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Pitbull Trader with Position Building

  • #401
  • Jan 16, 2012 3:55am Jan 16, 2012 3:55am
Took this signal at 3:45 AM Central and gone back to bed. Long AUD/USD and EUR/USD.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: long au.jpg Size: 169 KB
  • #402
  • Jan 16, 2012 4:06am Jan 16, 2012 4:06am
Yet another way of trading this system with a slight change in the pair selection. I have been trading 8 pairs ( No eurgbp and UsdJpy)

My group consists of NU,NJ,AU,AJ,EU,EJ,GU and GY,

Then I look at the 2 pairs where base currency is same, for eg EURUSD/EUROJPY.
When profit is double of the loss on one pair I close both pairs.
Wait and do same with the rest of the pairs. Seem to be pretty good so far.

Only problem is one has to watch it constantly and try to close both pairs simultaneously.( hope some one can create a script/Ea to take care of this)

I hate to add lot size as mentioned by chip, because when things go wrong whole account seem to collapse.
  • #403
  • Jan 16, 2012 5:09am Jan 16, 2012 5:09am
Good advice from Chips re exposure limits.
I use an overall 15%. If you apply the profit tracker indi (previously posted) it gives you an ongoing % value profit or DD. Makes life easier.

  1. I don’t close any of the indicator trades when I place a new trade. The 0.01 indi trades run throughout my session.
  2. I don’t take profit on the indicator trades....they are only of interest to me for larger lot size trades .10 .20 .40
  3. I always open the basket with 0.01 lot size.
  4. If I close a .10 .20 .40 trade for profit I don't open another at .01 lot size as thats the indicator lot size and they are always open.

cheers

  • #404
  • Jan 16, 2012 5:31am Jan 16, 2012 5:31am
Quoting ES Trader

I hate to add lot size as mentioned by chip, because when things go wrong whole account seem to collapse.
I agree with this. It is more risky to add increasing lot sizes. If anything, the indicator trades should be the higher lot size and add ons should be increasingly smaller. That way if you add on,
your average price is farther away from current price allowing for more breathing room for prices to flucuate before you have to put on a hedge.

For example (lets assume .01 lots = .10 per pip)

Adding higher lot size:

Eur/usd up 100 pips.. indicator trade = + 10.00(.01lots)
Add on .04
Eur/usd drops 50 pips..indicator trade = + 5.00 (.01 lots)
Add on trade = - 20.00 (.04 lots) trade trades
Total = (- 15.00)

Adding decreasing lot size:

Eur/Usd up 100 pips..indicator trade = + 40.00 (.04 lots)
Add on .01
Eur/usd drops 50 pips.. indicator trade = + 20.00 (.04 lots)
Add on trade = - 5.00 (.01 lots)
Total = + 15.00

Now lets say in stead of E/U reversing it went up another 100 pips, then the total for both trades would be:

Increasing lot sizes = + 60.00 (20.00 + 40.00)

decreasing lot sizes = + 90.00 (80.00 + 10.00)

You can try different examples of movement, but I think decreasing is a much safer way to go about this especially since drawdown seems to be the most concern for this method. Just my .02 worth.
  • #405
  • Edited 7:52am Jan 16, 2012 7:17am | Edited 7:52am
Quoting longhornxtreme
Chips:

Question:

If USD/JPY goes on a long rally, how does the basket still cycle from profit to loss to profit to loss?

Thanks a bunch,
LHX
Be patient, let it run until it is exhausted, (or when it stall on sideways),it may take a week, a month, or a year, but it will eventually come out from it's box - this I learned from Graeme. When it does, be ready to fasten your belt and reload all your ammos to recover your lost. Key word also from Graeme: particapate, follow the market (or cylce if you may) is what we need.
  • #406
  • Jan 16, 2012 7:28am Jan 16, 2012 7:28am
Bonjour courtneywild,

THANKS for your reply and I see that you always open the basket with 0.01 lot size in order to keep your DD as tiny as possible at first.

And once your 0.01 indicator trades show the way, you place trades .10 on the LAST two bottom pairs !

Now my main concern is what could be your started lot size when you open your basket if you get an account for example of 10.000€ or more ?

Did you always open tyour basket at 0.01 lot size

Thanks for your attention,

Happy trading,

Angel
  • #407
  • Jan 16, 2012 7:45am Jan 16, 2012 7:45am
Quoting Angel65
Bonjour courtneywild,

THANKS for your reply and I see that you always open the basket with 0.01 lot size in order to keep your DD as tiny as possible at first.

And once your 0.01 indicator trades show the way, you place trades .10 on the LAST two bottom pairs !

Now my main concern is what could be your started lot size when you open your basket if you get an account for example of 10.000€ or more ?

Did you always open tyour basket at 0.01 lot size

Thanks for your attention,

Happy trading,

Angel
...
Bonjour Angel.

This is my take on things...

Remember the opening trades are there for indication only. I am not interested in how much profit/loss each 0.01 trade makes. In fact at .01 they can move in large pip numbers yet profit/loss is pretty small.

The small lot size yes keeps DD a minimum but of course also any profit so you see that is not the issue... the DD on this lot size (in my experience) is always small. I just want the idicator in place.

So really the smaller the lot size you can run to produce the indicator is best. Profit is made from the higher lot size trades you place (sales) .10 .20 .40 or whatever your risk/ account is suitalbe for.

Yes for me regardless of account size I would open basket at 0.01 lot size.

trust this makes sense!

a bientot
  • #408
  • Jan 16, 2012 7:56am Jan 16, 2012 7:56am
Quoting trade4fun
about the USDJPY situation.

the only main difference in how i do it. is using oil and gold as anchors and i trade using support and resistance to set in my trades based on heavy spikes.

DD control is rule.
Trade4fun,

If I understand it right, one of these is buy and the other is sell. Kindly confirm.
  • #409
  • Jan 16, 2012 8:31am Jan 16, 2012 8:31am
Quoting ES Trader
Yet another way of trading this system with a slight change in the pair selection. I have been trading 8 pairs ( No eurgbp and UsdJpy)

My group consists of NU,NJ,AU,AJ,EU,EJ,GU and GY,

Then I look at the 2 pairs where base currency is same, for eg EURUSD/EUROJPY.
When profit is double of the loss on one pair I close both pairs.
Wait and do same with the rest of the pairs. Seem to be pretty good so far.

Only problem is one has to watch it constantly and try to close both pairs simultaneously.( hope some one can create a script/Ea...

Hi ES Trader,
could you show a pic about your open trades.
A friend of mine is testing an EA for the Pitbull System. Could be interesting to use your pairs.
  • #410
  • Jan 16, 2012 8:41am Jan 16, 2012 8:41am
Hope I am not stepping on ES's foot

But I am doing the same

Sell
GJ
AJ
NU
EU

Buy
GU
EJ
NJ
AU

They cancel each other out your .01 lot opening is about -$3.00
It may move a $1 or $2 + or minus

You don't have to worry so much about BOJ and the JPY pairs killing your
start up Pitbull Indi
  • #411
  • Jan 16, 2012 8:45am Jan 16, 2012 8:45am
Dear courtneywild,

Great, it does take sense for me and I agree with you that profits are made from the higher lot size trades you place (sales) .10 .20 .40 or whatever your risk/ account is suitalbe for.

Just for sharing trading ideas, my trading method is very simple :

1) ALL 5 indicators "sell or buy" are in the top/bottom half
2) Place trade on the LAST TWO bottom pairs (highest profits) and hedge the FIRST top pairs (highest loss) at the SAME lot size just for freezing this loss
3) Take profits at 3:1 sales cost ratio (on average 25 to 30 pips regarding FXCM's spread).

OK, back to work even if the market is quiet now.

My best tou you,

Happy trading all,

Angel
  • #412
  • Jan 16, 2012 8:49am Jan 16, 2012 8:49am
Quoting thorn
I agree with this. It is more risky to add increasing lot sizes. If anything, the indicator trades should be the higher lot size and add ons should be increasingly smaller. That way if you add on,
your average price is farther away from current price allowing for more breathing room for prices to flucuate before you have to put on a hedge.

For example (lets assume .01 lots = .10 per pip)

Adding higher lot size:

Eur/usd up 100 pips.. indicator trade = + 10.00(.01lots)
Add on .04
Eur/usd drops 50 pips..indicator trade = + 5.00 (.01 lots)
Add...


Since no one really knows where the market is going..may I suggest that you always start with lower lot sizes and increase your lot size once you see a clear trend. That way you have Trend working with you and you are capitalizing on the market move.

think about it.
  • #413
  • Jan 16, 2012 9:00am Jan 16, 2012 9:00am
Quoting Angel65
Dear courtneywild,

Great, it does take sense for me and I agree with you that profits are made from the higher lot size trades you place (sales) .10 .20 .40 or whatever your risk/ account is suitalbe for.

Just for sharing trading ideas, my trading method is very simple :

1) ALL 5 indicators "sell or buy" are in the top/bottom half
2) Place trade on the LAST TWO bottom pairs (highest profits) and hedge the FIRST top pairs (highest loss) at the SAME lot size just for freezing this loss
3) Take profits at 3:1 sales cost ratio (on average 25...
I don't always hedge the top two pairs. I wait and let them run. I may hedge at some point to freeze but prefer to build on the sales and manage DD that way. If top two run away I will consider hedge, reduce lot (close portion) or leave it cycle.
  • #414
  • Jan 16, 2012 9:16am Jan 16, 2012 9:16am
Quoting dryclean
Hope I am not stepping on ES's foot

But I am doing the same

Sell
GJ
AJ
NU
EU

Buy
GU
EJ
NJ
AU

They cancel each other out your .01 lot opening is about -$3.00
It may move a $1 or $2 + or minus

You don't have to worry so much about BOJ and the JPY pairs killing your
start up Pitbull Indi
Do you take profits the same way described by ES? Thanks
  • #415
  • Jan 16, 2012 9:37am Jan 16, 2012 9:37am
Quoting aelimian
Do you take profits the same way described by ES? Thanks
No I I use what pretty much everyone else is doing but on these 8 pair
Trade the 1 pair at the bottom only.
  • #416
  • Jan 16, 2012 10:03am Jan 16, 2012 10:03am
Quoting ES Trader
Yet another way of trading this system with a slight change in the pair selection. I have been trading 8 pairs ( No eurgbp and UsdJpy)

My group consists of NU,NJ,AU,AJ,EU,EJ,GU and GY,

Then I look at the 2 pairs where base currency is same, for eg EURUSD/EUROJPY.
When profit is double of the loss on one pair I close both pairs.
Wait and do same with the rest of the pairs. Seem to be pretty good so far.

Only problem is one has to watch it constantly and try to close both pairs simultaneously.( hope some one can create a script/Ea...
Please name the buys and sells using this variation. Thanks
  • #417
  • Jan 16, 2012 10:30am Jan 16, 2012 10:30am
Quoting tebis
Hi ES Trader,
could you show a pic about your open trades.
A friend of mine is testing an EA for the Pitbull System. Could be interesting to use your pairs.
Here are the trades
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: 5.jpg Size: 308 KB
  • #418
  • Jan 16, 2012 12:17pm Jan 16, 2012 12:17pm
Quoting ES Trader
Here are the trades
Thanks !
  • #419
  • Edited 2:08pm Jan 16, 2012 1:40pm | Edited 2:08pm
Quoting mobthehop
I really don't understand why all the hecklers always congregate on every thread that has something to do with Brian's ideas.... I follow 20+ threads on FF and nowhere else do I find so much negativity.....

Moving on....

Attached screenshot for this week - my demo account was deleted over the holidays as I was not trading.... Closed 1st basket of today (open for about 90 min this morning Asia time) to avoid ambiguity...

Have attached another visual aide which needs to be put in the expert folder (use like an EA but it is not trading!) -...
mobthehop , you are soooo right.....and I wander why......if they can't understand, it means no one else does......and if anyone thinks "chips" is "bijon" (I am not going to say any names....)no kidding he can't understand how to trade this way.......pleaseeeeee!!!!

Traders that can't trade this way are actually trying to convince traders that trade this way that it can't be done.....

There are so many other treads......you don't have to read this one.....
  • #420
  • Jan 16, 2012 3:39pm Jan 16, 2012 3:39pm
  •  MPP
  • Joined Jun 2007 | Status: Be yourself, everyone else is taken | 2,734 Posts
Quoting MPP
if we had opened the pitball basket on 1 july 2008 - this is where we'd be

309.20Nu
721.40Au
356.30Eg
-3092.20Eu
-4618.20Gu

2928.70Uj
1980.50Nj
6986.80Ej
9379.50Gj
2246.90Aj
...
now to follow on from this - here's the same results using the 8 pairs now being mentioned - for comparison

assuming we are using 0.01 lots 1000pips is around $100.00usd

Short Market results:

-4618.20GU Buy
-3092.20Eu
721.40Au
309.20Nu

9379.50Gj Sell
6986.80Ej
2246.90Aj
1980.50Nj

13913.90


-9394.00Gj Buy
-3092.20Eu
-2257.90Aj
309.20Nu

6986.80Ej Sell
-727.30Au
1980.50Nj
4610.40Gu

-1584.50

this just demonstrates the reason for balancing the basket, whilst the short side has shown massive profits - it would also equal massive loses if the market was long

why fight it when the markets turn.

just to add to this if we also flipped the 8 pairs balanced over we would be in profit by 1503 instead of neg -1584 and would have the advantage of the tripple swap.
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