Thinking Outside the Box!?!

Well unless you have a crystal ball you will never know that.

Why get hung up on trying to figure out which way it's going to go and just go the way it's already going?

Cause its already been there

ROFL..

people who want to argue about if its best to be in or out the box is irrelevant.. this discussion is open to outside the box.. or at least attempting to stir that creativity.. if your not here to contribute to outside the box then please go elsewhere

thank you

Fair enough. It's your thread. Good luck with the search

I just see it this way right.. if you consider transportation our "wheel".. then if we never tried to reinvent the "wheel".. we would not have cars and still be walking..

and then if we never tried to reinvent transportation again we would never came up with the helicopter or airplane...

so walking works... but i'm just trying to reinvent the wheel so I can have my sexy porsche.. and then my sexy jet

Ok one for out of the box. I was watching a pre recorded webinar on INO.

The speaker telling the story was a professional trader in his 60's. he had been trading successfully for many decades.

He spoke about his early days on the floor of the CBOT or CME can't recall.
One newbie came in one day armed with a open ended can on a string.

He came in everyday with the open ended can on a string. Quickly he was being noticed and mocked by most of the floor traders for coming in with the can on the string and keeping it next to his ear all through the trading session.

So the speaker asked him one day why he had the can on the string?

His reply was the people on Mars were telling him whether to buy or sell.
He was serious, as you can imagine he instantly became a laughing stock.

Fast forward he became one of the most successful traders on the floor because when he bought and price went in his direction he held on to it for a big winner and when he was wrong he cut the trade quickly.

True story.

Bingo I couldn't have said it better myself.... those are perfect examples of "Thinking outside the box."

They all will get you from point A to point B but each one is different... to expand on that... we have trains, buses, boats, motor cycles and so on... each one derived from someone who challenged the "box".

you take the thread sir.

Oh I really wanted to mess with this idea.. I need someones assistance though as I'm still confused......

so you know the saying.. over 90% are losing traders..

but basically how it works is 90% of trader rule assumes that 90% are losing traders..... in other words 90% are doing something wrong.. so you look around FF and see 90% of people on FF do the same crap right.. system.. indicators.. technicals.. etc.

now heres the punch line..

its also the 90% of traders who assume and believe the saying "90% of traders are losing traders".. because it also seems like 90% of traders say and talk about "90% of traders rule.." etc..

so thats a mind trip right.. since 90% of traders believe in the "90% of traders are losers" and most also associate whatever the majority 90% are doing must be the common mistake..

so thats where I leave off basically..


I know its a mind trip but wtf does that mean then.. the 90% of traders lose philosophy is wrong?


im so confused.. I'm melting my own fucking brain...





PS: to clear my own thoughts about the myth "90% of traders lose/fail"

I believe its simple means 90% of people who try forex give up or fail to become self sufficient traders.. and not 90% of active traders are currently failing.. and yet this is still unconfirmed for me never seen any true stats...



any thoughts on this mind trip?

Maybe focusing on the minority of 'winning' traders or % of trades would be a different way to look at that stat.

Outside Box Thinking: Think as if there's no box.

DAMN.. thats pretty deep.. there is no box bitches.. I like your thinking..

Good point but you need to understand why the wheel works before you start making cycles, cars and trains.

Regarding the 90% failures Emerald hit the nail on the head, concentrate on finding the 10% winners and do what they do.

http://mylowcarbjourney.com/wp-conte.../tv_static.gif

LOL, that TV sums up this entire site.

Go watch the movie: "The Number 23" with Jim Carey


Another good one for comparison: "A Beautiful Mind" with Russel Crowe

I think you will likely get a few answers.

Everyone.. thank you for the solid contributions so far.. I am surprise this thread was still alive after my brief absence as well..

as for Emeralds comment.. I like the idea of focusing on what the 10% are doing.. in fact thats what most my personal search is on FF, but when you said this it also provoked the though about the market..

to me I find 90% of the people in forex and on FF are focusing on where the market/price will go to next.. However...

you could also think of it as.. where the market / price will not go..


good stuff so far !

Hey new year here is my take on it. First as you know, you and I don't move markets the big players do ( institutions and banks).
Now 90% or maybe more look at the charts to make a decision. We all see the same thing, kind of. As we all see the same thing as like a price rally, fall or sideways action we react the same way.

Ok this is how we fail, unless its a real move based on Fundamental changes that have just occurred which will cause a rapid rise or fall the market big wigs are just playing liquidity games with us.

Hence you sit at your PC with 99 others at the same time watching the same pair on the same time frame. You all see then 10ma cross up the 20 or 50 or 100 or whatever ma with macd or stochastics or whatever giving you the go ahead.

Here is the catch, it matters not what is actually happening on the charts. Its what the buyers or sellers of the moment are doing. So on this occasion all the little fish have gone long. The books are lopsided with a lot of small buy orders. None big just small, no big sell orders at this time of day either.

So Takumi from the Bank of Japan is observing current price action and order flow. He notices a great opportunity to hit it short hard and for the risk of 1 million he makes 2 or 3 million for his bank. He jumps on and hits everybody's stops and jumps out. Job done!

Now at that same time of the day if nobody was watching the crossover and you along with 99 others were still all positioned short from another time frame and the order flow was showing the opposite affect. Well then Takumi would be buying and taking out everyone's stops and making money for his bank.

So it matters not what the charts are showing its where liquidity is.

The funny part is that we are told that this is not gambling it is a type of speculating or high risk investing.
Well in my short time playing Forex, I can conclusively state that it's easier to win by gambling on something you are more tuned in to then forex.

You see in Forex, you can spot a trade, play it confidently within your rules. It can go your way a little, then do a full reversal, spook you out, take your money and then go where you thought it would. A loss.

In any other betting, you are locked in. So your horse or sports team is losing mid event. So what your in for the ride. At the end of the event you either win or lose not you were winning, then lost but then it won.

Also if you follow any sports its not so hard to pick a sure winner. A strong team playing at home versus a weak side with injuries. Ok the odds maybe poor but a win is a win.

Don't get me wrong I love this game and I'm desperately trying all I can to come up with a winning recipe but the more I see, the more I realize that Forex is a greater fools game then anything else I've come across.

So philosophy is not wrong. I'll conclude by saying that successful day traders would have a pure and clear mind with no biases, fears or hesitations. I bet they log on the PC, skirt the charts, see a popular chart pattern taking shape and jump on it for the ride with no thinking. When it looks like it aint doing what it normally does they jump off. When it is doing they stay on board.

Honestly I see no other way. You need to remove all the junk inside your head and just go with the flow so to speak. I'm gearing towards this but I'm not there just yet, lifestyle prevents it at the moment but I'm working on it.

Pure and real Fundamental changes dont get played out in price resulting in a rapid rise or fall. What u are talking about is more like a sentiment change which could change dramatically in a Week,day, an hour or even in a single sentence by a central banker, piece of news coming out well above expectations or well below them, a rumor about debt restructuring and the list goes on.............. and thus creates the rapid move's getting traders offguard.

On the other hand a fundamental shift like growing inflation etc almost always leads or lags the market even months before or after the shift,... cause markets are forward looking and pricing in what could be expected in future and sometimes markets keep ignoring things until they get so bigger to be ignored,... thus a lag.
.

One method I've been doing for over a year now on my demo account feels very different to me

I have not attempted to trade it for live due to its non strict nature

but basically what I do is watch the 1M TF and just make a mental note of the actual fluctuations

so basically I see the 1M bouncing up and down between a certain range.. and by 1M I mean the current candle still being formed in the 1M.. and I watch it bounce up and down and stretch out the low and high

and then I start putting in buy and sell market order at the lower end and higher end of these fluctuations

sure scalping is nothing new but I feel my approach is a wee bit out of the box here.. its like trading on the bounces of a single current candle..

the crazy part is I make a good amount of demo profit doing this.. but the problem I have is to actually risk real sexy Benjamin's on such an unrefined method


anyways it works pretty well and maybe posting here others will find it useful? possibly build up my strength to trade it live?

although its so unrefined I'm sure others would fail at it.. but literally you can't find a thread on what I'm talking about.. you would need a video at the least to capture what I'm explaining as well... shit I might even make one if anyones interested..

but the methods so unrefined its more of an art than science

I don't know what I expect from this post but the method has not done much real shiz for me yet so I might as well share


PCCCEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Thanks! To be successful at trading a market we must be able to have an unbiased opinion and treat both sides the same.. there has to be a buyer for every seller right?

I like your mindset but have to make a change on one thing though.. my 90% (or w/e) wasn't necessary about traders, but about trades themselves. My pre-edit post was that one of my strategies I use has over 95% loss rate. How much those trades risk & lose is what we're in control of. Like you said, where will the market not go, and if it does then we dont care.

IMO 'losers' (traders) risk too much, are overleveraged, succumb to greed, and are out of the game before they have any positions in their portfolio.

All views are my personally opinion to help jump out the box