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  • #501
  • Jan 20, 2012 10:14am Jan 20, 2012 10:14am
Hey John
That's why I use the 8 pair 4 sell 4 buy that we were using in the T101 EA

at .01 lot the balance was always right around - $3 or - $2

No worries about intervention. But also when using the 10 pair in this thread there are times when the basket is in a pretty good + stage and you can close it out and start over. Not so with the 8 pair
  • #502
  • Jan 20, 2012 10:32am Jan 20, 2012 10:32am
Hi DC

good to hear from you again.

My thinking was this - as this method is not "true" basket trading - ie. trading all pairs long/short, but simply the 2 highest profit pairs (and if wanted the 2 highest losing pairs oppositely) - as long as true trades were not required to remain profitable (ie. the 0.01 "indicator" trades) - then why not use the full 14 universal pairs in one of the many available indicators that exist (ie. samir weekly/daily)

hence my question to Courtney, what positive or negative effect did actually having the indicator trades have on the profitability of the method

P.S. still in the UK working - but have found some interesting DLL's to make the T101 basket trader even more sexy - when I get the time

Quoting dryclean
Hey John
That's why I use the 8 pair 4 sell 4 buy that we were using in the T101 EA

at .01 lot the balance was always right around - $3 or - $2

No worries about intervention. But also when using the 10 pair in this thread there are times when the basket is in a pretty good + stage and you can close it out and start over. Not so with the 8 pair
  • #503
  • Jan 20, 2012 11:12am Jan 20, 2012 11:12am
I'm still trading the T101 method (IBFX pairs) and doing quite well with it. I also use orest's indi for the 14 pairs.
Thanks to Chips for opening this thread ... I like the idea of earning interest and DD control so am keeping my eye on this thread.
  • #504
  • Edited 3:03pm Jan 21, 2012 11:53am | Edited 3:03pm

Pitbull Trader with Postion building the millipede Way.



My main goal of this thread was to introduce the pitbull screen and DD management and then move on to building positions, but we got interrupted quite early.

There is nothing new here, just taking the trades to a larger scale, and having the positions work for us.
Reducing the number of transactions and growing profits and controlling DD

There is nothing new about this type of trading its the same concept but we are only
applying it to a larger scale the weekly and Daily,monthly TF and framing our business for the never ending cyclic movement of the market byusing proper sizing of positions to keep us making sales and netting the costs.

Now everyone who demoed the system, should be comfortable with the basket and how the market moves in cycles and the techniques used to manage DD.

DD is what we use to trade the market NOT STOP LOSS. There is control over DD but there is no control over STOP LOSS, you just loose using SL.

It shouldn't be a new concept of building position, after all the inital buys and sells we took are all positions.

So now what we doing is applying our positions to longer time frame of trading, using technical analysis and creating the Pitbull indicator in ONE shot.

The weekly Time FRAME Direction ....and managing DD using the 4H and Daily TF closing price.

Using Pitbull as the GUIDE and positions sizing and averaging applying business principles to the account.

So here we go. YOU MUST BE ABLE TO ACCEPT THAT SOME BE POSITIONS WILL DIE.

The main purpose of this type of trading is that we are not concern about daily market news and fluctuation of price, and we are not glue to the screen to make trades.

We are just Managing the postions and taking profit when positions mature Daily or weekly and monthly.

Diversification of positions is important as you will learn later. This is the same as making sales, however now we at the level of Account Managing using business priniciples.

If you consider yourself managing your business, making profit and increase revenue and managing your access to a Line of credit is of outmost importance, however the inevitable fact that a trade going into a loss will not be of any surprise to you, it’s the cost of doing business.

HERE WE go. Note the scale is large, so the circle is larger for the time it takes to return LOSS PROFIT LOSS

Using Brijons 10s or T101 pairs
Main Rule SET Your Maximum DD limit to 15% , stop trading at 10%...Start reducing positions. Let the daily cycle return. The weekly trend does NOT change as rapidly as the short time frame so be confident with the initial entries.

 

  1. Identify the weekly Trend. using TL , EMA or anything that suits you. We are using charts for this purpose a simple rule to follow is to follow the weekly closing price. You will find that once you enter positions in the Weekly trend , the market BIAS will be formed from the Basket of entries based the weekly trend. Pitbull trader will give market direction of price NOW.

Note also that, sometimes the longterm weekly trend will be cycle or retraced, we are also profiting from short-term cycle

2. At the start of the WEEK.Enter .01 position in the direction of the Weekly Trend on each pair no SL.
3. Sort all the pairs by profit ,,,Greatest profit or Lowest Lost at the bottom.

4. Using Pitbull screen Enter 1position in the direction of the 2 fastest +ve and the 2 fastest -ve.
Positions are place if daily price is above the weekly open.

5. use daily close price for managing DD trades.. example if current close is above or below previous Days open....Manage the Trade using DD Techniques.

6.You will need to do a daily audit on all the pairs to see closing prices for the day.

Now the Fun Part.

8. Stacking or scaling in. The will compound your winners with the trend. hence capitalizing on interest and pips gain

Add positions in the direction of the week. BE your profitable positions,
Now we are adding positions only on the fastest moving positions, using the pitbull indi. Our job is to BE and let the positions work for us.
Focus on the fastest moving pairs –ve or +ve positions.

9. you can BE your position hedged position as this will reduce exposure/risk and maintain the hedge.

10. If you are at the computer you can increase your Revenue buy doing short term trades on the Bottom pair only if Price today is above or below the Previous day close.

11. Remember AUDUSD Swap on Wednesday.

12. Diversify , your positions daily, weekly monthly.


Using the 4H and Daily TF to Manage the business its easier and more relaxing. Your initial basket is in line with the weekly Trend that does not change overnight
Hence taking profit on those pairs is not recommended they should remain AT BE once in profit.

NO rush to close losses as they can be controlled and eliminated if you position size the right way and use correct timing to identify the daily trend Change. use the closing price of the DAY.


Business Principles and Account Management.

Interest Swap rates
The idea here overtime is identify the highest paying currencies and hold those positions in the account for collecting interest payments to help control DD as we build positions, diversify and grow the account.


Think profit, always diversify for a profit. This is link to actually balancing the trades, position reduction, pay the bills and still left with a profit on the account. We will be doing it daily Weekly and monthly.


Do your research with your broker and have your list interest SWAP list ready.

So like a business make a list of the currencies that add value and those that take away value.
Hold positions on stocks that pays interest.


This is a business control your expenses. These are the trades that end up in a loss,, the cost of doing business.

These can be paid every Wednesday during the Runup to Tripple swap rollover

cheers and good luck.

  • #505
  • Jan 21, 2012 1:37pm Jan 21, 2012 1:37pm
wow I'll never understand this method. I guess I just can't control the DD properly. I'm out. I'll lurk the thread.

Good luck gents
  • #506
  • Jan 21, 2012 4:54pm Jan 21, 2012 4:54pm
Interesting approach here chips, I am following and demoing it since its beginnning. Now it becomes even more interesting with including Graeme's milipede techniques.

What I was actually doing last week was setting some kind of a grid on each of 10 pairs. I have plenty money management grid calculations and I decided to give one a try here (just look at the short snapshot below).

Instead of me watching the indicator trades many times a day or hedging trades in order to be calm when I'm not close to computer, I put one of my grids on each of the pairs with pending orders. A lot of them, but now with only a test 6-step-system (3 positive and 3 negative), but nevermind. With such a grid technique I know what is my max. negative exposure on the market for that particular day with that currency pair. I can then multiply it with 10 pairs to get my potential total negative exposure. This is the worse case scenario of that day for me. It has slim chances that all 10 pairs get there, but statistically it can happen.

So now that we know our bottom for the day, we can focus on our top. There things get sweet. As Graeme's statistical attitude is close to mine, I can't tell you what is my max. positive expectation. I could close trades reaching a certain level of profits, but I intend not to. I would love to build positions. Day by day starting the grid again and again, setting previous trades to BE+1. I would close some of them, to cover DD and close negative trades, but my mid-term goal is to build as many of them as possible to bring a stronger wave motion to my balance.

I would love to be as active with my reactions to indicator trades as chips, courtneywild and others that do well with it, but my time to do so is very limited during the day. That's the reason why I gave it a try as described above and so far it worked out reliably. I am aware of potential threats, but I look at it as a wave motion - sooner or later, there will be a set of waves going into one direction, regardless all the fuziness that happened once in the mean time.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: HedgeGrid Example.jpg Size: 132 KB
  • #507
  • Jan 22, 2012 5:52am Jan 22, 2012 5:52am
Hi Chips

I have a quick question regarding your latest modification for building positions.

You state that you will now create the Pitbull indicator trades based on the weekly trend (so obviously based on up to last weeks data when starting on Sunday)

Therefore you are no longer opening arbitary trades, ie. 5 buys and 5 sells, but for instance if in the 10 pairs the direction on 7 of them was bullish and 3 were bearish you would open the Pitbull indicator with 7 buys and 3 sells??

The rest of the concept seems to remain the same (ie. adding to positions on the extremes highest profit/loss etc.)

Is my understanding correct?

If so you are now not creating a balanced basket hedge - therefore there is a greater possibility of the pitbull indicator trades going very wrong (likewise of course they could go very right)

This brings me to the earlier point made in the thread - would it not be better to use a "virtual" account (demo or modify one of the indicators already available to allow the user to choose the direction buy/sell)

Regards, John
  • #508
  • Jan 22, 2012 6:54am Jan 22, 2012 6:54am
Quoting vanderpjer
Interesting approach here chips, I am following and demoing it since its beginnning. Now it becomes even more interesting with including Graeme's milipede techniques.

What I was actually doing last week was setting some kind of a grid on each of 10 pairs. I have plenty money management grid calculations and I decided to give one a try here (just look at the short snapshot below).

Instead of me watching the indicator trades many times a day or hedging trades in order to be calm when I'm not close to computer, I put one of my grids on each of...
This is interesting, a new concept. What is the size of your grid in between grids?

Edd
  • #509
  • Jan 22, 2012 7:03am Jan 22, 2012 7:03am
Quoting chips

Pitbull Trader with Postion building the millipede Way.



My main goal of this thread was to introduce the pitbull screen and DD management and then move on to building positions, but we got interrupted quite early.

There is nothing new here, just taking the trades to a larger scale, and having the positions work for us.
Reducing the number of transactions and growing profits and controlling DD

[font=Arial]There is nothing...
WOW Chips! I really really like this, very nice! Very smart!
  • #510
  • Jan 22, 2012 7:18am Jan 22, 2012 7:18am
What are the specific techniques used to manage DD ?





Quoting chips

Pitbull Trader with Postion building the millipede Way.



My main goal of this thread was to introduce the pitbull screen and DD management and then move on to building positions, but we got interrupted quite early.

There is nothing new here, just taking the trades to a larger scale, and having the positions work for us.
Reducing the number of transactions and growing profits and controlling DD

[font=Arial]There is nothing...
  • #511
  • Jan 22, 2012 8:40am Jan 22, 2012 8:40am
Quoting Edd Ganuelas
This is interesting, a new concept. What is the size of your grid in between grids?

Edd
Hi Edd, at the moment they are all the same on all pairs, 20 pips per step. I have many other scenarios, but decided to go with this one for the time being.

If after a while it proves to be a reliable way of pitbull trading for us not having opportunity to monitor trades oftenly, maybe there is someone who can put the grid into an EA where some additional variables can be included (e.g. ATR - as not all the pairs have the same wave size).
  • #512
  • Jan 22, 2012 11:36am Jan 22, 2012 11:36am
Here article worth reading if you have some time. http://www.etalkforex.com/forex-arti...dford-raschke/. Unfortunatelly the bbc documentary is not available on youtube, but I am sure if you can find it with some creative effort since it is BBC.
This also should clarify a bit the pitbull strategy.
  • #513
  • Jan 22, 2012 2:38pm Jan 22, 2012 2:38pm
Given that basically you are measuring the strength of various pairs, would it make sense to watch 28 pairs and base trading decision from that?

Here is how they looked at Friday's close - any of the signals show up as a buy with your method? I'm betting GBP-USD will.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 0030.jpg Size: 220 KB
It takes a lot for me to IGNORE you, but you can try.
  • #514
  • Edited 9:25pm Jan 22, 2012 3:35pm | Edited 9:25pm
Quoting jmw1970
Hi Chips

I have a quick question regarding your latest modification for building positions.

You state that you will now create the Pitbull indicator trades based on the weekly trend (so obviously based on up to last weeks data when starting on Sunday)

Therefore you are no longer opening arbitary trades, ie. 5 buys and 5 sells, but for instance if in the 10 pairs the direction on 7 of them was bullish and 3 were bearish you would open the Pitbull indicator with 7 buys and 3 sells??

The rest of the concept seems to remain the same (ie. adding...
There is no wrong or right way to trade. You will have to DEMO for your own and believe in you method. What I have shown, is my concept of managing the account. Everyone will trade different.

If there is conflict in your mind, you will have sort it out. DEMO, using the concept and you will be amazed at you own discovery.

there is actually a pitbul indicator, that one can use for prospecting and show a comprehensive view of the pitbull pairs. I will post it later.

It doesn't really matter Trading is managing DD, so whether on DEMO or live one has to always manage DD.

I enter the positions of the weekly, because the weekly trend doesn't change over night, so patience will always return the cycle, mean while, making sales on the fastest currencies.

Going wrong should not be of greave concern as DD limit is max 15%.
So adding when 10%, reducing exposure.
  • #515
  • Jan 22, 2012 10:13pm Jan 22, 2012 10:13pm
Quoting Erebus
Given that basically you are measuring the strength of various pairs, would it make sense to watch 28 pairs and base trading decision from that?

Here is how they looked at Friday's close - any of the signals show up as a buy with your method? I'm betting GBP-USD will.

Very nice.
Would you be able to share your excel sheet and currency strength meter.
Regards
  • #516
  • Edited 2:30am Jan 23, 2012 2:11am | Edited 2:30am
Quoting jmw1970
Hi Courtney

impressive results

out of interest - have you calculated what your figures would have been if you hadn't actually opened the indicator account trades (ie. the 0.01 lots) and used a "virtual" indicator account instead.

I ask because a lot of the detractors of this thread (when they have actually explained why they are against the method) are generally mentioning that opening the hedge trades could be somewhat harmful (though over the last few years not so)

I ask because this method is a continuation of Brijon's Pitbull method, which...

Hi John,

Over the trading period the basket (marketing costs for my business) have resulted in
+$265.12
-$307.35
net -£42.23

As long as my ROI on my sales (trades) is decent I am prepared to pay the $42 (even more if needs be as the ROI is good enough to warrent it).

I see this as the cost of running my business, my marketing costs so to speak. Business has to market its products and there's a cost associated with it. So they test their marketing and measure the return against the cost. When I look at this campaign I'm very happy with the ROI.

One important point is I'm not trading the basket as a basket, I'm trading individual pairs based on the basket indications.

Note: I close the basket every end of day. Chips keeps his basket open much longer. So the cost $42 would change if I keep them open but currently I am happy with all trades and basket closed each day

When I trade I don't open all the pairs in the relative direction I only trade the bottom two pairs and add to them if they continue their trend and manage DD if the reverse, taking profit and (trying my best) not being greedy.

I'm aware of the CHF influecne hence my post to Chips on the 14 pair basket, and I'll take his lead on that.

So far I'm happy with the ROI and this week will be the end a full month testing.

What I love about this is no charts.

Thats my take on it John, hope it helps you.

Regards

CW.
  • #517
  • Jan 23, 2012 3:07am Jan 23, 2012 3:07am
Quoting esprit
Here article worth reading if you have some time. http://www.etalkforex.com/forex-arti...dford-raschke/. Unfortunatelly the bbc documentary is not available on youtube, but I am sure if you can find it with some creative effort since it is BBC.
This also should clarify a bit the pitbull strategy.

Esprit... really good article... thank you.
  • #518
  • Jan 23, 2012 4:51am Jan 23, 2012 4:51am
Hi Courtney

thanks for the detailed answer.

Yes you are correct marketing costs of 42 are nothing when compared to your balance increase of 2500.

I look forward to seeing your results at the end of the week for the 4 week period.

Best regards, John

Quoting courtneywild
Hi John,

Over the trading period the basket (marketing costs for my business) have resulted in
+$265.12
-$307.35
net -£42.23

As long as my ROI on my sales (trades) is decent I am prepared to pay the $42 (even more if needs be as the ROI is good enough to warrent it).

I see this as the cost of running my business, my marketing costs so to speak. Business has to market its products and there's a cost associated with it. So they test their marketing and measure the return against the cost. When I look at this campaign I'm very happy with the ROI.

One...
  • #519
  • Jan 23, 2012 6:01am Jan 23, 2012 6:01am
Quoting vanderpjer
Hi Edd, at the moment they are all the same on all pairs, 20 pips per step. I have many other scenarios, but decided to go with this one for the time being.

If after a while it proves to be a reliable way of pitbull trading for us not having opportunity to monitor trades oftenly, maybe there is someone who can put the grid into an EA where some additional variables can be included (e.g. ATR - as not all the pairs have the same wave size).
Thank you. Your posts are very helpful. Looking forward to your next update.

Edd
  • #520
  • Jan 23, 2012 7:05am Jan 23, 2012 7:05am
Round up...

Closed all positions (half day for me - leave ahead of the game).
Results week 4 day one. +4.73%
Month since 3rd Jan

+59.05%
Net profit $3049
Start Equity $5167
Today $8216

Early strong long trend.
Finding the: A-samir- UNIVERSAL-daily-pitbull idi (posted earlier) vital to monitor strength of trend and help me decide to enter more sales or manage DD (thanks again to original poster of that indi).

Thanks to Chips & BJ.
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