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4H Box Breakout

  • #2,721
  • Aug 27, 2009 5:36pm Aug 27, 2009 5:36pm
Quoting danno96
No computer skill, not a programmer. I did all that work manually over the chart. That why there may be a few errors and not 100% accurate but close enough for my needs

I'm with FXDD, how does position size option work with the broker? I simply look at the range size if > 200 no trade for the week. The reason I did that is, if you look at some of the > 200+ weeks, some 300+ and even 500+ week there is low % chance that our TP4 will be hit but would risk greater than 2% per trade with my broker (min $1/pip with a standard account).

Yeah, I understand this now. because with Oanda I can open any size I want. Down to $0.01 so, I can control my position size without any problem. The problem is to translate prices from FXDD to Oanda. It looks like 5-10 pips difference and Oanda uses 3 hours candles. But with time I will get it right.
You know, you are actually right with your slightly changed rules. Those big wins actually help to make at least half of the profit.
I actually printed Ace's rules with your spice and set it on the wall in front of my eyes to follow
  • #2,722
  • Aug 27, 2009 5:42pm Aug 27, 2009 5:42pm
Quoting tazmaan
fxdd will give you 10c per pip, all you have to do is email them requesting it.
I have a live fxdd account as well.
Thank tazmaan, I'll do that.
  • #2,723
  • Aug 27, 2009 5:43pm Aug 27, 2009 5:43pm
shiko,

I trade with Oanda, also.

Why not switch to the 1 hour chart on Oanda? Just select the same 1H candles that are the same as the 4H candle on FXDD.

Comparing Oanda to FXDD, most of the time price differs only about 2-4 pips on average.
  • #2,724
  • Aug 27, 2009 6:40pm Aug 27, 2009 6:40pm
Quoting Bobcat2
shiko,

I trade with Oanda, also.

Why not switch to the 1 hour chart on Oanda? Just select the same 1H candles that are the same as the 4H candle on FXDD.

Comparing Oanda to FXDD, most of the time price differs only about 2-4 pips on average.

Thanks Bobcat2, I have done exactly this. But Oanda opens earlier than FXDD and I opened both when the action was already on. Had some problems and forgot about spread.
  • #2,725
  • Aug 27, 2009 6:47pm Aug 27, 2009 6:47pm
Quoting Ace284
Stoploss is typically 100 – 150 pips on average. After TP1 the stoploss is at BE. I don't trade weeks with 200 pip boxes because the target of 800 pips is usually unrealistic.





Ah, I see. Not to worry, ignoring the boxes 200 pips and over is already a rule.





I can't see much to post on that. But the long trade was not activated. The short trade was stopped out at BE after moving the stop once TP1 was hit.


Overall week: No profits, No loss. Breakeven Week.
Ace. The logic of NOT trading box sizes greater than 200 pip escapes me. I love this method as you know. I love poking and proding to hopefully see some weakness where we can improve and I certainly believe you adopting the BE move is essential.

Here is my thinking. A greater than 200 pip box would suggest a very strong moving market with the potential for some very good profits. To NOT trade this box just because you want to adhere to a TP4 rule just doesn't make sense. We want volatility and strong moves. That is where we make our big money.

If the box is greater than 200 pips then use a TP3 or a TP2 but to walk away from potentially good profit just becuase TP4 or 800 pips plus is unrealistic I beleive is wrong.
If the fellows that have the xls files could have a look at the weeks with greater than 200 pip boxes and see how far they did run, that might give us a clue as to the TP level we should strive for.

Just a thought.

Dave R.
  • #2,726
  • Aug 27, 2009 7:36pm Aug 27, 2009 7:36pm
Quoting danno96
No computer skill, not a programmer. I did all that work manually over the chart. That why there may be a few errors and not 100% accurate but close enough for my needs

I'm with FXDD, how does position size option work with the broker? I simply look at the range size if > 200 no trade for the week. The reason I did that is, if you look at some of the > 200+ weeks, some 300+ and even 500+ week there is low % chance that our TP4 will be hit but would risk greater than 2% per trade with my broker (min $1/pip with a standard account).

Danno. Could you do me a favour and look at your Excel and list the weeks that the box exceeds 200 pips and list the amount of pips the actual run was for that week.

This could be very significant in whether or not we trade or not.

Thank you

DAve R.
  • #2,727
  • Aug 27, 2009 9:06pm Aug 27, 2009 9:06pm
ACE284 + Fibo
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
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  • #2,728
  • Aug 27, 2009 9:41pm Aug 27, 2009 9:41pm
Quoting droland
Ace....
No, your absolutely right, sometimes I get too carried away with Risk to Reward and the mechanical aspect. Its because so far that mentality is mainly the reason why I developed the 4H Box Breakout and its left me with a positive balance in my account for almost a year now. Perhaps not full profits, but hey, I can't complain. That's mainly why I tend to block out trades with less reward unless I accidentally enter one.

Nonetheless, as you said, opportunity is definitely there even with a large box and I shouldn't necessarily state that it should not be traded.
  • #2,729
  • Aug 27, 2009 9:51pm Aug 27, 2009 9:51pm
Quoting Ace284
No, your absolutely right, sometimes I get too carried away with Risk to Reward and the mechanical aspect. Its because so far that mentality is mainly the reason why I developed the 4H Box Breakout and its left me with a positive balance in my account for almost a year now. Perhaps not full profits, but hey, I can't complain. That's mainly why I tend to block out trades with less reward unless I accidentally enter one.

Nonetheless, as you said, opportunity is definitely there even with a large box.
Ace. I really like your approach.

You have established a really really good system. You have given this to us and everyone wants to change it, improve it, question it but you resist until it becomes obvious that change is good. Like the move to BE.

I think you are handling this forum extremely professionally. You are not swayed by conjecture, you only move or change with fact.

Congratulations. Excellent forum. One of the few systems where I have made consistent money even with my prodding and pocking. I mean real live account money.

Love it. I will keep prodding and pocking but don't change anything until proven.

Dave R.
  • #2,730
  • Aug 27, 2009 10:10pm Aug 27, 2009 10:10pm
Quoting banana9009
ACE284 + Fibo
banana,

How are you trading this approach?
  • #2,731
  • Aug 27, 2009 10:39pm Aug 27, 2009 10:39pm
Does anyone have an EA that could manage this?
  • #2,732
  • Aug 27, 2009 10:48pm Aug 27, 2009 10:48pm
Quoting danno96
No computer skill, not a programmer. I did all that work manually over the chart. That why there may be a few errors and not 100% accurate but close enough for my needs

I'm with FXDD, how does position size option work with the broker? I simply look at the range size if > 200 no trade for the week. The reason I did that is, if you look at some of the > 200+ weeks, some 300+ and even 500+ week there is low % chance that our TP4 will be hit but would risk greater than 2% per trade with my broker (min $1/pip with a standard account).

Great job Danno!!!

Thanks a lot!
  • #2,733
  • Aug 27, 2009 10:52pm Aug 27, 2009 10:52pm
Quoting droland
Ace. I really like your approach.

You have established a really really good system. You have given this to us and everyone wants to change it, improve it, question it but you resist until it becomes obvious that change is good. Like the move to BE.

I think you are handling this forum extremely professionally. You are not swayed by conjecture, you only move or change with fact.

Congratulations. Excellent forum. One of the few systems where I have made consistent money even with my prodding and pocking. I mean real live account money.

Love...
Ace,

Thanks for sharing this profitable yet simple method. I too have never seen a system like this. Thanks also to all the countless members who have contributed in the backtest and suggestions. I've left a comment on your profile, surprised that few others have done so.

danno96,

Great manual backtest!
  • #2,734
  • Aug 27, 2009 10:55pm Aug 27, 2009 10:55pm
Quoting shiko
Thanks Bobcat2, I have done exactly this. But Oanda opens earlier than FXDD and I opened both when the action was already on. Had some problems and forgot about spread.
Iīm also with OANDA and i have also any problem, because I follow the quotes in Metatrader demo Alpari and Oanda always hit my SL just in my pip and goes to the other way suddenly and in Alpari donīt touch my SL... so I havenīt add this week the spread and I have lost pips in the long...

What kind of problems have you had?

Thank you?
  • #2,735
  • Aug 27, 2009 11:41pm Aug 27, 2009 11:41pm
Quoting droland
Ace. The logic of NOT trading box sizes greater than 200 pip escapes me. I love this method as you know. I love poking and proding to hopefully see some weakness where we can improve and I certainly believe you adopting the BE move is essential.

Here is my thinking. A greater than 200 pip box would suggest a very strong moving market with the potential for some very good profits. To NOT trade this box just because you want to adhere to a TP4 rule just doesn't make sense. Dave R.
Nice post . . . I couldn't agree more and I'm glad Ace saw the logic of your thinking as well.
Greetings from Guanajuato, Mexico
  • #2,736
  • Aug 27, 2009 11:47pm Aug 27, 2009 11:47pm
Quoting yen44x
Nice post . . . I couldn't agree more and I'm glad Ace saw the logic of your thinking as well.
True Yen but I didn't back it up with backtest.
That is why I hope Danno will look at his back test data and confirm that the 200 pip box is, in fact, worth trading.

Dave R.
  • #2,737
  • Aug 27, 2009 11:50pm Aug 27, 2009 11:50pm
Quoting droland
True Yen but I didn't back it up with backtest.
That is why I hope Danno will look at his back test data and confirm that the 200 pip box is, in fact, worth trading.

Dave R.
Definitely . . . it's not a slam dunk yet, but what appealed to me is the fact that we're looking for a volatile market rather than a ranging one. Why in the world would we ignore the very thing we're looking for?

Now, if Danno's backtesting disproves our thinking, remember we can always delete these posts and claim we never said it.
Greetings from Guanajuato, Mexico
  • #2,738
  • Aug 27, 2009 11:56pm Aug 27, 2009 11:56pm
Quoting yen44x
Definitely . . . it's not a slam dunk yet, but what appealed to me is the fact that we're looking for a volatile market rather than a ranging one. Why in the world would we ignore the very thing we're looking for?

Now, if Danno's backtesting disproves our thinking, remember we can always delete these posts and claim we never said it.
Gotta love your thinking. I remember earlier that you had been away somewhere with burros or something.

Where are you and why do I like you so much?

dr
  • #2,739
  • Aug 28, 2009 12:36am Aug 28, 2009 12:36am
Hi, very impressive job, thanks for share.

you made a little mistake on column U, line 475 for 2003 year ! you miss some good pips

thanks again

Greg

Quoting danno96
Hi All,

I've complete my back testing results back to 2002. Thank Ace's for this simple and stress free strategy. I try to keep it as simple as possible based on ACE's original approach with minor variations to meet my own trading needs. Like what Mark Douglas say in his book "Trading in the Zone". You needs to believe in your trading edge and follow your plan. My backtesting proof to me that this system work and if I stick to the plan I'll be rewarded.

Keep it simple, believe in the system, stick to the plan and you'll be rewarded....
  • #2,740
  • Aug 28, 2009 1:36am Aug 28, 2009 1:36am
Quoting lugarejo
Iīm also with OANDA and i have also any problem, because I follow the quotes in Metatrader demo Alpari and Oanda always hit my SL just in my pip and goes to the other way suddenly and in Alpari donīt touch my SL... so I havenīt add this week the spread and I have lost pips in the long...

What kind of problems have you had?

Thank you?


This was my second week. at first week I made box with Oanda slightly bigger than with FXDD and though price went through all box it diod not hit my stop loss and reversed. I think we need to add few more pips plus spread with Oanda.
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