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What lengths have you taken in trading

  • #21
  • Jun 5, 2009 3:04pm Jun 5, 2009 3:04pm
Quoting markmm
I hear this figure bandied about all the time but I think its a generalisation.
General; I have a Sensation: I think I am Going Long; But only by 2%... 3%... 5%... F$%^ 80% I'm in so deep that only Devine Intervention could extract me.

Rules used by others that you may not be aware of...

Bemac's 30/8 rule.

30% of Account exposed to Margin/Market {including Stop Loss}

8% OF THE 30% exposed to any One Market.

Futures:
Options:
Indicies:
Grains
Softs
Meats
Metals
Exotics
Currencies
Hards {Lumber, Copper etc.}

So... What does all this $hit mean?
Let's start here....
30% * 8% = 2.4%
In Each Market.
Forex = 2.4% Risk
Commodities = 2.4% Risk
Options = 2.4% Risk
to an accumulative Total of 30%

I've used this Rule for 15 years &, so far, it hasn't failed me yet.

Diversify your Trading.
  • #22
  • Jun 5, 2009 3:27pm Jun 5, 2009 3:27pm
Quoting Bemac
General; I have a Sensation: I think I am Going Long; But only by 2%... 3%... 5%... F$%^ 80%...
Great rule, im only in forex (im a wean compared to you in trading 6 months) and keep my % at 2-3% at any one time. Kept me in long enough (6 months) to find the real golden threads in here, and J16 PF.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #23
  • Jun 5, 2009 4:34pm Jun 5, 2009 4:34pm
Quoting pipmyride
I'm in need of inspiration ...

I am in the biggest rut in my 30+ year life

HOWEVER, i have a family, a wife, kid and mortgage to look after and the steady income of a rat-race job is the only security in meeting those needs.

Thanks for listening ...

pipmyride...the best way to make the transition to a professional status is to go professional. That would require you first and foremost to maintain what you've already achieved (your house, happiness of your family,etc.) and become better on that basis.

So my suggestion would be to apply for a job as a professional trader at a company where you get paid a base salary as an employee as well as a cut on the profit you make.
That will be a litmus test for you to measure if you have arrived at a level where you can place trading as your primary profession. Additionally, your family will be protected and even more supportive to see you in a "normal" job and you can see if you like what it takes without jeapardizing anything.

Good luck to you.
& keep us posted.
Hear the music before the song is over ...
  • #24
  • Jun 5, 2009 4:59pm Jun 5, 2009 4:59pm
Get a 2nd or 3rd shift job. I did, and now I can trade 'full time' even though i'm not living off of it. It's just a nice environment so that whenver i decide to do it full time, i know how it is. then again, why not keep doing both?
  • #25
  • Jun 5, 2009 5:23pm Jun 5, 2009 5:23pm
Quoting pipmyride
I will say that i am in an office IT job , which pays well, so its not merely the money, i make enough steady income but its simply that the work no longer inspires me, or motivates me.
Do you mean the trading activity provides you the excitment you don't get in your job anymore?
  • #26
  • Jun 5, 2009 7:05pm Jun 5, 2009 7:05pm
Quoting markmm
I hear this figure bandied about all the time but I think its a generalisation.
I'm sure it is, and unless we can find a friendly and accommodating broker to spill the beans, or give FF members a shot of sodium pentothal, all we can do is guess, I guess

2 in every hundred consistently profitable? I dunno, even that sounds a bit high to me!
  • #27
  • Jun 5, 2009 7:19pm Jun 5, 2009 7:19pm
Quoting pipmutt
I'm sure it is, and unless we can find a friendly and accommodating broker to spill the beans, or give FF members a shot of sodium pentothal, all we can do is guess, I guess

2 in every hundred consistently profitable? I dunno, even that sounds a bit high to me!
True, when you put it that way.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #28
  • Jun 5, 2009 8:57pm Jun 5, 2009 8:57pm
If possible, can you get extended leave from your job? Say, about a month? Tell them you need it for personal reasons, sick Aunt in Timbuktu or something a little more believable.

If so, you have left that door open and given yourself enough time to figure this s**t out!!

Seems like a chickens way out, but since you have family obligations I really couldnt recommend anything else.
non si dimentichi mai
  • #29
  • Jun 6, 2009 8:24am Jun 6, 2009 8:24am
Am kinda in the same predicament too. i work with an insurance firm but ever since i discovered forex trading about two years ago, it became my passion and i would love to trade for a living. however, i am under no illusion as to how difficult that decision may turn out to be so what i did was to take an extended leave of absence for three months and use that period to have a taste of what trading full time entails. this should help me in taking a decision later in future. you might want to take that route too cos ditching a job in this era of economic recession might not be too prudent especially with the family obligations.

kind regards
  • #30
  • Jun 6, 2009 8:35am Jun 6, 2009 8:35am
Why not trade daily TF? You can trade and work. Until you get enough to quit, i.e. no mortgage and 1 year living money.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #31
  • Jun 6, 2009 10:45am Jun 6, 2009 10:45am
Pip my ride

You are wasting your time looking for the answer on this and any other trading forum.

Fact: 95 out of every 100 who has ever posted here will never make it as a full time trader.

Fact: 95 out of every 100 threads here is littered with useless information. It's like the blind leading the blind.

The best piece of trading information I have picked up from here is "To become a successful trader you need a successful mentor"

Easier said than done though. To find a geniune, successful trader/mentor is very hard to find. Its taken me 4 years to find that individual.

Far to many half-wit, wannabe, know it all's posting here.

I'm still yet to find out whether what I have been taught I can actually put into practise and whether it suits my personality.

All the best
  • #32
  • Jun 6, 2009 4:28pm Jun 6, 2009 4:28pm
Quoting Bemac

I've used this Rule for 15 years &, so far, it hasn't failed me yet.

Diversify your Trading.
I did not think that mattered for the longest time - till fairly recently.

It matters. It matters.
I'm pretty much done with all this ...
  • #33
  • Jun 6, 2009 6:30pm Jun 6, 2009 6:30pm
Pipmyride:

A lot said here is true and applicable. I second:
- More time won't necesarily increase profits.
- Trading full time to put bread on table leads to trading decisions under pressure - been there, done that.
- Have enough money / means / deep diversified pockets to allow you to live for months without income.
- Have as low as possible fixed monthly debit orders.
- Find a mentor is very difficult but good way to go.
- Trading must become another job and not your source of adrenalin rush.

You did a great thing by starting this thread as there are many in this position.

I am still learning and discovering and trying to perfect trading which is a passion which will become "another job"

All the best mate!
  • #34
  • Jun 6, 2009 7:15pm Jun 6, 2009 7:15pm
I'm back from the brink.. I too thought trading fulltime would allow me to make more pips. I was doing great while working fulltime.. so I would do even better trading fulltime right? Nope. There is a huge mental shift that comes... and turns out I was undercapitalized to do this also.

This caused major trouble in many areas of life... If you are undercaptialized or under pressure to trade and make $... I don't care who you are... it's tough. I'm known in my business as a very stoic tough minded, consistent person... BUT.. when push comes to shove... I got hit hard.

Fortunately, I've learned from it all, and now back to making more pips than I was making before!... while working fulltime. I simplified my setups, and had code written to simply send me a text message when my setup came and also only used orders to make trades.... so I spend almost no time in front of the computer except to move my s/l and check every couple hours how a trade is doing... 902 pips this week..... NOW I'M ENJOYING LIFE... great job, with a huge second income

Be careful out there all.
DireXiv Make it happen, no one else is going to do it for you...
  • #35
  • Jun 6, 2009 7:43pm Jun 6, 2009 7:43pm
Quoting Tornado
Pip my ride

You are wasting your time looking for the answer on this and any other trading forum.

Fact: 95 out of every 100 who has ever posted here will never make it as a full time trader.

Fact: 95 out of every 100 threads here is littered with useless information. It's like the blind leading the blind.

The best piece of trading information I have picked up from here is "To become a successful trader you need a successful mentor"

Easier said than done though. To find a geniune, successful trader/mentor...
FACT: Facts are usually presented with evidence.
FACT: You are not a trader.
Economists have forecast 9 out of the last 5 recessions
  • #36
  • Jun 6, 2009 8:33pm Jun 6, 2009 8:33pm
Quoting pipmyride
I'm in need of inspiration ...

I am in the biggest rut in my 30+ year life and my dreams of trading for a living is within arms reach, but that reach is only slowly getting closer.

While i am profitable, i am not overly so, yet i am supremely confident in my abilities and the knowledge that if i could dedicate more of my time to analysis of trades that i could be quite successful.

HOWEVER, i have a family, a wife, kid and mortgage to look after and the steady income of a rat-race job is the only security in meeting those needs.

I am on...
I was where you are a short time ago. I took a short cut and stood on the shoulders of an experienced trader who showed me the bigger picture. Forex trading does not have to be a 24/7 deal. Trading on the bigger time frames means you can keep your job, family and sanity.
  • #37
  • Jun 6, 2009 8:38pm Jun 6, 2009 8:38pm
Quoting Tornado
Pip my ride



The best piece of trading information I have picked up from here is "To become a successful trader you need a successful mentor"

Easier said than done though. To find a geniune, successful trader/mentor is very hard to find. Its taken me 4 years to find that individual.



All the best
Try Jacko and James16. Two of the best in forex and right here on this forum.
  • #38
  • Jun 6, 2009 11:23pm Jun 6, 2009 11:23pm
Hi Pipmyride

I know you're looking for encouragement so I won't explain why you won't succeed if you quit your job at this stage, the others before me have explained well.

I would like to second Hilmys idea of getting a shift job whose hours don't coincide with when you want to trade. So you can trade full-time, and pay the bills, and won't stress about your family. I'm a bit biased towards this idea bcos this is essentially what I'm doing.

If you're serious enough, treat forex like a business and not a game, have other sources of income while you build your equity, I'm sure you'll do great.

Good luck!
  • #39
  • Jun 7, 2009 2:24am Jun 7, 2009 2:24am
You need to prove yourself before jumping full time. When you have done that do it - before that, prove it to yourself. If you can't do it while working, you can't do it later. The emotional pressure for having to make certain amount of money will crush you.

If you can't trade higher timeframes meaning d1+ (I would recommend that option) while working, then it's good idea to get leave for some months and see if you can really do it. Emotional pressure is weaker because you can always return to work but reward is as high because you still have an option to quiet from your work if you want to.

Also selling you house and trading that money before you have proven yourself to yourself is almost a financial suicide. Don't do it.

I'm not sure how big account you have already blew but IMHO it's part of growing as a trader. I did blow up a bigger account than most people here trade 2 times before I was ready to admit that I had to take this dead seriously. Why did I say this? Because you might end up blowing money you got from your house and it's gonna be lot harder to get back on your feet from that.

Also do a simulation on your account growth based on your recent realized trade history (I hope you ahve at least 6 months of data) on excel to see how much money you would make on monthly basis. Don't do excuses like "if I would be fulltime I would do better". You might but on the other hand you might not. That's one way to see could you make it or not.

As you are IT professional you might want to build some personal automated models as well. Testing zillions of models and after years of testing and finally building my own models was the point for me where I got really profitable.
  • #40
  • Jun 7, 2009 2:35am Jun 7, 2009 2:35am
you've got a lot of good replies here

I also want to add that you should read Mark Douglas.

Trading success = method + money management + mindset

It's easy to find a good method and learn good money management. But only consistently successful traders have the right mindset.
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