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The truth about trading

  • #21
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:30pm Jan 18, 2010 3:30pm
Quoting Turveyd
It's a trading site, not a english lit site!!

I don't care and never ever will, I'll leave the caring for saddo
So you don't care about doing things the correct way? Is this part of the pennies thing I keep seeing?
  • #22
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:32pm Jan 18, 2010 3:32pm
Quoting Mr demark
LMAOOOOOOOOOOOOOO ^^^
I tell you , this turdvery character is an absolute scream!!!! Read his thread and his posts on other threads!, a laugh a fuckin minute!!! He contradicts himself, criticises people for the exact things he does..you get the idea ..he is mentally
fuckin hilarious, I kid you not...a laugh a fuckin minute.....
  • #23
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:33pm Jan 18, 2010 3:33pm
Quoting Skyhook
So you don't care about doing things the correct way? Is this part of the pennies thing I keep seeing?
My english ability doesn't affect my ability to trade.

It also doesn't mean I'm stupid, it merely means I'm crap at english, it's not what I do for a living so I really do not or ever will care.

People who belittle people because of there english on a Forum well if it was my site you'd all be banned instantly, it detracts from the job at hand which is making $$$'s / £££'s!
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #24
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:36pm Jan 18, 2010 3:36pm
Quoting Turveyd
It's a trading site, not a english lit site!!

I don't care and never ever will, I'll leave the caring for saddo
People communicate using language be it written or spoken. Your written language skills are atrocious and sometimes make it very difficult to know what you are saying without having to read your post a few times and try to decipher it. So perhaps you SHOULD care.
  • #25
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:37pm Jan 18, 2010 3:37pm
Quoting Turveyd
My english ability doesn't affect my ability to trade.

It also doesn't mean I'm stupid, it merely means I'm crap at english, it's not what I do for a living so I really do not or ever will care.

People who belittle people because of there english on a Forum well if it was my site you'd all be banned instantly, it detracts from the job at hand which is making $$$'s / £££'s!
You're not making any money either though , are you?
  • #26
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:41pm Jan 18, 2010 3:41pm
Quoting Turveyd
My english ability doesn't affect my ability to trade.

It also doesn't mean I'm stupid, it merely means I'm crap at english, it's not what I do for a living so I really do not or ever will care.

People who belittle people because of there english on a Forum well if it was my site you'd all be banned instantly, it detracts from the job at hand which is making $$$'s / £££'s!
If this was my website, people would have to reach certain standards in, eg, being able to communicate effectively using their own language. So, turdvery, you would not be allowed onto my site, 'till you brushed up your English skills, thus sparing the rest of us the frustration of trying to work out what the fuck you're talking about.
  • #27
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:43pm Jan 18, 2010 3:43pm
Ok. I hope the greenhorns are reading this

Quoting Turveyd
.....aiming to make 10-15% per year ...
You should not aim to make NOTHING. You apply your trading discipline and the market will reward you. You DO NOT, and i repeat...DO NOT aim to make ANYTHING. If the market doesn't show a valid setup for a whole month, are you going to make pips out of sticks?


Just don't over complicate the thing.

I have to do some thread cleaning later (merlin or someone?)
All this thread was suppose to do is to get the get rich quick mentality out of the greenhorns
100% of traders are losers. Just that some win more than they lose!
  • #28
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:47pm Jan 18, 2010 3:47pm
Quoting Mr demark
Ok. I hope the greenhorns are reading this



You should not aim to make NOTHING. You apply your trading discipline and the market will reward you. You DO NOT, and i repeat...DO NOT aim to make ANYTHING. If the market doesn't show a valid setup for a whole month, are you going to make pips out of sticks?


Just don't over complicate the thing.

I have to do some thread cleaning later (merlin or someone?)
All this thread was suppose to do is to get the get rich quick mentality out of the greenhorns
You won't get away with that mr demark...turdvery will have the last word...watch.....
  • #29
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:49pm Jan 18, 2010 3:49pm
Quoting Mr demark

You dont aim to make NOTHING. You apply your trading discipline and the market will reward you. You DO NOT, and i repeat...DO NOT aim to make ANYTHING. If the market doesn't show a valid setup for a whole month, are you going to make pips out of sticks?


Just don't over complicate the thing.

Although I agree kinda and not trading during bad market times was 1 of my common errors, I likely get 20+ setups per day but I do gets hours where the market range isn't enough for me to scalp effectively.

Nothing is over complicated, infact I've recently simplified my system hugely.

There are more than a few ways to make money, smaller TF's get you a higher win rate, tighter SL's and many more small trades, just because you don't understand this way don't write it off
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #30
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:52pm Jan 18, 2010 3:52pm
Quoting Turveyd
Although I agree kinda and not trading during bad market times was 1 of my common errors, I likely get 20+ setups per day but I do gets hours where the market range isn't enough for me to scalp effectively.

Nothing is over complicated, infact I've recently simplified my system hugely.

There are more than a few ways to make money, smaller TF's get you a higher win rate, tighter SL's and many more small trades, just because you don't understand this way don't write it off
..and what about you writing off 4hr chart trading because YOU don't understand that? Doesn't this make you a hypocrite with no credibility whatsoever? I think it does.
  • #31
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:53pm Jan 18, 2010 3:53pm
Quoting Mr demark
All this thread was suppose to do is to get the get rich quick mentality out of the greenhorns

Some of them, very few but some will get rich quickly, I've known traders go for $500 to $30K+ inside of 6months and there still rocking the pips.


Ahhhhh to have a natural aptitude for daytrading, others just have to work on it longer thats all
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #32
  • Jan 18, 2010 3:58pm Jan 18, 2010 3:58pm
Quoting Turveyd
just because you don't understand this way don't write it off
And i do understand this. I've graduated from this style of trading. You have no idea the number of tests i've done. I even have a program that lets me trade the past data as if it was live .

I do agree that there might be more setups in lower TF. But that does not mean the win rate is higher. It is lower. And dont try to prove me wrong cuz we all know this.
100% of traders are losers. Just that some win more than they lose!
  • #33
  • Jan 18, 2010 4:02pm Jan 18, 2010 4:02pm
Daily candles are the easiest to trade. I still love my short term trading but daily's will always be easier. Nothing like getting into a trade and letting it run for weeks or even months. Not to mention it works really well for people who work a regular job. Come in, look at the chart, done in about 30 minutes. In my opinion, you can do as well or better on the daily's than most can with shorter time frames. I am slowly migrating back to the daily's over the next few months.

To the OP: I like most of your points. I have a slightly different point of view but I do like most of your points.

Good luck on getting rid of that lottery mentality that most have when they jump into Forex.
  • #34
  • Jan 18, 2010 4:05pm Jan 18, 2010 4:05pm
Quoting Mr demark
And i do understand this. I've graduated from this style of trading. You have no idea the number of tests i've done. I even have a program that lets me trade the past data as if it was live .

I do agree that there might be more setups in lower TF. But that does not mean the win rate is higher. It is lower. And dont try to prove me wrong cuz we all know this.

Well the win rate depends on your personal trading ability, the longer your in a trade and the bigger your SL/TP is, especially if you plan to just either hit with no management becomes very close to a 50/50 it's hard to get much of a edge over that.

M1 or below, you can win at 80%+ but on the same note and allowing for the spread cost you can lose at a 90%+ rate to with every upside comes a down side.

I find Forex to changeable to trade on anything over M1 personally, it has news out 3 times per day and totally changes it's mind / direction, stick to trading the smaller stocks for long term trading I personally say.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #35
  • Jan 18, 2010 4:16pm Jan 18, 2010 4:16pm
Do you also agreed the Trading TRUTH that people like yourself make more money selling their products/services than they do in their trading ? OR do they actually trade at all ?
  • #36
  • Jan 18, 2010 4:25pm Jan 18, 2010 4:25pm
Quoting 99vt66
Do you also agreed the Trading TRUTH that people like yourself make more money selling their products/services than they do in their trading ? OR do they actually trade at all ?

Those who can trade trade, those that can't write a book or open a web site and convince people they can trade.


Sad but true
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #37
  • Jan 18, 2010 5:12pm Jan 18, 2010 5:12pm
Quoting Mr demark
1. You will not make any money from Forex unless you understand the architecture of the market (why prices move) and the psychology behind it all. Why does the price change and why this pattern is formed? Why a trend-line break is so powerful? What can pinbars tell us about market sentiment and what the big boys are thinking

3. Trade by looking on weekly, then daily then maybe 4hr chart for now . The weekly and daily have their own patterns and patterns on this magnitude are hard to break by lower time frames. So its a good idea to...
#1 and #3 go hand in hand. All new traders need to be aware that the longer the time frame you are watching, the more correlated to the fundamentals will be. A simple example is the decline of the dollar during 2009. One of the big reasons was simply the US buying their own treasuries, which can be seen clearly as it was triggered by the news in March, see the monthly candlestick.

The reality is though, most new traders start trading on the shortest time frames possible. This is only natural and necessary, to see how price action moves and to discover one's own strategy. One must take baby steps, work from small and grow to something bigger over time. In other words, the first few trades of a new trader will either be scalping, or intraday trades. This is done simply to gain experience, no matter how much demo trading one did. The emotions associated with live trading is a book on its own. Now when you are trying to analyze intraday trading, it is hard to pinpoint any particular reason for any particular move. Usually we don't know the real news that moved the market intraday until after a move has occured.

My point is, for intraday trading, it is not as important to understand why price action does what it does, but being aware of news releases (either to stay out or know how to prepare for them) is a good part of any trading plan.

(As a side note...understanding the psychology behind candlesticks is entirely different from understanding the news. For example I can see the bull versus bear sentiment in any particular candlestick on the 5min to 4hour time frames (even in a ranging market) just by how that candlestick evolves. Putting them all together, I have full understanding of who is in control and how to trade for that particular time frame. Then again...my strategy is 90% psychology so don't focus on this.)

And let's not forget one thing, the bigger the equity in an account the bigger the time frame one will use to trade. When an account is small in size as is the case with most Forex begginers (as was the case with me), trading small on small timeframes is a MUST.

I hope this post didn't deviate from yours. I just simply wanted to point out the other side of the field, the smaller time frames as the majority of new FF visitors are "greenhorn" intraday traders.

Edit:Win versus loss. There are so many "successful methods" for this that I don't know why the issue comes up anymore. Here is my example. I keep a trading log of all my trades. So far for January I have a total of 23 trades. 19 of those trades where winners. 2 of those trades were losers. 2 of those trades where a loss around entry point (-1 pip and -8 pips), count it as you wish. My target per month for this year is 778 pips. So far I have gained 344 pips this month. 20 of those trades were done at half position so real gain is more along 600pips. This win loss ratio is insane by all standards. Is this achievable by the majority? I think not. Is it worth mentioning? I think not. Will I get crazy reactions to this win/loss ratio? No doubt.
Different opinions highly valued, ignorant to slander.
  • #38
  • Jan 18, 2010 5:39pm Jan 18, 2010 5:39pm
Quoting psiholog
#1 and #3 go hand in hand. All new traders need to be aware that the longer the time frame you are watching, the more correlated to the fundamentals will be. A simple example is the decline of the dollar during 2009. One of the big reasons was simply the US buying their own treasuries, which can be seen clearly as it was triggered by the news in March, see the monthly candlestick.

The reality is though, most new traders start trading on the shortest time frames possible. This is only natural and necessary, to see how price action moves and to discover...

Well I can't fault anything and mass psychology is definately a good way to play it.

Most excellent, win / lose ratio, I batted 23winners in a row once it's great when your on a winning streak just playing the short term momentum not over thinking it!!
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #39
  • Jan 18, 2010 5:51pm Jan 18, 2010 5:51pm
Quoting Turveyd
Well I can't fault anything and mass psychology is definately a good way to play it.

Most excellent, win / lose ratio, I batted 23winners in a row once it's great when your on a winning streak just playing the short term momentum not over thinking it!!
Since many traders will probably will focus on this more then any valuable piece of information posted, I feel its necessary to mention a high win/loss ratio can also be a double edged sword. Here is another example. In my first year live in 2008, I had 56 trades for the month of August. All those trades where winners. In those days I did not use stop loss. Due to the high amount of winners, I got so cocky that I felt I could do no wrong. The following month, I started with one losing trade, that I just could not let myself close at a loss. I doubled that position gradually until I pretty much burned my account in roughly 4 to 6 open positions. So again, high win % is not enough, protecting those wins is just as important hence the need for losers is essential, just to remind us as individuals that we cannot be right 100% of the time, only the market is right 100% of the time. Which is why there are many ways of profiting, including win loss ratios of 60/40, 70/30 or even as low as 30/70 as most generic trading books/seminars say.
Different opinions highly valued, ignorant to slander.
  • #40
  • Jan 18, 2010 5:54pm Jan 18, 2010 5:54pm
Quoting psiholog
Since many traders will probably will focus on this more then any valuable piece of information posted, I feel its necessary to mention a high win/loss ratio can also be a double edged sword. Here is another example. In my first year live in 2008, I had 56 trades for the month of August. All those trades where winners. In those days I did not use stop loss. Due to the high amount of winners, I got so cocky that I felt I could do no wrong. The following month, I started with one losing trade, that I just could not let myself close at a loss. I doubled...
So true and a very important info for new traders...Everyone of us will go trough that experience, sooner or later.
Nice posts.
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