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Trend Finder Daily

  • #641
  • Sep 4, 2008 11:10pm Sep 4, 2008 11:10pm
Grpip and Golum,

Well since I had a heck of a day today, and today is the last day of trading for the week and it will take a little while to explain the money management part of this system or any system for that matter, I will work on it this weekend and post it well before Sunday opening.

Grpip,

You are right. There weren't any new trades today. And AUDCAD is still rolling!!!

I know you said you are a creature of habit but I hate to hear that you don't want to understand because that is how I learned from my losses and how to better my winning percentage. My money management strategy changed because of ONE trade that got stopped out, I shorted the trade and it has definitely shorted, but if I knew then what I knew now about stop losses and gave the trade room to "breathe", I would be sitting on a 1200 pip profit just from that trade alone.

The poorhouse??? Well I hope you are only demo trading this system for now, because I will demo a system for AT LEAST 6 months before I decide if it performs well enough or not to trade live. And the opening will begin at 5pm Sunday your time.

I added the chart to show where I'm at with all my trades. I also added the template I'm currently using. Download the template to C:\program files\Metatrader-("broker name")\templates and then open Metatrader and apply it to all your charts. You must have all the the indicators in your indicator folder (Stoch histogram (Trend Finder 4 hour thread by Bull101, first post), AO (standard with MT), Advanced ADX (Trend Finder 4hour thread by Bull101, first post), ATR (standard with MT).

I'm off. Have a good weekend and I will talk to you all soon.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: bulls daily2.gif Size: 57 KB
Attached File(s)
File Type: tpl daily_bull_modified.tpl   2 KB | 434 downloads
Find the edge, and keep it sharp.
  • #642
  • Sep 5, 2008 4:13am Sep 5, 2008 4:13am
[quote=EclecticJoe;2202110]
I will work on it this weekend and post it well before Sunday opening./quote]

Thanks for sharing
  • #643
  • Sep 5, 2008 12:27pm Sep 5, 2008 12:27pm
Quoting EclecticJoe
Grpip and Golum,

Well since I had a heck of a day today, and today is the last day of trading for the week and it will take a little while to explain the money management part of this system or any system for that matter, I will work on it this weekend and post it well before Sunday opening.

Grpip,

You are right. There weren't any new trades today. And AUDCAD is still rolling!!!

I know you said you are a creature of habit but I hate to hear that you don't want to understand because that is how I learned from my losses and how to better my winning percentage. My money management strategy changed because of ONE trade that got stopped out, I shorted the trade and it has definitely shorted, but if I knew then what I knew now about stop losses and gave the trade room to "breathe", I would be sitting on a 1200 pip profit just from that trade alone.

The poorhouse??? Well I hope you are only demo trading this system for now, because I will demo a system for AT LEAST 6 months before I decide if it performs well enough or not to trade live. And the opening will begin at 5pm Sunday your time.

I added the chart to show where I'm at with all my trades. I also added the template I'm currently using. Download the template to C:\program files\Metatrader-("broker name")\templates and then open Metatrader and apply it to all your charts. You must have all the the indicators in your indicator folder (Stoch histogram (Trend Finder 4 hour thread by Bull101, first post), AO (standard with MT), Advanced ADX (Trend Finder 4hour thread by Bull101, first post), ATR (standard with MT).

I'm off. Have a good weekend and I will talk to you all soon.
Eclectic Joe....guess you misunderstood me....I do want to learn, I just didn't understand your explanation of the "Sunday Candle Effect" and really didn't think it was that important for me to put in a lot of time trying understand....just need to follow directions and execute the plan. As for proper MM, I understand the importance and will make every effort to educate and inform myself about your particular MM strategy....looking forward to your info. Thanks for including your chart and template. And no, I'm not trading live.....was only joking....have been demoing and trying out various systems for about six months.

Will have my Alpari MT4 loaded with your template and be ready to go Sunday evening at 5 p.m.

Will you start posting the signals for your modified system on Alpari? I will continue posting signals for Bull's regular system on ODL.
  • #644
  • Sep 6, 2008 12:09pm Sep 6, 2008 12:09pm
I started looking into this a while ago when I started running into problems with stops always getting hit, but looking back at the candle I took the trade on, most of the time the candle was in the direction of the trade I took. I read a couple of books recently and I also remember a thread of here that was using ATR (Average True Range) for their stops. ATR does not tell you which direction the currency pair is going, only the degree of movement or volatility the pair has averaged over a certain number of days. So I added ATR to Bull’s already great setup for entries and I set it to 13 days to match up with the ADX setting he uses. I also overlayed a 1 day ATR to keep an eye on where the pair is starting to become more volatile than the recent 13 day average.

To understand the ATR (13 days in this case) values for stop loss and how they work against a fixed number stop loss, on all pairs that DO NOT have JPY in the currency pair, look at the last 3 numbers. For all pairs that DO have JPY in the currency pair, look at the first three numbers. These numbers are the recent average of pips that the pair is moving in a day. I just took a look at my charts and all the ATRs are greater than the 100 pip fixed stop loss that Bull recommends. If you look at the EURNZD chart I attached and the highlighted candle, notice the long tail on what is a long entry according the rules. That pair is trading roughly around 239 pips a day per the ATR value, which means, the trade could first move against you 100 pips from the opening price and then turn around and gain 139 pips from the opening price. The entry price was around 2.1141 and the low for the day on that candle is 2.1037. Now if during the trading day, the trading moved against you first to that low of 2.1037 before it reversed during the day to the close it made, you would have been stopped out.

So what I have been learning from my experience so far is to use a fixed stop loss of 2xATR because all the pairs have a different volatility. Now on some of the pairs, that can be upwards of 500 pips and most around 200-300 pips and that is a lot of pips. For demo trading this is no problem because you are only seeing how well the system works. Open a demo account with a high starting capital and only trade with 0.1 lots so that you can take all the trades that meet the entry criteria and not have any margin calls to properly evaluate the system. If you decide to use this way of setting stop loss on live trading, use must learn about position sizing and trading the right amount of lots so that if this trade does go against you that many pips, that you still will not risk more than 2% of your account. I’m not going to go into position sizing here, and if you want to learn more about it, try googling it or send me a PM and I know a couple of good books that talk about it.

So for demoing this system, take all the trades just after the candle opens and all three indicators finally are all the same color and meet the criteria of being above or below the MA, just like Bull explains it. After taking the trade, take the ATR (13) value as it shows in the indicator window and multiply that times 2. Subtract that from your entry price if you went long or add it the entry price if you went short. That will be your absolute stop loss. Write that stop loss down on paper or if you want to add a line on your chart with that price, but do not put that stop loss value in Metatrader or whatever trading platform you use. The reason I say do not put the stop loss into the computer to have it automatically closed out is that while wicks are very important to the formation of a candle and for candle type charting, they also represent what I call “noise” on daily trading. For me, entries, stop loss, and exit are based on the bodies of the candle (open and close). Close out the trade for a loss if the OPENING PRICE at the opening of the candle is above or below, depending on long or short, the stop loss price you calculated.

Other than that let the trades run until at the opening of the candle, the AO or ADX has switched colors opposite your trade and then exit the trade. Also use this exit strategy for trades that are in loss even if they have not hit the stop loss you calculated.

From what I see, re-entries of the current trend are possible when the Stochs and AO changed color back to the current trend.

Also I forgot to add the candle time indicator that I have on my charts. So throw that in the indicator folder and re-open MT. I just use that because for some reason some charts don’t change to the new day and exactly 6pm EDT (5pmCDT). Sometimes they take a few minutes, so just make sure that the candle time says over 1400 minutes to go when you are looking for trade to go into or to exit.

I will post what trades I took and when I exited. I always enter or exit trades within the first half hour of candle opening. And that does sound like a good idea about also using ODL to see if and what it does truly matter.

Other than that, I can’t think of anything else at this time. Any questions just ask.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: eurnzd_example.gif Size: 16 KB
Attached File(s)
File Type: ex4 CandleTime.ex4   2 KB | 361 downloads
Find the edge, and keep it sharp.
  • #645
  • Sep 7, 2008 4:52pm Sep 7, 2008 4:52pm
Hi everybody,

This is my first time following this strategy, please can somebody tell my if this is a valid signal?.

I'll appreciate your assistance. Thank you in advance.
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: uj0907.gif Size: 15 KB
  • #646
  • Sep 7, 2008 5:53pm Sep 7, 2008 5:53pm
I'd be careful. Gaps generally retrace until they are closed. I'd wait for the monday candle to close.
  • #647
  • Sep 7, 2008 6:17pm Sep 7, 2008 6:17pm
Quoting Bull
Hi everybody,

This is my first time following this strategy, please can somebody tell my if this is a valid signal?.

I'll appreciate your assistance. Thank you in advance.
Bull....welcome aboard! Your U/J signal would be a valid long trade for this system....if it were on the Monday candle....not Sunday candle. This system was designed to trade with the ODL broker, beginning on Daily candle which opens with ODL at 7 p.m. each trading day. So yes, you are looking at the trade correctly....price above 200 SMA with stoch and AO both green. You're on the right track....just make sure you're on an ODL demo and check all pairs again tonite after 7 p.m. Central Daylite Time. Actually, signals have been know occasionally to change during the first hour of trading. So personally, I've decided that unless the AO and Stoch both have really strong signals, not just green or red dots, I'm just going to wait to take the trade until at least 30-45 minutes into the session....of course you can experiment and find whatever works for you. If you have more questions, just ask....will help if I can. Good luck!
  • #648
  • Sep 7, 2008 6:39pm Sep 7, 2008 6:39pm
Glad to see you here Bull. We might have to call you "lil Bull" though since "Big Bull" started the thread. GRPip is right about how quick the colors can change. I exited an AUDUSD trade I had because when the candle first opened it was opposite my trade and within 30 mins it had changed back to going with my trade.

Well don't forget everyone, GRPip and I are seeing if there are any differences in ODL signals and Alpari signals. I'm using Alpari.

New Trades

Long CADCHF at 1.0574

Closed Trades

Opened short GBPUSD on 8/27/08 @ 1.8376, closed 9/8/08 @ 1.7872 (AO change) 504 pips
Opened short AUDUSD on 9/3/08 @ .8370, closed 9/8/08 @ .8328 (AO change) 42 pips
Opened long EURAUD on 9/3/08 @ 1.7352, closed 9/8/08 @ 1.7261 (AO change) -91 pips

Good luck and talk to you everyone tomorrow
Find the edge, and keep it sharp.
  • #649
  • Sep 7, 2008 7:35pm Sep 7, 2008 7:35pm
No new valid signals on ODL....no open trades....good luck this week!
  • #650
  • Sep 7, 2008 7:37pm Sep 7, 2008 7:37pm
Hi GRPip & ElectriJoe,

I want to thank both of you for your comments and explanations.

I'll try to follow and test this strategy.
  • #651
  • Sep 8, 2008 1:53am Sep 8, 2008 1:53am
Quoting Ronald Raygun
I'd be careful. Gaps generally retrace until they are closed. I'd wait for the monday candle to close.
There are four basic kinds of gaps:
1.common gaps
2.breakaway gaps
3.runaway gaps
4.exhaustion gaps

If you ever wondered what causes gaps in price charts and what they mean?
http://stockcharts.com/school/doku.p...nd_gap_analysi

Hope this helps

LR
  • #652
  • Sep 8, 2008 2:02am Sep 8, 2008 2:02am
Quoting EclecticJoe
Grpip and Golum,

Well since I had a heck of a day today, and today is the last day of trading for the week and it will take a little while to explain the money management part of this system or any system for that matter, I will work on it this weekend and post it well before Sunday opening.

Grpip,

You are right. There weren't any new trades today. And AUDCAD is still rolling!!!

I know you said you are a creature of habit but I hate to hear that you don't want to understand because that is how I learned from my losses and how to better my winning percentage. My money management strategy changed because of ONE trade that got stopped out, I shorted the trade and it has definitely shorted, but if I knew then what I knew now about stop losses and gave the trade room to "breathe", I would be sitting on a 1200 pip profit just from that trade alone.

The poorhouse??? Well I hope you are only demo trading this system for now, because I will demo a system for AT LEAST 6 months before I decide if it performs well enough or not to trade live. And the opening will begin at 5pm Sunday your time.

I added the chart to show where I'm at with all my trades. I also added the template I'm currently using. Download the template to C:\program files\Metatrader-("broker name")\templates and then open Metatrader and apply it to all your charts. You must have all the the indicators in your indicator folder (Stoch histogram (Trend Finder 4 hour thread by Bull101, first post), AO (standard with MT), Advanced ADX (Trend Finder 4hour thread by Bull101, first post), ATR (standard with MT).

I'm off. Have a good weekend and I will talk to you all soon.
FOR Eclectic JOE:
firstly thanks for sharing so much on this thread. SUNDAY CANDLE information, your template, ATR stoploss strategy etc.

1. Why use the 3xMA's you do from your template? Is not the SMA200 enough?Please kindly explain.
2. Why ise ATR=1 pverlayed on ATR=13? Please explain the reason.
3. I think Adv ADR indicator from 4h strategy on daily charts is great idea. I have been testing on my charts for a while.
4. Does one enter the trade at the EOD close and open of the next day? If yes, on the Alpari demo platform (NO SUNDAY CANDLE) one should wait till tomorrow.

For GRPip:
thanks for your committment on this strategy and daily reporting of trades.

Greatly appreciated to both of you.

LR
  • #653
  • Sep 8, 2008 2:13am Sep 8, 2008 2:13am
Quoting Bull
Hi everybody,

This is my first time following this strategy, please can somebody tell my if this is a valid signal?.

I'll appreciate your assistance. Thank you in advance.
FOR BULL:

Thanks for sharing your chart.

I am using the trend finder signal indicator too from the paperclip onthis thread.

1. How to you change the position of this information from thwe left to the right of the chart?
2. How does your indicator calculate &)% of the ATR=14 in terms of pips and display it on the left of the chart?
3. What do the UP arrows indicate on your chart?
4. What does the AESTF stand for in the inputs of this indicator?

Thanks,

LR
  • #654
  • Sep 8, 2008 4:08am Sep 8, 2008 4:08am
Hi Irathi

Here you're the indicators that I'm using and the Template.

Have a nice day.



Quoting lrathi
FOR BULL:

Thanks for sharing your chart.

I am using the trend finder signal indicator too from the paperclip onthis thread.

1. How to you change the position of this information from thwe left to the right of the chart?
2. How does your indicator calculate &)% of the ATR=14 in terms of pips and display it on the left of the chart?
3. What do the UP arrows indicate on your chart?
4. What does the AESTF stand for in the inputs of this indicator?

Thanks,

LR
Attached File(s)
File Type: tpl trend finder daily.tpl   3 KB | 555 downloads
File Type: mq4 AOSignal.mq4   3 KB | 653 downloads
File Type: mq4 TrendFinder_Signals_v1.0.mq4   11 KB | 771 downloads
File Type: mq4 ATR Pips.mq4   2 KB | 590 downloads
  • #655
  • Sep 8, 2008 5:52am Sep 8, 2008 5:52am
Quoting Bull
Hi Irathi

Here you're the indicators that I'm using and the Template.

Have a nice day.
Thanks a lot Bull for YOUR indis and tpl. Could you point to the latest rules YOU are using?

Thanks

Forex37
  • #656
  • Sep 8, 2008 6:24am Sep 8, 2008 6:24am
Hi Forex37

I just began to test this strategy this week, following the original rules:

Long Entry Criteria:

1. Price is above the 200sma.
2. The Awesome Oscillator has changed to green.
3. The Stochastic Histogram has changed to green.


Short Entry Criteria:

1. Price is Below the 200sma.
2. The Awesome Oscillator has changed to red.
3. The Stochastic Histogram has changed to red.


And for real Short Entry Point you must need a Buy Entry point as a last signal (and viceversa), in other words if your last signal was a Short and then (for example) AO turned green and then in a couples candles change again to red, this isn't a valid signal because the las Valid Signal was a SHORT and now is like a "new short" then this is a invalid signal.

This strategy is similar to OZ system, but with a "little" change using AO. This a big difference, because if you read the origin of AO, AC and all indicators of Bill Williams and his Chaos Theory, the only indicator that give you a signal is the AO, this is the reason because I think that this is a better strategy.

I'll test forward and I'll try to show here my experience for everybody.

Bull

PS. Sorry for any mistake, English isn't my first language.





Quoting Forex37
Thanks a lot Bull for YOUR indis and tpl. Could you point to the latest rules YOU are using?

Thanks

Forex37
  • #657
  • Sep 8, 2008 7:02am Sep 8, 2008 7:02am
Bull,
Thanks for your quick and speedy reply. To clear up, just 3 questions:

1. What about broker setting ( no sunday cande - start 0.00 gmt?) for valid signals?

2. Trading only after close of signal candle, id if candle SWITCHING color compared to a candle before ? Trade immediateley or after close of this?

3. ANy hints concerning TP /SL ?

By the way - english isn`t my first language either, not even my second.

Best wishes and thanks

FOrex 37

p.s. Anybody still applying the 4hr version ( Trendfinder 4hr)
  • #658
  • Sep 8, 2008 7:39am Sep 8, 2008 7:39am
Hi Forex37

I'll try to answer your questions.

Quoting Forex37
1. What about broker setting ( no sunday cande - start 0.00 gmt?) for valid signals?
It's true, you must to avoid any signal generated by Sunday candle.

Quote
2. Trading only after close of signal candle, id if candle SWITCHING color compared to a candle before ? Trade immediateley or after close of this?

Place the Trade ONLY after a bar close, you have (more or less) 10 minutes to place your trade after the candle is closed and you're sure that you've a valid signal.

Quote
3. ANy hints concerning TP /SL ?

I'm following the originals rules, that mind First Target Profit at 50 pips, second at 100, when you close the first TP you must to move your SL to break even. And regarding the inicial SL is 50 pips.

Hope that can help you.

BTW, today we don't have a valid signal (using ODL as Broker, because they began a daily candle at 00:00 GMT)

Bull
  • #659
  • Sep 8, 2008 9:12am Sep 8, 2008 9:12am
Quoting Bull
Hi Irathi

Here you're the indicators that I'm using and the Template.

Have a nice day.
Thanks so much BULL.

I love the AO signal and ATR pips indicators

LR
  • #660
  • Sep 8, 2008 12:11pm Sep 8, 2008 12:11pm
It's not about entrances that make money but exits!!! As a rule of thumb Cut your losses short, let your profits run.
With random generated signals one can make money with MM. I stopped visiting FF regularly, I used to read here and there for so many hours. At the end I wasb't making money. Now I trade with no indicators, only price action and my eyes as a leading indicator. lol. (p^^q)
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