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MT4 Brokers' Virtual Dealer Plug-In

  • #681
  • Dec 19, 2011 3:19am Dec 19, 2011 3:19am
Brokers must have had plenty of spare time to browse the forums in the thin markets, one of mine has reset their VPS just today.
My comments are not to be taken as trading advice, not a financial advisor
  • #682
  • Dec 19, 2011 7:30am Dec 19, 2011 7:30am
Quoting Marv
You actually read that stuff?

I keep trolling you and you keep taking me seriously and now I feel like a jerk. lol

Just not interested in a religious debate, so good trading to you sir.
Thanks Marv.

Merry Christmas
  • #683
  • Dec 19, 2011 8:38am Dec 19, 2011 8:38am
Merry Christmas!
  • #684
  • Dec 20, 2011 7:56am Dec 20, 2011 7:56am
Quoting Marv
I disagree. It's not even close to being the best charting software. Limited time-frame options, limited chart types (no renko bars, no range charts, no P&F charts, etc), doesn't even support tick data, and so on.

Like I said the only reason this thing got famous is because it has programmability while being FREE. But compared to the dedicated software you can get, it plain sucks. But that is not the reason I dislike it as I am not a chartist. My main problem with Metatrader is its entire order handling system and being designed specifically for...
I agree Metatrader is very limited when it comes to charting,
I just wanted to ask you which trading platform you like the most
for charting? Merry Christmas!
Bulls are stupid Animals!especially when Im short!
  • #685
  • Dec 21, 2011 12:41pm Dec 21, 2011 12:41pm
Quoting roughtrader
I just wanted to ask you which trading platform you like the most
for charting? Merry Christmas!
I used to use Ninjatrader when I was into charting, I can recommend it.

http://www.danielstrading.com/images...t-1200x480.jpg

There are other ones that are also good, here's some:

Multicharts:

http://www.multicharts.com/traders-b...l_trading1.png

Tradestation:

http://www.traders.com/documentation...adeStation.gif

I heard of others (such as e-signal) but I don't know if they're good.

These are not free, so only use them if you need the advanced charting/programmability/backtesting features they have. If you don't need that stuff then a simple platform such as your bröker's proprietary platform should be enough.
  • #686
  • Jan 9, 2012 10:50pm Jan 9, 2012 10:50pm
you guys might want to have a look at this,
please help seed this so the torrent dies out,
it's good everyone can have the oportunity to view this
it's just a small file 25mb or so,
but very very interesting

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/6943545
Bulls are stupid Animals!especially when Im short!
  • #687
  • Edited 7:53pm Jan 17, 2012 7:05pm | Edited 7:53pm
Thanks for that roughtrader.

I have been doing some testing using sentinal and most brokers have come up as reasonable, but others are glaringly obvious to be using VDP. I have only just started testing FXCM yesterday but they are definately using most of the features of VDP, so beware.

Here is some initial findings, I will post corrupted trade charts as soon as they become available.

And please don't try and tell me this is normal, I have accounts with 11 different brokers who use MT4.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: FXCM Report.png Size: 36 KB
My comments are not to be taken as trading advice, not a financial advisor
  • #688
  • Jan 17, 2012 8:05pm Jan 17, 2012 8:05pm
  •  onu
  • | Joined Feb 2006 | Status: superior senior member | 746 Posts
Quoting cogs
Thanks for that roughtrader.

I have been doing some testing using sentinal and most brokers have come up as reasonable, but others are glaringly obvious to be using VDP. I have only just started testing FXCM yesterday but they are definately using most of the features of VDP, so beware.

Here is some initial findings, I will post corrupted trade charts as soon as they become available.

And please don't try and tell me this is normal, I have accounts with 11 different brokers who use MT4.
Why would a broker use it on a DEMO account???? Makes no sense to me....
  • #689
  • Jan 17, 2012 8:51pm Jan 17, 2012 8:51pm
Can they seperate it at all, demo from live? Doesn't appear so to me, and it's glaringly obvious to me they have it set up with agressive settings. Some positions I simply cannot close due to these error messages, unless they are running a loss then it's a prompt close.

The only way it appears they can seperate is to have a seperate server set up.
My comments are not to be taken as trading advice, not a financial advisor
  • #690
  • Jan 18, 2012 9:16am Jan 18, 2012 9:16am
Quoting cogs

I have been doing some testing using sentinal and most brokers have come up as reasonable, but others are glaringly obvious to be using VDP. I have only just started testing FXCM yesterday but they are definately using most of the features of VDP, so beware.

Here is some initial findings, I will post corrupted trade charts as soon as they become available.
Hi cogs,

There is no virtual dealer plugin used in FXCM's MT4, and all orders on NDD forex execution are filled dependent on liquidity.

We appreciate any feedback you have about the new MT4 demo accounts, and please send any feedback to tech support via [email protected] . One thing to keep in mind with our setup is that it uses Instant Execution, therefore the maximum deviation feature is available for use. Maximum deviation works in a similar way that Market Range works on FXCM's Trading Station platform. You can set a range of prices you are willing to accept for negative slippage. If the market price moves negatively beyond the maximum deviation, the order cancels automatically. When this occurs, an "Off Quotes" message is displayed. This is a standard MetaTrader 4 message notifying the user that an order canceled because the market price deviated beyond the order setting. FXCM trading policy allows for unlimited positive slippage on all order types. Therefore, FXCM has developed a way to override the restriction that the maximum deviation feature places on positive slippage. All orders placed on the FXCM MetaTrader 4 platform fill with the greatest amount of positive slippage possible dependent on liquidity even if it's beyond the max deviation you set. Keep in mind that lowering the max deviation increases the the likelihood an order could be rejected and the offquotes message appearing. Un-checking max deviation means max deviation will default to 0. More details on our MT4 execution policy, features, and settings can be found here http://www.fxcm.com/mt4-execution-po...d-features.jsp
  • #691
  • Jan 18, 2012 9:34am Jan 18, 2012 9:34am
Great work Cogs!
can you also please share which brokers passed your test,
I think you are wrong about FXCM though
I have live micro acount with them since about 6 months
and I havent seen any suspicious symtoms yet.
Im not using MT4 though, using Tradingstation 2.
but it just makes no sence to have it in one platform
and not on the other?
Cheers
Bulls are stupid Animals!especially when Im short!
  • #692
  • Edited Jan 19, 2012 1:13am Jan 18, 2012 4:40pm | Edited Jan 19, 2012 1:13am
I have closed FXCM testing, it's just so bad I am not even going to bother with them at all. Reports on slippage 2, 3, 4, 5 pips on top of order rejections. Absolutely shocking!

Jason, If it's liquidity that is causing all these rejections, you need to tap into more liquidity, obvious and not rip into clients pockets.

If current users aren't experiencing the same order rejections it is obvious FXCM is the counter party to your orders and are not about to hand out cash.

roughtrader,

Gomarkets, Pepperstone, 4XP all seem ok with order placement and promptly. VantageFX definately have the plugin but have toned down the settings recently, and I have given up testing on most pairs with them, order placement on most majors seem reasonably acceptable with EURJPY for example always having delays.

It appears even with pepper that spread widening happens on mostly closing of positions, sometimes opening but more often closing.
I tried a demo with FXCentral via autometatrading dot com, high liquidity and zero spread. Made an absolute mountain of money, (demo only dammit). Spread makes more difference than most realise.

As for why would VPD be on demo accounts, there could be several different reasons for this.
1. Cost of licenses per seat
2. VPD has intersect incoming and outgoing orders from their server to our PC's so most likely is installed in 'series' and not parallel. The only way to avoid it would be to switch it off. ie - set to than less than one second delay.

Have attached a couple of charts below, interpret for yourself.
Attached Image(s) (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: audusd sent.png Size: 59 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: aususd pep sent.png Size: 59 KB
Click to Enlarge Name: audusd go sent.png Size: 48 KB
My comments are not to be taken as trading advice, not a financial advisor
  • #693
  • Jan 19, 2012 6:17am Jan 19, 2012 6:17am
Im supriced you give FXCM such verdict,
Im not tryiing to protect them in any way
but I have traded live with them for some time now
and as I wrote, I haven't seen any unusual symptoms so far,
may I ask if you are testing their Demo or do you actually test real live acounts?
keep up the good work
Bulls are stupid Animals!especially when Im short!
  • #694
  • Jan 19, 2012 8:04am Jan 19, 2012 8:04am
Quoting roughtrader
you guys might want to have a look at this,
please help seed this so the torrent dies out,
it's good everyone can have the oportunity to view this
it's just a small file 25mb or so,
but very very interesting

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/6943545
Wow great show & scary.

By the way FXCM have built it's own platform so they can have any code withing the platform that can do such job even if it's NDD as it's automated. Do I need to remind you about how FXCM was keeping all "positive slippage" before NFA slap? They are here to make more profits & as long they can squeeze pips for no risk they will do it.

You may noticed my previous posts bashing FXCM. My tip & just do it your self. Check charts on any fast moves you detect at key levels ( know support ) back check bid/ask & again watch with other brokers you will get often surprised


13
Brokers are angels
  • #695
  • Jan 20, 2012 1:15am Jan 20, 2012 1:15am
Quoting fx13
Wow great show & scary.

By the way FXCM have built it's own platform so they can have any code withing the platform that can do such job even if it's NDD as it's automated. Do I need to remind you about how FXCM was keeping all "positive slippage" before NFA slap? They are here to make more profits & as long they can squeeze pips for no risk they will do it.

You may noticed my previous posts bashing FXCM. My tip & just do it your self. Check charts on any fast moves you detect at key levels ( know support ) back check bid/ask & again watch...
Thanks, Yes I have seen your posts,
it's good to be suspicious but on realistic grounds.
I just don't think you can get any reliable data from a Demo acount.
Demo and Live is compleatly different animals.
therefore testing Demo acounts is totally useless in my opinion,
it isn't very likely any broker would use the infamous plugin to cheat you out of your paper money.
if some broker is using the plugin,
I can guarantie you it's not activated on their Demo acounts.
bashing brokers based on Demo testing isn't enough.
test some live acounts, then you will have my full attention.
Cheers
Bulls are stupid Animals!especially when Im short!
  • #696
  • Jan 20, 2012 9:21am Jan 20, 2012 9:21am
Quoting roughtrader
Thanks, Yes I have seen your posts,
it's good to be suspicious but on realistic grounds.
I just don't think you can get any reliable data from a Demo acount.
Demo and Live is compleatly different animals.
therefore testing Demo acounts is totally useless in my opinion,
it isn't very likely any broker would use the infamous plugin to cheat you out of your paper money.
if some broker is using the plugin,
I can guarantie you it's not activated on their Demo acounts.
bashing brokers based on Demo testing isn't enough.
test some live acounts,...
Good point!

Defiantly there is no VDP on the demo, and not all real account has it. It will fully depends from the volume that we will try to set up.
  • #697
  • Jan 20, 2012 9:39am Jan 20, 2012 9:39am
Quoting roughtrader
Thanks, Yes I have seen your posts,
it's good to be suspicious but on realistic grounds.
I just don't think you can get any reliable data from a Demo acount.
Demo and Live is compleatly different animals.
therefore testing Demo acounts is totally useless in my opinion,
it isn't very likely any broker would use the infamous plugin to cheat you out of your paper money.
if some broker is using the plugin,
I can guarantie you it's not activated on their Demo acounts.
bashing brokers based on Demo testing isn't enough.
test some live acounts,...
Thanks cogs, roughtrader and fx13.

If the VDP is active on the demo platform, it surely must be active on live one. I doubt FXCM will be able to segragate the VDP to operate on one and not on another.

Cogs, if by any chance you do happen to test their live accounts, please do let a novice trader like me know. It's hard earned money. I want to trade with a broker I can trust.
  • #698
  • Jan 20, 2012 9:56am Jan 20, 2012 9:56am
Quoting High.Five
Thanks cogs, roughtrader and fx13.

If the VDP is active on the demo platform, it surely must be active on live one. I doubt FXCM will be able to segragate the VDP to operate on one and not on another.
VDP doesn't active on the demo, there is no point to do it. If they se on real, the easy segregate it.

Quote
Cogs, if by any chance you do happen to test their live accounts, please do let a novice trader like me know. It's hard earned money. I want to trade with a broker I can trust.

The truth is that You can trust to no one:-)
The question is only how much you can gain and withdraw. If you you will not earn more than million you can go almost to any broker.
  • #699
  • Jan 21, 2012 4:59am Jan 21, 2012 4:59am
Quoting roughtrader
you guys might want to have a look at this,
please help seed this so the torrent dies out,
it's good everyone can have the oportunity to view this
it's just a small file 25mb or so,
but very very interesting

http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/6943545
I get many PM's on how to dowload this file,
thats why Im adding this little tutorial here,
so for those of you that doesn't know how to download torrents,
first of all, Download and install a bittorrent application,
Im recommending Utorrent, Google it and you will find it,
then all you have to do is click the text in my link saying
Get torrent file, then something pops up asking you
if you want to save or open the file,
chose open, this will make Utorrent start up
and allow you to chose where to save your download
on your computer then wait a few minutes untill
the download is complete, note, you cannot view the
movie untill it's 100% complete
I hope that helps.
Bulls are stupid Animals!especially when Im short!
  • #700
  • Jan 22, 2012 5:37am Jan 22, 2012 5:37am
Quoting High.Five
Thanks cogs, roughtrader and fx13.

If the VDP is active on the demo platform, it surely must be active on live one. I doubt FXCM will be able to segragate the VDP to operate on one and not on another.

Cogs, if by any chance you do happen to test their live accounts, please do let a novice trader like me know. It's hard earned money. I want to trade with a broker I can trust.
I'm sure FXCM not using VDP on this! Because their MT4 price feed is the same as TS2. Take care for that point. Doesn't mean FXCM is not cheating no!!!

FXCM is linking MT4 to it's core execution system & this system is custom built for the "NDD" but "AUTOMATED Dealing DESK" system so it can move markup pricefeed each time & spread to make more money. FXCM have some tuned solution but unlike virtual dealer that requotes & ticks are now outdated & well known.

Example:

Check FXCM raw spread (avaible thru Active trader platform) it's supposed to be the price feed used before FXCM add markup or it's own charge in ask & bid. It's usually about 0.8-1 pip per side and would get on Eurusd 1.6-2. You will notice that markup will widen & move from ask to bid depending on price moves ;-).

If they were so transparent FXCM would set a FIXED charge on each side & not move it depending on price move or even widen it or also depending on market balance buyers Vs Sellers as I think the heavier side will get charged more to make more ca$h!

13

PS: Jason this is an unprofessional thread... So...
Brokers are angels
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