Attachments: Sine Wave and Channel Reflection, Action/Reaction putting it all together

Sine Wave and Channel Reflection, Action/Reaction putting it all together

#21
Dec 24, 2010 8:13pm Dec 24, 2010 8:13pm

JR97
Joined Apr 2004 | Status: #slack pricetimeforecast | 1,934 Posts

Quoting kapital

Disliked

How could I have determined an ellipse (or arcs) such as the one in the chart, in advance, which captured price?

Ignored

To end in the right place you need to start in the right place. Ellipses and other geometric shapes that seem to 'capture' or contain price are nothing more than cycles. Cycles can measured. So to use the ellipse as a tool for forecasting possible price movement requires finding a cycle... or two or three.

There are some examples here: http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=148796

and here:
http://www.forexfactory.com/showthread.php?t=42407

#22
Mar 5, 2011 10:48am Mar 5, 2011 10:48am

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

I really like this concept of this thread. Here are some results from my doodling:

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"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#23
Edited 11:23am Mar 5, 2011 11:09am | Edited 11:23am

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

A couple of notes:

-the blue circle creates the partial sine wave and its reflection for the BC line of the pitchfork

-the white circle in the third chart is a result of the bronze circle being lowered so that its perimeter (top left) touches the low (spike) of the candle preceeding the bullish outside bar; take note that price found support at the perimeter of the circle (top right)

-charts are using the hourly timeframe

"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#24
Edited 1:25pm Mar 5, 2011 11:12am | Edited 1:25pm

auxesis
Joined Apr 2007 | Status: (Latin: statūs), rank, state | 3,127 Posts

Quoting kapital

Disliked

I really like this concept of this thread. Here are some results from my doodling:

Ignored

Kapital,

Like your charts, the more you work with arcs and ellipses the more you will like them being a part of your tool box. I like to adjust mine to the swing.

My doodles on $/Cad, fwiw

regards,

edit:

Kapital,

Just thinking off the top of my head, direction is crucial, corrective waves reflect the impulse, impulse mirror each other. Exception would be wave terminus where impulse follows impulse. In a pure sine wave ab=cd, or what we seek cd should share characteristics of ab measured in relation from bc.

To the Fib follower a 1.618 extension from a .618 retracement completes the wave. The forker looks price to play the medians, ideally in timing drawn from ab (think measured moves), here cb is exhibiting structure derived from ab and drawn from the end of bc. If price overshoots a median we look for that measurement to come back into play measured from the other medians. Here price is still playing the ab/bc relationships just "time" has shifted left and the lines resume the prior angles. When this happens we think the wave has completed.

in a perfect world it looks like this, the problem arises when cd doesn't equal ab, finding the relationship is hard sometimes. The benefit of arcs, ellipses. they will get you in ahead of the herd thinking is straight lines.

fwiw

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#25
Edited 3:19pm Mar 5, 2011 2:43pm | Edited 3:19pm

auxesis
Joined Apr 2007 | Status: (Latin: statūs), rank, state | 3,127 Posts

fwiw

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#26
Mar 5, 2011 6:56pm Mar 5, 2011 6:56pm

ha-pattern
Joined Sep 2008 | Status: hardcore chartist | 2,173 Posts

Quoting auxesis

Disliked

fwiw

Ignored

At another thread you posted at, your chart appeared to offer that one does better when the ellipse surrounds a cycle, that is, a few trends or similar area that has both significant change in smaller trends' angles and in overall direction of the price-time line.

I still draw ellipses so that at least some of the price-time line form-fits into a plainly-seen curve. This time, I also made sure they surrounded a cycle, as per your charts.
However, I'm otherwise not really into midlining ellipses in a bunch of places unless the price-time line already justifies it.

I included the idea of compromise, since your last picture fits the last between the first two ellipses. The idea works better with the chart area I found. (I'm working on the idea elsewhere.)
I also included a Gann Fan with parallel lines. On the Gann Fan, I was lucky enough to have it align with the price-time line and went ahead and put TL's in place of its tines for the longterm chart below.
Plus, I was able to form a hypothesis with them and parallel lines, after realizing, from your pictures, how well parallel lines and ellipses work together:
Ellipses are half between Gann Fans and channels, allowing compromise to be introduced as possibly valid.

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#27
Mar 5, 2011 6:56pm Mar 5, 2011 6:56pm

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

Thanks for your responses auxesis.

Do you know of a way to "manually" draw an arc (half ellipse) on the AB pivots? I have an ellipse drawing tool but I need to know the starting and ending points.

"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#28
Edited 7:33pm Mar 5, 2011 7:16pm | Edited 7:33pm

auxesis
Joined Apr 2007 | Status: (Latin: statūs), rank, state | 3,127 Posts

Quoting kapital

Disliked

Thanks for your responses auxesis.

Do you know of a way to "manually" draw an arc (half ellipse) on the AB pivots? I have an ellipse drawing tool but I need to know the starting and ending points.

Ignored

Kapital,

Alas we are forced to use primitive tools for drawing, LOL.

Under the parameters tab when you highlight a tool (here the fib ellipse), you can set the scale. Drawing from "B" perpendicular to the level of "A" I adjust the scale in or out so that the radius is set to "A". From there I use that ellipse to map out the wave.

Point "C" should make sense, some relation to AB, likewise "D" should make sense, via arc, timing, pitchfork variant of AB/BC

Hope that helps.

In a perfect world, you would pinpoint the AB and the computer would calculate an equation that measured the outer and inner arcs, these might not necessarily be a true arc or ellipse..... and duplicate/flip as shown, it would be much more accurate, but since my puter won't do that, eyeballing it will have to do.

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#29
Mar 5, 2011 7:19pm Mar 5, 2011 7:19pm

auxesis
Joined Apr 2007 | Status: (Latin: statūs), rank, state | 3,127 Posts

Quoting ha-pattern

Disliked

At another thread you posted at, your chart appeared to offer that one does better when the ellipse surrounds a cycle, that is, a few trends or similar area that has both significant change in smaller trends' angles and in overall direction of the price-time line.

I still draw ellipses so that at least some of the price-time line form-fits into a plainly-seen curve. This time, I also made sure they surrounded a cycle, as per your charts.
However, I'm otherwise not...

Ignored

HA,

I'm not the text book on ellipses and arcs, I just share some of that which at times works for me......... the chart I posted, the one you linked..... I drew in the white arcs, highlighting the same method as described above.

regards,

#30
Mar 5, 2011 9:07pm Mar 5, 2011 9:07pm

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

Quoting auxesis

Disliked

Hope that helps.

Ignored

I discovered what I needed to do (it's what I've been doing all along....it's just with a different set of pivots...lol). Although it wasn't identical to what you outlined, I appreciate the response nonetheless.

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"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#31
Mar 5, 2011 9:15pm Mar 5, 2011 9:15pm

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

Continuing from the charts above...

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"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#32
Edited 7:29am Mar 6, 2011 7:06am | Edited 7:29am

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

I just realized how extended sine waves are formed (both under-over and over-under) when the ellipses are placed side by side in any direction as in the chart above. Interesting.

I'm also wondering that when it comes to pitchforks, is there some type of mathematical relationship between the arcs when drawn on the pivots (AB, BC, and AC).

Hmmmm....

"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#33
Mar 6, 2011 7:37am Mar 6, 2011 7:37am

auxesis
Joined Apr 2007 | Status: (Latin: statūs), rank, state | 3,127 Posts

Quoting kapital

Disliked

I just realized how extended sine waves are formed (both under-over and over-under) when the ellipses are placed side by side in any direction as in the chart above. Interesting.

I'm also wondering that when it comes to pitchforks, is there some type of mathematical relationship between the arcs when drawn on the pivots (AB, BC, and AC).

Hmmmm....

Ignored

Kapital,

I think you'll find the answer in one of JR's old posts. In the past examples from yesterday we're mapping the last half of the sine wave, but requires correctly identifying the initial wave.....in essence trading C's and 3's

imho.

Quoting JR97

Disliked

To end in the right place you need to start in the right place. Ellipses and other geometric shapes that seem to 'capture' or contain price are nothing more than cycles. Cycles can measured. So to use the ellipse as a tool for forecasting possible price movement requires finding a cycle... or two or three.

Ignored

#34
Mar 7, 2011 3:04pm Mar 7, 2011 3:04pm

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

Hourly GBP/USD

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"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#35
Mar 7, 2011 3:35pm Mar 7, 2011 3:35pm

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

The initial ellipse is centered around the crosshair of the pitchfork using points B and C. Take note of how price mimicked the path of the sine wave created by the first two ellipses.

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"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#36
Mar 8, 2011 10:26am Mar 8, 2011 10:26am

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

This price action appears to follow a sine wave pattern. Let's see if we can collectively find the setup for it.

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"GIVE ME 3 POINTS IN SPACE IN TIME AND WATCH ME CREATE MAGIC."

#37
Mar 8, 2011 11:42am Mar 8, 2011 11:42am

kapital
Joined Jan 2009 | Status: Trader | 1,617 Posts

Here is my attempt at cracking the atom.

In the first chart, centered the first ellipse on the swing move indicated by the arrows. I then shifted a copy of the ellipse to the right.

Now, in the second chart I had the thought (within the last 30 mins or so of posting this) to rotate the ellipse around the center of the swing move to a horizontal orientation and then shift copies of it to the right. The result is an idea of how it will look (although I'm sure it's not off by much) because I don't have the software to change the orientation of an ellipse. If anyone has the capabilities of doing such, could you please post a chart showing it. I, as well as others, would appreciate it. Thanks.

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