VantagePoint discussion thread

Quoting drjoe4x

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I believe he used 10 pips beyond the high/low as a buy/sell stop order since he was using a 25 pip S/L and entering 15 pips below the high or above the low...a stop and reversal entry would be entered at 10 pips above or below the PNDH/PNDL when the S/L was triggered.

Pred Next Day High: 1.1875
Sell Limit Order: 1.1860
Buy Stop Order: 1.1885 (Stop and Reverse)

Pred Next Day Low: 1.1800
Buy Limit Order: 1.1815
Sell Stop Order: 1.1790 (Stop and Reverse)

If I am wrong, please correct me BB...but I am thinking that was the process.

drjoe

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Quoting BeachBum

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I received a PM inquiry about the feasability of using VP for the purpose of "breakout" trades only. Here are the results of some quick analysis using the same 60 trading days I have been working with in recent posts:

30 trades would have been triggered immediately upon breaking out of the P H/L

1-19 pips beyond H/L 2
20-50 pips beyond 15
51-100 pips beyond 11
100+ beyond 2

Using a T/P of 20 pips would have yielded a gain of 560 pips (minus broker margin)

Two trades would have been loosers.

I think in this scenario a S/L of 20 pips would have worked out, but it is not possible to determine how much retracemant there would have been with each trade after the price broke the P H/L. However, my informal observations are that when the price breaks the P H/L, it keeps going with little or no retracement. Twent-eight profitable, fairly low risk trades in 60 days is quite good, I think. And at the risk of repeating myself, managed trades with this data are always more profitable.

FYI......last Friday, I used VP P H/L on the eur/usd. The low was hit within 2 pips at 3:30 am est, the high was hit within 3 pips at 2:00 pm est. I got all 100 pips. Sweet!

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Quoting drjoe4x

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Forward test each scenario 2-4 weeks (or more)
Tweek each traders rules at the end of the time period based on each traders observations of why/why not trades were successul or stopped out.

What do you think...I would be willing to demo trade a separate account if we could find a few others...or if not, you and I can or whatever...

Continue this pattern until we find a consistant strategy, even if it takes the next six months...(hopefully not)

I think this would be a great thread.

VANTAGE POINT FORWARD TESTING RESULTS
and a separate thread
VANTAGE POINT FORWARD TESTING DISCUSSION

LMK, keep up the good work and I am going to go get you that retracement info on your breakout trades as it looked very promising from your results.

THX
drjoe

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Quoting drjoe4x

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BB,

I have been going over the previous data and just read your post about the breakout trades...It took me a couple of hours but I was able to get thru about the first 15 days of trading and I was looking for what you just said..

"not possible to determine how much retracement"

That is exactly what I was doing with the data...going to VP History, then on 4 hour MT4 charts and you can see how much retracement would take place...IE -42 pips before reversal on trade 1, -12 pips before reversal...I think this is key to doing a historical to figure an accurate s/l per pair,,,however, something is telling me we should get a group of 3-4 people together and forward test these ideas instead of backtesting so much.

Don't get me wrong, the data you are providing is valuable and should be considered in setting up our current parameters for forward testing...if we can get 3-4 people and assign specific rules for each person to follow, follow the results of each person with their demo account by posting in a new thread daily results from their technique, then we may be able to get a better grasp on this thing...

Something like this.

Trader 1
Rules: BUY/SELL LIMIT 15 pips within PH/PL
S/L 25 Pips
T/P 50 Pips

Trader 2
Rules: BUY/SELL BREAKOUT Trades 10 Pips past PH/PL
S/L 25 Pips
T/P 50 Pips

Trader 3
Rules: BUY/SELL LIMIT only in direction of trend w/in (?) PIPS
S/L (?)
T/P (?)

Trader 4
Breakout trades only in direction of trend
yada yada yada

Forward test each scenario 2-4 weeks (or more)
Tweek each traders rules at the end of the time period based on each traders observations of why/why not trades were successul or stopped out.

What do you think...I would be willing to demo trade a separate account if we could find a few others...or if not, you and I can or whatever...

Continue this pattern until we find a consistant strategy, even if it takes the next six months...(hopefully not)

I think this would be a great thread.

VANTAGE POINT FORWARD TESTING RESULTS
and a separate thread
VANTAGE POINT FORWARD TESTING DISCUSSION

LMK, keep up the good work and I am going to go get you that retracement info on your breakout trades as it looked very promising from your results.

THX
drjoe

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Quoting Trinity

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Thanks for the clarification re entry of P Hi/Lo as 10 pips >/<.

I shall be trying this out for a while.

Trinity

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Quoting drjoe4x

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BB,

I have been going over the previous data and just read your post about the breakout trades...It took me a couple of hours but I was able to get thru about the first 15 days of trading and I was looking for what you just said.........however, something is telling me we should get a group of 3-4 people together and forward test these ideas instead of backtesting so much.

Don't get me wrong, the data you are providing is valuable and should be considered in setting up our current parameters for forward testing...if we can get 3-4 people and assign specific rules for each person to follow, follow the results of each person with their demo account by posting in a new thread daily results from their technique, then we may be able to get a better grasp on this thing...

Something like this.

Trader 1
Rules: BUY/SELL LIMIT 15 pips within PH/PL
S/L 25 Pips
T/P 50 Pips

Trader 2
Rules: BUY/SELL BREAKOUT Trades 10 Pips past PH/PL
S/L 25 Pips
T/P 50 Pips

Trader 3
Rules: BUY/SELL LIMIT only in direction of trend w/in (?) PIPS
S/L (?)
T/P (?)

Trader 4
Breakout trades only in direction of trend
yada yada yada

Forward test each scenario 2-4 weeks (or more)
Tweek each traders rules at the end of the time period based on each traders observations of why/why not trades were successul or stopped out.

What do you think...I would be willing to demo trade a separate account if we could find a few others...or if not, you and I can or whatever...

Continue this pattern until we find a consistant strategy, even if it takes the next six months...(hopefully not)

I think this would be a great thread.

VANTAGE POINT FORWARD TESTING RESULTS
and a separate thread
VANTAGE POINT FORWARD TESTING DISCUSSION

LMK, keep up the good work and I am going to go get you that retracement info on your breakout trades as it looked very promising from your results.

THX
drjoe

Ignored

Quoting fijitrader

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Personally I'm having difficulty embracing the breakout idea for the following reasons:

1. If you consider the ph/pl to be valid s/r and the software is wrong that tends to invalidate the premise that you in fact have a breakout.

2. Nobody has provided any statistical proof that breakouts of the ph/pl give any edge to trading.

3. My observations indicate that breakouts of the ph/pl are seldom substantial in nature and tend to range all over from a few pips to 60 or so pips with the occasional excursion to a greater number.

4. I understood the original proposal for this idea was for everyone to trade the same basic idea of bounces off the ph/pl but using different stop and target parameters.

5. I'm not convinced that even this idea will render statistically valid results but it seems like a worthy experiment. However if everyone wants to race off in different directions with some even trading against the software (breakouts of an invalidated s/r point) I don't see how we will be able to pool our results.

If we do this let's be focussed about it.

FT

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Quote

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QUOTE=drjoe4x]
I would be just fine with fiji or bb setting the trading rules for each person as long as we keep each session of testing focused and mechanical and we have good follow thru from everyone in the group.

Quote

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I think we can get something going by next week, just need to decide who is going to set the rules and open the new threads.
VP FORWARD TESTING
VP FORWARD TESTING DISCUSSION

Quoting cp_trader

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Hi, I'm new to this forum, but I've been reading a lot of posts, especially in this thread for the past couple of weeks. I am going to be a new customer of Vantage Point tomorrow. Hope to have everything setup with it by early next week. I'd be willing to help test the strategies of VP if you would like after I have it all set up. I currently use FXCM for my real trading, but I could open an MT4 demo account for testing if you want to have everone using the same platform. Let me know if you would like my help in the testing. I'm really excited about finally having and being able to use this software.

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Quoting cp_trader

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Hi, I'm new to this forum, but I've been reading a lot of posts, especially in this thread for the past couple of weeks. I am going to be a new customer of Vantage Point tomorrow. Hope to have everything setup with it by early next week. I'd be willing to help test the strategies of VP if you would like after I have it all set up. I currently use FXCM for my real trading, but I could open an MT4 demo account for testing if you want to have everone using the same platform. Let me know if you would like my help in the testing. I'm really excited about finally having and being able to use this software.

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Quoting deecos

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All,
After closely examining the VP software output, and having put it to use, I can assure you that the facts presented in the Product Review: VantagePoint Software thread are indisputable..<o></o>

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Quoting Rocket

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That is a very positive statement and Im sure VP users would appreciate your data to fully appreciate your statement?

thks
Rocket

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