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Looking for the Worst EAs

  • #1
  • First Post: Edited Jun 26, 2014 10:38am Feb 13, 2009 8:22am | Edited Jun 26, 2014 10:38am
m
  • #2
  • Feb 13, 2009 9:16am Feb 13, 2009 9:16am
My worst EA =D
Attached File(s)
File Type: mq4 Losing EA.mq4   11 KB | 1,098 downloads
  • #3
  • Feb 13, 2009 9:35am Feb 13, 2009 9:35am
Harooki,

What might even work better than a bad EA is a bad trader. Think about it. If you could sit down next to the worlds worst trader (who would trade on a demo account) and do the exact opposite of what he/she does (on a live account), you should make money consistently. The reason why this will work much better than an EA is because the human trader will trade with emotions, but the EA will not. This is where you could use fear and greed to your advantage. In a sense, you would be acting like a bucket shop broker and taking the opposite side of each trade. But, in order to make it work, I think it would have to be a real trader, not a novice or someone who knows nothing about trading, since at that point you might as well flip a coin and use that as your guide for trade direction.

Slade
  • #4
  • Feb 13, 2009 10:10am Feb 13, 2009 10:10am
It will never work taking the opposite side of an EA or human. The reason for such failure is the constant whipsaws. You'll get just as whipped on the opposite side imo.

todd
  • #5
  • Feb 13, 2009 10:23am Feb 13, 2009 10:23am
One word....stupid! Just because a buy signal might be given by the EA doesn't mean that one should sell, and vice versa. Also, one still has to backtest and optimize...

bad idea!
  • #6
  • Edited 1:28pm Feb 13, 2009 1:17pm | Edited 1:28pm
Quoting harooki2
I'm working on some trading research that could turn some miserable systems into big winners. If anyone has an EA that is a CONSISTENT loser in a 15-min to 4-hr environment and can share it with me, I would appreciate it. Just post your EA (it must work properly but be a loser) and I will apply my recovery strategy to it.

This is not a joke (though it sounds like it), and I'm not trying to scam anyone. I have no financial motivation for doing this, except for my personal trading. If I benefit from it, I will share the results with you individually...
Just open trades every 1 min bar with equal and low sl and tp (for example 10 pips) and statistically the method must lose because of spread.

edit: Example loser attached, this is loser even on daily. Good luck. (Alpari = 5 point version, change sl & tp to 10 if you want to have 4 point version).
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: loser.gif Size: 10 KB
Attached File(s)
File Type: mq4 mikko_test.mq4   < 1 KB | 898 downloads
  • #7
  • Feb 13, 2009 2:26pm Feb 13, 2009 2:26pm
um, if trading were as easy as finding the "worst trader" than everyone would be rich. your idea has been around since trading started.

Quoting slade
Harooki,

What might even work better than a bad EA is a bad trader. Think about it. If you could sit down next to the worlds worst trader (who would trade on a demo account) and do the exact opposite of what he/she does (on a live account), you should make money consistently. The reason why this will work much better than an EA is because the human trader will trade with emotions, but the EA will not. This is where you could use fear and greed to your advantage. In a sense, you would be acting like a bucket shop broker and taking the opposite...
  • #8
  • Feb 13, 2009 4:07pm Feb 13, 2009 4:07pm
Quoting harooki2
I'm working on some trading research that could turn some miserable systems into big winners. If anyone has an EA that is a CONSISTENT loser in a 15-min to 4-hr environment and can share it with me, I would appreciate it. Just post your EA (it must work properly but be a loser) and I will apply my recovery strategy to it.

This is not a joke (though it sounds like it), and I'm not trying to scam anyone. I have no financial motivation for doing this, except for my personal trading. If I benefit from it, I will share the results with you individually...
Initiation In Progress:
if i {we} fail; all we have to do is the inverse.

Next phase. {usually} Numerous Q's about Indicators and their worth.

Save some time & Research {on the web} PA ("price action") ("support +resistance")
That's the Base. Period.
Don't waste Time or Money thinking you can Trade Against the 95 {or so} %.

Like any business...
When the CEO loses His Focus...
... They Fucus...

Ce la Vie.
  • #9
  • Feb 13, 2009 10:42pm Feb 13, 2009 10:42pm
that's easy - get any ea and try to improve it (real hard)
when you mess it up - it almost not working - you good to go
  • #10
  • Feb 13, 2009 10:59pm Feb 13, 2009 10:59pm
Sometime back FxClub had one competition...loose to win....those who loose most will get award...and surprise...most people made big money instead of loosing
  • #11
  • Feb 13, 2009 11:38pm Feb 13, 2009 11:38pm
Quoting harooki2
I'm working on some trading research that could turn some miserable systems into big winners. If anyone has an EA that is a CONSISTENT loser in a 15-min to 4-hr environment and can share it with me, I would appreciate it. Just post your EA (it must work properly but be a loser) and I will apply my recovery strategy to it.

This is not a joke (though it sounds like it), and I'm not trying to scam anyone. I have no financial motivation for doing this, except for my personal trading. If I benefit from it, I will share the results with you individually...
I hope you must be kidding
  • #12
  • Feb 14, 2009 12:13am Feb 14, 2009 12:13am
Now that's refreshing another one who thinks you can reverse something that is not symmetrical.
Like no one in a hundred years did come up with that one.
  • #13
  • Feb 14, 2009 10:49am Feb 14, 2009 10:49am
Quoting tdion
um, if trading were as easy as finding the "worst trader" than everyone would be rich. your idea has been around since trading started.
I did not use the word "easy." That was your word. And yes, this is not a new idea, and it has been around since trading started. How do you think alot of retail forex brokers make money (besides collecting spreads)? Take the opposite side of traders who will reliably and consistently lose money.

In effect, what you are saying is that if I could set up a forex casino and invite the retail public to come in and trade against me (assuming I was very well capitalized) and I was the counter party to each and every trade that was made in my casino - excluding spread - that my forex casino would go broke? If you are correct...than how do retail forex brokers stay in business? Why wouldn't all those traders be able to consistently make money in the spot forex market?

The reason that this would work is because most live traders will cut their winners short and hold on to their losers, will not consistently trade the same system over time, and will employ position sizing techniques and money management strategies that will work against them in the long run.

And by the way....this system is currently in use and people do make money trading exactly the way I described.

Slade
  • #14
  • Edited 8:09pm Feb 14, 2009 12:38pm | Edited 8:09pm
everything you just said is common knowledge. DUH what do you think a bucket shop is, anyway?

you go out and find that worst trader in the world, slade. just don't be surprised if they suddenly become the best trader in the world while you are taking the opposite of their positions.

i swear, the theoretical chit chat on these boards is comical at times.

Quoting slade
I did not use the word "easy." That was your word. And yes, this is not a new idea, and it has been around since trading started. How do you think alot of retail forex brokers make money (besides collecting spreads)? Take the opposite side of traders who will reliably and consistently lose money.

In effect, what you are saying is that if I could set up a forex casino and invite the retail public to come in and trade against me (assuming I was very well capitalized) and I was the counter party to each and every trade that was made in my casino...
  • #15
  • Feb 14, 2009 7:47pm Feb 14, 2009 7:47pm
The worst ever EA is the one that gives you same number of winers and loosers. And I do supose stronger ad stronger, that most of EA gives such result, and rest is outside of a reach of my wallet yet
[not becae of their price as they are free, but cause of their drawdow...]
  • #16
  • Feb 15, 2009 5:49am Feb 15, 2009 5:49am
Quoting tdion
everything you just said is common knowledge. DUH what do you think a bucket shop is, anyway?

you go out and find that worst trader in the world, slade. just don't be surprised if they suddenly become the best trader in the world while you are taking the opposite of their positions.

i swear, the theoretical chit chat on these boards is comical at times.

So then we are in agreement? You caved in pretty quickly.

And by the way...I would be VERY surprised if any trader became the best trader in the world (or even just a great trader) during the course of his or her life time. The odds are overwhelmingly against that taking place.

Glad that I could provide some comic relief for you while you are in your serious quest to become a successful trader.

Slade
  • #17
  • Feb 15, 2009 6:47am Feb 15, 2009 6:47am
Some thoughts on the approach 'take a losing system, and just reverse the signals':

First of all, as I see it, there are two very easy ways to get a consistent losing system:

- Furious overtrading, you lose all your money quickly due to paying the spread.
- Risking 100% of the account size per trade. A single losing trade wipes out your account completely, no matter how much money you have made so far. All martingale systems fall into this category, because at some point (after a long losing streak) the risk per trade approaches 100% of your available money. Then just one last losing trade, and your trading career is finished. The only way to win with a martingale system would be to have infinite money. But then I would have no need for trading, and would rather enjoy life on my private caribbean island...

For obvious reasons, these two approaches cannot be reversed. Or, more precisely: The direct reverse of these 'systems' is not what we want:

- The direct reverse system to overtrading would be 'Become a broker, and cash in the spread that the overtrading guys pay you'. Obviously a sure winning system.
- The direct reverse system to 'insane risk per trade' would be 'Risk 0% of your account per trade'. The result would be 'No matter how much losing trades you have, you will never lose your account' (but also not make any money...)

So lets try something else:

Is there a system which loses money consistently under the following restrictions? a) No overtrading, so that spread payments won't matter too much. Lets say, a maximum of 1 or 2 trades/day. b) Reasonable risk per trade, lets say we risk a maximum of 1% per trade.

Under these assumptions, it should be possible to get a winning system by just reversing the signals of a certain losing system. It must be sure that we consistently lose more money than just the spread per trade by applying the losing system.

I tried to construct such a system, and it proved very hard to find such a thing. Furthermore, there are a lot of traders who apply these two rules (no overtrading and low risk per trade) very disciplined, and who manage to barely trade 'break-even'.

What are my conclusions from these observations? The ugly word 'random walk' comes to my mind...
  • #18
  • Feb 17, 2009 11:00am Feb 17, 2009 11:00am
Quoting Bemac
Don't waste Time or Money...
from someone wich is your 'buddy' (i think) talking about the same approach the op wish to use:

"...Account more than doubled in less than 45 days. Draw Down 1.34%,
avg win well above avg loss, win rate over 80%. over 450 trades now with 60 sets..."
  • #19
  • Feb 18, 2009 3:53am Feb 18, 2009 3:53am
If you feel like wasting your time, martingale is terrible, however trying oposit is timewasting... [I did :]
  • #20
  • Last Post: Feb 20, 2009 9:19am Feb 20, 2009 9:19am
more than 24h. I can't correct my previous post.
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