What is wrong with me? | Forex Factory

Options

Go to
Permalinks
Print Thread

Similar Threads

Wrong Trade: Wrong Place / Wrong Time 16 replies

[HELP] Arrows drawn in wrong position? What's wrong? 0 replies

Right Wrong Right Wrong Right Wrong 13 replies

Am I wrong or is Alpari wrong? 1 reply

Attachments: What is wrong with me?
Exit Attachments

What is wrong with me?

  • #1
  • First Post: Edited Aug 7, 2009 12:52am Aug 6, 2009 3:04am | Edited Aug 7, 2009 12:52am
I've been learning and practicing trading (forex) on demo account for 3 or maybe 4 years now and still I'm not able to trade profitably, and I've tried many different strategies. What is wrong with me? I'm not stupid. I graduated. Is it because something's wrong with my trading psychology? I think so. I'm very impulsive trader - many times I just feel that I need to trade, the price is moving, so many others trade - what am I waiting for? I know it's wrong and I need to be more disciplined.

But, though I'm seeing some improvement over these years - at least my monthly losess are getting smaller and sometimes I have a small profit at the end of month, I still have not enough skills to trade live. And I'm afraid that if I'm not able to trade live after these 3 or 4 years of practicing then I will never be able to do that.

Einstein said that person who's, for long time, doing the same thing over and over again, with the same wrong results, is insane. And sometimes I don't know whether I'm insane or persistent.

I really need your opinion and some help.

Thank you.
  • #2
  • Aug 6, 2009 9:59am Aug 6, 2009 9:59am
Do you have trading plan?
  • #3
  • Aug 6, 2009 10:03am Aug 6, 2009 10:03am
what are your rules and do you follow them precisely?
where are your trading records for every trade?

we could probably easily see what the problem is if you document them.
taking series 3 and 34
  • #4
  • Aug 6, 2009 11:49am Aug 6, 2009 11:49am
Sounds like you are really trying to play things by ear. When people don't have a system they simply open their charts and trade based off emotion. Emotion becomes their system, which is pretty doomed for failure. Begin to develop a method, and developing a real strategy that you replicate(be it mechanical or discretionary), you still need underlying guide/rules.

You are not insane, persistence is important.

Keep at it
Mike
  • #5
  • Aug 6, 2009 12:29pm Aug 6, 2009 12:29pm
Just because you have been doing something for x years does mean you are automatically entitled to be competent at it, just like being a graduate doesn't necessarily exclude you from being stupid. So forget how long you've been doing it, what have you actually learnt? From what you have told us, it doesn't sound like a great deal. Shooting from the hip with no plan ain't going to learn, and less still earn, you nothing. I mean no disrespect but my advice is to take it seriously or get on with your life, it's far too short to be pissing away on this game if there's no likely pay-off at the end of it.

PS Einstein said:

“The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”
  • #6
  • Aug 6, 2009 12:46pm Aug 6, 2009 12:46pm
Quoting confusedtrdr
I've been learning and practicing trading (forex) on demo account for 3 or maybe 4 years now and still I'm not able to trade profitably, and I've tried many different strategies. What the is wrong with me? I'm not stupid. I graduated. Is it because something wrong with my trading psychology? I think so. I'm very impulsive trader - many times I just feel that I need to trade, the price is moving, so many others trade - what am I waiting for? I know it's wrong and I need to be more disciplined.

But, though I'm seeing some improvement over these...
I was there once too. I started Forex trading in 2005(w/o any plan/experience/objectives)-I lost continually for the next 2-1/2 years(some small gains to wet the whistle). I was a Forex Loser Poster boy. I stopped trading "live" and started to demo-watching charts endlessly for patterns I could trade with. I read EVERYTHING about charting/forex/trading. And my biggest move was to "fire" my broker. I got a plan together and started to trade "nanolots" to gain experience "live" trading. I started to profit consistently in 2008 and developed my own method into an EA(ExpertAdvisor). I will bet many more members here at FF have had a similar Forex experience. If u give up-you WILL be counted among 90+% of traders that dont survive. Other people do extract profit from Forex and u can too. Education (for me) was that turning point. Hope u stay here though.
FF = Forex Faggots
  • #7
  • Aug 6, 2009 4:02pm Aug 6, 2009 4:02pm
Quoting 8fingers
I was there once too. I started Forex trading in 2005(w/o any plan/experience/objectives)-I lost continually for the next 2-1/2 years(some small gains to wet the whistle). I was a Forex Loser Poster boy. I stopped trading "live" and started to demo-watching charts endlessly for patterns I could trade with. I read EVERYTHING about charting/forex/trading. And my biggest move was to "fire" my broker. I got a plan together and started to trade "nanolots"...

while i dont agree with the EA part, the majority of your post is correct. the only reason that traders fail is that they give up. they dont stay in the market. what fingers did was great. he did whatever he could to stay in the market, and he's still there. plus, he learned as much as he could. read everything you can and focus on the things that are pretty much universal in all the books/pdfs whatever. thats the stuff that works.
  • #8
  • Aug 6, 2009 4:25pm Aug 6, 2009 4:25pm
Quoting blacksun1
while i dont agree with the EA part, the majority of your post is correct. the only reason that traders fail is that they give up. they dont stay in the market. what fingers did was great. he did whatever he could to stay in the market, and he's still there. plus, he learned as much as he could. read everything you can and focus on the things that are pretty much universal in all the books/pdfs whatever. thats the stuff that works.
I agree that EA trading isnt perfect-I actually love programming way more than I luv using EA's. One thing that EA trading does that is positive - trade w/o emotion and rarely misses an Entry. It works for me and I was lucky that I found that "something" that works for me. Most dont sadly. Blacksun1 thanks for the nice words. Hope that original Poster makes it too.
FF = Forex Faggots
  • #9
  • Aug 6, 2009 4:39pm Aug 6, 2009 4:39pm
Nothing is "wrong with you". You have not had proper instruction because you did not know where to go. Many people tell you that you need to learn how markets work. That is misleading. You have to come to grips with certain facts. The hardest pill to swallow is that when you win (big or small) it is luck and when you lose (small) it is skill and when you lose (big) it is your own dumb fault. That is the truth that will set you on the road to profits. I read and listened to Mark Douglas over and over. It finally sunk in. The outcome of any trade is a random event and I can not control the outcome. What caused me to enter the trade has nothing to do with the outcome of the trade. I am powerless to make the trade a winner.

The next question is how in the world can I win at trading if I can't control the outcome? Forex provides opportunities to make money 24 hours a day. Of course, some trading times are "better" than others. You can win by keeping your losses at a fixed amount and letting your winners run. I know it sounds like "old hat" but there is some wisdom in there. A pair like EURJPY moves about 30 pips an hour on average. That means, if you have 2 losing trades of 10 and one winning trade of 30, then you are winning. Sooner or later, you will catch that "monster" trade that gives you 50 pips or more. That is when you cash out for the day, shut the computer off and go relax. You must learn when to quit. Right now, I am done trading for the day after making my pip quota.

Don't let anyone intimidate you into believing you need what they are offering to be a successful trader because you don't. Do not make trading any more difficult than need be because it doesn't have to be complex. You don't need a bunch of monitors and indicators. You only need one monitor. Stop by my "C4 Scalping for Poor Traders" thread and see how I trade.

Good luck and good trading to you.
If you only trade long, then you can't always be wrong.
  • #10
  • Aug 6, 2009 4:56pm Aug 6, 2009 4:56pm
Many people talk about trading plans. It sounds like something you should do, right?

Here is the only plan you need:

Decide how much you are willing to lose per trade. That is called RISK. The maximum amount you should risk per trade is 2% of your total account size according to most experts.

Decide what your stop loss is going to be or decide what your position size is going to be. Then calculate the last piece.

RISK = STOP LOSS * POSITION SIZE

STOP LOSS = RISK / POSITION SIZE

POSITION SIZE = RISK / STOP LOSS

Decide what your entry trigger is going to be. The entry trigger does not matter. That's blasphemy but it is the truth. You can't control the outcome and the reason you entered doesn't determine the outcome. Flip a coin, it doesn't matter. No one knows what happens next.

When the trigger fires, without hesitation, enter the trade and enter your stop loss immediately.

If you have a set profit exit, enter that now.

Sit back and watch the trade. That's all you can do. You'll either stop out or take some profit. Those are the only 2 possible outcomes.

That is it. You do not need anything else.

You don't believe me? You have doubts? Then open a demo account and try it for yourself. Trade 100 trades. Only one trade allowed per hour. See how much you won or lost.
If you only trade long, then you can't always be wrong.
  • #11
  • Aug 6, 2009 5:01pm Aug 6, 2009 5:01pm
Quoting FrankenPip
The hardest pill to swallow is that when you win (big or small) it is luck and when you lose (small) it is skill and when you lose (big) it is your own dumb fault.
lol WHAT??? luck? hahah ok. it isnt luck if you knwo what you are doing. you cant predict with a 100% certainty where the price is gonna go, but you can have an educated guess on it. if your guess is right, that isnt luck. if it's wrong, get over it and do it again. if you are going into a trade with no experience, then yeah its luck. but if you at least have a semblance of a clue what you are doing, it's not luck. i'm sorry.

Quoting FrankenPip
The outcome of any trade is a random event and I can not control the outcome. What caused me to enter the trade has nothing to do with the outcome of the trade. I am powerless to make the trade a winner.
i do agree with this....to a point. the outcome is random, yes, but again, you can make a guess as to what it will be. the better your knowledge and experience, the better your guess will be. yeah yu are powerless to MAKE a trade a winner, but not to guess a winning trade.

Quoting FrankenPip
You can win by keeping your losses at a fixed amount and letting your winners run. I know it sounds like "old hat" but there is some wisdom in there.
i definitely agree with that statement. however, it's a pretty vague statement. if you have a set stop loss, that number can always be known. youre trade will always close at this point. or you will always close your trade at this point. you dont know where to close your tradwe when you let it run however. thats the hard part. its a little more subjective, but it is doable. my advice is to either move the stop up after breaks of SR, or to have a mental stop loss in your head. but yeah, not arguing against you. good point.


Quoting FrankenPip
Don't let anyone intimidate you into believing you need what they are offering to be a successful trader because you don't. Do not make trading any more difficult than need be because it doesn't have to be complex.
also agree with this. people overcomplicate trading WAY too much. keep it simple. i've said it a few times before, but the ONLY thing that you can rely on 100% of the time is your own experience. thats it. everything else can be wrong at some point. what you KNOW cant. remember that.
  • #12
  • Aug 6, 2009 6:25pm Aug 6, 2009 6:25pm
Quoting blacksun1
lol WHAT??? luck? hahah ok. it isnt luck if you knwo what you are doing. you cant predict with a 100% certainty where the price is gonna go, but you can have an educated guess on it. if your guess is right, that isnt luck. if it's wrong, get over it and do it again. if you are going into a trade with no experience, then yeah its luck. but if you at least have a semblance of a clue what you are doing, it's not luck. i'm sorry.
I stand by what I posted:

The hardest pill to swallow is that when you win (big or small) it is luck and when you lose (small) it is skill and when you lose (big) it is your own dumb fault.

My assumption is you have read the work of Mark Douglas. If that is correct then you know the outcome of any particular trade is a random event. The exact same setup can produce a winner one time and a loser the next 2 or more times in a row. And vice versa.

"Educated guess" is still a guess and that means if you guess correctly, it was a lucky guess. Let's say you and I are trading next to each other. You are making your "educated guesses" and I am tossing a coin. If we both trade in the same direction, did I get lucky? Did you? If we are not trading in the same direction and I win and you lose, did I get lucky? If we both lose, was it bad luck? If you win and I don't, was it because of anything that you did prior to entering the trade?

The only thing that you can "know what you're doing" is to size your position according to your risk and stop loss, take every trade signal from your system, enter without hesitation, and place your stops. The rest is up to the market and no one knows what it will do next.

Most money managers do not beat the market index and they get paid to "know what they are doing". What does that tell you about trading? How many of these funds have collapsed recently? What happened to all of the "educated guesses"?

It is a hard pill to swallow but the sooner you do, the more profitable you'll become. Not to mention, you'll have more time because you won't be looking at the "indicator of the day" in search of the Holy Grail.
If you only trade long, then you can't always be wrong.
  • #13
  • Aug 6, 2009 6:41pm Aug 6, 2009 6:41pm
I think it was Arnold Palmer (but I have also heard it attributed to Gary Player and Tom Watson) who said:

"It's a funny thing, the more I practice the luckier I get."

The outcome of an uncertain event is random, but do not confuse this to mean that if there are two possible outcomes then the probability of either occurring has to be 50/50. I do not believe that a trade entry is a coin toss. A roll of the dice maybe, but the job of the trader is to rig that die and weight it so your number comes up enough to squeeze the green. If you can make a profit through trade and risk management alone taking random entries like FF resident child prodigy Ronald Raygun then more power to you, but it doesn't have to be like that. Not IMO anyway.
  • #14
  • Aug 6, 2009 8:58pm Aug 6, 2009 8:58pm
Quoting birdt
I think it was Arnold Palmer (but I have also heard it attributed to Gary Player and Tom Watson) who said:

"It's a funny thing, the more I practice the luckier I get."

The outcome of an uncertain event is random, but do not confuse this to mean that if there are two possible outcomes then the probability of either occurring has to be 50/50....
That is an astute observation, Mate. However, even if the outcome were 90/10 in your favor, that does not preclude you losing on 2 or more consecutive entries. The "random walk" has the proof.
  • #15
  • Aug 6, 2009 9:02pm Aug 6, 2009 9:02pm
Quoting confusedtrdr
I've been learning and practicing trading (forex) on demo account for 3 or maybe 4 years now and still I'm not able to trade profitably, and I've tried many different strategies. What the is wrong with me? I'm not stupid. I graduated. Is it because something wrong with my trading psychology? I think so. I'm very impulsive trader - many times I just feel that I need to trade, the price is moving, so many others trade - what am I waiting for? I know it's wrong and I need to be more disciplined.

But, though I'm seeing some improvement over these...
I don't know about you, but my issue is here:

http://www.forexfactory.com/showpost...&postcount=173
The Thief of Wall Street
  • #16
  • Edited 10:26pm Aug 6, 2009 9:54pm | Edited 10:26pm
Quoting confusedtrdr
I've been learning and practicing trading (forex) on demo account for 3 or maybe 4 years now and still I'm not able to trade profitably, and I've tried many different strategies. What the is wrong with me? I'm not stupid. I graduated. Is it because something wrong with my trading psychology? I think so. I'm very impulsive trader - many times I just feel that I need to trade, the price is moving, so many others trade - what am I waiting for? I know it's wrong and I need to be more disciplined.

But, though...

You have answered your own questions.......
Same Whore .... Different Dress
  • #17
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:23am Aug 7, 2009 1:23am
Hi,

While you learn the game, you can always get some outside help - which pays as you learn!

The bottomline - decide your rules, put in a EA. That's the cure to impulsive trading.

regards.
buddy

p.s. http://www.forexfactory.com/t/187777...system--1.html
  • #18
  • Aug 7, 2009 1:29am Aug 7, 2009 1:29am
ok i think i know whats wrong with you...i suggest u to throw all the indicators from your trading tool....come down to naked trading....just use three simple tools untill u master them...



simple trendlines
pivot (daily weekly monthly)
fibs

i am attaching pivot for you...KISS(keep it simple and stupid) IS THE FORMULA
Attached File(s)
File Type: mq4 ###Auto Pivot2.mq4   16 KB | 357 downloads
  • #19
  • Aug 7, 2009 3:29am Aug 7, 2009 3:29am
I think when you find a strategy that works, and you consistently trade it, you will be confident in it. A strategy that works for me, may not work for you, and visa versa. Every man to his own.
Probability Professor
  • #20
  • Aug 7, 2009 3:32am Aug 7, 2009 3:32am
Quoting Alihuzaifa
ok i think i know whats wrong with you...i suggest u to throw all the indicators from your trading tool....come down to naked trading....just use three simple tools untill u master them...



simple trendlines
pivot (daily weekly monthly)
fibs

i am attaching pivot for you...KISS(keep it simple and stupid) IS THE FORMULA
Again, Indicators work for some, but they aren't for others. It's all how your implement these tools into your trading. I personally don't use many or any indicators apart from ATR. In different trading scenarios, some of these tools can be useful: so I think an experienced seasoned trader can use them in a smart way, without relying upon them to enter a trade.
Probability Professor
0 traders viewing now