Is "systems-sharing" really a good thing? | Forex Factory

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Is "systems-sharing" really a good thing?

  • Poll

  • Is systems-sharing a time wasting?
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  • #1
  • First Post: Aug 24, 2009 6:02pm Aug 24, 2009 6:02pm
Hi, what i'm looking to discuss here is if the systems-sharing effect, like this one that happen everyday on forexfactory, somebody have a system, want to share, other people improve it, discuss it, etc...

Now, looking over the box, why it's a "waste of time"?


Because:

We say that 95% of people loose money, so it's obvious that the 5% who actually make it (and make it big) don't share his experience (costed many money [losses during the learning curve]) with the other 95% of traders, now..

This let us know that the system-sharing phenomenon is used only between that other 95% of traders, who don't know how to trade profitably.
As result, 100% of systems shared and posted in forums, blogs, books, videos, etc.. are systems created by people who don't trade profitably (not consistently), so these are systems that mainly loose money in the long term.

These systems cannot make regular profit, and the "improvements" are some add-ons/modify of the system imposed by people (always in the 95% of loosers) that isn't able to make profit from the market.

Result: loosing systems modified by unexperienced people, months working on systems all together.. and always end with a loosing system.

That's why i say that probably if we spend less time looking other people system and we concentrate all our energies to our personal system, created from our studies, this will give a chance to create something of profitable.

I created a poll, feel free to give your opinion

Thank you
  • #2
  • Aug 24, 2009 6:08pm Aug 24, 2009 6:08pm
I completely agree with everything you have said.
The breaking of a wave cannot explain the whole sea.
  • #3
  • Aug 24, 2009 6:23pm Aug 24, 2009 6:23pm
Quoting tunera
Hi, what i'm looking to discuss here is if the systems-sharing effect, like this one that happen everyday on forexfactory, somebody have a system, want to share, other people improve it, discuss it, etc...

Now, looking over the box, why it's a "waste of time"?


Because:

We say that 95% of people loose money, so it's obvious that the 5% who actually make it (and make it big) don't share his experience (costed many money [losses during the learning curve]) with the other 95% of traders, now..

This let us know that the system-sharing phenomenon...
Not really. There's always a new supply of taht 5% population. They gotta learn this market from somewhere. That's where the systems section comes in. I suppose these guys who are in the top 5% started out like anyone would. Reading up on these forums and getting immersed into all kinds of systems and learning the common themes. Finally after some months or years, they are finally making it and dissapears into the abyss.
  • #4
  • Aug 24, 2009 6:23pm Aug 24, 2009 6:23pm
I disagree, a few people have used a few of my systems from what there saying profitably, sadly I'm a better system developer than I am trader cause I'm still working on my system.
Nothing to it, but to do it!!! Stick to the plan FOOL!!!!
  • #5
  • Aug 24, 2009 6:46pm Aug 24, 2009 6:46pm
exactly, and if we don't system share, then that's leaving 100% of trial and error to each of us, instead of you trying out this system, while I try out this system, while another fellow tries out another system, by sharing systems, profitable ones or not, we're only adding to the collective knowledge base flowing on the forum. No point in re-inventing the sword, we have guns now. By that I mean, why let newbies make the same mistakes we have, when we can help prevent it.
  • #6
  • Aug 24, 2009 7:58pm Aug 24, 2009 7:58pm
System sharing is a waste of time and a major distraction. How much help do you think the 95% who fail are going to offer to improve your system?? How do you know if they are a 5%'r or a 95%'r. Chances are they are a 95%'r. That's like taking marriage advice from someone who is divorced.

Cruise through the systems section and you will see a definite pattern. Within the first few posts will come: Do you trade this live? What is your winning percentage? Do your indicators repaint? Then within the first few pages comes the person with the first of many indicators that will help to "filter out" the bad trades. Usually from someone who doesn't trade live or has never had a winning month. What they fail to see is that their new savior of an indicator may save you from 1 or 2 20 pip stopouts but it gets you in 60 pips late on the long running trends. Helping you by netting you 40-50 pips less than if you would have just taken the stopouts in the first place.
  • #7
  • Aug 24, 2009 8:38pm Aug 24, 2009 8:38pm
Quoting magnumfreak
System sharing is a waste of time and a major distraction. How much help do you think the 95% who fail are going to offer to improve your system?? How do you know if they are a 5%'r or a 95%'r. Chances are they are a 95%'r. That's like taking marriage advice from someone who is divorced.

Cruise through the systems section and you will see a definite pattern. Within the first few posts will come: Do you trade this live? What is your winning percentage? Do your indicators repaint? Then within the first few pages comes the person with the first...
Nice post, well said.

that is the eben flow of most systems in posted in the trading systems section.
  • #8
  • Aug 24, 2009 8:54pm Aug 24, 2009 8:54pm
my question about that is, do we even know it's still 5%?

25 years ago, 5% of the people could use a computer, now 70% can use one effectively.

Just because books that date back to lord knows when say that 5% can become successful, well, if it's been 5% for the last 40-60 years, then I would imagine it's much higher then that now.
  • #9
  • Aug 24, 2009 8:59pm Aug 24, 2009 8:59pm
Quoting Pharoah
my question about that is, do we even know it's still 5%?

25 years ago, 5% of the people could use a computer, now 70% can use one effectively.

Just because books that date back to lord knows when say that 5% can become successful, well, if it's been 5% for the last 40-60 years, then I would imagine it's much higher then that now.
or it could be much lower!
  • #10
  • Aug 24, 2009 9:01pm Aug 24, 2009 9:01pm
this is true, but the fact remains, we at this point no longer can say it's 95% will come and go, 5% will come and stay as a certainty.
  • #11
  • Aug 24, 2009 9:05pm Aug 24, 2009 9:05pm
Quoting Pharoah
this is true, but the fact remains, we at this point no longer can say it's 95% will come and go, 5% will come and stay as a certainty.
You're right there, I have heard 5% 2% 1% 10% never actually seen a study on the actual figure from an exact time.
  • #12
  • Aug 24, 2009 9:14pm Aug 24, 2009 9:14pm
I think it's just any other statistic, it's commonly referenced as being 95-5 so this is where the common belief stems from, but we do not know exact statistics, because I don't think at any point was every trader (both successful and not) surveyed. The only way to get an accurate 100% definitive answer, is to survey all traders from the last 10 years, then and only then can we even begin to establish any form of true statistic, otherwise it's just hear say.
  • #13
  • Aug 24, 2009 9:52pm Aug 24, 2009 9:52pm
1% of the Worlds Population control 80% of the Worlds wealth.

I think 5% is a shamless Marketing Ploy to give Hope...
  • #14
  • Aug 24, 2009 9:55pm Aug 24, 2009 9:55pm
Quoting Bemac
1% of the Worlds Population control 80% of the Worlds wealth.

I think 5% is a shamless Marketing Ploy to give Hope...


Well said.
  • #15
  • Aug 24, 2009 10:04pm Aug 24, 2009 10:04pm
so with all of this said, is sharing systems a good thing? Depends if you learn from them or not I would say is the ultimate answer. If you can't learn from them, then you're most likely in the category of those that will fail, if you can learn something from them, then you just might be in the category that stays.
  • #16
  • Aug 24, 2009 10:08pm Aug 24, 2009 10:08pm
It doesn't matter how good is your system, no one is going to believe it anyway if you share. Try this.

Do you think any trader has yet discovered a "holy grail"? If yes, that person should not have remained unknown to rest of the world by now.

No one on this earth is superior than other, everyone of us is unique. The only issue is that we do not believe in ourselves and look for the solutions outside of our being. The people who know this are more successful than others.
The Thief of Wall Street
  • #17
  • Aug 24, 2009 10:15pm Aug 24, 2009 10:15pm
Quoting Chicky
It doesn't matter how good is your system, no one is going to believe it anyway if you share. Try this.

Do you think any trader has yet discovered a "holy grail"? If yes, that person should not have remained unknown to rest of the world by now.

No one on this earth is superior than other, everyone of us is unique. The only issue is that we do not believe in ourselves and look for the solutions outside of our being. The people who know this are more successful than others.
This can be true on certain levels, but there have been many who have had belief in themselves, and ended up rock bottom, because they let their own superiority complex in the way of rational thought.

Belief in ones self can only take you so far. Too much belief in ones self can be just as destructive as no belief at all.
  • #18
  • Aug 24, 2009 10:24pm Aug 24, 2009 10:24pm
Quoting Pharoah
This can be true on certain levels, but there have been many who have had belief in themselves, and ended up rock bottom, because they let their own superiority complex in the way of rational thought.

Belief in ones self can only take you so far. Too much belief in ones self can be just as destructive as no belief at all.
They were them.

This is exactly the kind of thinking I am talking about. So let 1% make 80%, they very well deserve it...... and probably I belong to that 1%.
The Thief of Wall Street
  • #19
  • Aug 24, 2009 10:31pm Aug 24, 2009 10:31pm
I'm seeing your point now more clearly.

I personally have complete faith in myself, and the system that I have devised, will my system win 100% of the time? no, but it's R/R is 1/8+ so I can afford to take 7 losses before I break even from 1 gain (I never have 7 losses in a row).

Alot of people tend to confuse win/loose ratio with R/R, sure a system may win 95% of the time, but, are those winner large enough to make up for those 5 major loosers?.

Alot of people don't understand 1 trade can kill 100 trades worth of profit.
  • #20
  • Aug 24, 2009 10:35pm Aug 24, 2009 10:35pm
Quoting Chicky
They were them.

This is exactly the kind of thinking I am talking about. So let 1% make 80%, they very well deserve it...... and probably I belong to that 1%.
...I... Don't believe your doubts and don't doubt your beliefs
Chicky Rockerfeller... Hmmm...

but that was funny...
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