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4H 5EMA System

  • #2,721
  • Jan 21, 2009 3:47am Jan 21, 2009 3:47am
Quoting alright
...this system is based on price action around support and resistance. If you think about this, it will be easier to understand the way you move your stops.
  • #2,722
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:01am Jan 21, 2009 4:01am
Quoting tonirai
Hope you're not taking the piss, toni!
Joking apart, even after reading it many times it took me a while to put it into practice and then all of a sudden I saw the light
  • #2,723
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:03am Jan 21, 2009 4:03am
Thanks once again for the quick responses I am getting a better view now (I think) and the S&R tip is useful to help the way one thinks. I have tried again below to summarise, changed from Bar 3 Close onwards.

Bar 1 - LONG at High of Previous bar (Long signal bar), LONG STOP order at Low of Previous bar (Long signal bar).

Bar 1 Close - SELL LIMIT order at Low of Previous bar (Long signal bar) - Same level as LONG STOP order.

Bar 2 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 1.

Bar 2 Close - As it’s a new Long signal bar - SHORT STOP order moved from the High of Bar 1 to the High of Bar 2 and also added a BUY LIMIT order at the High of Bar 2.

Bar 3 - STOPPED OUT OF SHORT and now LONG. LONG STOP order at Low of Bar 2.

Bar 3 Close - LONG STOP order left at Low of Bar 2 (as Bar 3 is not a new set up bar), SELL LIMIT order at the Low of Bar 2 (because that was the last set up bar).

Bar 4 - No action, no new set up bar, still in LONG.

Bar 5 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 4.


On Close of Bar 5 - Currently open and made a new low (so new set up bar). I assume that when this bar closes (assuming it wont take out the Bar 4 High) I move my SHORT STOP order from the High of Bar 4 to the High of Bar 5. And I also introduce a BUY LIMIT order at the same level.


Comments appreciated and I will update on close of this next bar too.


W
  • #2,724
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:13am Jan 21, 2009 4:13am
Quoting alright
About the daily TF which looks terrific from the latest posts, I'm sure you did run a back test with your settings. In this case, do you mind posting your results?
Hi Alright,
I did thorough backtesting using 4 hr rules and the results were comparable with the 4 hr - slightly down but more than compensated for by the minimal maintenance and comparable draw downs. Stop losses are higher; current stop loss after yesterday's big move is 629pips!
The tweaks have been individually backtested - that is, I have looked for where they would be applied and am happy that in balance, they are beneficial in the daily timeframe. I haven't done a full years' backtesting including the tweaks, if someone would like to, I'd like to see the results too!
You don't have to be right, just don't be too wrong
  • #2,725
  • Edited 4:39am Jan 21, 2009 4:27am | Edited 4:39am
Quoting wilczek


Bar 5 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 4.

The Stop Order remains at High of Bar 3 since Bar 4 wasn't a new setup bar. Remember support and resistance?

The rest is correct in my opinion.
  • #2,726
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:32am Jan 21, 2009 4:32am
Thanks again, my stop order never was at the high of bar 3 as I wasnt short until bar 5, so when the short was triggered on bar 5 i put an initial stop at the high of the bar before (bar 4). Please can you explain why I should have placed this at the high of bar 3 instead as I dont remember reading this anywhere. Sorry to be a pain.

W
  • #2,727
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:47am Jan 21, 2009 4:47am
Quoting wilczek
Thanks again, my stop order never was at the high of bar 3 as I wasnt short until bar 5, so when the short was triggered on bar 5 i put an initial stop at the high of the bar before (bar 4). Please can you explain why I should have placed this at the high of bar 3 instead as I dont remember reading this anywhere. Sorry to be a pain.

W
Bar 3 was a reversal bar so after it closes you put a stop loss at its high for the sell order you have below bar 2. Rule #4 on El Dee's doc. Bar 4 doesn't provide any support nor resistance.
  • #2,728
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:51am Jan 21, 2009 4:51am
Quoting wilczek
Thanks again, my stop order never was at the high of bar 3 as I wasnt short until bar 5, so when the short was triggered on bar 5 i put an initial stop at the high of the bar before (bar 4). Please can you explain why I should have placed this at the high of bar 3 instead as I dont remember reading this anywhere. Sorry to be a pain.

W
Lets see on ur chart :
2 is set up bar for long , when 2 close u place pending buy (price higher and SL lower from 2)
on 3 buy is triggered u r in long , after 3 close , u place revers order , with price lower from 2 and SL - higher betwen high from 2 and high from3
I think it help
good luck
Peter
  • #2,729
  • Jan 21, 2009 5:27am Jan 21, 2009 5:27am
Position after 12:00 -
Short from 1.3805. SL moved to 1.3929 + buy order at the same level, with stop loss at 1.3709.
Attached Image
  • #2,730
  • Edited 6:12am Jan 21, 2009 6:10am | Edited 6:12am
All,

You have all been great and many thanks to you. I finally think I have got this right - please correct me where I am wrong.

Bar 1 - LONG at High of Previous bar (Long signal bar), LONG STOP order at Low of Previous bar (Long signal bar).

Bar 1 Close - SELL LIMIT order at Low of Previous bar (Long signal bar) - Same level as LONG STOP order.

Bar 2 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 1.

Bar 2 Close - As it’s a new Long signal bar - SHORT STOP order moved from the High of Bar 1 to the High of Bar 2 and also added a BUY LIMIT order at the High of Bar 2.

Bar 3 - STOPPED OUT OF SHORT and now LONG. LONG STOP order at Low of Bar 2.

Bar 3 Close - LONG STOP order left at Low of Bar 2 (as Bar 3 is not a new set up bar), SELL LIMIT order at the Low of Bar 2 (because that was the last set up bar).

Bar 4 - No action, no new set up bar, still in LONG.

Bar 5 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 5 (the last reversal bar).

Bar 5 Close - Made a new low (so it’s a new set up bar). SHORT STOP order moved from the High of Bar 3 to the High of Bar 5. Also introduced a BUY LIMIT order at the same level.
Attached Image
  • #2,731
  • Jan 21, 2009 6:51am Jan 21, 2009 6:51am
Quoting wilczek

Bar 1 Close - SELL LIMIT order at Low of Previous bar (Long signal bar) - Same level as LONG STOP order.
we place sellstop order
Quoting wilczek
Bar 2 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 1.
stoploss for short is high from bar

Quoting wilczek
Bar 2 Close - As it’s a new Long signal bar - SHORT STOP order moved from the High of Bar 1 to the High of Bar 2 and also added a BUY LIMIT order at the High of Bar 2.
stoploss from short moved and we place buystop order

Quoting wilczek


Bar 3 Close - LONG STOP order left at Low of Bar 2 (as Bar 3 is not a new set up bar), SELL LIMIT order at the Low of Bar 2 (because that was the last set up bar).
as for me is easer way looking for action
stoploss for long can be change only if on reversal bar make new lower or last bar is setup bar for short
Quoting wilczek
Bar 4 - No action, no new set up bar, still in LONG.
if u use alpari US , which i'm use , bar 4 make high higher as high from bar 3 and we need change stoploss for our revers on high from bar 4
Quoting wilczek
Bar 5 - STOPPED OUT OF LONG and now SHORT. SHORT STOP order at High of Bar 5 (the last reversal bar).
stoploss for short is hihg from 4
Quoting wilczek
Bar 5 Close - Made a new low (so it’s a new set up bar). SHORT STOP order moved from the High of Bar 3 to the High of Bar 5. Also introduced a BUY LIMIT order at the same level.
stoploss for short moved on high from 5
regards
Peter
  • #2,732
  • Jan 21, 2009 9:09am Jan 21, 2009 9:09am
Hi guys. I took the liberty to back test 2008 with the daily rules and the tweaks suggested by El Dee, which I used strictly (a couple of bad trades were entered because of only 1 pip, like December 29th!). Metatrader is from Alpari US demo. The grand total gives me 3843 pips with an average of 320 pips a month.
I can't swear everything is correct. I also see quite a few big discrepancies with the results mentioned by El Dee a few pages ago. So take it with a pinch of salt. I marked the entry and exit points along with the dates, so it should be quite easy for anyone willing to check them.
I would be glad if someone could find mistakes in favour of the system.
Attached File(s)
File Type: xls Daily back test.xls   29 KB | 363 downloads
  • #2,733
  • Jan 21, 2009 1:44pm Jan 21, 2009 1:44pm
been a tough 24hours
  • #2,734
  • Jan 21, 2009 2:35pm Jan 21, 2009 2:35pm
Quoting alright
Hi guys. I took the liberty to back test 2008 with the daily rules and the tweaks suggested by El Dee, ... I also see quite a few big discrepancies with the results mentioned by El Dee a few pages ago
Hi Alright - you've been busy!
I compared the trades since late Nov and there is a discrepancy - but also I am unable to match your entry and exit dates and levels with mine so I assume the Alpari server time is different to mine - I use ProRealTime live data feed for this trading so bar close times must be different.
For the matching trades from my first long on Nov 24th you get a total of 1867 against my 2306 - about a 450 pip difference in just 2 months (I know mines right coz the money's in the bank to prove it)
I'll try to get the time to do a full backtest and then we can see where the discrepencies lie.
Nice work!
You don't have to be right, just don't be too wrong
  • #2,735
  • Jan 21, 2009 2:57pm Jan 21, 2009 2:57pm
What the nice ride north , after three day go south .
On my chart sell was close with -58 pips and now long from 1.3863 SL 1.3614
good luck
Peter
  • #2,736
  • Jan 21, 2009 3:01pm Jan 21, 2009 3:01pm
Quoting El Dee
Hi Alright - you've been busy!
I compared the trades since late Nov and there is a discrepancy - but also I am unable to match your entry and exit dates and levels with mine so I assume the Alpari server time is different to mine - I use ProRealTime live data feed for this trading so bar close times must be different.
For the matching trades from my first long on Nov 24th you get a total of 1867 against my 2306 - about a 450 pip difference in just 2 months (I know mines right coz the money's in the bank to prove it)
I'll try to get the...
Hi El Dee , yesterday I start test daily system. Will be nice to see Your understandble and clear document with rules .
Thanks again for doc with rules for 4h.
Good luck and more pips
Peter
  • #2,737
  • Jan 21, 2009 3:20pm Jan 21, 2009 3:20pm
Hello El Dee,
It will be greatly helpful if you can Post Daily Rules and Tweaks Document like you did for 4 Hour Rules Document.
Thanks
Bhupinder
  • #2,738
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:38pm Jan 21, 2009 4:38pm
Quoting alright
...(a couple of bad trades were entered because of only 1 pip, like December 29th!).
You should be out of market that day, it's an iliquid market that day... because most traders are celebrating my anniversary!
  • #2,739
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:51pm Jan 21, 2009 4:51pm
Quoting El Dee
Hi Alright - you've been busy!
I compared the trades since late Nov and there is a discrepancy - but also I am unable to match your entry and exit dates and levels with mine so I assume the Alpari server time is different to mine - I use ProRealTime live data feed for this trading so bar close times must be different.
For the matching trades from my first long on Nov 24th you get a total of 1867 against my 2306 - about a 450 pip difference in just 2 months (I know mines right coz the money's in the bank to prove it)
I'll try to get the...
As I said, I would be glad if you prove I was wrong. On my side tomorrow I will spend some time trying to comment on the trades from late November, so you can see if they match the rules you've followed so far.
  • #2,740
  • Jan 21, 2009 4:57pm Jan 21, 2009 4:57pm
Quoting tonirai
You should be out of market that day, it's an iliquid market that day... because most traders are celebrating my anniversary!
I did think there was something strange in the air that day, you naughty boy!...
Thank God at that moment I was still busy reading the over 100 pages of this thread...
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