5% per day is achievable | Forex Factory

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5% per day is achievable

  • #1
  • First Post: Nov 6, 2005 10:00pm Nov 6, 2005 10:00pm
There was a discussion that was saying 5% per day gain day trading is not heard of. Well it can be possible and even on consistant basis. You have to find a predictable market on basis of technical analysis. If you know a market personality, then it would be easy to trade it and make even more than 5%.
Do you agree?
  • #2
  • Nov 6, 2005 10:46pm Nov 6, 2005 10:46pm
Quoting Franz Shoar
There was a discussion that was saying 5% per day gain day trading is not heard of. Well it can be possible and even on consistant basis. You have to find a predictable market on basis of technical analysis. If you know a market personality, then it would be easy to trade it and make even more than 5%.
Do you agree?
What discussion are you referring to?

I've made as much as 12% in a single day, but 5% every day? I'll agree it is theoretically possible, but in practice it would be virtually impossible. That would work out to a (1.05^30)-1=332% monthly gain, every month. I don't think so.

Quoting Franz Shoar
You have to find a predictable market on basis of technical analysis.
Yes, that is exactly what you would have to do. The problem is that there is no such thing as a predictable market.

Anybody care to disagree?

Dial
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  • #3
  • Nov 7, 2005 5:16am Nov 7, 2005 5:16am
IMHO, 5% per day is way too much. I have a monthly, quarterly, semi-annual and annual percentage targets. Tell you what, my MONTHLY target is around 5%, and I am wondering how I am going to achieve this target consistently with the least possible risk, that's what I am actually searching for right now.

Thanks,

Nader
  • #4
  • Nov 7, 2005 6:17am Nov 7, 2005 6:17am
Some people in forum give target income or realised profit in trades in percentage terms. That's realistic and totally objective to compare results or performances if your account size is big enough. But there are many newbies investing or trading with USD500 or USD1000. When someone says 5% per day or per month, it is misleading without knowing his/her account size, risk appetite, margin etc. It is not the same thing to earn 5% with a 1K account and 1000K account under different circumstances. It is meaningless to earn $100 on $500 account without knowing some specific info. Why do big hedge funds or managed accounts spend lots of cash for advertising when they reach double digit performances in a given year? When you talk in percentage terms, please inform people on what basis (account size, risk etc.) you are talking about before misleading public.
  • #5
  • Nov 7, 2005 3:37pm Nov 7, 2005 3:37pm
Yes having more money and managing your # of contract is very crutial but duable of making 5% everyday consistantly. Requirments are the market has to be a well known market with liquidity and tight bid and ask spread.
Markets are like humans. every one of them has personality like humans. Once you get to know a particular market and come up with a system that will respond to the signals, then achieving 5% return is just merely few trades away, maybe even one per day. I do it every day and consistantly. Money management and contract mangement can make this possible for as low as $2000.00 or a 4 contract minimum. So depending on how much each contract is you can manage to get 5% out of it everyday.
  • #6
  • Nov 21, 2005 9:10pm Nov 21, 2005 9:10pm
Mr. Franz

I believe you. Do You want to trade my account, we could bring it a target and a stoploss and we could start with, if the monthly target is done I bring you the double of lots every month.

Ideas form you are welcome to work with this lots.
Send me your phone I call you.

Thanks
Robert
  • #7
  • Nov 21, 2005 10:03pm Nov 21, 2005 10:03pm
anything "per day" is unrealistic. you dont have to trade for very long to understand trading doesnt work like that. even the best NYSE scalpers dont win everyday.
Relax and be happy.
  • #8
  • Nov 21, 2005 10:23pm Nov 21, 2005 10:23pm
Quoting Blackeagle
Some people in forum give target income or realised profit in trades in percentage terms. That's realistic and totally objective to compare results or performances if your account size is big enough. But there are many newbies investing or trading with USD500 or USD1000. When someone says 5% per day or per month, it is misleading without knowing his/her account size, risk appetite, margin etc. It is not the same thing to earn 5% with a 1K account and 1000K account under different circumstances. It is meaningless to earn $100 on $500 account without knowing some specific info. Why do big hedge funds or managed accounts spend lots of cash for advertising when they reach double digit performances in a given year? When you talk in percentage terms, please inform people on what basis (account size, risk etc.) you are talking about before misleading public.
If you have scalable position sizing like with Oanda, then the % return on a 100, 1000, 10000, 100000 account size will be achievable by taking exactly the same trades. Your account size is irrelevant to the % return - as long as you can scale your position sizes.

As for 5% per day - if you are making it - show us the account. I don't believe it. I know of someone who's goal is 1%/day for a year - he is getting close for this year.

Simon
  • #9
  • Nov 21, 2005 11:25pm Nov 21, 2005 11:25pm
I've never been successful trying to set a "Daily" Goal. I want to give myself a fighting chance. I find that weekly and monthly goals set are more realistic. Being realistic is VERY IMPORTANT. When i continually miss a set goal i get discouraged and stop setting goals altogether...not a very smart thing to do...
  • #10
  • Nov 21, 2005 11:35pm Nov 21, 2005 11:35pm
I have to agree with those that say 5% a day achivable NOT. I just started to trade live. I demoed for 6 months. I have read many an articals and books, much propoganda of claims of what can be achived. theoreticly 5% a day but reality no. One may have a good few day and achive such a percentage but not everyday is a good day. There is always losses that what makes the game fun. You can always win.

Just my 2 pips


Fdisk
Fdisk Please I just want a few pips. Is that too much to ask?
  • #11
  • Nov 21, 2005 11:50pm Nov 21, 2005 11:50pm
Quoting merlin
anything "per day" is unrealistic. you dont have to trade for very long to understand trading doesnt work like that. even the best NYSE scalpers dont win everyday.
Right on Merlin. I used to believe in Santa Clause, then I went through the stage where my head knew he was a fable, but my heart continued to believe. Now I know the truth, and the truth is as you said. Anything "per day" is unrealistic.

How'd you get to be so smart Merlin? Was it from hanging around guys like me?

Dial
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  • #12
  • Nov 22, 2005 2:48am Nov 22, 2005 2:48am
I'll echo what somebody said above...5% of what?

The "of what" should be viewed as the amount of capital you should have (both in the account and as reserve) in order to trade each contact. You work this out using algebra from your trade plan and money management rules.

The margin as far as I am concerned is totally irrelevant.

In my case I reserve $12,500 capital for each contract (I trade futures) Equivalent to $10,000 per forex lot.

If you don't have such plans in place, you stand a big chance of crashing and burning. I have been doing this for a living for 5 years, and I intend being around a lot longer, hence I will stand steadfastly by what I say here.

That mean I would have to average 50 ticks (ticks for futures) a day to make 5%.

hmmmmm nice theory, not realstic.
  • #13
  • Nov 22, 2005 3:00am Nov 22, 2005 3:00am
Quoting merlin
anything "per day" is unrealistic. you dont have to trade for very long to understand trading doesnt work like that. even the best NYSE scalpers dont win everyday.
what:surprised ... 8 months not long...
Keeping it Simple
  • #14
  • Nov 23, 2005 3:09am Nov 23, 2005 3:09am
It all depends on account size and lots you trade. If your account is 50K and you trade 100K lot, it is very difficult to get 5% a day.

but with 5K and 100K lots it is achievable.
Look at loss side. If it is possible to lose whole account in a day there is potential to gain 100% a day.

I agree to this approach: never measure profits in time. If you made 150pips a day it does not mean that you will do it every day. Furthermore you will experience losses too.
kiss the trend
  • #15
  • Nov 23, 2005 3:46am Nov 23, 2005 3:46am
I'm only new at this but from my maths, (approx)

$400 account
50:1 leverage
trade 1 mini lot, = 10,000 units (Oanda)
20 pips = $20 = 5%

sounds easy when it's written like that, ha ha.... till ya realise 100 pips in the wrong direction would split your acount down 1/4 to $300...... ouch.

Dean.
perception is reality
  • #16
  • Nov 23, 2005 4:26am Nov 23, 2005 4:26am
Quoting deanz
I'm only new at this but from my maths, (approx)

$400 account
50:1 leverage
trade 1 mini lot, = 10,000 units (Oanda)
20 pips = $20 = 5%

sounds easy when it's written like that, ha ha.... till ya realise 100 pips in the wrong direction would split your acount down 1/4 to $300...... ouch.

Dean.
Thats why you need to work out your money management parameters

On that mini account and using a 2% fixed fractional method, your stop should be no bigger than 8 pips.

Although on such a small a/c a 5% fixed fractional is acceptable. ie, you should be using stops no wider than 20 pips on a single mini lot.

Wider than that and a run of losses will wipe out your account.

Cheers
  • #17
  • Nov 23, 2005 5:20am Nov 23, 2005 5:20am
5% a day? hehe trust me, if you can sustain over time a 10% return a month you are definitely in the right track to richness.


Besides, focusing on a daily goal is ridiculous, because it'll force you to trade even in days where market conditions dictate that you shouldn't be trading at all. Trading goals should be based on longer time frames, even for the intra day trader.
  • #18
  • Nov 24, 2005 5:19am Nov 24, 2005 5:19am
Quoting WTB
5% a day? hehe trust me, if you can sustain over time a 10% return a month you are definitely in the right track to richness.
I dropped some info about my results a few weeks ago. Playing very high i had later about 30% drawdown but i gained it back and now i do more or less stable 10% weekly. AND WHAT? This is not enough to say whether I am a good trader.

Great trader would probably do 10% weekly risking only little part of his funds. I risk about 80% so no wonder I gain 10% weekly - I need a few pips to gain it. But a few big losses would whip me out of the marked, I know it, but so long I play with small money I stay cool

So - it is not important how many % one gains.

Let us talk about pips/time. I measure my result in weeks and I do about -5 up to 60 pips weekly. Average is 35 (8 weeks history).

What about you guys?
time is money! Z
  • #19
  • Nov 24, 2005 5:49am Nov 24, 2005 5:49am
Quoting Zazzy
I dropped some info about my results a few weeks ago. Playing very high i had later about 30% drawdown but i gained it back and now i do more or less stable 10% weekly. AND WHAT? This is not enough to say whether I am a good trader.

Great trader would probably do 10% weekly risking only little part of his funds. I risk about 80% so no wonder I gain 10% weekly - I need a few pips to gain it. But a few big losses would whip me out of the marked, I know it, but so long I play with small money I stay cool

So - it is not important how many % one gains.

Let us talk about pips/time. I measure my result in weeks and I do about -5 up to 60 pips weekly. Average is 35 (8 weeks history).

What about you guys?
Pips are not relevant because it doesn't tell you how much money you made. If you make 20 pips per week and I make 100 pips per week who makes the most money? You can't tell. What if we both risk 2% of our account in each trade and your stop size was 5 pips (I know I am being extreme here) and my stop size was 200 pips - now we know who made the most money. I made 100/200 my risk which would be 1% and you made 20/5 my risk which would be 8%. Pips alone don't tell you how much you made - % does.

Simon
  • #20
  • Nov 24, 2005 6:28am Nov 24, 2005 6:28am
I think both pips and percent must be looked at to get the total picture.

It is possible, over a series of trades, to have a net loss in pips while having a net gain in equity.

It is also possible, over a series of trades, to have a net gain in pips while having a net loss in equity.

The above two scenarios usually happens when one's risk per trade is not consistent from trade to trade.

By monitoring both pips and percent, you will gain feedback that perhaps your money management needs some adjustment to keep the pips and percent always in the same direction.

Dial
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