Forex vs Poker | Forex Factory

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Forex vs Poker

  • #1
  • First Post: Apr 11, 2011 1:40am Apr 11, 2011 1:40am
Hello, my friends.

This weekend I was involved slightly to Poker industry and was surprised how similar it is to Forex industry.

Few common things:

Let's start from the beginning:

- Services give you great deposit bonus up to 200%
- You can play on multiply accounts at the same time.
- Thousands of strategies and methods how to make money.
- Poker EAs even exist!

What do you think?

Josef
  • #2
  • Apr 11, 2011 2:36am Apr 11, 2011 2:36am
Quoting josef
Hello, my friends.

This weekend I was involved slightly to Poker industry and was surprised how similar it is to Forex industry.

Few common things:

Let's start from the beginning:

- Services give you great deposit bonus up to 200%
- You can play on multiply accounts at the same time.
- Thousands of strategies and methods how to make money.
- Poker EAs even exist!

What do you think?

Josef
The only parallel I can draw between poker and forex is that both require good risk management skills. Without that, it's money down the drain.
Not all sins are created equal
  • #3
  • Apr 11, 2011 3:27am Apr 11, 2011 3:27am
Quoting Jay Walker
The only parallel I can draw between poker and forex is that both require good risk management skills. Without that, it's money down the drain.
Agree. But Poker Rooms and Forex brokers use the same, almost exactly the same tools to get more clients.

P.S When I was posting this thread, I wanted to post it in "Trader discussion" folder, but posted it here, coz I think it fits here better. Am I right?
  • #4
  • Apr 11, 2011 4:36am Apr 11, 2011 4:36am
You cannot play poker on multiple accounts. Poker sites conduct random ID checks and if you are caught with more than one account you will be instantly banned for life. They will also freeze your account and you wont get your money back.

Same with using poker EAs - you will be banned if caught, but poker bots cannot beat thinking human players anyway.

Deposit bonuses must be cleared through regular play - to make a $200 deposit bonus available you would need to play nl25 or nl50 every day for a few months. And players at those levels will clean you out long before you clear the bonus.
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
  • #5
  • Apr 11, 2011 5:12am Apr 11, 2011 5:12am
Quoting numbnuts
You cannot play poker on multiple accounts....
The same as with Broker bonuses. - Look here.

http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=287947

I was talking about not multiply accounts - about multiply table.

P.S Numbnuts, looks like you are familiar with this stuff.
  • #6
  • Apr 11, 2011 8:34am Apr 11, 2011 8:34am
Quoting josef
Agree. But Poker Rooms and Forex brokers use the same, almost exactly the same tools to get more clients.
Not only that, but I have seen Forex brokers advertising during poker tournaments. I see no other reason other than marketing to a similar personality type.

Many who make a living promoting affiliate programs focus specifically on 3 things. Poker, forex and ahem...pornography.

Quoting josef
P.S When I was posting this thread, I wanted to post it in "Trader discussion" folder, but posted it here, coz I think it fits here better. Am I right?
That's not for me to decide.
Not all sins are created equal
  • #7
  • Apr 11, 2011 8:54am Apr 11, 2011 8:54am
Quoting Jay Walker
Not only that, but I have seen Forex brokers advertising during poker tournaments. I see no other reason other than marketing to a similar personality type.

Many who make a living promoting affiliate programs focus specifically on 3 things. Poker, forex and ahem...pornography.
I didn't know that. It makes sense.
  • #8
  • Apr 12, 2011 2:49am Apr 12, 2011 2:49am
yeah I am familiar with this stuff, poker pays for my forex habit
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
  • #9
  • Apr 12, 2011 4:09am Apr 12, 2011 4:09am
It is quite possible to play against people who are better at poker than you are, but still win based purely on proper money management. Poker players don't understand money management like a well studied Forex practitioner. Money management is absolutely key in any form of 'gambling'.

I've harped on this before, but if you haven't read "Trade your way to financial freedom" by Van Tharp, do yourself (and your poker game!) a favor!

Mark
Almost got it or far far away. Result is the same - you didn't get it!
  • #10
  • Apr 12, 2011 8:30am Apr 12, 2011 8:30am
Quoting MarkRox
It is quite possible to play against people who are better at poker than you are, but still win based purely on proper money management. Poker players don't understand money management like a well studied Forex practitioner. Money management is absolutely key in any form of 'gambling'.

I've harped on this before, but if you haven't read "Trade your way to financial freedom" by Van Tharp, do yourself (and your poker game!) a favor!

Mark
Not true. Good poker players understand money management just as well as some of the best traders.
Not all sins are created equal
  • #11
  • Apr 14, 2011 8:27am Apr 14, 2011 8:27am
Yes, there are a lot of similarities between poker and forex. I played online poker before getting involved with forex and the mindset and skills I learned in poker has transferred very well to my trading.
  • #12
  • Apr 14, 2011 8:28am Apr 14, 2011 8:28am
Quoting Jay Walker
Not true. Good poker players understand money management just as well as some of the best traders.
True. Any poker player who is serious about making money understands money management very well. It's at the very core of being a good player and one of the first things you learn.
  • #13
  • Apr 14, 2011 8:44pm Apr 14, 2011 8:44pm
Quoting Trankuility
True. Any poker player who is serious about making money understands money management very well. It's at the very core of being a good player and one of the first things you're supposed to learn.
Edited for accuracy.
Not all sins are created equal
  • #14
  • Apr 15, 2011 10:27am Apr 15, 2011 10:27am
Don't let your afro juice affect your thinking.

I was talking about good players. To be a good player you need solid MM. Therefore, if you're a good player you're beyond the stage of "supposed to learn". You did learn.
  • #15
  • Apr 15, 2011 4:53pm Apr 15, 2011 4:53pm
Both poker and forex are based on one simple calculation - odds of winning x risk/reward. In poker these odds can be calculated exactly during a hand, in forex they are estimated. Poker players who move to forex automatically understand this essential principle very well which gives them a big advantage over non-poker playing newbies. Successful poker players should also have the patience and discipline required to 'trade' for hours, or days, on end without actually placing a trade until they are certain the odds are in their favour. Inability to do this is what washes out most traders early in their career.

The educational/developmental sides of poker and forex are also very similar. To succeed in either you must make a long term commitment and get into a regular study routine. You need to leave ego at the door and open yourself up to self analysis to find mistakes in your game and constantly work on them. In both poker and forex you can make the right decision and lose, you can make a big mistake and win. you need to ignore short term results and focus on long term expectation.

The biggest difference between the two, and the reason I switched from poker to forex, is that poker gets exponentially more difficult as you move up through the levels. In forex the game doesn't change as you increase the stakes, which allows traders to compound their returns.
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
  • #16
  • Apr 15, 2011 10:04pm Apr 15, 2011 10:04pm
Really the external factors are extremely similar, creating an system that gives you a slight edge over time, it's the internal battle we wage within us that determines whether we succeed or not.

Once we can detach ourselves from the fear of losing money we can manage our system (play our hand) consistently not giving any tells.
  • #17
  • Apr 16, 2011 1:16am Apr 16, 2011 1:16am
As I've said before, I think blackjack is more analogous to FX trading, than poker is. Three reasons, just off the top of my head:

1. In blackjack you're playing a negative expectancy game against a single, anonymous, inscrutable giant ("the house"), and you're using a (card-counting) strategy to attempt to shift expectancy into your favor. Whereas in poker you're pitting your wits against multiple opponents, and no individual is disadvantaged by a negative edge (before the cards are dealt).

2. There's no opportunity to bluff the house, when playing blackjack; just as it's impossible to bluff the market.

3. It would be every bit as foolish to go "all in" when playing blackjack, for exactly the same reason that it would be to likewise risk one's entire account on a single trading outcome.
  • #18
  • Apr 16, 2011 7:40am Apr 16, 2011 7:40am
Well said hanover, one disadvantage to blackjack is that you can't bank roll where as in the markets you can. As you well may know, the reason for the max bet, is so you can't keep doubling your bet to cover a spread. If you were to start with a $100 bet and lose, bet $200 the next hand and lose, bet $400 the next hand and lose, bet $800 the next hand and win, you are now +$100, pocket the $100 and stat your best over back at $100. Problem is when the tables cap you at a max $500 bet, this doesn't work.

The markets however allow you to wager any bet you want, therefore you could, in theory bank roll the market. Just an interesting observation.
  • #19
  • Edited 9:32am Apr 16, 2011 9:21am | Edited 9:32am
Quoting TimRacette
Well said hanover, one disadvantage to blackjack is that you can't bank roll where as in the markets you can. As you well may know, the reason for the max bet, is so you can't keep doubling your bet to cover a spread. If you were to start with a $100 bet and lose, bet $200 the next hand and lose, bet $400 the next hand and lose, bet $800 the next hand and win, you are now +$100, pocket the $100 and stat your best over back at $100. Problem is when the tables cap you at a max $500 bet, this doesn't work.

The markets however allow you to wager any...
The M word. Do you really want to base your money management on increasing risk of loss/ruin? This is akin to gambling (and playing with fire)-(Not directing this at you Tim even though I'm quoting you. I know you said just in theory. I just want to comment on this in a different direction). No matter how confident you are in your strategy, crazy and unexpected things will happen if you are around long enough. Of course there is such a thing as luck, but you can't count on it in currency trading. It's not a good model in this business and you would have to be extremely fortunate to make it big on that alone. Just don't put yourself in that position. Never make it easier to put your back up against the wall.
  • #20
  • Apr 16, 2011 9:46am Apr 16, 2011 9:46am
The biggest difference is that a poker player at a final table can take enormous risks because he knows that he has a minimum guaranteed amount of cash winnings. A FX trader has no such guarantee of cash winnings. If a FX trader makes a stupid mistake at the wrong time, he can lose everything...a poker player will simply come in 2nd place vs 1st place.....that is a HUGE difference folks.
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