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MTF Trix system

  • #2,001
  • Sep 3, 2009 9:17am Sep 3, 2009 9:17am
Quoting Royston
How do you count pips, Indrek? or, for people in general, what is the general convention?

Is on AUDUSD 14+1 = 15 pips ? or is it 15/2 =7.5 pips, assuming 50% size on each half? Was the risk on EJ -23 pips or was it -46 pips? I am never quite sure what it means when people give a score in pips......
That's why I always report my gain/loss in percentage of account as opposed to pips. Scaling out of trades can make the pip counts deceiving.

Doc
  • #2,002
  • Sep 3, 2009 10:04am Sep 3, 2009 10:04am
For entertainment only, as usual.
My last fishing doesn't hit target of 1.4347/EURO
So I close whole "NET" of orders manually at 1.4328-1.4330 area
I did pic little before I close it to see how it looks
took 3 days +18% of the account

Now another fish just hit my NET at 1.4253 won't go in though,
just touched and reverses.. Will TP close to 1.4314... I was going to
trade like you guys, and cannot just stand those 5-10 pips scalps, while
here is swings $1.41-$1.44 EURO area, maybe next time
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  • #2,003
  • Sep 3, 2009 10:38am Sep 3, 2009 10:38am
Just to complicate matters even further:

240 15 5 trades

It is possible to have a long position on 240M TF and a short position on 60M or 30M TF.

The long position is running into a drawdown ( stop loss not hit) and 30M or 60M short signals are generated (profitable one). The trade will fill TP1 and TP2 before it hits the SL on 240M trade and then turn around and fill TP on 240M.
Or...the stop loss is hit but you have " subsidized " the 240M loss with the profit made on lower TF`s i.e. 30m or 60M.

If you throw it all in one pot, you can skew the results even further but that is ultimately IMHO how MTF should be traded although as a standalone, it works very well.
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #2,004
  • Sep 3, 2009 11:26am Sep 3, 2009 11:26am
I have always liked the daily fibo, and especially for those who trade on longer tf's it gives a nice option for target setting. Green line represents a hypotherical intraday entry.

Note that the trades on the chart do not follow the mtf trix method.

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  • #2,005
  • Sep 3, 2009 11:27am Sep 3, 2009 11:27am
Glen, could you, please, post your template? I like your results..
Want to try it as well.. Thank you. If it's Renko, it's ok,
cause I have that script..
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  • #2,006
  • Edited 11:51am Sep 3, 2009 11:35am | Edited 11:51am
Quoting DocPMD
That's why I always report my gain/loss in percentage of account as opposed to pips. Scaling out of trades can make the pip counts deceiving.

Doc
I am not sure if % of account shows much as it depends too much on the size of your account and your personal account management principles. If I say that my account has grown for 4 % in September then it does not say anything to anybody as they do not know 1) what proportion of my account I used for trading; 2) what proportion of my account I used for trading this particular system; 3) how much money I withdrew right before the period or during the period.

So, if to choose between talking about pips and % then I choose pips. They show how well did you catch a trend, how much did you take out from a trend etc. Besides, what and how I do with my money is my personal matter and not subject of public discussion
  • #2,007
  • Sep 3, 2009 11:53am Sep 3, 2009 11:53am
Quoting Indrek
I am not sure if % of account shows much as it depends too much on the size of your account. And whenever you withdraw larger sums from your account, the percentage changes radically. I do not know about you but I usually have quite a big portion of inactive money on my account, just as a buffer. So, if I say that my account has grown 4 % in September it cannot say anything to anybody as nobody knows how many % of my acccount I used in trading.
I agree. If you notice, I also include how much I risk per trade.

But even that isn't good enough. Point is that there are a lot of ways of tracking progress, and any of them can skew one's performance if taken out of context.

So whomever is trying to evaluate the profitability of this (or any) trading method had better either do it themselves, or if they are going to rely on other people reporting results, had better understand the basis of the numbers.

One method is not any better than another, it's just a question of understanding the basis.

Glen reporting a +25 +35 on a trade is no better or worse than me reporting 1.8% profit, 2% risked.

Everyone needs to use their brain a little to understand what any of these numbers means to them. IMHO all that takes is looking at the charts.

Doc
  • #2,008
  • Sep 3, 2009 11:55am Sep 3, 2009 11:55am
Quoting Indrek
I am not sure if % of account shows much as it depends too much on the size of your account. And whenever you withdraw larger sums from your account, the percentage changes radically. I do not know about you but I usually have quite a big portion of inactive money on my account, just as a buffer. So, if I say that my account has grown 4 % in September it cannot say anything to anybody as nobody knows how many % of my acccount I used in trading.
In the end it is all relative. How you report your trading results whether in % , pips,$, hours etc. It all starts with an outcome on a trade to trade basis.
Whether you scale out, use a fixed TP per trade, the end result boils down to one thing only..was it a winner/loser?

The size of your account and trade risk is only relevant for your own personal MM strategy. Nothing wrong with reporting on that on a trade-by-trade basis as well, if you wish.

I personally don`t add the pips when I scale out but average the trade result. The only reason why I report on TP targets eg +25 +35 etc. is to show the trade progression.

In the end, a stated above, was it a winner or a loser? Where did I enter and where did I exit?
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #2,009
  • Sep 3, 2009 11:58am Sep 3, 2009 11:58am
Quoting Gleneagles
In the end, a stated above, was it a winner or a loser? Where did I enter and where did I exit?
This is the most important part. Thinking hard is anyone's personal and very private task as we have been taught already
  • #2,010
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:02pm Sep 3, 2009 12:02pm
Quoting DocPMD
I agree. If you notice, I also include how much I risk per trade.

But even that isn't good enough....
You posted this while I was typing.
Agree..... in the end make sure you understand exactly what you are comparing before you make a decision.
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #2,011
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:03pm Sep 3, 2009 12:03pm
Gleaneagles,

Have you taken any trades in the last 5 hours, since 12:00 GMT?
  • #2,012
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:03pm Sep 3, 2009 12:03pm
Quoting Indrek
This is the most important part. Thinking hard is anyone's personal and very private task as we have been taught already
We should be thankful for the good grounding we received
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #2,013
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:10pm Sep 3, 2009 12:10pm
Quoting angus
Gleaneagles,

Have you taken any trades in the last 5 hours, since 12:00 GMT?
Angus,

I had to shut down my early trades at LDN open early because of ISP issues.
Took reentry on GBPUSD (long) later for +25.
That was my trading effort for the day.

I missed out on a lot more pips but decided to go for lunch instead of kicking the dog and pulling the parrot`s feathers out.

Ended up with 113 pips for the day.
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #2,014
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:16pm Sep 3, 2009 12:16pm
Quoting Gleneagles
Angus,

I had to shut down my early trades at LDN open early because of ISP issues.
Took reentry on GBPUSD (long) later for +25.
That was my trading effort for the day.

I missed out on a lot more pips but decided to go for lunch instead of kicking the dog and pulling the parrot`s feathers out.

Ended up with 113 pips for the day.
Ok, thanks.
  • #2,015
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:19pm Sep 3, 2009 12:19pm
Quoting Gleneagles
Angus,

I had to shut down my early trades at LDN open early because of ISP issues.
Took reentry on GBPUSD (long) later for +25.
That was my trading effort for the day.

I missed out on a lot more pips but decided to go for lunch instead of kicking the dog and pulling the parrot`s feathers out.

Ended up with 113 pips for the day.
I hope you don't mind all the questions again, but would you have taken any of these? (In the highlighted area)
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  • #2,016
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:31pm Sep 3, 2009 12:31pm
Quoting angus
I hope you don't mind all the questions again, but would you have taken any of these? (In the highlighted area)
Angus,

It looks like:

a) Reentries long after the trend signal
b) Before red flag news

No, I will stand aside.

Edit: Are you referring to 30 5 entries?
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #2,017
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:35pm Sep 3, 2009 12:35pm
Quoting Gleneagles
Angus,

It looks like:

a) Reentries long after the trend signal
b) Before red flag news

No, I will stand aside.

Edit: Are you referring to 30 5 entries?
Ok, thanks a lot, again.
  • #2,018
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:36pm Sep 3, 2009 12:36pm
Quoting Gleneagles

Edit: Are you referring to 30 5 entries?
Yes.
  • #2,019
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:42pm Sep 3, 2009 12:42pm
Quoting Indrek
Absolutely, many thanks to the Master, Grandmaster and Supermaster
OMG !!!

Do you mean a hard thinker like this?
Attached Image


Hi,

nice efforts as I can see. I wonder which chart-setp I should use ... Glen ... Indrek .. my own (that does look a little different to yours). I'm still on demo, looking what would be best.

I enjoy it very much that your thread is still increasing. Much food for thoughts. Thanks.

If there are pips you can collect - just do it!
  • #2,020
  • Sep 3, 2009 12:48pm Sep 3, 2009 12:48pm
Angus,

Yes, I will consider 30 5 longs only, AFTER the news event if the average daily range is not at the xtreme.

Short 30 5 , no thank you.

Short 60 15 5, yes, I will consider it, if the pullback was far enough to generate a new signal.
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" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
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