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4H Box Breakout

  • #2,801
  • Aug 29, 2009 12:47pm Aug 29, 2009 12:47pm
Quoting nubchai
No if you hit TP1 you're guaranteed no loss....
Would you devide your initial risk into two pending orders then you mean?
Otherwise if we take a full hit we would've lost twice as much.
Then on the other hand we can only win 50% which lowers our RRR by about half.
I don't know, doens't sound so good to me, or maybe i'm calculating this in the wrong way?
  • #2,802
  • Edited 1:01pm Aug 29, 2009 12:52pm | Edited 1:01pm
Quoting Jesper
Would you devide your initial risk into two pending orders then you mean?
Otherwise if we take a full hit we would've lost twice as much.
Then on the other hand we can only win 50% which lowers our RRR by about half.
I don't know, doens't sound so good to me, or maybe i'm calculating this in the wrong way?
Yes rather than placing two orders of .3 each as an example I would place 1 order at .6 lots.

I personally would prefer banking pips on 1/2 the trade with .3 lots and let the remaining .3 lots runs to completion. But that's me.

Sandy
  • #2,803
  • Aug 29, 2009 1:11pm Aug 29, 2009 1:11pm
Quoting Jesper
Would you devide your initial risk into two pending orders then you mean?
Otherwise if we take a full hit we would've lost twice as much.
Then on the other hand we can only win 50% which lowers our RRR by about half.
I don't know, doens't sound so good to me, or maybe i'm calculating this in the wrong way?
You are absolutely right, as we cannot get partial losses if the trade goes against us, we should not get any partial profits.
Regards
  • #2,804
  • Aug 29, 2009 1:30pm Aug 29, 2009 1:30pm
Ace there's evidently a British banking holiday on Monday and Labor Day is next Monday in the US.

Do you still trade these weeks and if so do you make any adjustments ? E.g. reduce lot sizes. Or do you trade as usual?

Thanks!

Sandy
  • #2,805
  • Aug 29, 2009 1:47pm Aug 29, 2009 1:47pm
Quoting nubchai
Ace there's evidently a British banking holiday on Monday and Labor Day is next Monday in the US.

Do you still trade these weeks and if so do you make any adjustments ? E.g. reduce lot sizes. Or do you trade as usual?

Thanks!

Sandy
It think he said he was gonna trade on monday, but i don't know if he will enter full throttle.
  • #2,806
  • Aug 29, 2009 1:51pm Aug 29, 2009 1:51pm
Quoting Jesper
It think he said he was gonna trade on monday, but i don't know if he will enter full throttle.
Thanks Jesper.

Sandy
  • #2,807
  • Aug 29, 2009 1:55pm Aug 29, 2009 1:55pm
I have a question, not really about this system, but still interesting i think.
All broker takes a fee for us to buy through them, wether it be spread or a percentage.
..but who are the brokers sending our buy/sell orders to?
Are they the big fishes who let's brokers trade through them for again a spread/commission fee?
Then ontop the big fishes or the big fishes themselves, are they trading for free?
What i mean is that someone somewhere has to be the King/Queen of trading and not having to pay for spreads or commissions per trade, or?
They should be able to trade for free right?

I guess it's a pretty deep question, but oh so interesting.. to me atleast.
  • #2,808
  • Aug 29, 2009 2:39pm Aug 29, 2009 2:39pm
Quoting howard
You are absolutely right, as we cannot get partial losses if the trade goes against us, we should not get any partial profits.

I guess the only logical solution would be to take partial loss as well on 1/2 position...
  • #2,809
  • Aug 29, 2009 2:39pm Aug 29, 2009 2:39pm
I have to post something such "herry was here" after read this thread for 5 and half straight hour.. (3am here)

so, here is my testimony :
i like the back & forward test result, i also like the pharoah SL approach even if it isn't tested-approved yet.

and i wanna say Hello to the thread starter and all contributive members here, thx for sharing your ideas..
  • #2,810
  • Aug 29, 2009 2:46pm Aug 29, 2009 2:46pm
Quoting Jesper
That doesn't looks bad, thanks for the info.
Though what i am looking for, i don't know if this exist or if it's even possible to program as an indicator, is an indi that automaticly moves the SL when certain areas prices are hit.

Like an automated SL, kind of like a trailing stop, but it only moves when, as said, certain prices are hit, for instance:

TP #1 is hit, EA now moves SL to BE +20.
TP #2 is hit, EA now moves SL to TP #1
TP #3 is hit, EA now moves SL to TP #2
etc...

Does anyone know anything like that to exist or if it's possible...
I am with IBFX and I use their program called IBFX partial close available through their website downloads. I tried to use it with non-IBFX platforms and I got a repetitive error pop-up...
However, I am still working on incorporating a straddle/hedge program into this because they obviously don't let you place hedges.
Mike
  • #2,811
  • Aug 29, 2009 2:58pm Aug 29, 2009 2:58pm
Quoting mikepip
I am with IBFX and I use their program called IBFX partial close available through their website downloads. I tried to use it with non-IBFX platforms and I got a repetitive error pop-up...
However, I am still working on incorporating a straddle/hedge program into this because they obviously don't let you place hedges.
Mike
Hi Mike,

i must've read your post 4 times and 1 time VERY slow, but i still can't see the connection to my question you quoted.
  • #2,812
  • Aug 29, 2009 3:12pm Aug 29, 2009 3:12pm
Quoting howard
You are absolutely right, as we cannot get partial losses if the trade goes against us, we should not get any partial profits.
Actually, we can choose a "partial" loss by adopting the suggestion to set the SL at 50% of the box. I'm leaning more toward a SL of 60-65% of the box, but even that would still improve R:R considerably.

Another factor in my decision to take partial profits was the research showing that a breakout will go at least 100 pips the great majority of the time. If I can close one lot at 100 pips or so, I'm much more relaxed about letting my second lot run its course.

I think we've traded posts in the past on the infamous OzFX system, right? Were you part of some of Kharvell's threads too? Ah, memory lane.
Greetings from Guanajuato, Mexico
  • #2,813
  • Aug 29, 2009 3:20pm Aug 29, 2009 3:20pm
Quoting Jesper
Hi Mike,

i must've read your post 4 times and 1 time VERY slow, but i still can't see the connection to my question you quoted.
LOL!! I can't even make sense of it. MUST... HAVE... COFFEE!!
What I meant to say is -
If you have IBFX, use their program called Partial Close. It allows you to move s/l and t/p as desired.
  • #2,814
  • Aug 29, 2009 3:26pm Aug 29, 2009 3:26pm
Quoting mikepip
LOL!! I can't even make sense of it. MUST... HAVE... COFFEE!!
What I meant to say is . . .


At least it was a one-time glitch for you, my friend. With me, it's more a habit. I figure if I post thoughts that neither fellow traders nor I can understand, there's little chance of anyone challenging my statements.
Greetings from Guanajuato, Mexico
  • #2,815
  • Aug 29, 2009 5:28pm Aug 29, 2009 5:28pm
Quoting mikepip
LOL!! I can't even make sense of it. MUST... HAVE... COFFEE!!
What I meant to say is -
If you have IBFX, use their program called Partial Close. It allows you to move s/l and t/p as desired.
Ahhh rofl!
Sounds interesting! I will check out IBFX..
..
....
Ok i just did, lol.. read a bit on their website and must say it looks really good at a first glance.
I'm going to open a demo account and see if i can realize my SL/TP dreams.
lol, thanks Mike!
  • #2,816
  • Aug 29, 2009 5:35pm Aug 29, 2009 5:35pm
Quoting yen44x


At least it was a one-time glitch for you, my friend. With me, it's more a habit. I figure if I post thoughts that neither fellow traders nor I can understand, there's little chance of anyone challenging my statements.

haha now that's a great RRR!!
Though i guess the reward part is pretty much left out since you don't even understand your own statements then, lol.

Unless of course the reward is that no one understands that you don't understand, but you understand that they don't understand the statements either!
  • #2,817
  • Aug 29, 2009 6:29pm Aug 29, 2009 6:29pm
Quoting yen44x


At least it was a one-time glitch for you, my friend. With me, it's more a habit. I figure if I post thoughts that neither fellow traders nor I can understand, there's little chance of anyone challenging my statements.
LoL, Yen you always bring up your posting mistakes No worries man
  • #2,818
  • Aug 29, 2009 7:34pm Aug 29, 2009 7:34pm
Quoting nubchai
Great results. I can't help but wonder how many of those BEs were in profit and could have been converted to wins by taking partial profit. Pharoah's MA trailing stop system maybe

Sandy

later---- I went back and checked Danno's great data for 2009 using the trades with modifications. There are 9 trades that closed at BE after hitting TP1. So if you used the strategy of placing two pending trades in the same direction instead of one, closed 1 at TP1 and set the other to BE + 10 or +20 (upto you) you would have 9 additional trades that closed...
Sandy:

You are absolutely right about the many options to deal with the BE issue. The most maddening period for getting stopped out (and later rocketing into profit) was in the second half of 2007. I am not really concerned though, about the results from 07, 08 and (so far) 09. What I am worried about are flat, or mildly choppy markets, of which there have been aplenty in the past. The partial TP option could be an answer to dealing with more than one type of market, but I need to backtest it.

What I can say is that the 1x BE option, even without a partial TP, can save you in dead or mildly choppy markets. But you do give back some of that when you get stopped out of great runs when the market perks up.

Thanks for your reply. I have some spreadsheets coming which may be of interest to you.

Tom
  • #2,819
  • Aug 29, 2009 9:30pm Aug 29, 2009 9:30pm
Quoting Jesper
haha now that's a great RRR!!
Though i guess the reward part is pretty much left out since you don't even understand your own statements then, lol.

Unless of course the reward is that no one understands that you don't understand, but you understand that they don't understand the statements either!
I understand that you think you understood my post, but it could all be a misunderstanding.

BTW, I noticed your profile mentions you're from Sweden. Well, let me say your ability to turn a phrase in English is better than 99% of the native English posters (me included . . . ok, especially me).
Greetings from Guanajuato, Mexico
  • #2,820
  • Aug 29, 2009 10:52pm Aug 29, 2009 10:52pm
[quote=yen44x;3004871]Actually, we can choose a "partial" loss by adopting the suggestion to set the SL at 50% of the box. I'm leaning more toward a SL of 60-65% of the box, but even that would still improve R:R considerably./quote]

why dont you do some work and backtest this and show the results here in this forum????
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