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Zero Net Loss Trading Strategies

  • #61
  • Edited 8:02pm Jun 10, 2011 5:47pm | Edited 8:02pm
This guy from Nigeria has my attention.

I expect it to become something much more valuable than all the requests for money that seem to find a way to my mail or Skype,

So till the time you are back and able to explain matters a bit better, I will wait patiently.
  • #62
  • Jun 10, 2011 7:55pm Jun 10, 2011 7:55pm
Quoting angus
Hi,

Yes, I saw that, but what was the drawdown for that particular trade mentioned in my post?
307939102011.05.16 00:20sell20.00eurusd1.40730.00001.40732011.05.23 06:221.40730.000.00-545.8500.00

My dear a little patience will do.The trade reversed back to its original position and it was closed at $0.That is part of the strategy.Confirm the trade on your charts.Note that the strategy is an outside the box strategy.We dictate to the market what we want and we are not at the mercy of the market.

"A man without integrity,is as good as a dead man".

Thanks.
  • #63
  • Edited 2:29am Jun 11, 2011 2:00am | Edited 2:29am
Quoting oluwadare
30793910 2011.05.16 00:20 sell 20.00 eurusd 1.4073 0.0000 1.4073 2011.05.23 06:22 1.4073 0.00 0.00 -545.85 0 0.00

My dear a little patience will do.The trade reversed back to its original position and it was closed at $0.That is part of the strategy.Confirm the trade on your charts.Note that the strategy is an outside the box strategy.We dictate to the market what we want and we are not at the mercy of the market.

"A man without integrity,is as good as a dead man".

Thanks.
That still doesn't answer my question, but I guess it safe to say you don't mind a 60k drawdown?
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  • #64
  • Jun 11, 2011 12:31pm Jun 11, 2011 12:31pm
Quoting ido370
This only works when you have much, much money just made a similar EA last week which places a buy and sell order after each other, and every time price is up 10 pips higher, it buys, and ofcourse same applies to sell, every 10 pips more down, it sells.
every time when profit + order swap of all orders is >5 (or what you want) then all orders were closed.
in a back-test (1m) on 2010, there's times that there maybe like 200 order all open!
Also you should take profit every few month's or so, until you reach at least twice your deposited amount,...
Sorry, I can not send PMs since I am a junior Can you please share the EA you mentioned in the above post, or send the code by PM? I was just looking for something like that, I will be grateful for your kind assistance.
Thank you!
  • #65
  • Jun 11, 2011 7:03pm Jun 11, 2011 7:03pm
Quoting savastekin
Sorry, I can not send PMs since I am a junior Can you please share the EA you mentioned in the above post, or send the code by PM? I was just looking for something like that, I will be grateful for your kind assistance.
Thank you!
sure. i just came home from a party, so gonna sleep first
i'll upload the ea tommorow in this thread so you can play with it. i used it about 3 times last 2 weeks (and especially on trichet day...) so i was sure to get another 1 euro (which is set as profitlevel on this micro account )
i'm using it with a pip distance of 100 pips, and a minimum profitlevel of 1.
in backtest i've seen it at a maximum of around 30 orders last 2 year, so that's still easyily done with micro account with 0.01 lotsize
  • #66
  • Edited 5:47am Jun 12, 2011 5:34am | Edited 5:47am
To be honest anybody using indicators, money management and a stoploss is gauranteed to loose all their money over time.

Brokers are 100% aware that 95% of traders follow money management rules and see where your stops are and will place counter trades in order to hunt them down. If the brokers don't take your pips then murphy will. I gaurantee that there is not 1 person on this forum that can provide verified accounts proving any of the systems mentioned on this forum to be profitable. If there is, I'll give them £10k right now. Even this strat here is flawed because the author forgot to include sufficient hedging against reversals and cannot close for a loss (martingale blowup).

The only and I repeat only way to make money in this game is to use hedging / no stop loss. They can't take unrealised losses from you providing you have sufficient margin equity to cover it.

I hedge trade oil companies in the aim stock market and make money on spuds, gushers and dusters. Not every time admitidly, but far more profitable than if i was to just guess using indicators.

I don't even use moving averages or MACD anymore. Every day indicators become less and less reliable, the stock market I trade is saturated with high frequency and algo traders, do you think they care about your MA cross, course they don't they're arbing the spread. Forex is becoming more and more algo by the day.

The only profitable strategy I've found so far is hedging, and thus I presume this is why hedge funds are called hedge funds and not scalping funds or trend trading funds.

The problem with the strategy is you do need a lot of capital. I'm almost ready to go live with my own EA based on grid hedging, it uses what I call 3 way variable hedging. The second and third hedge deal with trend reversals and close at a loss just under break even if the trade is faked out 3 times. This happens very rarely so far on my forward test and is far outweighed by the profits generated.

And if you must know yes I'm trading 0.01 lots but thanks to the hedging no £60k drawdowns here.

I'm taking 10% profit every month using my strategy, anything more than that is gambling.
  • #67
  • Jun 12, 2011 6:37am Jun 12, 2011 6:37am
Quoting bluebulluk
The only and I repeat only way to make money in this game is to use hedging / no stop loss. They can't take unrealised losses from you providing you have sufficient margin equity to cover it.
Hi bluebulluk, 100% agree with you on this.

Quoting bluebulluk
grid hedging
Im working on developing something similar to this but I have a feeling it will only be possible by applying some kind of martingale/pseudo-martingale concept to it.

Quoting bluebulluk
3 way variable hedging.
Does this mean you will have 3 "seperate" hedges open at any given time?
Is this with one market or a basket?

Interesting comments

cheers
  • #68
  • Jun 12, 2011 10:41am Jun 12, 2011 10:41am
Quoting Pipalicious
Hi bluebulluk, 100% agree with you on this.



Im working on developing something similar to this but I have a feeling it will only be possible by applying some kind of martingale/pseudo-martingale concept to it.



Does this mean you will have 3 "seperate" hedges open at any given time?
Is this with one market or a basket?

Interesting comments

cheers
What I mean is you have 3 ea's however the middle and right ea's are connected to the basket of the previous hedge

so, the first EA has a basket, on x level it then opens a hedge which is actually the basket of another EA, the hedge element then grabs pips so that it and the first ea can close as one whole basket.

In the event of failure a third EA will hedge against the hedge, what this means is you are always in the middle ground and have the market cornered from every angle.

As soon as you are in profit bang, all 3 ea's close.
  • #69
  • Jun 12, 2011 11:24am Jun 12, 2011 11:24am
Interesting.

Would like to test that setup, so awaiting your future posts on the subject.
  • #70
  • Jun 12, 2011 2:02pm Jun 12, 2011 2:02pm
Quoting bluebulluk
What I mean is you have 3 ea's however the middle and right ea's are connected to the basket of the previous hedge

so, the first EA has a basket, on x level it then opens a hedge which is actually the basket of another EA, the hedge element then grabs pips so that it and the first ea can close as one whole basket.

In the event of failure a third EA will hedge against the hedge, what this means is you are always in the middle ground and have the market cornered from every angle.

As soon as you are in profit bang, all 3 ea's close.
Finally got my internet up and running again, was out all day, and ofcourse provider couldn't be reached on sunday
I'll make some last changes to my EA and will upload it tomorrow.

I'm interested in your grid hedger too, can you share your code or a more detailed explination of it?
  • #71
  • Jun 12, 2011 2:23pm Jun 12, 2011 2:23pm
Quoting bluebulluk
What I mean is you have 3 ea's however the middle and right ea's are connected to the basket of the previous hedge

so, the first EA has a basket, on x level it then opens a hedge which is actually the basket of another EA, the hedge element then grabs pips so that it and the first ea can close as one whole basket.

In the event of failure a third EA will hedge against the hedge, what this means is you are always in the middle ground and have the market cornered from every angle.

As soon as you are in profit bang, all 3 ea's close.
In the end the market is constantly presenting opportunities, irrelevant of 'conventional conditions' per se...

I suppose its just a way of viewing the markets, a mindset.

Its the difference between punters' gambling amongst each other meanwhile in the background the real entrepeneur is building a solid sustainable business model, providing a 'service' for those who would like to gamble/play amongst each other.

You simply collect the fees.

Nah, just talking aloud but that is how I personally view the markets.

I also believe to fit into this approach using stops isnt the way to go...

Your approach sounds very intriguing and 'stable'.
  • #72
  • Jun 12, 2011 2:43pm Jun 12, 2011 2:43pm
Quoting bluebulluk
To be honest anybody using indicators, money management and a stoploss is gauranteed to loose all their money over time.

Brokers are 100% aware that 95% of traders follow money management rules and see where your stops are and will place counter trades in order to hunt them down. If the brokers don't take your pips then murphy will. I gaurantee that there is not 1 person on this forum that can provide verified accounts proving any of the systems mentioned on this forum to be profitable. If there is, I'll give them £10k right now. Even this strat...
This is an excellent post. A lot of good observations and advice in here.
  • #73
  • Jun 12, 2011 2:44pm Jun 12, 2011 2:44pm
I learn a lot from this comments.
  • #74
  • Jun 13, 2011 9:41am Jun 13, 2011 9:41am
Quoting angus
That still doesn't answer my question, but I guess it safe to say you don't mind a 60k drawdown?
Good-day angus,
I observed you didn't study those trades very well.The actual drawdown was about 120pip.The trade was in hedge against another 20lot.The 20lot buy was closed in profit, while the sell leg was gamely allowed to reverse.
  • #75
  • Jun 13, 2011 9:45am Jun 13, 2011 9:45am
Good-day angus,
Hope you got my explanation.
Please Put me through on how you were able to put your comment on the chart after pulling it out. I need it for clear explanation of this strategy. I am back now.

Your prompt response will be appreciated.
  • #76
  • Jun 13, 2011 9:57am Jun 13, 2011 9:57am
i have read this thread from beginning to end and I must admit I have not come accross more rubbish in my whole career as a trader. This guy who started the thread is obviously a newby that knows absolutely ziltch and is sucking in the rest of you. I am not even going to explain why , it should be so obvious to any seasoned trader.
  • #77
  • Jun 13, 2011 10:14am Jun 13, 2011 10:14am
Quoting bluebulluk
To be honest anybody using indicators, money management and a stoploss is gauranteed to loose all their money over time.

Brokers are 100% aware that 95% of traders follow money management rules and see where your stops are and will place counter trades in order to hunt them down. If the brokers don't take your pips then murphy will. I gaurantee that there is not 1 person on this forum that can provide verified accounts proving any of the systems mentioned on this forum to be profitable. If there is, I'll give them £10k right now. Even this strat...
Good-day bluebulluk,

I've been waiting for you to come on this tread. You are powerfully wellcome!!!!.

Your findings are my findings.Lets share Ideas to make the strategy better.
I have redefined that strategy and that is what I used on the trades now that generated the 40%- http://fxwealth.mtrocket.com/. The risk management is tight.

I like to call it a game. It makes use of the risk management with worst case scenerio, gride, outside the box hedging,leveraging the market,respecting timeframe trend size,support and resistance,brakeouts etc.

The beauty is that you can turn your losses to profit. In the next 3weeks I will explain the strategy. It is obvious that people are finding it hard to believe trading is possible without netloss.


Successful Trading
  • #78
  • Jun 13, 2011 10:17am Jun 13, 2011 10:17am
Quoting johnvr
i have read this thread from beginning to end and I must admit I have not come accross more rubbish in my whole career as a trader. This guy who started the thread is obviously a newby that knows absolutely ziltch and is sucking in the rest of you. I am not even going to explain why , it should be so obvious to any seasoned trader.
If you are a guru, what are you looking for out-here.
  • #79
  • Jun 13, 2011 10:21am Jun 13, 2011 10:21am
Just looking to see what the wabee's are up to. You have to be a wanabee if you think that an EA is going to make you money.
  • #80
  • Jun 13, 2011 2:21pm Jun 13, 2011 2:21pm
Quoting johnvr
Just looking to see what the wabee's are up to. You have to be a wanabee if you think that an EA is going to make you money.

You could might consider trying this EA.
When attaching the EA to your chart it will open a buy and sell order inmediately.
Then, after reaching the given distance, it will place a new buy or sell order, until the profit equals the minprofit variable.

Since, this EA is always in trade, if you want to quit trading it, you should set the EA option stop to true.

when stop is set to true, the EA will stop placing new orders when the current orders are closed in profit.

P.S. it does calculate the profit including commission and/or swap.
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