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C4 Scalping

  • #5,081
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:39am Aug 4, 2009 11:39am
Quoting Gleneagles
Right, normally the activity will peak above 30 during one or both sessions, it is when it drops below 30 that you have to be extra careful.
I forgot to add...look at daily ATR...we are entering the summer doldrum period now, daily ranges are tapering of over this period. 30 ATR on GBPUSD is OK for now.
A small adjustment may be needed shortly.

But the main thing is to figure BSN time and try to practice a little bit of patience and discipline.
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #5,082
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:43am Aug 4, 2009 11:43am
14 trades today, all +5 pips... Cannot be true...
LWMA12 and Sm Candles on Renko, that is enough to trade and win. Great!
As I am not very fast in making charts and 14 trades is too much to show, I hereby do not post any samples. If needed, I will

P.S. My 15th and last scalp ended also with +5. It was a long way to go - trade lasted 2 hours and 1 minute...
  • #5,083
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:44am Aug 4, 2009 11:44am
Quoting Yidrasil
Jazz, yes, I know thanks (I have the overlaid Trix). My post was aimed at stimulating discussion on the topic, especially from the more experienced traders.

I find myself in somthing of a dichotomy at the moment whereby I have settled into entering on the close of an MA-crossing candle (Edge has today confirmed the candle doesn't have to cross which was useful). On the other hand, those posting C4 charts of successful trades are often taking entries a candle or more after the signal candle has closed (letting PA develop presumably). I'm therefore...
I think that it is best to let the trades come to you first and foremost. I would rather have 1-2 very good setups than just trade multiple setups as per a mechanical signal. The use of SM Scalper candles is quite useful as I can easily ascertain if I am at least in the right direction with a touch of momentum in support. The HMA acts as my 'trend' confirmation and potential SL barrier. A quick check of ATR lets me know if sufficient range is supplied to warrant placing a trade expecting a goal of +5 plus spread.

Just takes 'seat' time is all.

I cannot stress enough how gaining any measure of C4 proficiency at all will make the transition into Nitro seamless and quite enjoyable. However, others should be warned that this is an apples to oranges comparison. You cannot trade one off of, or in conjunction with, the other.

Regards.
  • #5,084
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:44am Aug 4, 2009 11:44am
Quoting Gleneagles
GBPUSD 30M

1) First session 06H00-10H00 GMT
2) Second session 10H00-16H00 GMT

ATR (2) horizontal line set at 30 pips

Just to take up on the ATR discussion again.
You will see VERY few trades that I will post that fall in the period where ATR is below 30 pips on this pair.
Anything below 30 pips is either consolidation or a period before or after trend change...same effect...risky.

You can just change to 5M TF and change horizontal line to 10-15 pips and see the same pattern.
I don't get how you are using ATR.
Is the red horizontal line in bottom window the one set at 30 pips? And how do you set it at 30? And is this a different number for each pair?
What tf is the chart? Does the ATR number change as tf changes?
Lots of questions, I know but I have not used ATR in the past.
******************* I'd rather make money than be right.
  • #5,085
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:48am Aug 4, 2009 11:48am
Quoting Indrek
14 trades today, all +5 pips... Cannot be true...
LWMA12 and Sm Candles on Renko, that is enough to trade and win. Great!
As I am not very good in making charts and 14 trades is too much to show, I hereby do not post any samples. If needed, I will
Very nice indeed. Original simplicity at work. Glad to see you are getting a better grasp on the +5 thing. I realize that it is a difficult concept for a swing trader to grasp.

It is the 'unscramble scrambled eggs' quandary at work.

Highest Regards.
  • #5,086
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:48am Aug 4, 2009 11:48am
...

Hello Edge,

First time posting on this thread. Have not read the entire thread yet, but have read the first 30 or so pages and have tried to keep up to date with the latest posts. Have gone over page 1 numerous times, so think I'm familiar enough with the method to at least give it a try.

Here's a snapshot of my AUD/USD trades today to give an idea of my entry and exit timing. Basically just followed the rules. Waited for MA to change colour, then enter when TRIX changes colour. Trying to focus on proficiency at entering/exiting the trades and not worrying about P/L. I just press F9, and hit buy or sell.

I do get an error when I try to input SL and TP values, "price too close to market", so I just leave those fields blank. Once the trade has been entered, I keep an eye on price and exit when TP is reached. Sometimes, I can MODIFY the order and put in 5 pips TP, sometimes not.

No stoploss set, but exited trades when TRIX or MA changed colour again.

Winning percentage around 50%, but early days. -80pips for the day out of 20 trades between 11am and 3pm GMT, despite what the pic. says.

:-)

Just one question if I may. On page one, after you set out the primer and detonator requirements, (MA and TRIX), you later say the following:

"Note: Make sure you install the smsuper trix v.1 as this will allow the PV type trix indi's to operate on your platform. Also, TURN OFF ALL ALARMS!! (Tools, Options, Events, uncheck the 'enable box'."

...

I'm not sure what this means. I've already installed the smSuperTRIXPV4Col. Should I have TWO TRIX indicators installed?

Thanks.




...

http://www.ukonlinewholesalers.com/i...C4Practise.JPG

...
  • #5,087
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:54am Aug 4, 2009 11:54am
Edge, can you take a look at this chart and tell me if it is within the guidelines to take trades after the first or second candle above or below the MA. In this instance, would you take the trade on the first red candle only (which crosses the MA) or take the second or third candle if you missed the first?

BTW, this morning I made 5 trades using the C4, had 4 in the money and one loss (only because the PA missed my TP by 1 pip then reversed!). Net = 26 pips.

Thank you edge and the other experienced traders here for sharing your experiences with guys like me that are only into Forex a few months. I have learned a lot on this thread!
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  • #5,088
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:56am Aug 4, 2009 11:56am
Quoting 4xStar
I don't get how you are using ATR.
Is the red horizontal line in bottom window the one set at 30 pips? And how do you set it at 30? And is this a different number for each pair?
What tf is the chart? Does the ATR number change as tf changes?
Lots of questions, I know but I have not used ATR in the past.
No problem,

ATR or average trading range will simply tell you the range of the candles (high minus low) or size if you wish. Normally low trading activity reflects via small candles...right? So by monitoring the candle sizes over a period and acting on any changes...increase or decrease...we can time our market exposure to coincide with peak activity.

It simply puts the odds in our favor.

The 30 pip line I added under inputs..levels.... as .0030. If the graph breaks above 30, the average length of candle is bigger than 30 for the period set on the indi.

It is best to set upthe indi to get a feel for it and see what it does.

Yes, the settings need to change for different pairs because trading ranges are different.
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #5,089
  • Aug 4, 2009 11:57am Aug 4, 2009 11:57am
Quoting Edgetrader
Very nice indeed. Original simplicity at work. Glad to see you are getting a better grasp on the +5 thing. I realize that it is a difficult concept for a swing trader to grasp.

It is the 'unscramble scrambled eggs' quandary at work.

Highest Regards.
It is difficult, especially the part with risk-reward ratio... But at the same time, for a swing trader it is morally easier to set bigger SL I have had even 100 pips for GU when aiming also 100 pips per trade.
Today I divided my day - in the morning had 5 bigger-pip trades and then scalped.
  • #5,090
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:02pm Aug 4, 2009 12:02pm
Quoting Gleneagles
No problem,

ATR or average trading range will simply tell you the range of the candles (high minus low) or size if you wish. Normally low trading activity reflects via small candles...right? So by monitoring the candle sizes over a period and acting on any changes...increase or decrease...we can time our market exposure to coincide with peak activity.

It simply puts the odds in our favor.

The 30 pip line I added under inputs..levels.... as .0030. If the graph breaks above 30, the average length of candle is bigger than 30 for the period set...
OK .. thanks for that. I also have an indi,, ATR in Pips and a while back someone mentioned using 2 different periods for that, a short and a long one, as a way of measuring if activity is increasing. Could that work instead of using the line indicator?
How did you know to put in .0030 for a 30 pip line? I tried doing that under levels on the 5 min and nothing showed up, on the 15 & 1 hour it does show up .. but how did you know to use that number?
And should the period number always be set to the default 14?
******************* I'd rather make money than be right.
  • #5,091
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:03pm Aug 4, 2009 12:03pm
Quoting Edgetrader
Am going to simply use one of 'Gleneagles' chart shots as a general guide in C4 trading here.

If you wish, take the time to review as many chart shots as he chooses to provide. All have the appearance of showing one thing in common, patience!
I notice how it is routinely displayed how he allows PA to 'develop' somewhat before initiating a trade. It may seem as though these are late entries, but we are talking about 'noisy' candlesticks here.

Let the trade come to you, do not trade C4 by mechanical means alone.

Regards.
Think this is a good thing to point out.
After all we are not trying to capture the Whole move , just a small portion of it.
Taking the middle out of a few 30 to 50 pip swings a day is all the doctor ordered.
A BIG factor in posting a very high hit rate as well.

Think about how Edge has described what he is doing..
Large lot size/ for smaller pip wins /using a High hit rate method....

For those not set in the method yet, Quit changing your charts around every day, focus on the base chart as given and trade it relentlessly for 2 weeks.
Forget about who is using which magic indicator,
IT is NOT the indicator on the chart it is the One between your ears that matters.
Give your brain the time to learn the dance that is unfolding before you instead of changing the tune every other day.

(lol.. there are only probably 10, 000 indicators posted around for mt4, what you gonna do? go through all of them?)

Take notes on all your trades. good and bad.
If you do that you will be on your way to surviving and be ahead of the other 90% that never will.....

In 2 weeks time you will be a changed trader...
As Edge said earlier,, FOCUS.

Gleneagles makes it look easy doesn't he...
He has probably already accepted the conditions by which he is trading .
My goal is to join him there.
  • #5,092
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:04pm Aug 4, 2009 12:04pm
Also I am playing with the settings and trying to make it look like it does on your chart, but so far I cannot duplicate it. Either tf is off or period # is off, I think.
******************* I'd rather make money than be right.
  • #5,093
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:06pm Aug 4, 2009 12:06pm
Quoting takingthepip
...

Hello Edge,

First time posting on this thread. Have not read the entire thread yet, but have read the first 30 or so pages and have tried to keep up to date with the latest posts. Have gone over page 1 numerous times, so think I'm familiar enough with the method to at least give it a try.

Here's a snapshot of my AUD/USD trades today to give an idea of my entry and exit timing. Basically just followed the rules. Waited for MA to change colour, then enter when TRIX changes colour. Trying to focus on proficiency at entering/exiting the trades...
It is nothing other than a failsafe. Originally, some older CPU's were having trouble with the SM PV deals due to the power needed to operate such. The standard V1 is just a filter to ensure the PV operates correctly.

Also, nice work on train wrecking efforts. It gets better as you keep plowing forward.

Regards.
  • #5,094
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:10pm Aug 4, 2009 12:10pm
Quoting Duitman
Edge, can you take a look at this chart and tell me if it is within the guidelines to take trades after the first or second candle above or below the MA. In this instance, would you take the trade on the first red candle only (which crosses the MA) or take the second or third candle if you missed the first?

BTW, this morning I made 5 trades using the C4, had 4 in the money and one loss (only because the PA missed my TP by 1 pip then reversed!). Net = 26 pips.

Thank you edge and the other experienced traders here for sharing your experiences...
I like the PA to develop most of the time. As such, I would let a candle close and let it move around a bit. Ever notice how most 'new' 5m candles like to retrace before resuming direction? Patience.

Regards.
  • #5,095
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:20pm Aug 4, 2009 12:20pm
Hi,

just to let Edge know that there are probably more people trying this then have posted here are my results for today, which is the first day that i have really set time aside and did my checks before taking trades. It seems patience does pay off after all. 5 trades all winners.

Many thanks for the idea and the continued effort to get the message across regarding discipline and that less is more.

Fredella
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  • #5,096
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:21pm Aug 4, 2009 12:21pm
Quoting Gleneagles
GBPUSD 30M

1) First...
Great stuff Glen, thanks....
  • #5,097
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:22pm Aug 4, 2009 12:22pm
Quoting Edgetrader
It is nothing other than a failsafe. Originally, some older CPU's were having trouble with the SM PV deals due to the power needed to operate such. The standard V1 is just a filter to ensure the PV operates correctly.

Also, nice work on train wrecking efforts. It gets better as you keep plowing forward.

Regards.
Thanks for the clarification. Will 'soldier on', and see if I can improve my performance. One thing I've noticed. Sometimes there's a nice oscillating PA and the turning point can almost be visualised, but the TRIX signals too late. However, sometimes it triggers a little earlier, just after the turn. Maybe those are the higher probability trades.

Anyway, I'll continue to take every trade that comes, to increase proficiency at entry/exit, and analyse results afterwards.

...
  • #5,098
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:23pm Aug 4, 2009 12:23pm
Quoting 4xStar
OK .. thanks for that. I also have an indi,, ATR in Pips and a while back someone mentioned using 2 different periods for that, a short and a long one, as a way of measuring if activity is increasing. Could that work instead of using the line indicator?
How did you know to put in .0030 for a 30 pip line? I tried doing that under levels on the 5 min and nothing showed up, on the 15 & 1 hour it does show up .. but how did you know to use that number?
And should the period number always be set to the default 14?
Yes, you can drag another ATR indi into your existing one and set one up as " fast" and one as "slow" ATR eg. 5 and 25. The crossover of the fast over the slow line will also indicate a change in trading range, much like MA cross.

The number .0030 is the correct setting for 30 pips.

All the pairs have different trading ranges, it is best to look at average daily trading ranges and set a value based on a % of that range.

Default period set at 14 simply means that the average trading range of past 14 candles will be indicated.

If you want to act on any change in market activity, it is too slow, you need a smaller, faster acting number eg 2 or 3.
" Never let the past hold the future to ransom "
  • #5,099
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:47pm Aug 4, 2009 12:47pm
Hello

Look what i did...

I sand you 2 charts...
First one is 5 min chart with candles set 7.2.1.1

And that MA 8 and MA 48

Second chart is 15 min chart

I put in there MTF 0 time frame setings 3.1.1.1
Below that MTF 30min TF setings 3.1.1.1
Bellow that MTF $h TF setings 2.1.1.1

Below is that Stoch..it is helpfull sometimes ....i will keep it...

Ok now...when i cheked this visialy only not thru the trades it looket that almost one can play with 30TP and lets say 60SL...but it was not so often that we touched that SL

You can check it buy your self...

My question acc to this is next..

What do you think on this settings and please explain me when i look at those MTFs and we have arraow lets say on 14.30....

Is it static arow or it can repaint after next half h...lets say

By the way..those 2 attacehd charts are one below another on my pc and i am keepin an eye on it that way

My rules are

Entry when that mtf 0 tf and that mtf 30 tf are same color...that 4h mtf is just for trend ...

Those emas are just there ...looking still how they can help me...

Please check that one bad trade at 13.40h...how i can manage to miss that?

My opinion acc to that MTF and 5 min sinchronisation is that mtf lets say have an arrow on 13.30-13.45 that is entry on 5 min chart at 13.55 - 14.00h bar

Dont know if it is the same with 30 min MTF and 4 h mtf?

Please check it when you find time

Caos

Charts are in the next post...sorry if i miss tread..coos we are speaking here only about some other staff
Work smart not hard
  • #5,100
  • Aug 4, 2009 12:49pm Aug 4, 2009 12:49pm
Hi
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Work smart not hard
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