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Comparison of AutoClick Services

  • #21
  • Feb 11, 2007 1:51am Feb 11, 2007 1:51am
I notice quite a few posters keep talking down some strategies used at news time pointing out that these will no longer work or be tolerated by brokers.
I think they have made their point already and the repeat posts about this are getting irritating. Since when have retail forex brokers been tolerant or facilitated any winning strategy? Like Burgerking said, milk it for what it's worth and for as long as it last. Mind you, any broker who dares disallow news trading will more than likely see a flight of customers. All we can do for now is trade according to the rules and possibilities of the day and we can do without the constant warnings from the doomsayers, thank you!
  • #22
  • Feb 11, 2007 2:34am Feb 11, 2007 2:34am
Quoting BurgerKing
I'd rather *MILK* them now before they are gone, rather than them *GONE* before I could milk them. Opportunity knocks only once.
I wholeheartedly agree with you BK - make hay while the sun shines as they say!
  • #23
  • Edited 5:15am Feb 11, 2007 5:00am | Edited 5:15am
Quoting zarni
That is exactly where it is difficult to trade this with all the games retail shops play. Banks trade reports all the time and I do to with institutional account and get usually better fill than retail platform. so please save us your wisdom since obviously you are not speaking from experience or the experience you are basing your comments on is limited.
I can only laugh. You've no idea who I am nor my credentials to make such observations, and a spot fx institutional account is not a regulated market like an exchange. I work at a top 10 hedge fund wrt aum and have been in this industry for many years. You may well trade on an institutional platform but I can am confident I know more about the markets than you. You can choose to believe me or not, but I'm thinking someone of your stature must surely have bloomberg so why not pm me and gimme your bb id so I can reply and you'll see exactly who I am, where I work, and maybe next time you'll not be so fast to dismiss my comments. Your having success on an instituional platform most certainly does not give you the necessary experience to comment so generally. And I'll repeat just in case my comments didnt filter through the first time. An instituional spot fx platform such as currenex is no a full limit matching order system and as such ... you will often encounter backwardations which might be allowing you to get fills around news. Try this on any futures instrument and you will be buried with any fancy autoclick software you may or may not be using
  • #24
  • Feb 11, 2007 7:48am Feb 11, 2007 7:48am
Hi guys. It's been a while since I've been thinking about using SNW but my only problem was the broker. Anyone care to share his experience about a broker who has good fills and one click trading? I know about OANDA and MT4 brokers will requote you 99% of the time, and profinum appeared to be a scam.
BTW nice topic to discuss BK.
  • #25
  • Feb 11, 2007 10:31am Feb 11, 2007 10:31am
Quoting sccz97
I can only laugh. You've no idea who I am nor my credentials to make such observations, and a spot fx institutional account is not a regulated market like an exchange. I work at a top 10 hedge fund wrt aum and have been in this industry for many years. You may well trade on an institutional platform but I can am confident I know more about the markets than you. You can choose to believe me or not, but I'm thinking someone of your stature must surely have bloomberg so why not pm me and gimme your bb id so I can reply and you'll see exactly who I am, where I work, and maybe next time you'll not be so fast to dismiss my comments. Your having success on an instituional platform most certainly does not give you the necessary experience to comment so generally. And I'll repeat just in case my comments didnt filter through the first time. An instituional spot fx platform such as currenex is no a full limit matching order system and as such ... you will often encounter backwardations which might be allowing you to get fills around news. Try this on any futures instrument and you will be buried with any fancy autoclick software you may or may not be using
There are lots of people who work at hedge funds and use bloomberg who still don't know what they are talking about....that is no real guarantee of competency. Your comments previously speak odes... I never said I was or had any intention of trading futures on news and I have nothing to prove here for you.
  • #26
  • Feb 11, 2007 10:46am Feb 11, 2007 10:46am
Quoting zarni
Banks trade reports all the time and I do to with institutional account and get usually better fill than retail platform.
Just curious, who do you have your institutional account with?
  • #27
  • Feb 11, 2007 11:14am Feb 11, 2007 11:14am
Quoting zarni
There are lots of people who work at hedge funds and use bloomberg who still don't know what they are talking about....that is no real guarantee of competency. Your comments previously speak odes... I never said I was or had any intention of trading futures on news and I have nothing to prove here for you.
The fact that you appear so confident of your views of the market when you use other peoples services says more about you than I really need to. All I've tried to do is to warn ppl of the potential dangers involved with trading news by blindly following somone like felix who quite obviously has no clue. And yes, there are plenty of ppl working at hedge funds, but those working at funds with over 5bn under management are few and far between.

And wrt to futures, I dont recall suggesting you try, I was using it as an examlpe to highlight the fact that this spike trading craze is only really possible in an unregulated market. If you're using an instituional platform succesfully then good luck to you, because even there, once you get up to a decent size, the banks will tell your pb to stop you trading. To think that you're trading anonymously on institutional platforms like lava/cnx is naive.
  • #28
  • Feb 11, 2007 11:23am Feb 11, 2007 11:23am
Quoting sccz97
The fact that you appear so confident of your views of the market when you use other peoples services says more about you than I really need to. All I've tried to do is to warn ppl of the potential dangers involved with trading news by blindly following somone like felix who quite obviously has no clue. And yes, there are plenty of ppl working at hedge funds, but those working at funds with over 5bn under management are few and far between.

And wrt to futures, I dont recall suggesting you try, I was using it as an examlpe to highlight the fact that this spike trading craze is only really possible in an unregulated market. If you're using an instituional platform succesfully then good luck to you, because even there, once you get up to a decent size, the banks will tell your pb to stop you trading. To think that you're trading anonymously on institutional platforms like lava/cnx is naive.
Wow...amazing conclusions. You use Bloomberg right - as far as I know that is umm....'other people's services'.
I do not recall proposing that you blindly follow anybody...quite the contrary. 5bn can also go bust. Again your account size is no guarantee of competency. I make my observations on what you say. Making statements about your account size does not prove anything. So please stop.
And you should get this by now - I don't care a damn what will happen a week from now as long as I make money this week....Is that coming through??? Enough nonsense...
  • #29
  • Feb 11, 2007 12:47pm Feb 11, 2007 12:47pm
The sad truth is that the news spike trading gravy train has already come to an end. The very fact that people are looking to pay hundreds (or thousands) of dollars a month to get in a few pips earlier is testament to the fact that the average return for news trading has dropped considerably. Why pay for a service that makes you a few pips when you can use that money for margin and make a larger return on the gazillion pips you already make?

I myself made an assload of money trading the news, but I had no illusions that I was some super trader outsmarting the financial elite. I was exploiting an execution guarantee provided by the retail brokers who allowed me to arbitrage the latency in their price feed. The prices I traded at never existed, so the money I made came directly out of the brokers pockets. Unfortunately, people like Felix who thought they were God’s personal trading avatar had to go and show the world what it was missing. As soon as the brokers figured out their mistake, the hole was closed and news spike trading as a viable system was dead.

The challenge was put out a couple weeks ago for anyone who was still making even marginal returns trading the news to prove it. Not a single response was given. I have no doubt that people make 100+pips on some events, but the sad truth is the losses they incur on the other reports wipe those big wins away. The question is, why?

Even outside the retail space, the prices a spike trader needs to get in don’t exist. There are 2 prices to trade in these events, the one before and the one after. If you’re trying to trade in the middle, you’re going to receive nothing but disappointment, regardless of who your broker is. All things being equal, this probably wouldn’t destroy news trading, but things are no longer equal.

Throughout 2005 and most of 2006, there was some serious disagreement regarding the direction of interest rates. Every data point was factored into trying to answer the question, “When will they stop raising rates in the US?” When they finally did stop, the debate was over so the month to month data ceased to be of critical importance. The range of movement a release generated, even on a big miss, dropped considerably because an extra 50,000 jobs or a 2 point change in a survey index wasn’t going to materially alter the feds thinking. Until those data points ARE going to change the course of interest rates, we won’t be getting the follow through necessary to make the current news spike trading environment profitable.

Given the fact that the latency arbitrage opportunity is closed, and the follow-through necessary to profit without it isn’t there, trying to make money trading news spikes in this environment is like chasing a white elephant. At some point in the future it will be viable again, but unless you take your medicine many of you won’t be around long enough to take advantage of it. So bite the bullet and learn another method of trading. Your account will thank you for it.
  • #30
  • Edited 1:19pm Feb 11, 2007 1:06pm | Edited 1:19pm
Quoting Darkstar
The sad truth is that the news spike trading gravy train has already come to an end. The very fact that people are looking to pay hundreds (or thousands) of dollars a month to get in a few pips earlier is testament to the fact that the average return for news trading has dropped considerably. Why pay for a service that makes you a few pips when you can use that money for margin and make a larger return on the gazillion pips you already make?

I myself made an assload of money trading the news, but I had no illusions that I was some super trader outsmarting the financial elite. I was exploiting an execution guarantee provided by the retail brokers who allowed me to arbitrage the latency in their price feed. The prices I traded at never existed, so the money I made came directly out of the brokers pockets. Unfortunately, people like Felix who thought they were God’s personal trading avatar had to go and show the world what it was missing. As soon as the brokers figured out their mistake, the hole was closed and news spike trading as a viable system was dead.

The challenge was put out a couple weeks ago for anyone who was still making even marginal returns trading the news to prove it. Not a single response was given. I have no doubt that people make 100+pips on some events, but the sad truth is the losses they incur on the other reports wipe those big wins away. The question is, why?

Even outside the retail space, the prices a spike trader needs to get in don’t exist. There are 2 prices to trade in these events, the one before and the one after. If you’re trying to trade in the middle, you’re going to receive nothing but disappointment, regardless of who your broker is. All things being equal, this probably wouldn’t destroy news trading, but things are no longer equal.

Throughout 2005 and most of 2006, there was some serious disagreement regarding the direction of interest rates. Every data point was factored into trying to answer the question, “When will they stop raising rates in the US?” When they finally did stop, the debate was over so the month to month data ceased to be of critical importance. The range of movement a release generated, even on a big miss, dropped considerably because an extra 50,000 jobs or a 2 point change in a survey index wasn’t going to materially alter the feds thinking. Until those data points ARE going to change the course of interest rates, we won’t be getting the follow through necessary to make the current news spike trading environment profitable.

Given the fact that the latency arbitrage opportunity is closed, and the follow-through necessary to profit without it isn’t there, trying to make money trading news spikes in this environment is like chasing a white elephant. At some point in the future it will be viable again, but unless you take your medicine many of you won’t be around long enough to take advantage of it. So bite the bullet and learn another method of trading. Your account will thank you for it.
Numbers speak louder than words...My insti cnx account says otherwise although I trade other systems I only trade systems with 90% or more WTR. News trading for me falls in that category...But you have to be selective with what and how you trade. You can lose on any system if you don't do your homework...Crybabies everywhere
  • #31
  • Feb 11, 2007 1:21pm Feb 11, 2007 1:21pm
Quoting zarni
I only trade systems with 90% or more WTR.
Ohh yeah, and what type of systems are those?
  • #32
  • Feb 11, 2007 1:22pm Feb 11, 2007 1:22pm
Quoting Darkstar
Ohh yeah, and what type of systems are those?
I will let you guess that for yourself...
  • #33
  • Feb 11, 2007 1:39pm Feb 11, 2007 1:39pm
Quoting zarni
I will let you guess that for yourself...
Yeah, I'm calling BS. You have made some tall claims in this thread and don't want to back any of them up with the tiniest bit of evidence. It isn't that hard to let people know the general idea behind what you’re doing without exposing your exact system. It's doubtful you’re even on Currenex because you can't even share which broker you’re with. Given your lack of sincerity with these immaterial issues, I fail to see how you expect anyone to believe your ridiculous claims regarding your returns.

I fully realize you don't care if I believe you, but the community isn't going to believe you either. Going forward you may as well spare us your vaulted claims; we won't be inflating your ego for you any time soon.
  • #34
  • Feb 11, 2007 1:50pm Feb 11, 2007 1:50pm
Quoting Darkstar
Yeah, I'm calling BS. You have made some tall claims in this thread and don't want to back any of them up with the tiniest bit of evidence. It isn't that hard to let people know the general idea behind what you’re doing without exposing your exact system. It's doubtful you’re even on Currenex because you can't even share which broker you’re with. Given your lack of sincerity with these immaterial issues, I fail to see how you expect anyone to believe your ridiculous claims regarding your returns.

I fully realize you don't care if I believe you, but the community isn't going to believe you either. Going forward you may as well spare us your vaulted claims; we won't be inflating your ego for you any time soon.
Hehe you are funny. I don't care a damn if ANYBODY believes me.
I am just exposing those who hand out advice when it's nonsense...

oh here is some evidence for you:


http://www.fx-performance.com/Defaul...:0&sorting=2:1


And this is just a technical trading system I tinker with. My top systems I keep to myself.
  • #35
  • Feb 11, 2007 2:15pm Feb 11, 2007 2:15pm
Quoting zarni
oh here is some evidence for you:


http://www.fx-performance.com/Defaul...:0&sorting=2:1
Are we supposed to be looking at something in particular?
  • #36
  • Feb 11, 2007 3:14pm Feb 11, 2007 3:14pm
Quoting Darkstar
Are we supposed to be looking at something in particular?
Well I guess you dont take a hint.
So here I will spell it out to you "Take a look at number 1"
  • #37
  • Feb 11, 2007 4:57pm Feb 11, 2007 4:57pm
Not to be rude, I suggest that we all go back to the subject matter of "AutoClick" services.

As far as opinions/points raised in previous messages, it has come to my attention that AutoClick is a double edged sword: "We may get filled anywhere from pre spike price to peak of the spike".

I have Historic Charts to show what risk we are all up against should we get filled away from the "desired" pre-spike/pre-release price. Even on a devastating October 6 NFP, I did not see prices shooting up 50 pips in a single tick and retracing 50 pips back on the next tick. The price were changing 5~10 pips per tick and there were enough time to close it for profit too - I know I did and i dont even have the experience/knowlegde what "revision" were.

What if we were indeed filled at the top of the spike? This is why we have to choose the "deviation trigger" wisely. When there is a huge deviation, we have almost zero chance of a major retrace after the initial spike. Do the research, look at the Historic Charts for comparision.

Ahh yes, the last UK CPI and US Retail Sales were quick reversals. Felix lost money on the US Retail Sales inspite of the HUGE deviation. But the loss should not be huge; after all, it is NOT a 1 tick total reversal!

I personally would like to get my hands dirty with my broker + Autoclick. So what if I *CONTINUOUSLY GET FRUSTRATED* with my brokers? I'd rather get frustrated with my brokers and run away with THEIR MONEY trading the news (4 of them), than be frustrated with my TA Trades and the brokers running away with my money. I admit I suck 100% with TA. Everytime I try TA, I loose money! There is no point for me to trade TA while I suck at it. So why in hell should I trade TA? Its like Michael Jordan; he finally realized he suck at Baseball and returned to Basketball.

"Do what we are good at, not what we are told to."
  • #38
  • Feb 11, 2007 5:53pm Feb 11, 2007 5:53pm
Quoting zarni
Well I guess you dont take a hint.
So here I will spell it out to you "Take a look at number 1"
You mean the uber system that has an average 54% winrate and loses money on almost every non-carry trade pair?

http://www.thetechdepartment.com//zarni.gif

Congratz on a great month by the way.

And I'm done with this thread. I said my piece about the autoclick and wish everyone luck who continues to utilize it. Just be careful and track your trades.
  • #39
  • Edited 6:32pm Feb 11, 2007 6:20pm | Edited 6:32pm
Quoting Darkstar
You mean the uber system that has an average 54% winrate and loses money on almost every non-carry trade pair?

http://www.thetechdepartment.com//zarni.gif

Congratz on a great month by the way.

And I'm done with this thread. I said my piece about the autoclick and wish everyone luck who continues to utilize it. Just be careful and track your trades.
Never said that I am good with other pairs.
I am not trading anything but JPY on that system in more than 4 months. The others just dont work. Thanks for the congrats.
  • #40
  • Feb 11, 2007 6:33pm Feb 11, 2007 6:33pm
Quoting BurgerKing
Not to be rude, I suggest that we all go back to the subject matter of "AutoClick" services.

As far as opinions/points raised in previous messages, it has come to my attention that AutoClick is a double edged sword: "We may get filled anywhere from pre spike price to peak of the spike".

I have Historic Charts to show what risk we are all up against should we get filled away from the "desired" pre-spike/pre-release price. Even on a devastating October 6 NFP, I did not see prices shooting up 50 pips in a single tick and retracing 50 pips back on the next tick. The price were changing 5~10 pips per tick and there were enough time to close it for profit too - I know I did and i dont even have the experience/knowlegde what "revision" were.

What if we were indeed filled at the top of the spike? This is why we have to choose the "deviation trigger" wisely. When there is a huge deviation, we have almost zero chance of a major retrace after the initial spike. Do the research, look at the Historic Charts for comparision.

Ahh yes, the last UK CPI and US Retail Sales were quick reversals. Felix lost money on the US Retail Sales inspite of the HUGE deviation. But the loss should not be huge; after all, it is NOT a 1 tick total reversal!

I personally would like to get my hands dirty with my broker + Autoclick. So what if I *CONTINUOUSLY GET FRUSTRATED* with my brokers? I'd rather get frustrated with my brokers and run away with THEIR MONEY trading the news (4 of them), than be frustrated with my TA Trades and the brokers running away with my money. I admit I suck 100% with TA. Everytime I try TA, I loose money! There is no point for me to trade TA while I suck at it. So why in hell should I trade TA? Its like Michael Jordan; he finally realized he suck at Baseball and returned to Basketball.

"Do what we are good at, not what we are told to."
Right on!
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