly has the time or wants to tolerate the distraction of posting. Many times I have considered not posting because it costs trading opportunities and focus. However, I believe there is benefit for hobbyists, as you call them, to post as I am sure they learn in the process...and others learn as well.

I know what it is to be consistently profitable, and I also know what it is like not to be; and how to get back there again and stay there. If a trader has a sharp trading edge, which does take hard work to develop and test, and they are a discretionary trader, then one must find the heart-mind solutions. Can't divorce the trader's input from the outcome.

To me pro is someone who can trade freely and profitably on bare chart alone without any indicators.Because everything one needs is there.If you must have "tools" then you are not complete.

If that is your definition of a pro, I'd rather be profitable because it takes more time, and different skills and training for the mind to trade that way, and some traders may not be suited to that style of trading. That sounds like ego to me (no offense intended btw)...just my 2 cents . Tools or no tools: that has nothing to do with being complete...each person is different. That's like saying someone who uses reading glasses is not complete...mho.

Btw, even if someone is consistently profitable, that doesn't mean that another trader will automatically be if they are "given" information...they still have to fight for it and go through "their" journey to get "there"...wherever that is for them. Some traders don't want to fight that hard, because they don't really understand all that is involved in the journey. I also don't think it is right/fair to ask, even to expect a pro to give their nuggets and gems away that they have paid for in time, money, pain etc. to someone. If they choose to do so, that's fine. However, usually it will not be valued because the recipient has no idea what it cost. (Not saying you are doing that btw).

Know of a situation where someone wanted to learn, but, they wanted to have the person teach them for three or four sessons; then they, the student, would decide if it was working for them, so they could make a decision at that time, whether they wanted to pay or not. How insulting!!! The funny part is, they thought nothing of it: seemed like standard practice. If that is their mentality how will they ever trade successfully? If after you have done careful analysis, and a long position is opened because the market looked bullish but price tanked, then what? Anyone who wants no risk should not trade. Know of another situation where the potential student wanted to know why it costs so much to learn, and it was under 1K, but, they were buying every fancy gadget and indicator out there. Who do they think they are to set a value on what someone else has laboured over...and that price was already discounted to try to help others? Then, to top it off, they wanted the pro to tell them why they were being stopped out. Hilarious!!! Why don't they ask the person who sold them the indicator. Here's another: someone wanted a pro trader to mentor them while they traded other live accounts and would be getting paid to do so, but they wanted the pro to mentor them for free. Unreal!!! This is a business for professionals. Pros in the making don't behave that way: they are pros in character already. That is why they make it and "become" a pro: the raw material was already in them. Talk about the law of attraction...a real pro can tell a pro in the making any day.

Didn't plan to say that much, but maybe it will be a wake up call; a moment of realization (truth) for some.

Seems like you might be genuinely seeking....

Take care,


FX4

P.S. This could be your answer: TAF: trading with no indicators and taught by a professional. Want another laugh? I directed someone to that thread, and they complained that it was too much to read (just 200 pages), and the thread starter is a professional...worked in Tier 1 banks etc. etc. Ah...people. If a trader doesn't do the work to become a trader (notice I didn't say learn to trade), they will crack in the heat of the battle. Becoming a professional trader is a process. Believe me, there is more money out there waiting to be managed, than there are traders capable of doing it successfully.
Trade what you see, not what you think or feel. Let the market come to you.
  • #64
  • Edited 1:49pm Mar 4, 2012 12:34pm | Edited 1:49pm
Quoting FX4Newbies
Davit,

You have asked a very good question and made some interesting observations. First of all, a professional trader hardly has the time or wants to tolerate the distraction of posting. Many times I have considered not posting because it costs trading opportunities and focus. However, I believe there is benefit for hobbyists, as you call them, to post as I am sure they learn in the process...and others learn as well.

I know what it is to be consistently profitable, and I also know what it is like not to be; and how to get back there again...
Thank you FX4 for your insights.
I have been lot of things in life age 48 . An Artist,frame maker,server,busboy,fire deterrent salesmen,gambler(hardest most painful) etc.and learned human behavior which you elegantly explained in your post.
I know one thing that everything that has value comes with a price and its up to a person to overcome it.
Trading to me is a micro study of human behavior -greed/fear and what influences those factors.
My back is against the wall.I don't enjoy regular jobs anymore.I don't like bosses,managers,costumers etc.
What attracts me to forex is potential freedom to be myself and make money.
I don't look to get rich quick but hopefully overtime be good enough to quit my day job.
Regards and all success to you.Thanks for the link I'll check it out.

edit after 1hr page 4th and I am fascinated and realized I am ignorant about Market structure and without this fundamental understanding I'll be lost.Thanks again for the link.

haha just read this and confirms my gut feeling about SL

"Stop loss are for suckers (oops sitting ducks)
Sure it gives you peace of mind , thats because you're not watching after your babies,
but at what price?
Dance the dance.
If you cannot take the heat, stay out of the kitchen,
If there's a problem. Chances is either over leverage or over trading, or undercapitalise.
These mkts you are trading in, are killing fields,
and there's lots of calm on the surface,
in the undercurrents, theres lots of killing going on.
And I kid you not."
"
In trading, you have to be defensive and aggressive at the same time
  • #65
  • Mar 4, 2012 12:49pm Mar 4, 2012 12:49pm
Quoting Davit
What attracts me to forex is potential freedom to be myself and make money.
I don't look to get rich quick but hopefully overtime be good enough to quit my day job.
Regards and all success to you.Thanks for the link I'll check it out.
That's one of the main attractions to FX for most people. It can be done but it is a process. Keep focused and put the necessaries in place one brick at a time; one layer at a time. At the end of it all, the whole picture will gel.

TAF is a powerful thread...may not be an easy way to go for some. But for those who are able to stick with it and make it work or incorporate aspects of it into an effective strategy, it is a lifesaver for traders...mho.

All the best,

FX4...
Trade what you see, not what you think or feel. Let the market come to you.
  • #66
  • Mar 4, 2012 4:10pm Mar 4, 2012 4:10pm
I have been wanting to post on this thread for a while.

The Law Of Attraction (like attracting like) is only a part of the picture when it comes to how our minds interact with reality. In terms of trading, if you set a goal to your unconscious to become a profitably consistent trader you will attract the right material, teachers, insight, ect. to take you to your desired reality. But that's not everything.

The main thing to consider 'attracting' or rather 'creating' is being a successful trader - being the type of trader that can close out the day with profit in their account. It's the progression of becoming, evolving, forming into a new identity. When this imaginable reality becomes fixed and anchored as a truth in your mind, things start to happen. You start thinking differently, you see new things, your understanding opens up and somehow your trade decisions are far more solid and amazingly accurate, consistent and profitable. (I am saying this because this has happened to me for a short period of time, I am trying to get it back).

How do we create this reality from our minds? So many good teachers have their own methods but there is a general underlying method to them all.

Visual; visualization
Auditory; affirmations (unless you have visual affirmations)
Kinaesthetic; feeling/acting

With whatever works for you, you are trying to accomplish one thing; to build a sense of inner certainty, belief and reality of your objective. There is something about the mind that when it has so much support (belief and determination) and little resistance (doubt, fear, stress, ect.) it manages to manifest it in physical reality. You then usually discard the manifestation as coincidence or luck, ect. but in my experience it is non of those things.

But this can be easier said than done.
  • #67
  • Mar 4, 2012 5:05pm Mar 4, 2012 5:05pm
Quoting constin
I call it "the law of attraction" because most of people are familiar with it. Anyways, from hours and hours spent on the computer with strategies, setups, news, etc. I've realized that there is more to it and that is not because I didn't really know about "the law of attraction" for over a decade now but didn't even realized that has so much power over trading. With this in mind over the time it became more and more real to me.
I think that the people that are winning in trading are powerful human beings and either they realize it or...
The dude that" invented" this Power of Attraction thing ended up killing people.
All those people who were on that original "Power of Attraction" BS propaganda probably made a killing because people are so gullible. It basically said all you have to do is sit around on the couch all day and wish hard enough and the Universe will make your wishes come true.

What a bunch of RUBBISH !! Yes, you have to envision. Then you have to WORK towards what you envision. It seems that most people confuse the words "WORK" and "WISH".
  • #68
  • Mar 4, 2012 5:37pm Mar 4, 2012 5:37pm
Quoting Davit
Thank you FX4 for your insights.

edit after 1hr page 4th and I am fascinated and realized I am ignorant about Market structure and without this fundamental understanding I'll be lost.Thanks again for the link.

haha just read this and confirms my gut feeling about SL

"Stop loss are for suckers (oops sitting ducks)
Sure it gives you peace of mind , thats because you're not watching after your babies,
but at what price?
Dance the dance.
If you cannot take the heat, stay out of the kitchen,
If there's a problem. Chances is either over leverage...
Glad you meant business. What has been shared in that thread is priceless. Hope you can extract the nuggets that are there.

FX4
Trade what you see, not what you think or feel. Let the market come to you.
  • #69
  • Mar 4, 2012 6:09pm Mar 4, 2012 6:09pm
@FX4Newbies.
I'm wondering how you equate "trade what you see, not what you believe" with "let the Universe decide"

I need you to teach me how I can sit on the couch and just wish my way to a great trade. Please help.
  • #70
  • Edited 7:16pm Mar 4, 2012 7:05pm | Edited 7:16pm
Quoting ONEjust1
@FX4Newbies.
I'm wondering how you equate "trade what you see, not what you believe" with "let the Universe decide"

I need you to teach me how I can sit on the couch and just wish my way to a great trade. Please help.
"let the Universe decide"

Please show me...where did I make that statement?

FX4
Trade what you see, not what you think or feel. Let the market come to you.
  • #71
  • Mar 4, 2012 7:51pm Mar 4, 2012 7:51pm
Quoting FX4Newbies
"let the Universe decide"

Please show me...where did I make that statement?

FX4
OK... I made a mistake. I was just assuming (making an ass of myself), that anyone here liked the couch potato theory.

My most humble apology.
  • #72
  • Mar 5, 2012 12:32am Mar 5, 2012 12:32am
Quoting Tyoon
........................... if you set a goal to your unconscious to become a profitably consistent trader you will attract the right material, teachers, insight, ect. to take you to your desired reality. But that's not everything.

The main thing to consider 'attracting' or rather 'creating' is being a successful trader - being the type of trader that can close out the day with profit in their account. It's the progression of becoming, evolving, forming into a new identity. When this imaginable reality becomes fixed and anchored as a truth in...
Thank you for verbalizing what I would of liked to say. Communication is not one of my strong suites.
One more thing I would add to methods is:
Emotional: kind of like an emotional visualization. ( how would it FEEL to be a success ?)
But I think you know that.
  • #73
  • Mar 5, 2012 12:35am Mar 5, 2012 12:35am
Quoting ONEjust1
............. It basically said all you have to do is sit around on the couch all day and wish hard enough and the Universe will make your wishes come true........
.
No offence, but this is a very distorted view of PoA.
  • #74
  • Edited 1:32am Mar 5, 2012 12:41am | Edited 1:32am
Quoting ALThau
No offence, but this is a very distorted view of PoA.
True... That guy BTW had a bad day apparently!

PoA; it's (from what I gather) about basically reprogramming your subconscious to a positive state in which you can basically eliminate all the BS that hold you back from your goals like fear, self doubt, negativity, all those nasty words. When you can find the good in things for example you can follow a path that someone from a negatively geared mindset just won't see. Blinded by their own hang ups.

Once you have this embedded in your mind, sitting around on the couch would likely be the last thing you want to do. It's about self belief and in turn vision, motivation, desire, all those good words. Easier said than done. But not as hard as it sounds either.

But you still have to put the work in unfortunately, the PoA is about getting in the right mind set to do that for whatever en-devour you want to pursue. Likely I just said whats' been stated 100 times already not been through the thread though just wanted to comment. It really is a powerful tool? For all aspects of life.

I haven't personally done any courses or seen "the secret" but I can relate a little bit to the idea of it. A must for aspiring traders for sure. Mindset is key, the rest should follow. I think some people naturally "have it" and others need to work for it or perhaps just develop it over time. Who knows I just know that Positive thought is imperatively linked to success. And is it such a mystery?
Time hides Nothing
  • #75
  • Mar 5, 2012 2:02am Mar 5, 2012 2:02am
Quoting ALThau
Thank you for verbalizing what I would of liked to say. Communication is not one of my strong suites.
One more thing I would add to methods is:
Emotional: kind of like an emotional visualization. ( how would it FEEL to be a success ?)
But I think you know that.
Yes, emotion (or as I referred to as 'kinaesthetic' in my previous post) is critical for most. I have found many methods to either be manual or 'automatic'. Manual being that you consciously affirm the objective be it through visualizations, verbal commands, vision boards, ect. so you feel the objective as reality. The point is trying to get the mind to believe as if it has already happened (like the placebo effect). Automatic however, is more like hypnotic conditioning where you allow a mantra to repeat during sleep.. an unconscious method.

We need a few things in place before using any kind of method:

1. clarity - me must know with conviction what it is we want - not a fuzzy idea of what we think we want.

2, confluence - we need a belief system that supports the objective with little or no resistance toward it's accomplishment. For example, how many net pips would you want to profit each day? Think about it.. What would be your dream net profit? Then say to yourself "I net 'x' amount of pips each day". If you feel comfortable in saying that to yourself then you have confluence. But it is highly likely you feel uncomfortable with it (doubt, unworthiness, fear, ect.) and those resistances must be upgraded and evolved to support the objective not resist it.

3, conditioning - at least twice a day (morning and evening at best) use whatever method (visualization, affirmation, ect.) to condition in the objective; feeling it, seeing it, owning it, knowing it. If you still have resistance you need to go back and work on your belief system.

This takes discipline and a lot of work but it's one of the best things you can learn to do.
  • #76
  • Mar 5, 2012 2:15am Mar 5, 2012 2:15am
I guess the new era of 2012 is the year of spiritual transformation? So glad to be able to collaborate trading with the Law of Attraction. Before this, trading involves the financial market, it seems now it has also involved the universe! Strange but true, I have read the first LOA series by Ryonda Bynes (not the new editions though), what I thought is it works in all aspect of lives. But don't conjure with greed, that would cause LAW OF DISASTER! Hahaha, anyway one word to Constin: I think your spiritual quest is near! And yes, i believe successful traders/entrepreneurs/housewives/any entity precedes the mind and enlightenment , not the other way around. This pretty much sums up why my dad often told me about realizing our existence first and things will follow. Very enlightening thread my friend. Thanks .
  • #77
  • Mar 9, 2012 1:03am Mar 9, 2012 1:03am
A lots of great stuff it's been posted in this thread.
There is a bridge between the law of attraction and the results of the manifestation. We have to improve that bridge in a practical way.

Constin
  • #78
  • Mar 13, 2012 7:38am Mar 13, 2012 7:38am
The benefits of Law of Attraction are for those who are ready, or highly sprititual person(with gd karma, or gd luck cycle).

The practice of Law of Attraction is visualisation/ affirmation + Feeling of achieving it.

My belief is that visualisation/ affirmation is not that difficult, but for our goal/ visualisation to be manifested quickly, we must be able to Feel it (already achieved).. that's the challenging part!

Therefore i wish everybody improve and work on our spiritual part, to be in position to use Law of Attraction more effectively.

All the Best..!!
  • #79
  • Mar 13, 2012 8:39am Mar 13, 2012 8:39am
Quoting Les Lau
The benefits of Law of Attraction are for those who are ready, or highly sprititual person(with gd karma, or gd luck cycle).

The practice of Law of Attraction is visualisation/ affirmation + Feeling of achieving it.

My belief is that visualisation/ affirmation is not that difficult, but for our goal/ visualisation to be manifested quickly, we must be able to Feel it (already achieved).. that's the challenging part!
The whole point of visualizations, affirmations, mindmaps, visionboards, ect. (whatever method you choose) is to create the feeling of reality. Our minds are primitively emotional - the emotional brain is the part of ourselves that we must almost 'trick' into believing it has happened. Athletes do this by using mental rehearsal. This is when you use every sensory system to simulate the experience in a very specific and vivid way. For example, a basketball player would repetitively imagine themselves scoring perfect shots one after the other. Because the unconscious mind cannot tell the difference between vivid imagination and reality - the mental rehearsals, when done enough times, starts to build a belief from that imagined 'reality'. When your mind builds a strong enough belief about something it starts to act upon it in more that one way; you start acting differently in ways that bring the goal to realization, you 'magically' attract the things, people, experiences, ect. and unexplainable coincidences happen. All the negative feelings, thoughts and beliefs you once had about the goal disappear and you feel a feeling of freedom and true strength. I would recommend doing this even just for the feelings you get from the process.

So, how do we make our methods work? How do we get the feeling of 'reality' for our goal? Sometimes it can be hard to just affirm a goal as reality because your mind can reject it as a false statement. It is a bit like saying to yourself "my name is Sandra" when it's actually John. Your wind will go WTF? and reject the affirmation as BS. Instead, you can try this two-step format;
1, affirm your statement but not as a fact (that will cause mental resistance), rather state it in the feeling that you are willing to believe it could/will happen. In this way you are easing the idea into your mind rather than just throwing it into your mind. The harder you try to push an idea that your mind does not agree with, the more it will push you back. When you ease an idea into the mind with the feeling of acceptance it will sink in better.
2, when you get a good emotional response from this statement then start visualizing it. See it, hear it, feel it, taste it. You may then start to feel the reality of the goal when doing this. While you keep mentally rehearsing the goal then start repeating the statements again but this time as fact. If you get the feeling of rejection again then just accept it... eventually you'll start to feel ok with it then soon enough you will feel certain about it. When you start feeling certain about your affirmations/statements this is a good sign that you will start realizing your goal.

The point of these two steps is to open the mind up and feed it gently with the ingredients it needs to start building these beliefs necessary for your achievement.

This needs to be done twice a day for about a month. If you believe this stuff works and you are determined to be a successful trader then this shouldn't be a problem.

I have typed enough. I hope I have helped anyone here. If anyone else has any pragmatic contributions it would be great to see it.
  • #80
  • Mar 13, 2012 8:56am Mar 13, 2012 8:56am
i love how it's all so complex... when really it's not at all.

where can you practice or rehearse something without external interference affecting the outcome? where can you experience perfect practice? in your friggin mind!

what is the difference between driving a car down the street with all of the inherent distractions and dangers and myriad of possible evolving scenarios, and going through the motions of driving and getting a feel for how to operate the vehicle while in a safe environment away from everything? the difference is the turn of 1 simple key in the ignition.

wanna learn how to swim? go jump in a deep pool of water without floaties. you might drown, but shit happens. wanna learn how to swim efficiently and effectively? take up lessons in a pool away from danger and distractions.

you don't learn to surf by taking a board out into the sea on your first try.

all learning takes place away from the distractions of the world. you don't learn a new idea or concept while someone is telling you about it, or while you read it, or while you are in the middle of experiencing it. it happens when you stop and simmer on it for awhile and work it over in your head until it all clicks together. similarly all practice takes place away from the distractions of the world. you secure a set of actions / movements in your mind first, and then try to recreate this perfection in reality second.

my mind knows the difference between reality and imagination. geez.
Congratulations ScalaFX for coming out of the closet!
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