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  • #10,621
  • Sep 6, 2010 4:14pm Sep 6, 2010 4:14pm
Quoting Low

So it's OK to lose all your money gambling, but it's not OK to lose all your money trading?????

Only in America.

Liberty and security rest on opposite sides of a scale. The more you have of one, the less you have of another.
Oh man. Talk about a misunderstanding of what poker is. Poker is rarely gambling. Only to those who don't know how to play. Frank is absolutely right to try to legalize poker.

You really think that "trading" with 100-1 leverage is better than playing $1/$2 Texas Hold'em? Give me a break...

You're kidding yourself if you don't think a person can lose all their money playing the forex market at 50-1 leverage. In fact, I think I 'd have a better chance of making a 100% return playing poker than playing the forex market at 50-1 leverage... not even close which one I think would be more profitable for me...

Sadly us online poker players lost our ability to play in 2006 during a back-room deal in Congress signed by George W Bush as part of a budget bill. If you don't believe me, look up the UIGEA (The Unlawful Internet Gaming Enforcement Act).

So you know what -- Go Barney Frank -- I'm all for sensible legislation and legalizing online poker is certainly that.
  • #10,622
  • Sep 6, 2010 5:09pm Sep 6, 2010 5:09pm
Quoting 4xAddict
Deciding to curtail people's rights with further rules now after overseeing the loss of vast portions of their economy and job prospects is so unfathomably outrageous, I can't believe people aren't outside the halls of power in Washington shooting at them.
4xAddict...

I usually find your posts a breath of fresh air on here but I'll just make two small points:

1) I'm trying to square your last post with the one prior regarding your bullish bias on US Stocks. If things are so hopelessly bad, how could you possibly be bullish?

2) You really think finance rules didn't need some reform after being gutted by Clinton and Bush II? Honestly I'm shocked that anything at all got passed given the special interest feeding frenzy that went on with that bill and the clear obstructionist tendencies of many in congress. There are many things to be outraged about in this country but financial reform was long-overdue (IMHO).

Happy Labor Day & happy trading in September to all!
  • #10,623
  • Edited 6:18pm Sep 6, 2010 6:15pm | Edited 6:18pm
Infinity,
I understand your point about having too much rope to hang ourselves with. It shouldn't affect anyone who understands good MM and keeps their risk to 1-2 percent per trade. But it does follow a pattern of over-regulation on the part of the U.S. agencies. The leverage was going to be 10:1 until brokers and traders alike sent over 9000 letters of complaint, more than the CFTC had ever seen for a single issue. This on top of raising capital limits for brokers several times in the last five years.

I don't need to move to another broker because of this, and it doesn't really affect my trading. But on principle, it would be interesting to see if a noticeable percentage of traders use this as an excuse to go offshore. Chris, I see you have a link to Dukascopy on your web page - do you have an agreement with them? They are certainly catering to the retail market these days - microtrading, small initial deposit, etc. Just curious...

(EDIT: BTW I understand this is off-topic for this thread, so feel free to go to the other threads in the Brokers forum for discussion on this. )
Disregard all prognostications.
  • #10,624
  • Sep 6, 2010 6:33pm Sep 6, 2010 6:33pm
Quoting Pidgeon
But it does follow a pattern of over-regulation on the part of the U.S. agencies.
Just curious, what are you referring to with this comment?

Thanks,
I-SL
  • #10,625
  • Sep 6, 2010 7:54pm Sep 6, 2010 7:54pm
Quoting InfinitySL
Just curious, what are you referring to with this comment?

Thanks,
I-SL
Hmm, perhaps "pattern" is too strong a word. How about "tendency" towards over-regulation? My point is, in the interests of protecting us, they are going a few steps beyond what the rest of the industry has agreed to as standard leverage. Perhaps you would call this "leading the trend" towards greater regulation of the market. Japan's FSA may be next to adopt a 50:1 ratio, so perhaps this is much ado about nothing. Not all regulation is bad, but the manner in which they did this seemed heavy handed, as if they'd made up their minds without consulting those who would be affected by the decision. This is just my opinion, and its off topic, so I'll say no more.
Disregard all prognostications.
  • #10,626
  • Sep 6, 2010 8:11pm Sep 6, 2010 8:11pm
Quoting InfinitySL
Oh man. Talk about a misunderstanding of what poker is.
I think you missed my point Infinity, I know almost nothing of online poker, so I won't argue there, but to me it just looked like more double-speak, "Lets make this kind of gambling harder, and this other kind easier", and I am honestly quite content with the outcome, but the original CFTC proposal just seemed like a knee-jerk public relations reaction to me, as Congress felt the need to regulate something to prove their utility.

Overall, the best thing our fearless leaders have done for themselves is to divide us into pro/anti regulation camps that fit well with existing party lines.

IMO, one of the purposes of a democratic republic is that it allows average citizens to leverage the power of the federal government against exploitative interests (really big business) who have the resources and connections necessary to run roughshod over the populace.

The debate of weather or not government should be pro/anti regulation/business needs to take into consideration the size of the business being regarded. I believe the government should work to towards incentivizing small/medium businesses (if by no other means than shrinking it's own payrolls), but should also make itself available to stand up to large multi-national corporate interests in the defense of it citizens.

LOL.....holiday boredom---> leads to strange political ramblings

I promise, I'll stop when the markets start moving again.
  • #10,627
  • Sep 6, 2010 10:07pm Sep 6, 2010 10:07pm
Here is a chart that caught my eye over the weekend...

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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I'll be watching to see if this can maintain at these levels. Aggs in general appear to be doing pretty well (anyone remember sugar?).
  • #10,628
  • Sep 6, 2010 10:53pm Sep 6, 2010 10:53pm
Quoting InfinitySL
Here is a chart that caught my eye over the weekend...

Attachment

I'll be watching to see if this can maintain at these levels. Aggs in general appear to be doing pretty well (anyone remember sugar?).
Yeah, in my podcast I mentioned Corn. It is a GREAT market to start out with if you are looking at futures. It has a mini size, and I just like the "feel" of it.

The grains look good, but having said that - the crops here in the midwest are doing well.....
  • #10,629
  • Sep 6, 2010 10:57pm Sep 6, 2010 10:57pm
Quoting Pidgeon
Infinity,
I understand your point about having too much rope to hang ourselves with....
Yes, I have an agreement with Dukascopy. They have definitely moved towards the retail end, as the institutional end is small and over serviced from what I am told.

I like Dukascopy either way, so when they offered the partnership - I jumped at the chance. I also have an agreement with AVA FX out of Ireland whom I am liking a lot as well.

In full disclosure, I would also recommend the following that I don't have agreements with:

 

  1. GFT
  2. Interbank FX
  3. Alpari
  4. Oanda
  5. Interactive Brokers (Only if you have a large account)

Not that there aren't other good ones.....just that I have had actual experience with these.

  • #10,630
  • Sep 6, 2010 10:58pm Sep 6, 2010 10:58pm
I would comment on Low and Infinity's conversation as it actually IS interesting. But I am too wiped out to think that hard right now. lol
  • #10,631
  • Sep 7, 2010 5:46am Sep 7, 2010 5:46am
Quoting clockwork71

The grains look good, but having said that - the crops here in the midwest are doing well.....
Yeah, sorry, should have been more specific. If it can hold up at these levels and give me a nice entry signal, i was actually looking for a long.
  • #10,632
  • Sep 7, 2010 7:43am Sep 7, 2010 7:43am
Quoting InfinitySL
Yeah, sorry, should have been more specific. If it can hold up at these levels and give me a nice entry signal, i was actually looking for a long.
I agree. I think it is in the process of at least attempting to break out.
  • #10,633
  • Sep 7, 2010 7:44am Sep 7, 2010 7:44am
I will be back to normal posting here in the next couple of days......by the end of the week. We are in the home stretch on campus.

Ugh. This is a special kind of exhaustion.
  • #10,634
  • Sep 7, 2010 8:23am Sep 7, 2010 8:23am
Quoting InfinitySL
4xAddict...

I usually find your posts a breath of fresh air on here but I'll just make two small points:

1)...
On the bullish bias mate I simply think things can't get much worse when everyone is pricing a double dip recession into their projections. Whenever things get that skewed in one direction something has to give. It's my opinion that the markets will be well bid into the later part of the year until there is something major occurs like a Euro region default or significantly worse numbers come out from the US. That said if Ireland falls over with this Allied Irish Bank mess it could happen a lot sooner and I reserve the right to be wrong and quickly change my mind in that case

The bond market is so crowded that eventually the blue chips paying decent dividends are going to start to get looked at more seriously.

Once things really slow down into next year in the US and things finally come to a head in Europe then I'll be hot on Golfer's heels heading for the log cabin

You are right about reform being required, without question! I just feel that what gets covered in the media rarely addresses the real issues and that it should be an individuals god-given right to hang themselves with a leveraged rope if they so choose. In the greater scheme of things, who cares. It's just not a priority, it's not like they are reducing the quantity of alcohol allowed in drinks to 0.5% or outlawing all automatic weapons which cause far greater problems in society. It is that very anti-Darwinian attitude in policy makers that continues to reward mediocrity and punish overachievers.

The US government essentially underwriting the nation's mortgages is another thing entirely. People with some dead-end job should not be able to borrow on 30 year terms at interest rates that many countries cannot finance their debt for. It is just not feasible.

There needs to be a big write-down done and the pain suffered now rather than prolonging this issue and compounding it.

Why re-write laws when you still haven't acknowledged the problem? Doing things in that order just allows the very special interest groups and their lobbyists who contributed to the mess in the door to water it all down before meaningful change is achieved.

That is the end of my ranting I promise.
  • #10,635
  • Sep 7, 2010 2:47pm Sep 7, 2010 2:47pm
There needs to be a big write-down done and the pain suffered now rather than prolonging this issue and compounding it.

Why re-write laws when you still haven't acknowledged the problem? Doing things in that order just allows the very special interest groups and their lobbyists who contributed to the mess in the door to water it all down before meaningful change is achieved.

That is the end of my ranting I promise.[/quote]

No need to apologize, and to be honest - this is 110% on the mark in my opinion. This is exactly why there will be another financial crisis in the next couple of years.

Nobody has the cajones to take the pain and get it over with.
  • #10,636
  • Sep 7, 2010 2:50pm Sep 7, 2010 2:50pm
So I am driving down an alley at Ohio State today, going from one job to another and I see this spray painted on a dumpster. Perfect. For those of you that are not in the US, Jersey Shore is a great example of why we are in serious trouble.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #10,637
  • Sep 7, 2010 3:03pm Sep 7, 2010 3:03pm
Quoting clockwork71
So I am driving down an alley at Ohio State today, going from one job to another and I see this spray painted on a dumpster. Perfect. For those of you that are not in the US, Jersey Shore is a great example of why we are in serious trouble.
LOL, that is GREAT!

As for the whole mess, IMO, nothing will be resolved as long as we try to remain such a wide voting democracy. We let idiots who can't even pay their bills and balance their checkbook, or even keep a minimum wage job have the same say on what is best for our country as people who make millions out of nothing, are long time war vets, or are the true pillars of a community.

No one wants to admit what is wrong, and take on the pain, because we have so many idiots voting, that the one person who does it the right way will be voted out of office.
  • #10,638
  • Sep 7, 2010 3:26pm Sep 7, 2010 3:26pm
Quoting unlv_tj
LOL, that is GREAT!

As for the whole mess, IMO, nothing will be resolved as long as we try to remain such a wide voting democracy. We let idiots who can't even pay their bills and balance their checkbook, or even keep a minimum wage job have the same say on what is best for our country as people who make millions out of nothing, are long time war vets, or are the true pillars of a community.
What are you trying to say? That only some "deserve" the right to vote? And if so, who will decide which ones are worthy? The high priest maybe...?

That's a dangerous path to even consider.

We do not have to earn our right to vote, that's the whole idea - you know - all men created equal with equal rights. Maybe women shouldn't be allowed to vote either then, by the same logic... The Roman emperor Nero once appointed his horse to senator so he could win a vote... Beware of starting down the path that separates a chosen few from the rest.

Sorry if I misinterpreted you btw.
  • #10,639
  • Sep 7, 2010 6:05pm Sep 7, 2010 6:05pm
Quoting o990l6mh
What are you trying to say? That only some "deserve" the right to vote? And if so, who will decide which ones are worthy? The high priest maybe...?

That's a dangerous path to even consider.

We do not have to earn our right to vote, that's the whole idea - you know - all men created equal with equal rights. Maybe women shouldn't be allowed to vote either then, by the same logic... The Roman emperor Nero once appointed his horse to senator so he could win a vote... Beware of starting down the path that separates a chosen few from the...
No, you interpreted me correctly.

We ALREADY determine who is allowed to vote and who isn't. Under 18, sorry, you don't vote, but you can pay taxes. Convicts, ditto.

So to scream "THIS WOULD NEVER BE FAIR" is incorrect, because it is already in place.

The founding fathers kicked around the idea of only land owners get to vote, and they pay the most taxes through property tax. Personally, I don't think this is a horrible idea, though I think it could be more fair than this.

No one under 25, unless you serve in the armed forces (then at 18). And no one on welfare (other than seniors living off of social security, or other social security issues, such as injuries and such).

That, or our country will fall. Life isn't fair, mother nature doesn't give a damn about any of us, you piss with mother nature, you lose, fair or not.
  • #10,640
  • Sep 7, 2010 8:00pm Sep 7, 2010 8:00pm
You know what, I don't think this discussion has much to do with trading. But just to clarify what you're saying: A 25yr old trust-fund baby (with plenty of "land") should have more rights than a 25yr factory worker trying to raise himself up by his bootstraps and make something of his life? Give me a break man that's not what this country is/was about...

Nobody said democracy was perfect but it's the best we got.

And lets not work under the assumption that the Constitution itself was perfect: The 3/5 compromise, men only voting, slavery OK, etc etc.

Anyway...back to trading?
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