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Silent Service Method

  • #8,781
  • May 21, 2010 11:52pm May 21, 2010 11:52pm
this post is so touching . this is exactly what has happened to me when i was on bed waiting for my heart operation ! these moments you mature years in a few minutes . and we understand that what we used to take for granted are the most important things in our lives .
a GREAT post Chris .

[quot There will be good and bad times, but the time that matters the most to me is the time I spend with my boys at the park. (As an example.)



I can't imagine laying on my deathbed thinking about all those great pips I scored in life.[/quote]
  • #8,782
  • May 22, 2010 12:22am May 22, 2010 12:22am
Here's that eurnzd at the end of the day. That level acted as quite strong support on the way down so it looks good that this could be about to continue back down but we'll have to wait and see.
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Position trader - Anything intraweek is just noise...
  • #8,783
  • May 22, 2010 7:43am May 22, 2010 7:43am
I believe this one could be due for a big bounce. However, the weekly and daily are giving conflicting signals. This normally means that we could be heading for a range-bound period of trading. I will be watching this for consolidation.

However, there could possibly be news over the weekend out of Europe that could change everything. You have this when the whole world is in a trade.....
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  • #8,784
  • May 22, 2010 2:22pm May 22, 2010 2:22pm
Further to my post the other day I thought of this. A lot of really good traders (think of two highly regarded traders from this forum) say that you have to detach yourself from the money and just think of it as numbers. The implication is that you have to eliminate any emotional reaction to losing completely. I have found that this doesn't necessarily work for me. If I don't give a shit about winning or losing aren't I more likely to take too many trades and more random, B or C trades? I have found that it helps me a load to think of exactly how much money I am risking on a trade and being comfortable with that amount. Let's say rather than thinking in micro lots I think, right, I'm going to lose 25 quid if this trade goes wrong but I think it will go my way and make me 50 to 75 quid before I get stopped out with my manually trailed stop. That way I am not kidding myself that if I lose it's just a number on a screen. It has to mean something to you to lose that money or you will just take any old trade that comes along and not worry if it's a winner or a loser. I can see the point that you shouldn't overreact to a loss and start chasing the money, having to get it all back on the next trade but for me it should mean something. I am capable of taking some really good trades when they present themselves. What I am asking myself now is am I capable of leaving the so-so trades where they are? My new regime of one trade at a time will certainly help but I need to do more than that and have the patience to wait for a trade rather than taking a trade just to be in the market. That will be my real breakthrough. Sorry for boring you all, just thinking out loud and you never know, someone in the future might read this and feel the same?
Position trader - Anything intraweek is just noise...
  • #8,785
  • May 22, 2010 2:35pm May 22, 2010 2:35pm
Chris, are you still long usdjpy? Friday shows it bouncing from that long down trendline but it's a way away from where you bought first?
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Position trader - Anything intraweek is just noise...
  • #8,786
  • May 22, 2010 8:29pm May 22, 2010 8:29pm
Quoting Arfer Daily
Chris, are you still long usdjpy? Friday shows it bouncing from that long down trendline but it's a way away from where you bought first?

No, that ridiculous candle that spiked down a while back took me out.....am still looking at this pair though....
  • #8,787
  • May 22, 2010 8:31pm May 22, 2010 8:31pm
Quoting Arfer Daily
Further to my post the other day I thought of this. A lot of really good traders (think of two highly regarded traders from this forum) say that you have to detach yourself from the money and just think of it as numbers. The implication is that you have to eliminate any emotional reaction to losing completely. I have found that this doesn't necessarily work for me. If I don't give a shit about winning or losing aren't I more likely to take too many trades and more random, B or C trades? I have found that it helps me a load to think of exactly how...
I hear what you are saying about this. I think that maybe people misunderstand what "not letting it mean too much to you" means. What I mean is that I love the challenge, technical analysis, and "game." I don't worry about the money, but I love the game - and therefore don't like it when I take crappy set ups. I know what you mean though, and everyone is going to be a bit different in the end - so find what works for you, and follow it!

Chris
  • #8,788
  • Edited 9:18am May 23, 2010 3:03am | Edited 9:18am
Quoting Arfer Daily
Further to my post the other day I thought of this. A lot of really good traders (think of two highly regarded traders from this forum) say that you have to detach yourself from the money and just think of it as numbers. [...]
I believe that not everyone who trades is "trading to make money," which is the point of trading. Yet every time we put on a live trade, whether it's a winner or loser, we literally create money. Hence the generative power of leverage and why we accept the risk. The why in why we're paid as much: it may not return!

It also happens to prey on our primal emotions, which surround a possibility of loss or failure in the future. Indeed the underlying feelings of being abandoned, isolated or separated from what's vital to us can cloud our perception of what's real in the market. We end up playing not to lose and consequently lose sight of making money with what's present.

Money is a means to facilitate exchange and nothing more. Yet the idea of money also reveals our present understanding of how we're designed by life. Like Chris was saying earlier, life moves in cycles of giving and receiving. Well, we received this life first and foremost. Like it or not, we were also completely dependent on our environment to contribute the best it had in order to make us!

Herein lies the existential problem that undeniably confronts every would be trader, attachment to a purely infantile belief that trading (too!) should be an exercise for just receiving money as we received life in the womb. Point being is not to detach from the emotion but to detach from the belief or perspective that trading is only about receiving! Many who trade evidently don't get that and lose, if not money then their health, meaningful relationships or pursuits. For a time I was part of that onerous crowd...

To better prevent that now I tithe my trading income, exclusively trading a few pairs for such non-profit purposes, transfer it into a savings account whereupon I set the target amount, time and percentage to donate. Then I choose a charity and/or cause with due diligence to make the contribution and send it. All this built from the inherent understanding that we're made to serve. More harmonious living has been the result! Not-to-mention a peculiar ability that comes when practicing this in conjunction with my business/trading plan to perceive more opportunities to make money in the market

I can hardly tell you how enjoyable it is! Otherwise the more I trade for myself, the more effort just to take, the more isolated, abandoned and separate I feel from this life's that's given all of us. Any discordant emotions, behaviors or vices of today can be traced back to that fundamental ignorance. I believe it's the hardest thing to get over as a trader precisely b/c it demands the whole person to be present and give, accepting the risk, allowing the trade.

Evil is ignorance. Wisdom is reality. The life principles of discretion and discernment apply to giving, which is why I choose to trade responsibly and give to legitimate charities via tithing, not street beggars e.g.. Trading is an expression of what we believe about the market and life. A successful trader is firstly a giver of life, commerce and opportunity serving with their intuition, instinct and intelligence. We receive in kind. Thank you!
  • #8,789
  • May 23, 2010 5:52am May 23, 2010 5:52am
Quoting Soca
I believe that not everyone who trades is "trading to make money,"...
Interesting view, not one I've heard before. Thanks for your thoughts.
  • #8,790
  • May 23, 2010 9:20am May 23, 2010 9:20am
Quoting Soca
I believe that not everyone who trades is "trading to make money," which is the point of trading. Yet every time we put on a live trade, whether it's a winner or loser, we literally create money. Hence the generative power of leverage and why we accept the risk. The why in why we're paid as much: it may not return!

It also happens to prey on our primal emotions, which surround a possibility of loss or failure in the future. Indeed the underlying feelings of being abandoned, isolated or separated from what's vital to us can...
Very interesting and well put. Thanks for posting this.
  • #8,791
  • May 23, 2010 11:34am May 23, 2010 11:34am
Quoting Soca
Yet every time we put on a live trade, whether it's a winner or loser, we literally create money. Hence the generative power of leverage and why we accept the risk.
Your thoughts on trading and life are good to hear and if it works for you, more power to you.

The part I quoted above however, is incorrect. Trading is a zero sum game (actually, after accounting for commissions and/or bid-ask spread, it's a net negative sum game for most). For every buyer, there is a seller. For every transaction, there is a middle man taking his cut. By putting on a trade, you don't create money at all... (unless you're the Federal Reserve, which none of us are).

Whenever you make a trade, someone is taking the opposite side of that trade from you: If I buy 100 shares of Apple, thinking it's going up, there is another person (maybe a genius, maybe a fool) thinking that it's not going up (or else, why would he/she sell?). This is the appeal of trading: you are matching wits with the entire market. Not only do you think the person selling it to you is making a bad decision, but the market as a whole is pricing the security too cheaply. We collectively think we can outsmart the market -- that's what makes trading so difficult, there are a lot of smart people doing it and there is constantly the broker taking the vig on every trade.

So, whether you like it or not, you're not creating money when you win, you're taking money from someone who lost, alternatively, when you lose, you're giving your money to someone else (by making a bad trade). And finally, if you're over trading your account, you're just giving money to your broker and making him/her a very rich person in the process.
  • #8,792
  • May 23, 2010 11:53am May 23, 2010 11:53am
Time for your (monthly/quarterly/whatever) appointment with the only commodity with a PhD in economics: Dr. Copper. He gave us a very nice looking weekly pinbar. I'll be keeping an eye on this one for clues about the global economy. So far, I like what I see:

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(Click to enlarge)
  • #8,793
  • May 23, 2010 12:03pm May 23, 2010 12:03pm
Quoting clockwork71
I hear what you are saying about this. I think that maybe people misunderstand what "not letting it mean too much to you" means. What I mean is that I love the challenge, technical analysis, and "game." I don't worry about the money, but I love the game - and therefore don't like it when I take crappy set ups. I know what you mean though, and everyone is going to be a bit different in the end - so find what works for you, and follow it!

Chris
You weren't one of the traders I was thinking of btw because I don't think you've quite put it in those terms.
Position trader - Anything intraweek is just noise...
  • #8,794
  • May 23, 2010 12:07pm May 23, 2010 12:07pm
Quoting InfinitySL
Your thoughts on trading and life are good to hear and if it works for you, more power to you.

The part I quoted above however, is incorrect. Trading is a zero sum game (actually, after accounting for commissions and/or bid-ask spread, it's a net negative sum game for most). For every buyer, there is a seller. For every transaction, there is a middle man taking his cut. By putting on a trade, you don't create money at all... (unless you're the Federal Reserve, which none of us are).

Whenever you make a trade, someone is taking the opposite...
Some really good points which I agree with but one thing I'd point out is that it isn't always 'zero sum' in the way people think. Don't forget that a lot of forex brokers won't pass the trades of retail traders on to the market but just absorb the profit and loss of these traders with the expectancy that they will sooner or later blow their accounts. This means effectively that you are trading against not only the market but your broker. When you win it's your broker that loses. Mind you in the end it amounts to the same.
Position trader - Anything intraweek is just noise...
  • #8,795
  • May 23, 2010 12:09pm May 23, 2010 12:09pm
Of course there's only one thing you really need to make money trading...

Inserted Video
Position trader - Anything intraweek is just noise...
  • #8,796
  • May 23, 2010 1:38pm May 23, 2010 1:38pm
Quoting Arfer Daily
Some really good points which I agree with but one thing I'd point out is that it isn't always 'zero sum' in the way people think. Don't forget that a lot of forex brokers won't pass the trades of retail traders on to the market but just absorb the profit and loss of these traders with the expectancy that they will sooner or later blow their accounts. This means effectively that you are trading against not only the market but your broker. When you win it's your broker that loses. Mind you in the end it amounts to the same.
Depends if they are an ECN broker or a market maker though surely. I only trade with ECN brokers for that very reason.
  • #8,797
  • May 23, 2010 1:49pm May 23, 2010 1:49pm
Quoting InfinitySL
Time for your (monthly/quarterly/whatever) appointment with the only commodity with a PhD in economics: Dr. Copper. He gave us a very nice looking weekly pinbar. I'll be keeping an eye on this one for clues about the global economy. So far, I like what I see:

Attachment
(Click to enlarge)

Thanks for posting. Copper is certainly a great indicator.
  • #8,798
  • May 23, 2010 1:59pm May 23, 2010 1:59pm
Quoting InfinitySL
Time for your (monthly/quarterly/whatever) appointment with the only commodity with a PhD in economics: Dr. Copper. He gave us a very nice looking weekly pinbar. I'll be keeping an eye on this one for clues about the global economy. So far, I like what I see:

Attachment
(Click to enlarge)
Who are your trading with mate to get access to copper? I can only get gold, silver, crude and natgas with FxPro. Nice clean chart
  • #8,799
  • May 23, 2010 2:27pm May 23, 2010 2:27pm
Quoting 4xAddict
Who are your trading with mate to get access to copper? I can only get gold, silver, crude and natgas with FxPro. Nice clean chart
I got this chart from BroCo Investments. I don't trade with them, but I do have an MT4 demo with them which works great for charting things like commodities, indexes, individual stocks and larger ETFs. They have a gazillion instruments on their platform (I think close to 500 or so).

The chart itself (i.e. color scheme, etc) you should be able to replicate on any MT4 setup -- It's basically just a set of colors and indicators saved as a template (white background, Red/Green candles, etc). I'll attach it to this message if you like it...

Instructions:
Save the file into: Program Files/MetaTrader/templates/Filename.tpl
And then when you create a new chart, right click on the chart itself, select "templates", and then you should be able to bring up the {Filename} chart - if its not there, just click the "Load Template" button and browse over to where ever you saved the file...
Attached File(s)
File Type: tpl WhiteChart.tpl   2 KB | 322 downloads
  • #8,800
  • Edited 4:13pm May 23, 2010 3:54pm | Edited 4:13pm
Thanks mate, certainly a lot of instruments!! Any tips on how to get the weekly and monthly history into the charts? Daily goes back for years but weekly only a few months?? Bizarre.

Thanks also for the template however I was referring more to the lack of lines on the chart, you draw your SR levels very clearly. Cheers

Quoting InfinitySL
I got this chart from BroCo Investments....
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