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Why 61.8%?

  • #361
  • May 9, 2010 7:45pm May 9, 2010 7:45pm
Quoting Sim
Thanks for the reply......
Yes, agreed..... fine post.

Perhaps their adamant, aggressive tone could be partly due to their frustration?

I've no doubt that some of the traders who post at FF are profitable, some immensely so. But I also wonder how many other successful traders bother to post on forums. I'm reminded of the saying "those who know, don't say; and those who say, don't know". There might be cases of that here.

I've become very careful in the way that I sift through information in public forums; I don't take anything for granted without proving its validity for myself. However, it's usually not too difficult to determine from the language in a post, as to how successful the poster might be. I see extravagant boasting as a symptom of ego rather than knowledge. If I was making huge amounts from my trading, I wouldn't feel the need to tell the whole world about it; I'd just smile quietly to myself as I watch the sun set from the balcony of my beachfront home in the Bahamas, LOL.
  • #362
  • May 9, 2010 8:42pm May 9, 2010 8:42pm
Quoting Sim
What I love about forums is that publically admitted failed traders (hint ted and the above) feel a compelling urge to give their definitive answer to open-ended concepts, which ironically, rely on THEM to make it work..
Keep on trolling.
You're a very sad individual.
  • #363
  • May 10, 2010 5:09am May 10, 2010 5:09am
Quoting hanover
Yes, agreed..... fine post.

Perhaps their adamant, aggressive tone could be partly due to their frustration?

I've no doubt that some of the traders who post at FF are profitable, some immensely so. But I also wonder how many other successful traders bother to post on forums. I'm reminded of the saying "those who know, don't say; and those who say, don't know". There might be cases of that here.

I've become very careful in the way that I sift through information in public forums; I don't take anything for granted without...

Lmao! Love it.. and once again agree with every point there
  • #364
  • May 10, 2010 8:26am May 10, 2010 8:26am
Quoting Sim
touched
  • #365
  • May 10, 2010 9:58am May 10, 2010 9:58am
Quoting Sim
The same circular concept applies to so many arguments in life, ..... incapable of viewing possibility beyond their own internalised boundaries.
Maybe that's what taking different approaches to making a trading plan means. How one deals with one's "internalised (sic) boundaries" in the entirety of life reflects how much and what form of other peoples' devices one will allow into one's own trading plan of other peoples' devices. Also, trading is a very personal activity; it's very easy for a rookie to feel highs when the price-time line goes their way, and lows otherwise.
That one person takes umbrage to a popular trading device is indicative of the person wanting to define their own personal boundaries in terms of how approximate, or area covered to determine, of a price boundary one is willing to accept.

A social, opinionated individual may stress just one boundary of a trading device as being invalid and instead take a device that resembles the original only it sticks with the "personal", that is the price-time line itself;
a second may be okay with a bunch of approximative trading devices that each define a particular variable in figuring where price is to be next;
and, a third may want to undermine the entire idea of approximation through using only a strand of price-time line and its effect on other points along the price-time line.

Thus, while several posts of the last few pages were very well written, they and the trading method each denotes also proves the relative nature of each of our own versus another's personal boundaries.
  • #366
  • May 10, 2010 10:18am May 10, 2010 10:18am
Quoting ha-pattern
Thus, while several posts of the last few pages were very well written, they and the trading method each denotes also proves the relative nature of each of our own versus another's personal boundaries.
Yep, that is agreed and generally assumed.. but the fact still remains that this relative nature of individuals, i.e. the methodoly taken to express one's view, has some convention and takes into account weighing up experience to advisory content, efficiency in conveying your own message relative to politeness, etc etc.

These are things in discussion here currently, and what you said is of good nature and understanding You a psychiatrist by trade?
  • #367
  • May 10, 2010 10:25am May 10, 2010 10:25am
Quoting Sim
Yep, that is agreed and generally assumed.. but the fact still remains that this relative nature of individuals, i.e. the methodoly taken to express one's view, has some convention and takes into account weighing up experience to advisory content, efficiency in conveying your own message relative to politeness, etc etc.

These are things in discussion here currently, and what you said is of good nature and understanding You a psychiatrist by trade?
Hobby and family tree. Too messed up, myself.
  • #368
  • May 10, 2010 10:27am May 10, 2010 10:27am
Aww

Well 'messed up' could also be relative mate! What if you're just a deeper thinker and everyone else is messed up?
  • #369
  • May 10, 2010 3:44pm May 10, 2010 3:44pm
Quoting hanover

Perhaps their adamant, aggressive tone could be partly due to their frustration?
Most probably. Also there's probably some deep psychological reasons why it's more comfortable to convince oneself that the reason for not being able to use specific tools profitably when others seem to be using them successfully is nothing to do with one's lack of ability, it's because the tools are BS!
  • #370
  • May 11, 2010 6:55am May 11, 2010 6:55am
Exactly.. typical of human attributions - link failure to external causes like the tool used suck, success to internal like I am a pro trader with 1 day of net profit!
  • #371
  • May 11, 2010 7:33am May 11, 2010 7:33am
A poor tradesman always blames his tools.
  • #372
  • May 11, 2010 9:15am May 11, 2010 9:15am
Quoting hanover
Yes, agreed..... fine post.

Perhaps their adamant, aggressive tone could be partly due to their frustration?

I've no doubt that some of the traders who post at FF are profitable, some immensely so. But I also wonder how many other successful traders bother to post on forums. I'm reminded of the saying "those who know, don't say; and those who say, don't know". There might be cases of that here.

I've become very careful in the way that I sift through information in public forums; I don't take anything for granted without...
Don't ever underestimate the huge ego's attached to some of the best traders. Not that one should generalize that each hyper-successful trader naturally comes with such an ego - but rest assured some do. I have met some and it is not always a bad attribute when it comes to shine.

If you clash with them, they usually have either an extremely demoralizing or increasingly uplifting effect on you...all depending on your own state of mind.

You are correct to state that (at least the one's I have met) don't come out unprovoked and boast about their achievements. Usually it's triggered by the general disbelief or something similar.

regards
daytrading
Enter Signature
  • #373
  • May 11, 2010 2:43pm May 11, 2010 2:43pm
Quoting Sim
Aww

Well 'messed up' could also be relative mate! What if you're just a deeper thinker and everyone else is messed up?
My phrase was a bit strong.

I once read, and in agreement with Mr. ToxicChili, that to be a consistently winning trader, one must enjoy and do well at the skill of trading. That's what I enjoy thinking deeply about: How to improve my chart study and other trading skills every day, whether I win or lose.
  • #374
  • Oct 15, 2012 6:01am Oct 15, 2012 6:01am
Hello, I am brand new to the trading, and I have some school degree in physics, and I know few math, I am also french so please forgive the bad english, or praise the good one. I didn't read the whole discussion, it is very surprising that people on the market think in such an esoteric way. I just discovered the fibonnaci retracement, but knew the serie, I was wondering how analysts predict resistance. To be clear I am definitely on the side of Ted, the golden ratio is nothing less (and more) than the golden number minus 1, the golden number doesn't arise so often in the nature, and if it arises it is just because of strains the nature applies. This is just the ratio between two number which you can have a "steady" growth. that is if c=b+a, a>b c/a=a/b, that's all, it is normal that such complex "structure" sometimes arise somewhere, or more precisely, this is normal human eye is able to see some. But it is nothing fundamental, it's an outcome, some mathematicians don't think so, but mathematicians tends to be "scientist believers". I searched for explanation on the internet, and until now, I didn't find anything. But if it happens, my money is on a retroaction loop in the market. If everybody predict a resistance at one level, then the flow stops, or bounces, this is only the power of believers finally, it works because they believe in it.

Cheers.
  • #375
  • Oct 15, 2012 7:29am Oct 15, 2012 7:29am
Quoting kalish
Hello, I am brand new to the trading, and I have some school degree in physics, and I know few math, I am also french so please forgive the bad english, or praise the good one. I didn't read the whole discussion, it is very surprising that people on the market think in such an esoteric way. I just discovered the fibonnaci retracement, but knew the serie, I was wondering how analysts predict resistance. To be clear I am definitely on the side of Ted, the golden ratio is nothing less (and more) than the golden number minus 1, the golden number doesn't...
The fib levels work best if they are in confluence with other levels and in trending markets. You'll see traders saying "61.8", others saying "ma200", yet more will say "January high" and so on. So these are points of confluence and are useful.

Price action studies at these sorts of levels are by far the most valuable and interesting studies, in my opinion.

But whether or not you agree with the theory, Fibonacci levels can not be ignored, because traders use them. When major players use one, you will know.

By the way, your English is excellent and it is clear you have mathematical credentials. Thanks for posting.
Gone to a better place
  • #376
  • Oct 15, 2012 8:38am Oct 15, 2012 8:38am
It works because so many traders use Fibs as support/resistance...so it's almost like a self-fulfilling prophecy.
  • #377
  • Oct 15, 2012 9:10am Oct 15, 2012 9:10am
Ratio in nature
  • #378
  • Oct 20, 2012 5:44pm Oct 20, 2012 5:44pm
It is said golden ration because the ratio is found in different creation of God.
Also the Fibonacci retracement came from the ratio of fibonacci number. 1,2,3, 5,8.....
  • #379
  • Oct 20, 2012 5:48pm Oct 20, 2012 5:48pm
Quoting shanewatson
It is said golden ration because the ratio is found in different creation of God.
Also the Fibonacci retracement came from the ratio of fibonacci number. 1,2,3, 5,8.....
that is a big statement.


you can actually win the novel price if you can prove that God in fact exists and he created something
AVT INVENIAM VIAM AVT FACIAM
  • #380
  • Nov 17, 2015 9:20am Nov 17, 2015 9:20am
Quoting the redlion
{quote} that is a big statement. you can actually win the novel price if you can prove that God in fact exists and he created something
i do not think anybody can prove or disprove God's existence. it is just a matter of belief. you either believe in Supreme Being's existence or you do not. God in my understanding is not some kind of physical being, it is the Oneness of every"thing" and no"thing".
As Above, So Below
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