Meditation & Trading?

The technical analysis you show seems to have a lot of depth with many hours of thought put into it. How's your management strategy? Would you say you evolve with the market and "feel" what's going on at the moment? Do you have a set number of pips you look for on any given trade?

When I started working for a broker a while ago he said something to me that made me questioned why I worked for him in the first place,

"Would you rather be a poor analyst or a rich broker?"

I quit 2 weeks later and became a trader.

First of all niceguy, your looking AT THE POUND/CABLE. of course it conforms to Fib!! it's the classic pair for Fib!! show us an example on Jpy/aud or aud/usd pairs i'll actually look at. - I don't follow cable at all. lol
(because I don't Fib (impossible not to on gbp/usd). lol

let's play a game called not my trading style. ;-) Who uses Eliot waves? heavily, i don't mean as method # 24.

I've read the blerbs, seen charts, tried to count, - but never taken up a broker that had it. (partially because I want to able to do something by hand before I go out trading it... lol

Very interesting chart JR with the Star on it. your coming from a whole different perspective. ;=) I'm not sure I could or should duplicate that though. lol
It does prove to me that I'll never know what all the other traders on the market are thinking at any given moment. Z;=)
The Gann Fan, and various other gann tools I've played with on charts but I never found the trick to it. (I ended up love'n Andrew's pitchfork instead. ;-)

Peace,
Fez

Well, you are missing the point entirely, but never mind.....

Er, what point are you actually making here?

Interesting thread, and a very overlooked aspect of personal maintenance that is critical to get into the 5%.

The goal of meditation is to slow the incessant, compulsive production of thoughts so that the reality which thoughts obscure can be experienced.

Our thoughts become streams and then rivers and then tidal waves about getting into or getting out of trades. When you don't have a definite, self-created plan for this stage of your trading journey, then thoughts can take over and pull you to the left and then the right, and then up and then down, and then right and then wrong.

Meditation is purposely engaging in exercises to slow this endless stream of thoughts (either by observing breath, brainwave entrainment, mindfulness exercises, centering exercises [con=with + centration= bringing to the center = concentration], vocal mantras, drawing or looking at geometric mandalas, or self hypnosis, etc.) and this allows one to participate more acutely and keenly in the constant underlying reality that one can't usually participate in. The mumbo-jumbo of the constant thoughts act as a veil over the eyes of perception.

With a very quiet mind one can see many other perspectives of the same situation and this is the core of creativity. To see the movement of a market with a very quiet mind (with limited amounts of Bloomberg or CNBC vying to give you their opinions and thoughts) gives one more confidence in their decision making and you don't have to rely on the very unreliable thought process to make as many decisions for you (even though one has done this for most of their life). And, this is where a bit of intuition (immediate understanding) gets in the mix. You discern where the market is going rather than think about where the market is going. Naked trading (or with very limited tools) starts to make more sense when this mindset is achieved.

Meditation allows one to start trusting our inner voice, and creating the quiet space within oneself so we can acutally (and clearly) listen to that inner voice. The zone that is brought on by meditation can be applied to all aspects of life and relationship and not just making more accurate trading decisions. Bigger picture perspectives start to become the norm, as well, and the static and noise peacefully dies down. Meditation becomes a habit one looks forward to when done effectively.

I prefer to meditate before jumping into the charts, so I can have a clarity and calmness and my opinions don't get in the way of the reality as much. I enjoy brainwave entrainment technology to assist in getting to quiet states more rapidly, with headphones. I use two free software programs to create my own meditation assistants: Gnaural to create entrainment recordings and then use Audacity to edit the entrainment and add music, nature sounds and verbal suggestions and reminders. It takes a little bit of time and research to get familiar with the process and the software, but it is well worth it. One can also purchase some commercial productions (like EquiSync or HoloSync or others) for ease of getting into it. (Google "brainwave entrainment" to look at the research and products).

But, this is only what is working for me and you must develop your own style and plan for trading or life, for the creative principle and the creative process is the most powerful link to life and I suggest using other's approaches as idea generators, rather than a one-size-fits-all plan. Another person cannot donate their awareness to you. One has to develop this space within oneself.

Quieting thoughts brings sharper awareness. Always.

pipsqueak4x

pipsqueak4x
Excellent post my friend.

Very true, pipsqueak, and a valuable addition to the thread. Thank you.

Personally, I prefer to leave out the music. There is a wonderful, extremely subtle music inside that I have heard on occasion, but I still prefer to stay as clear as I can.

...and here's another example of how it works.

I quickly checked the charts on Saturday, and you can see what happened on Monday.

Not sure who this was addressed to, but if it was to me, I don't have a set number of pips to look for. The chart and time tell me when to start looking to get out. I just make sure that there is enough range and risk/reward to my target area. No different than any other trader. My betting strategy is a bit like how I play poker. There are setups where I'll throw down my allotted amount on the first entry. Other times I'll scale in. Just depends. I'll admit that if things are going well, I'll add on more than the allotted amount because usually at that point it's house money.

Yeah, I've found the hard way that trading Gann and other esoteric methods takes a complete paradigm shift. I also feel that it takes opening up both sides of the brain and even leaning more towards the creativity side vs the analytical side. I've got a huge blog post about this I'm writing that goes into it. I'm also finding out that it's more than just a paradigm shift in trading, but about everything. Like they say, you don't trade the market.. you trade your perceptions.

I was an audio/video mastering engineer for 10 years and I've done work with clients that had subliminal and brain wave type audio things going on. Pretty interesting. My boss was adiment about hearing the subliminal stuff before he encoded it to make sure he wasn't going to end up a Manchurian candidate at the end of the day. He was actually pretty upset about not getting the script until the last minute, too.

One of the first and best programs for generating brain wave impulses is Cool Edit Pro. Adobe bought it and now it's called Audition, but I'm not sure if they kept the brain wave functions in there or not. You can still find the older fully functional demos of Cool Edit out there.

btw, great post. As stated in my other post, I'm writing a big blog article and touch on a lot of the things you said. If it's cool, I'd like to quote you because you said some things better than I ever could.

JR97 and others,

Thanks for the kind words. Yes, you can use any collection of words I have assembled, as they collectively came from others who have also rolled back the turbulent waves of thought and found a dimension of reality that has been quietly existing just beyond the veil. Sharing a few words with you is a small fee for the massive amounts you have shared with me and others through the past years on your observations in numerous forums of sacred geometry, Gann, esoteric approaches, and alternative methods of observation of the digital river of international money that changes hands in very interesting patterns. You have been a wonderful alternative voice for those who see the world through a different color shade of glasses and want to apply it to their trading endeavours.

In the same vein that sleep1Iopen says in his footer: "Trade for philanthropy and you will know the ultimate profit", trading is but a stepping stone on the journey across the ocean of mystery of life. And if this stepping stone can be made strong for other travellers or become an energizing point for others on their journey, then giving of oneself, or of one's experiences, is a noble gift both in the taking and the giving.

The paradigm shift you alluded to is the difficult transformation (which for some can occur in days and for others years) and few rarely cross that boundary and can artisticly apply scientific or mathematic principals to the spectrum of dynamics that occur within the exchange of money. The matrix of life is exhibited in free markets and the fractal dimensions that arise become the unknown, but many times the predictable opportunities for exchange arise for those who have opened extended perceptions to these repeating patterns.

This thread approaches a very important intersection of knowledge of science (math, markets, programming and such) and knowledge of Self (personal psychology, goals, interpersonal disciplinary attitudes, spirit and such) and I am thankful to altrader for creating it. May this necessary conversation continue and help bring balance to the other side of being a successful trader; being a successful soul. The .mq4 version of my experiences are available to all.

Have a wonderful Day of Giving Thanks (Thursday) for those in the US. Isn't this all great? Beyond all the sham, deceit and empty words, it is still a wonderful time to be alive and I am thankful to be able to participate in international communications like this with a weird collection of unique minds like you all!

Cheers!

pipsqueak4x

Hey Pipsqueak4x,
I am from the land very fine literary minds. Sadly i am utterly devoid of such talent, however i still know how to appreciate one and applaud one. Once again nice post mate.

Now this is an interesting thread.

As a guy who starts his day meditating before opening my screen I was very interested to read the excellent and thought provoking posts on this thread.

I've also been the esoteric route - it must be ten years since I purchased Brad Cowen's trilogy - sadly it was too advanced for me and my astrologically minded friend. I also spent six or more months working with Earik Bean's Wave 59 software and his Market Esoterica. Regrettably, neither improved my trading, but this may be a reflection on my ability or dedication rather than the actual material!

I hope to make time over the weekend to read this thread and its links and may then be able to contribute.

Meanwhile, thank you to those that have already done so.

Reagards

Islander

I bought the Cowan books about 3 years ago. Not for the faint of heart. I still go back to them regularly and every time it starts to make a little more sense. The one thing that the triology doesn't do is show how to actually trade the information. I lost my a$$ trying to implement things I didn't have enough understanding of. But now I can't see the market any other way than geometrically/cyclically. It's been a slow and difficult evolution but very rewarding in more ways than just pips in the pocket.

ps... if you're looking to get rid of Market Esoterica, let me know how much you want for it. It's been on my to-do-list for a couple of years.

I am going to mention this because ... well.. no one else has. Pipsqueak4x made sort of a reference to it..I believe.

Remote viewing. The ability to see real places and things without actually being or having been there physically. I have had some successful experience with it many years ago, but not in a trading capacity. I know there is a trader ...sometimes goes under the name of Robin Hood, who uses a method of remote viewing to predict price action.

Earlier posts on this thread talk about using meditation to clear ones mind, or detach oneslf from distraction. What I refer to is more directed. Seeing in one's head, or with the mind's eye. For our purposes this would be seeing price action in the future. Seeing where price will be in X time from now. Not only where it will end up, but the path it will take.

I am not sure what I think about this phenomenon. Especially since I have had my own planned remote viewing experiences and have observed those of others (far more detailed and accurate than my own) so I know this ability exists. I also believe most all people have it, but it needs to be discovered and developed.

This is my experience. I was trained to bring myself to a meditative level, fully aware of surroundings. Once there, an observer simply asked me what I could 'tell' or 'see' about ... (I would be given a name of someone that they knew. Someone I had never heard of.) I would proceed to describe that person in some detail including their physical and personality characteristics. Because this method was for the purposes of healing, I would then begin to scan the body of the person I was 'seeing'. I would locate trouble areas and describe them to the observer. A third person was present who recorded my statements and later verified them with the observer. In the next step I visualized various means of 'healing' the trouble I found. There were about 30 individuals taking part in this method at any time. We would mix around so that everyone had the opportunity to be the observer, the 'healer' and the recorder. While I was somewhat accurate in my 'seeing' there were others who were astounding. One 'healer' in particular gave me a detailed account about my brother's leg operation. Details about it that I did not know. When I asked my brother about it, he said.. Lou, how did you know that? Its true! This involved a specific, unorthodox procedure that the doctor tried as a last resort to fix a nerve in my brother's leg. The 'healer' 'saw' the doctor doing this procedure and even acted it out. She did not know or ever see my brother, he lived about 5 miles away. He did not know I was involved in the remote viewing until I mentioned what she had seen.

Ok back to trading.
The brain records everything it experiences. It may take awhile and some sleep to have an 'aha' experience when the brain makes sense of all the pieces of information it has received. I am wondering if a person especially a gifted person in this area of remote viewing could see future price action based on the sythesis of absorbed information. Maybe one needs to keep the analytical side of the brain from working so much and let the other side see the solution.

In the training we received, that allowed us to attain a meditative state, we were also taught ways to find solutions to problems. Focusing on the problem and falling asleep framing the problem in specific ways. I remember waking up with the realization of : yes... that is what I will do ! I cannot say that it happened for every problem or that it happened quickly.

It seems to me that there is an application here for a solution to the problem, stated in specific terms: Where on the chart is the price of the _____ pair going to go over the next _____ time frame?

I wonder if I can do it? I wonder if I want to make the effort to try it ?

Hi Lou, good to hear from you! yes indeed remote viewing is for real. You only have to ask traders who have done our online course all over the world! We use it in conjunction with kinesiology to identify factors affecting sunbconscious programming that may be getting in the trader's way.

Your bit about the leg operation made me laugh, as we discovered something very specific for a very unusual condition in someone's leg in Ireland when we lived in Switzerland. So it is something that has a practical application and that still, and probably always will, amazes me.

It's not a trick or some sort of clever woo-woo spooky thing. I believe we are all connected much more than we realize, and particularly as traders, we need to learn to trust our intuition a lot more. It's very powerful, if we let it in, and don't squash it with what our brain tries to tell us! the brain is a very imperfect machine when it is so heavily influenced by our negative aspects such as fear and limited beliefs. When you are truly in touch with yourself, you are truly empowered, and you don't need to get information on your trades from others on forums!

For me, it's not so much about attaining a 'meditative state'. I'm not quite sure what that means in practical terms, but if it is another way of saying that you get completely in touch with what is really going on for you, then I understand what you are saying.

'I wonder if I can do it? I wonder if I want to make the effort to try it ? '

Interesting. How much effort does it take to be oneself, rather than trying to bend yourself into the shape of someone you think you ought to be? I know that isn't quite what you are saying here, but that's what most of us spend our lives doing.

uhhmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I read this thread back in November, for it's an interesting topic. I first tried meditation 20 years ago when I was in grad school. I had befriended a Buddhist and he introduced me to the Japanese school of Buddhism and meditation. I found that when I meditated before writing papers, it got me focused like nothing ever had before or since. Once I finished grad school though, I lost touch with Tom and stopped meditating. I moved to Korea and you'd think I'd do it there, but no.

Anyway, I bought the first level of Holosync. I've been doing it since mid-December. I love it. I look forward to doing it every day. So far, the most prominent effect has been a huge calming down. I'm actually a bit high-strung and lots of little stuff would annoy me. One criticism I've heard all my life (usually from women and my parents) is that I would never relax. I find it hard to sit still for very long (I'm a pacer) in most situations. Since I started this I find myself feeling extremely and unusually calm as well as not getting annoyed by the little stuff in life, like Emiratis driving their Land Cruisers as if they were on a Nascar track, or the typical bullshit that one finds in just about any job.

More importantly, I have two very young boys and anyone who has kids knows how stressful they can make life at times. The constant noise alone is enough to drive me crazy. In the last two months, I just don't get annoyed very much by them. They really have to go ballistic to get me going now. This result alone is worth 10x the cost of the first level.

Due to commitments, I've missed days, sometimes two in row and I can feel myself getting a bit "out of whack" and my annoyance levels seem to rise. Then I meditate and all is right with my world again. Whether or not this will bring about permanent change remains to be seen. Meditating every day is really not a bad thing, I can think of many ways to spend an hour, most of them wasteful. Holosync is a program that takes many years to reach the end. They say it'll bring permanent change. I'm only on the first level and I like what I've experienced so far. I will move the next level in a few more months or earlier if I'm ready for it. As I said, it works for me and it's worth every penny.

For those who never experienced the Delta state, it's amazing. I do it lying on the floor. The first 30 minutes is called The Dive, it prepares you by getting you into an Alpha state, then I believe Theta. When the second stage (Immersion) begins and brings me into Delta, it's almost like getting high, but in a good way. High in that the rush is immediate and overwhelming. I feel like I've fallen off a cliff and I'm floating. At times I feel like I'm out of body. It's hard to explain, one would have to experience it, kind of like sex. When it finishes, I feel calmer and more relaxed then any time in my life, kind of like after sex.

Bill Harris, the owner of Holosync has to be the biggest promoter on the net. The guy is tireless, yet harmless. I've ignored most of his stuff he sends, but today I looked at one called the Silva Life System. It claims you can attain Alpha state and function. This would address an earlier post in which it was suggested that meditating while trading might be helpful. I'm looking into the Silva system and I very well may get it. It costs next to nothing, my concern is finding the time every day to do it. If I get it, I'll post my thoughts here on this forum.

Hi Dopey,

A couple of posts above, I mentioned my experiences. We were using the Silva Method.

Better and Better

Lou

Hi Lou,

Very interesting post. So you went to a "class" in the US? Have you tried it on your own? I'm in the UAE so I don't think I could make any classes, but I'm interested in trying it.

I think most people who trade for some time realize there are times when you feel in "sync" with what you're doing. Not so much with the market, but just feeling in top form, that you're focusing and thinking correctly. This has as much to do with the things we need to do to trade properly as it does with reading the markets. We all know there are times when you just shouldn't go near your computer. Maybe you're feeling under the weather, something is bothering you, etc. In my experience, it's at these times that I'll jump the gun on entering or exiting trades.

My understanding of the Silva method is that one could enter the Alpha state and still function properly. Would this be a preferable way to approach trading everyday? I don't know. Have you tried it? Do you know anyone who has?

I must admit, the idea of remote viewing seems a bit strange to me, but I'm open enough to explore it. I've read a few other things about it and it's interesting. It's tough to find unbiased opinions about the Silva system, or Holosync on the net. It seems that damn near every link I go to for an opinion is linked to a sale page. Therefore, reading an opinion like yours where there is no benefit for you becomes very valuable. Thank you for sharing it.

If I get the Silva system, I'll post my thoughts and experiences here for you and others to see.