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vsa with Malcolm

  • #16,141
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:31am Mar 14, 2011 11:31am
Quoting KinsaleForex
I leave for work at quarter to the hour so just missed it by 5mins!
I missed it also. Would have been nice place to add. Very easy.
  • #16,142
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:39am Mar 14, 2011 11:39am
Quoting pres78
Narrow, range high volume is a squat bar.
This bar has neither a narrow spread nor high volume. It's not a squat and has no VSA based specific name.
  • #16,143
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:40am Mar 14, 2011 11:40am
anybody has any experience on haw is dukascopy volume compared to esignal?
thanks
"Imagination is more important than knowledge" Einstein
  • #16,144
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:44am Mar 14, 2011 11:44am
Quoting Intel
This bar has neither a narrow spread nor high volume. It's not a squat and has no VSA based specific name.
Oops my mistake... was looking at the picture on my Black Berry and it looked like the volume was wider than the last few bars but I see now that it wasn't...

Sorry for the bad info.
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
  • #16,145
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:45am Mar 14, 2011 11:45am
Quoting Oxford
Thank you pres78!!
See Intel's reply to this... I made a bad call from my Blackberry... sorry about that.
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
  • #16,146
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:49am Mar 14, 2011 11:49am
Quoting pres78
Oops my mistake... was looking at the picture on my Black Berry and it looked like the volume was wider than the last few bars but I see now that it wasn't...

Sorry for the bad info.
'Squat' is not a VSA based term.
  • #16,147
  • Mar 14, 2011 11:51am Mar 14, 2011 11:51am
Quoting Intel
'Squat' is not a VSA based term.
Really... I seen it referred to on here in the past? Must just be an add on type of bar that some use with their VSA.

So from VSA point of view does a bar with narrow spread and higher volume have a name? Effort to fall?
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
  • #16,148
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:01pm Mar 14, 2011 12:01pm
Quoting Mtm
I am studying.. this area looks like one of the times where price bounced up and down within a zone and it seems to have a bit bit more sign of re-accumulation than distribution, i suppose this is what you have spotted too/ ?

i know some gurus here would wait for a "no effort to fall" bar to appear before entering long when dealing with these kind of zones.

but did you mean you're just going to enter long, as long as 3980 is breached?
would you not go down on a smaller TF and wait for a test to enter?


did u mean that you would probably...

I posted a few hours back I want 4004 to be breached before going long. The 3980 was a recomendation to another trader since price was choppy and a break of 3980 would signal bulls had dried up supply enough to test 4000 again. I do like to see price push through levels for my entries and will wait for testing the majority of the time esp when I am trading on a lower timeframe. TBh I will not be trading Eur today unless I close out some of my gu which has taken up the majority of my margin.

Squat is a term I believe invented by Bill Williams to decribe what intel has stated. Hidden Gap like to use them in his posts and it is probably where you picked up the term.
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  • #16,149
  • Edited 12:31pm Mar 14, 2011 12:10pm | Edited 12:31pm
Quoting pres78
Really... I seen it referred to on here in the past? Must just be an add on type of bar that some use with their VSA.

So from VSA point of view does a bar with narrow spread and higher volume have a name? Effort to fall?
Yes the term 'squat' has been used (and still is) by some traders here. We commonly use it to describe a narrower spread than the previous bar on higher volume. We only tend to take notice when we see a wide spread bar on high volume then see a squat.

The correct definition of a squat is a bar where compared to the previous bar, the MFI is down and the volume is up. It comes from Bill Williams and his mothodology.

Technically the bar in question could be a squat (I haven't bothered to measure it), but it's certainly not a squat as we have come to know it here.
  • #16,150
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:13pm Mar 14, 2011 12:13pm
Quoting Intel
Yes the term 'squat' has been used (and still is) by some traders here. We commonly use it to describe a narrower spread than the previous bar on higher volume. We only tend to take notice when we see a wide spread bar on high volume then see a squat.

The correct definition of a squat is a bar where compared to the previous bar, the MFI is down and the volume is up. It comes from Bill Williams and his mothodolgy.

Technically the bar in question could be a squat (I haven't bothered to measure it), but it's certainly not a squat as we have come...

I think HG was the first to use it with VSA (on FF) back in the old days of Shamus' thead.
  • #16,151
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:18pm Mar 14, 2011 12:18pm
Quoting Intel
Yes the term 'squat' has been used (and still is) by some traders here. We commonly use it to describe a narrower spread than the previous bar on higher volume. We only tend to take notice when we see a wide spread bar on high volume then see a squat.

The correct definition of a squat is a bar where compared to the previous bar, the MFI is down and the volume is up. It comes from Bill Williams and his mothodolgy.

Technically the bar in question could be a squat (I haven't bothered to measure it), but it's certainly not a squat as we have come...
Oh ok... thanks Intel and Sono for the replies.

So Intel do you mean that if we see a wide spread bar on high volume and then a narrow spread bar on even higher volume would it be a squat if it is in the same direction as the wide spread bar (i.e. both up) or against it?

I suppose in one sense it would be a possible SOW and the other a possible SOS?
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
  • #16,152
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:28pm Mar 14, 2011 12:28pm
Quoting pres78
Oh ok... thanks Intel and Sono for the replies.

So Intel do you mean that if we see a wide spread bar on high volume and then a narrow spread bar on even higher volume would it be a squat if it is in the same direction as the wide spread bar (i.e. both up) or against it?

I suppose in one sense it would be a possible SOW and the other a possible SOS?
Yes in the same direction, but only for how WE use it here.

@ Sono

LOL sorry pal, you beat me to it. Didn't mean to reiterate what you said!!
  • #16,153
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:36pm Mar 14, 2011 12:36pm
Quoting Intel
Yes in the same direction, but only for how WE use it here.

@ Sono

LOL sorry pal, you beat me to it. Didn't mean to reiterate what you said!!

Great minds think alike! lol
  • #16,154
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:47pm Mar 14, 2011 12:47pm
Quoting Intel
..The correct definition of a squat is a bar where compared to the previous bar, the MFI is down and the volume is up. It comes from Bill Williams and his mothodolgy...
The term squat does indeed come from Bill Williams. The technical definition is a bar with increasing volume and a decreasing MFI. However, Bill's "short hand" definition is simply a bar with a narrow range (as compared to the previous bar) and increasing volume.

eminiwatch calls this same idea (decreasing range/spread and increasing volume) a high churn bar.

VSA does not have a name for this type of bar per se. Yet, an End of a Rising market usually is a squat. But more basically, VSA is concerned with a bar where the volume is "greater" than the range. When the range is kept narrow, it means that every sell order, for example, by the herd is immediately being matched by a buy order from the BBs.

"If the market has been in a bull-move and you place a buy order into a rising market, you may receive what appears to be a good price from the floor of the exchange. Why are you receiving a good price? have these hard-nosed professionals decided that they like you and have decided to be generous giving away some of their profits to you? Or have they now decided to start switching positions, taking a bearish or negative view of the market, because their books have started to show large sell orders to dispose of? Their perceived value of the market or stock may be lower than yours because they expect prices to fall or at best go sideways. Such action, repeated many times across the floor, will tend to keep the spread narrow, by limiting the upper end of the price spread, because they are not only giving you what appears to be a good price, but also every other buyer.

If, on the other hand, the market maker has a bullish view, because he does not have large sell orders on his books, he will mark-up the price on your buy order, giving you what appears to be a poor price. This repeated, makes the spread wider as the price is constantly marked up during the day.

So by simple observation of the spread of the bar, we can read the sentiment of the market-makers; the opinion of those who can see both sides of the market." MTM, Tom Williams, p.28.

Simply put, the "squat" concept is fundamental to VSA. The name, however, comes from someplace else.
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #16,155
  • Mar 14, 2011 12:50pm Mar 14, 2011 12:50pm
Quoting HiddenGap
The term squat does indeed come from Bill Williams. The technical definition is a bar with increasing volume and a decreasing MFI. However, Bill's "short hand" definition is simply a bar with a narrow range (as compared to the previous bar) and increasing volume.

eminiwatch calls this same idea (decreasing range/spread and increasing volume) a high churn bar.

VSA does not have a name for this type of bar per se. Yet, an End of a Rising market usually is a squat. But more basically, VSA is concerned with a bar where the volume is "greater"...
As always many thanks HG...
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
  • #16,156
  • Mar 14, 2011 1:05pm Mar 14, 2011 1:05pm
So i've only recently started looking into 5min charts as I feel my analysis and knowledge of VSA is improving. I've annotated most of today's action in a chart. If people could comment on rights/wrongs i'd appreciate that. For what it's worth I was noting a lot of this live and have put the chart together retrospectively.

The main part i'm interested in is whether I have correctly identified the trigger line/number (green line) from the high volume down bar and that area being tested.
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  • #16,157
  • Mar 14, 2011 1:09pm Mar 14, 2011 1:09pm
Just out of interest, is anyone updating the HG pdf I posted a few months back?
  • #16,158
  • Mar 14, 2011 1:09pm Mar 14, 2011 1:09pm
Quoting KinsaleForex
So i've only recently started looking into 5min charts as I feel my analysis and knowledge of VSA is improving. I've annotated most of today's action in a chart. If people could comment on rights/wrongs i'd appreciate that. For what it's worth I was noting a lot of this live and have put the chart together retrospectively.

The main part i'm interested in is whether I have correctly identified the trigger line/number (green line) from the high volume down bar and that area being tested.
Nice pick up on the failed test. I saw that too. There is a "new" trigger level. Do you see that?
Without VSA, you're playing checkers while the Smart Money plays chess.
  • #16,159
  • Edited 1:31pm Mar 14, 2011 1:15pm | Edited 1:31pm
Quoting HiddenGap
Nice pick up on the failed test. I saw that too. There is a "new" trigger level. Do you see that?
It appears the new trigger level has alread been tested also. I know you use triggers... don't we want the test bar to close above the trigger when looking for a long?

There were a few earlier bars that I would have looked at as tests (well hidden tests since they closed as upbars) of the first trigger line which went below and closed above on lower volume. The two bars marked both close below.

Actually the lead into the first test we have two or three tests on progessively decreasing volume, all closing above the trigger line... good SOS.
Today's zone = Tomorrow's opportunity!
  • #16,160
  • Mar 14, 2011 1:16pm Mar 14, 2011 1:16pm
Quoting HiddenGap
Nice pick up on the failed test. I saw that too. There is a "new" trigger level. Do you see that?
Two bars before the failed test?

And while i'm at it, would we look to use this for shorts? Or test from above for further strength?
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