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Expert traders secret "revealed"

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  • #1
  • First Post: Edited May 17, 2011 5:04am May 5, 2011 4:56pm | Edited May 17, 2011 5:04am
The forex market is principally governed by two principles which are;

 

  1. Technical Analysis
  2. Fundamental Analysis


Technical analysis has to do with patterns (based on past statistical data) that shows the continuation or reversal of a trend while the fundermental Analysis has to do with economic forces such as the news.
With this said, so many have fallen into the trap that if you have a strong understanding on the technical and fundermental principles of the market they are bound to make money As discussed in this thread
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=57639


you may have the Mega - strategy but if you don't know what i am about to tell you, you will just be another frustrated trader trying one system to another and then buying that EA for a couple of hundred dollars and still not getting results.


SO WHAT'S THE SECRET?

I will not tell you yet. I will tell you what really controls the forex market.

HUMAN EMOTION/PSYCHOLOGY
This is the driving power behind the forex market. The price of any commodity doesn't depend on the cost of raw materials but the consumer's perception of the value of that commodity.
Some Economic Analyst are of the opinion that Greed and market sentiments drives prices up and down.

(References;
http://todaystockmarket.info/secret3/
http://investorshub.advfn.com/boards...e_id=61575136#
http://www.fortunewatch.com/handling...-in-investing/


This partially explains why you hear the phrase "THE BULLS ARE TAKING OVER" or "THE BEARS ARE TAKING OVER".

BULLS: This simply means that majority of the traders are perceiving that the market will go up so they buy. the more the buy the more the market price drives up. the inverse happens for a bearish market.

NOW HERE IS THE MAGIC PHRASE
"Make your Greed recede
and you will succeed Indeed"

'Quote Adewumi Gideon

THATS IT!!!
That is the secret so many experts wont tell.
Why is it a secret?
Because it's what many people neglect, perharps because they dont want to see themselves as been greedy.

What does that mean?

It clearly spells out three words

  1. CONTENTMENT
  2. DISCIPLINE
  3. ORGANISATION

  1. They are contented with their systems and try to make it work and master the up and downs of it.
  2. Most Forex Experts are disciplined they set their target and once the achieve it they don't go for more no matter how bright the market can be.
  3. They are very organized and keep daily logs or journal of every trade or setup the make.


Reference:
http://www.earningmoneyonlinearticle...-fundamentals/

Someone out there might probably be saying by now that if I know all this why am I not topping Warren Buffet by now?

The answer is simple

"It takes a Great mind to conceive but takes a mastermind to Achieve." (Gideon Adewumi)

In order words, I am working towards mastering my emotions. If I can control that I can "command" the market to go in my favour and make pips drip into my bank account


Thanks for lending me your hears

one may ask,
So what you saying in essence. None of this sounds new to me;

'its simple experts dont neglect what know but neglect

"..the diligent man will get precious wealth (Proverbs 12:27; RSV)."

  • #2
  • May 5, 2011 5:39pm May 5, 2011 5:39pm
good post but not exactly THE secret.

it takes many components to be successful

YOU= psychology, processing of information, intuition,

Market recognition= understand the market youre trading on and strategic areas

Capitalization= understanding to manage your capital and using as strategy in itself.

system and discipline: strategy, style, discipline, reward

always adapt, the market changes, its unpredictable, adapt and adapt quickly, device a strategy on the fly
AVT INVENIAM VIAM AVT FACIAM
  • #3
  • May 5, 2011 6:06pm May 5, 2011 6:06pm
Quoting Adewumi
"Make your Greed recede and you will succeed Indeed" 'Quote Adewumi Gideon

"It takes a Great mind to conceive but takes a mastermind to Achieve." (Gideon Adewumi)
"...... but some parts of your post, I find hard to believe" (hanover)
Quoting Adewumi
...... I can command the market to go in my favour.........
How many billions are you moving?
  • #4
  • May 5, 2011 10:22pm May 5, 2011 10:22pm
Quoting hanover
How many billions are you moving?
I OPENED A LIVE ACCT A COUPLE OF YEARS BACK AND LOST MY ACCOUNT DEPOSIT IN A WEEK.

But that was mostly due to the newbie excitement spirit. That repeatitive voice ringing in your ears that you are ready.


After the loss i withdrew to went back to the drawing board. Became and on looker and principles of the market to the next level.

WHY ARE SO MANY PEOPLE TRADING FOREX?
the answer is simple


"IT IS THE GET RICH QUICK SYNDROME"


so many have pulled out of the market completely but i am still here not because i have the absolute answer but because i have the sincere answer for my losses.

I HAVE BEEN A THOUSAND TIMES BETTER SINCE THEN

so many people blame their loses on their trading strategies, systems or EA but fail to realise that those things dont have brains.

when we fail its because we are not ready and not basically because our systems are not tidy.


they are so many strategies here on Forex Factory still most people still can earn a living from forex.

Why? is it because the dont work?

I dont think so!

The so called "secret" i posted above simply reveals that orderliness and self control emphasied by experts to make sure you dont go for every pip in the market and end up losing your account in the process.



As for my success i would be posting my acct details (demo of course from time to time on my thread) for as long as i can keep my internet connection.

THANKS
  • #5
  • May 5, 2011 10:31pm May 5, 2011 10:31pm
Quoting the redlion
good post but not exactly THE secret.

it takes many components to be successful

YOU= psychology, processing of information, intuition,

Market recognition= understand the market youre trading on and strategic areas

Capitalization= understanding to manage your capital and using as strategy in itself.

system and discipline: strategy, style, discipline, reward

always adapt, the market changes, its unpredictable, adapt and adapt quickly, device a strategy on the fly

if you now all these and dont know when to exit the market you are bound to lose your money. one of my forex mentors (often critised though) Peter Bain once said "knowing when to exit a trade" separates most successful traders from the unsuccessful ones.

As for what you said, you certainly cant trade if you dont know your right from your left and i think everyone knows that thats why i didnt tag it as a secret in my post.

THANKS FOR POSTING ANYWAY
  • #6
  • May 6, 2011 12:50am May 6, 2011 12:50am
Quoting Adewumi
The forex market is principally governed by two principles which are;

 

  1. Technical Analysis
  2. Fundamental Analysis


Technical analysis has to do with patterns that shows the continuation or reversal of a trend while the fundermental Analysis has to do with economic forces such as the news.
With this said, so many have fallen into the trap that if you have a strong understanding on the technical and fundermental principles of the market they are bound to make money.

SORRY!!!

you are dead wrong.
you may have the Mega - strategy...

seems like the new age self-help guys have found their way to this forum.
  • #7
  • Edited 1:25am May 6, 2011 12:55am | Edited 1:25am
Quoting Adewumi
so many people blame their loses on their trading strategies, systems or EA but fail to realise that those things dont have brains.
and they are right to blame losses on their trading strategies.

Quoting Adewumi
when we fail its because we are not ready and not basically because our systems are not tidy.
I partly agree.

Quoting Adewumi
they are so many strategies here on Forex Factory still most people still can earn a living from forex.

Why? is it because the dont work?

I dont think so!
yes, because most don't work. If you backtest most strategies here, they will end up with negative expectancy.

Quoting Adewumi
As for my success i would be posting my acct details (demo of course from time to time on my thread) for as long as i can keep my internet connection.
of course demo, I didn't expect anything else.


I personally think, that if you really believe all that what you wrote, then you still got a lot to learn. Psychological development is overrated.
  • #8
  • Edited 1:19am May 6, 2011 1:04am | Edited 1:19am
Quoting Adewumi
if you now all these and dont know when to exit the market you are bound to lose your money. one of my forex mentors (often critised though) Peter Bain once said "knowing when to exit a trade" separates most successful traders from the unsuccessful ones.
Let me give you three choices and let you pick what is most important:

 

  1. entries
  2. exits
  3. profits/losses

which one is the most important here? Obviously profits/losses. What makes up the profits/losses? That's right, it's entries AND exits. Saying that ONLY exits separates successful from unsuccessful traders is utter nonesense, since the growth of your equity is depending on both entries AND exits.

  • #9
  • May 6, 2011 1:28am May 6, 2011 1:28am
Quoting Custos
Let me give you three choices and let you pick what is important:

 

  1. entries
  2. exits
  3. profits/losses

which one is the most important here? Obviously profits/losses. What makes up the profits/losses? That's right, it's entries AND exits. Saying that ONLY exits separates successful from unsuccessful traders is utter nonesense, since the growth of your equity is depending on both entries AND exits.

when i began this thread i had one thing in mind and that is
NEWBIES
if you talked to someone who hasn't spent a month trading forex you will notice that:

 

  1. they barely test a strategy for a week before the flush it out.
  2. most are impatient with the market
  3. the more profit they make the more they want to trade
  4. they hate to lose
  5. most lack money management and journal keeping traits which most experts promote



I once visited a website Urban Forex and he said something that i believe is true.
he said
"most strategies work, you just have to stick with it modify to your taste and trading conditions and you will do fine"

I believe if a system can get you profit 70% of the time, then that system is good.



Now here is why I stick to those statements that you said are partially true.

Most newbies now that already.
"if you want to train an athlete you work on his weaknesses not is strength. isn't it?"

thanks for posting anyway many people would find that useful

  • #10
  • May 6, 2011 1:32am May 6, 2011 1:32am
Quoting Adewumi
I OPENED A LIVE ACCT A COUPLE OF YEARS BACK AND LOST MY ACCOUNT DEPOSIT IN A WEEK. .......
IMO you made some valid points in your first post, but I'm afraid you're very naive if you believe that these are hidden secrets known only to expert traders. It's universally known that mindset, discipline and organization are important.

Some of your comments are incomplete or misleading. For example, psychology is only one of many forces that drive the FX market. Overcoming greed is only one part of becoming successful; each individual's shortcomings are different, and they are not necessarily all psychological. There are no "magic phrases", and it's not possible for a retail trader to "command the market". Simply mastering your emotions will not make you as wealthy as Warren Buffett.

I like Gil Blake's simple success formula. (He's one of Jack Scwhager's interviewees in New Market Wizards). From page 248:

1. Focus on trading vehicles, strategies, and time horizons that suit your personality.

2. Identify non-random price behavior, while recognizing that markets are random most of the time.

3. Absolutely convince yourself that what you’ve found is statistically valid.

4. Use this to set up trading rules.

5. Follow these rules.

The way I see it, it is both as simple, and as difficult, as that.
  • #11
  • May 6, 2011 1:34am May 6, 2011 1:34am
Quoting Adewumi
when i began this thread i had one thing in mind and that is
NEWBIES
if you talked to someone who hasn't spent a month trading forex you will notice that:

 

  1. they barely test a strategy for a week before the flush it out.
  2. most are impatient with the market
  3. the more profit they make the more they want to trade
  4. they hate to lose
  5. most lack money management and journal keeping traits which most experts promote

totally agreed. In the end they jump from strat to strat cause they are not sure if the strategies work. Emotionality will go away once you have rationality in its place. For me that means proper backtesting of a strategy and coming up net-positive in the end.

Quoting Adewumi
"most strategies work, you just have to stick with it modify to your taste and trading conditions and you will do fine"
nah, just from my backtesting work, can't agree with that statement. Most strategies are just crap and don't survive for long.


Quoting Adewumi
I believe if a system can get you profit 70% of the time, then that system is good.
positive expectancy is made up of two elements: win/loss ratio & risk/reward

Normally if you have a high win loss like 70%, you have a terrible risk/reward ratio. I actually think the best strategies have a low win/loss and a high risk reward ratio, cause they tend to be more robust, though not all of them.
  • #12
  • May 6, 2011 1:51am May 6, 2011 1:51am
Quoting hanover
IMO you made some valid points in your first post, but I'm afraid you're very naive if you believe that these are hidden secrets known only to expert traders. It's universally known that mindset, discipline and organization are important.

Some of your comments are incomplete or misleading. For example, psychology is only one of many forces that drive the FX market. Overcoming greed is only one part of becoming successful; each individual's shortcomings are different, and they are not necessarily all psychological. There are no "magic phrases",...
Nice observation i must say. some of the points you pointed out were gotten from some websites i read and they backed up what the said. with reasonable explanations.

for example most traders that trade soley on technical analysis avoid (or fear) news hours.

The news affects what we think will happen to a currency and hence people tend to enter long or short positions in anticipation that price will rise or fall as the case may be.

when you see news like eurusd has reached an all time high what comes to your mind?

Nevertheless, it is important to know that just being orgainised and not greedy wont make you like warren buffet. espicially if you dont have a good system.

As i told custos, this thread is meant for newbies and i wanted to address most mistakes they make.


it is good that you came up and clarify some issues so that someelse wont mis-quote me
i will try to be citing references
  • #13
  • May 6, 2011 6:31pm May 6, 2011 6:31pm
The purpose of establishing a thread is either to learn or to share.
I decided to post this because i discovered that many people were disappointed by the content of the thread after reading the thread's title.

They had high expectations only to see that it was not the really the secret the expected. perharps they expected something close to the holy grail. i will applogise to all who feel that way.

In summary, let all newbies take this advises

* Dont Buy or Sell unless you are following a strategy.
* Dont give up because of your massive losses. just make sure you pick a lesson from every bad trade. "Persistence brakes every resistance". if you dont quit and continue to learn from your mistakes, you will surely be a pro one day no matter how long it takes.
Wish you all the Best!!!


for me the secret to success is not really about a strategy but about you. Settle down,

 

  1. take forex gradually,
  2. if you have a strategy try to see how to maximize its profits and avoid its downsides or false signals.
  3. if you do look for a simple strategy with testimonials from fellow traders and probably acct details proof
  4. if you dont like something about the strategy try to modify it and make it suit your trading style or preferences
  5. Dont be Greedy,
  6. start with a daily target lets say 20pips a day and then 30pips after three months. it is better for your acct to grow gradually than for it to rise in a blink of an eye and lost in the grasp of a breath. it is not worth it.
  7. try to withdraw your profits upon achieving certain profits.


I think with this steps things would work out for you.

As for me, i am doing well though not well as i would want but i know i have to be patient, observant and optimistic. Rome wasn't built in a day.

That's all i think there is to being successful. if you have any other ideas you are free to post them.

THANKS

  • #14
  • May 7, 2011 2:26am May 7, 2011 2:26am
Quoting Custos
Let me give you three choices and let you pick what is most important:

 

  1. entries
  2. exits
  3. profits/losses

which one is the most important here? Obviously profits/losses. What makes up the profits/losses? That's right, it's entries AND exits. Saying that ONLY exits separates successful from unsuccessful traders is utter nonesense, since the growth of your equity is depending on both entries AND exits.


Custos,
would you care to share you strategie ?
i was reading your posts from more that 1 year and you seem to be one of the few here that is profitable and talking sense.

no problem if you dont want to do it...i just have to try

thanks in advance,
Bradu
  • #15
  • May 7, 2011 2:40am May 7, 2011 2:40am
Quoting Adewumi
The forex market is principally governed by two principles which are;

 

  1. Technical Analysis
  2. Fundamental Analysis

Wrong. It's governed by buyers, sellers and fear. The rest is smoke and mirrors.
  • #16
  • May 7, 2011 2:42am May 7, 2011 2:42am
Quoting bradu
Custos,
would you care to share you strategie ?
i was reading your posts from more that 1 year and you seem to be one of the few here that is profitable and talking sense.

no problem if you dont want to do it...i just have to try

thanks in advance,
Bradu
first of all thank you. Secondly, I don't wanna share how I trade for the simple reason that I spent a lot of time to research that. Handing out such work doesn't make sense to me.

But I recommend you to just get a good backtesting program and learn how to program. Then you can research your own strategy. From my point of view that is the only way of attack to "conquer" the markets. Cause the backtesting program will be able to test your strategy across various time-frames and instruments within a few minutes.
  • #17
  • May 7, 2011 2:52am May 7, 2011 2:52am
thanks.

i already have a strat, since i`ve been trading live from 2009, and it took me some time to make it work for me. now i`m just lurking on ff.com in order to see if i can learn something new, something that can help me in my trading.

but, i must admit i have psicho problems still - for eg. if i rise my risk o a trade more that 1% i`m nervous and tend to close it too soon, so the only way for me to trade is with 0.5% risk (that is my confort zone). it is curious that even that i`m somewhat profitable, i cant overcome that,

anyway, thanks for your quick response
  • #18
  • May 7, 2011 2:53am May 7, 2011 2:53am
Quoting Adewumi
if you dont quit and continue to learn from your mistakes, you will surely be a pro one day no matter how long it takes.
if it were as easy as that, then everybody would be a millionaire. Most people are not meant to be successful at this.

Quoting Adewumi
if you dont like something about the strategy try to modify it and make it suit your trading style or preference
bad idea. Most modifications make strats worse. You need to statistically verify that the modifications are still leading to positive expectancy.

Quoting Adewumi
start with a daily target lets say 20pips a day and then 30pips after three months. it is better for your acct to grow gradually than for it to rise in a blink of an eye and lost in the grasp of a breath. it is not worth it.
daily targets? I thought you wanna help the newbs, not help them kill their accounts. Daily targets are just so wrong. Markets are not equal every day. Sometimes they are ranging, sometimes trending, sometimes low volatility, sometimes high.
Monthly targets are the way to go. Cause then you have enough days with different market conditions. You are not required to make pips every day.
  • #19
  • May 7, 2011 2:55am May 7, 2011 2:55am
Quoting bradu
thanks.

i already have a strat, since i`ve been trading live from 2009, and it took me some time to make it work for me. now i`m just lurking on ff.com in order to see if i can learn something new, something that can help me in my trading.

but, i must admit i have psicho problems still - for eg. if i rise my risk o a trade more that 1% i`m nervous and tend to close it too soon, so the only way for me to trade is with 0.5% risk (that is my confort zone). it is curious that even that i`m somewhat profitable, i cant overcome that,

anyway, thanks...
that's the reason why I automate my trading. So I don't have emotionality stand in the way of profitability.
  • #20
  • May 10, 2011 12:29pm May 10, 2011 12:29pm
Quoting Custos
if it were as easy as that, then everybody would be a millionaire. Most people are not meant to be successful at this.

That is quite a blunt statement, you cant just make a rash statement like that without stating the reasons.

Quoting Custos
bad idea. Most modifications make strats worse. You need to statistically verify that the modifications are still leading to positive expectancy.
can someone make modifications without testing them? you said most!! which means that there are actually some that works." modifications i have made were made to clarify entry and exit points or apply a given strategy to different timeframes. you should know that nobody makes modifications without having a positive expectancy. modifications can also help in eliminating false signals. i personally think your statement is not true in this case.

Quoting Custos
daily targets? I thought you wanna help the newbs, not help them kill their accounts. Daily targets are just so wrong. Markets are not equal every day. Sometimes they are ranging, sometimes trending, sometimes low volatility, sometimes high.
Monthly targets are the way to go. Cause then you have enough days with different market conditions. You are not required to make pips every day.
i will like to ask you a question Custos. HOW MANY WAYS ARE THERE TO TRADE THE FOREX MARKET? you seem to think there is only one way and that is yours (no offense please). A strategy usually has entry and exit signals. you may have daily targets but if you don't if there is no entry signal for that day you simply stay out of the market. it is as simple as that.

Secondly markets arent equal everyday but they are average daily ranges of currencies which if you are going to be sincere are more than 40 pips at least. (whether the market is ranging or trending). Even low volatility days like Monday still records more than 20pips.

Also, i believe a good systems caters for ranging and trending markets. it should be able to avoid one or find a safe way of making profits in both. it is not compulsory to make profit everyday. As a matter of fact, there are days you could actually incure losses and still stay out of the market despite the fact that you have daily targets.

the thing is this when it comes to money, it is very difficult to keep emotions out of it. you have obviously adopted an automated strategy that have helped you to calm your emotions but what about those that dont have such strategies? what is your advise for them? should they keep trying to make their monthly targets and lose their acct in a desperate attempt to do so? i dont think so.

PLEASE, CLARIFY YOUR POINTS. THE GUIDELINES I POSTED HAVE BEEN TESTED NOT ONLY WITH ME BUT WITH SEVERAL OF MY FRIENDS AND THEY'VE ALL ADOPTED IT.

it is however, obvious that there are many ways to trade the forex markets and yours is most likely a good one to adopt too.
Bye.


PERSONALLY I FEEL YOU ARE AN EXPERT THAT HAVE FORGOTTEN WHAT IT IS LIKE TO TRADE LIKE NEWBIE (am not attacking you) but your points were not as clear as they used to be

I will not be available this week. but i will try and much as possible to reply to your next post as soon as possible if you reply this post.
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