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What if everybody trades ?

  • #1
  • First Post: May 8, 2008 2:44pm May 8, 2008 2:44pm
Hello Volks,
there is a think I dont understand, maybe I think there are some trading strategies that realy works and which are not hard to do just by some limitorders, and know let us think everybody do this, if its so hoe will then go to work in future if they can make so much money at tradeing the markets, do you understand what I mean, ok, not everybody find strategies like that really works but if one find one he can tell it to everybody and how does the markets can be exists then in future if somethink like this will hepen, if everybody have a tradingstrategie and works from home and the market conditions dont change, hoe will go work then what will then happen, have anybody think about that and ideas, I my self dont know so much from the markets but that is a think that i always be thinking about????
  • #2
  • May 8, 2008 2:46pm May 8, 2008 2:46pm
sounds like a good idea. Even if we push 5-10 pips successfully everytime, that will be great !!!
  • #3
  • May 22, 2008 12:23am May 22, 2008 12:23am
I've thought of that several times before. I think the real reason why a highly reliable winning strategy wouldn't produce thousands of winning traders is that people deviate from the strategy, try to blend in their own methods, etc. Even the slightest deviation from the original strategy could produce consistent losses. Another factor is that people use different brokers and different charting software, which easily creates various results. Essentially, human emotion (greed, fear) plays the biggest factor in this conundrum.

As far as automated systems go, no system works all the time. The market is always changing. The automated system cannot learn from it's mistakes, like a human can. As of yet, we do not have the technology to create artificial intelligence, and that's why I believe the most successful traders are the ones who find a reliable system and know how to tweak it accordingly to the ever changing market conditions. Wouldn't you agree?
  • #4
  • May 22, 2008 12:49am May 22, 2008 12:49am
I've thought of this too.... Someone gets on every radio station and every tv channel and tells EVERYBODY to buy EUR/USD at 1.4000 and then wait until it reaches 1.8000 to sell it. What if everyone actually followed this plan? We'd all make millions! The point is, it wouldn't work. When the price reaches 1.8000, it becomes a game of who sells it the quickest. If you're the last person to sell, you lose all your money because the 60 million people who sold it 2 seconds before you have plummeted the price back down.

So you get clever... Hmmm... instead of selling at 1.8000, I'll sell at 1.7000!! That way I won't have to compete with 60 million people when the price reaches 1.8000! But the guy next to you is thinking, "I'll sell this sucker at 1.6000 to play it safe. And so on.... So what essentially happens is that people sell it off at all sorts of different levels, and the price goes haywire.

The same principle applies if 100 million people followed the exact same indicators at the exact same time to buy the eur/usd. They wouldn't wait for the indicator to show a "sell" signal to take profit. Different people would sell way before then, to beat other traders to the punch.

This theory explains the law, "For every winner, there is a loser." In order for me to survive (eat), something has to die... whether it's a chicken or a cow, etc.
  • #5
  • May 22, 2008 9:36am May 22, 2008 9:36am
if you get 5 pip every day its ok isnt it?
  • #6
  • May 22, 2008 1:17pm May 22, 2008 1:17pm
I dont knwo I am just losing in the markets till know.
  • #7
  • May 22, 2008 2:59pm May 22, 2008 2:59pm
Quoting kluster1999
I've thought of this too.... Someone gets on every radio station and every tv channel and tells EVERYBODY to buy EUR/USD at 1.4000 and then wait until it reaches 1.8000 to sell it. What if everyone actually followed this plan? We'd all make millions! The point is, it wouldn't work. When the price reaches 1.8000, it becomes a game of who sells it the quickest. If you're the last person to sell, you lose all your money because the 60 million people who sold it 2 seconds before you have plummeted the price back down.

So you get clever... Hmmm... instead of selling at 1.8000, I'll sell at 1.7000!! That way I won't have to compete with 60 million people when the price reaches 1.8000! But the guy next to you is thinking, "I'll sell this sucker at 1.6000 to play it safe. And so on.... So what essentially happens is that people sell it off at all sorts of different levels, and the price goes haywire.

The same principle applies if 100 million people followed the exact same indicators at the exact same time to buy the eur/usd. They wouldn't wait for the indicator to show a "sell" signal to take profit. Different people would sell way before then, to beat other traders to the punch.

This theory explains the law, "For every winner, there is a loser." In order for me to survive (eat), something has to die... whether it's a chicken or a cow, etc.
Great explanation Kluster.
Quoting MRmojtaba
if you get 5 pip every day its ok isnt it?
Same here. OK, maybe even 10, but no need for more than that when you got brother leverage on you side.
On the path to Enrichment.
  • #8
  • May 22, 2008 5:22pm May 22, 2008 5:22pm
Quoting kluster1999
I've thought of this too.... Someone gets on every radio station and every tv channel and tells EVERYBODY to buy EUR/USD at 1.4000 and then wait until it reaches 1.8000 to sell it. What if everyone actually followed this plan? We'd all make millions! The point is, it wouldn't work. When the price reaches 1.8000, it becomes a game of who sells it the quickest. If you're the last person to sell, you lose all your money because the 60 million people who sold it 2 seconds before you have plummeted the price back down.

So you get clever... Hmmm... instead of selling at 1.8000, I'll sell at 1.7000!! That way I won't have to compete with 60 million people when the price reaches 1.8000! But the guy next to you is thinking, "I'll sell this sucker at 1.6000 to play it safe. And so on.... So what essentially happens is that people sell it off at all sorts of different levels, and the price goes haywire.

The same principle applies if 100 million people followed the exact same indicators at the exact same time to buy the eur/usd. They wouldn't wait for the indicator to show a "sell" signal to take profit. Different people would sell way before then, to beat other traders to the punch.

This theory explains the law, "For every winner, there is a loser." In order for me to survive (eat), something has to die... whether it's a chicken or a cow, etc.
If EVERYBODY wanted to BUY euros, that means that NOBODY wants to sell them. So, who would EVERYBODY buy them from?Have a think.
  • #9
  • May 23, 2008 1:29am May 23, 2008 1:29am
Quoting TheGreatMilenko
If EVERYBODY wanted to BUY euros, that means that NOBODY wants to sell them. So, who would EVERYBODY buy them from?Have a think.
Someone who REALLY wants dollars ?
On the path to Enrichment.
  • #10
  • May 23, 2008 8:44am May 23, 2008 8:44am
Quoting Jurrasic
Someone who REALLY wants dollars ?
If SOMEONE wants to buy dollars , that means that NOT EVRERYBODY , wants to buy euros. Have another think.
  • #11
  • May 23, 2008 3:48pm May 23, 2008 3:48pm
Obviously.. I'm talking about a VERY LARGE number of people, not the entire world...

Quoting TheGreatMilenko
If EVERYBODY wanted to BUY euros, that means that NOBODY wants to sell them. So, who would EVERYBODY buy them from?Have a think.
  • #12
  • May 23, 2008 4:05pm May 23, 2008 4:05pm
Quoting Heino
Hello Volks,
there is a think I dont understand, maybe I think there are some trading strategies that realy works and which are not hard to do just by some limitorders, and know let us think everybody do this, if its so hoe will then go to work in future if they can make so much money at tradeing the markets, do you understand what I mean, ok, not everybody find strategies like that really works but if one find one he can tell it to everybody and how does the markets can be exists then in future if somethink like this will hepen, if everybody have a tradingstrategie and works from home and the market conditions dont change, hoe will go work then what will then happen, have anybody think about that and ideas, I my self dont know so much from the markets but that is a think that i always be thinking about????
The huge demand for laborers to build all the pippers' homes would make me want to go into contracting so that I can take all of your money since no one wants to do it, and it is in so much demand. Id make more money building houses for forex traders than trading forex with everyone else.
  • #13
  • May 23, 2008 4:07pm May 23, 2008 4:07pm
Opposite side of the contract issues aside... let's face it, it's a dog eat dog world. As soon as a lot of people collude on a trading strategy someone smarter with more money will figure out the best time to take the opposite side of the trade... and knock ya'll out. I already trade a few strategies that are "anti" some of the popular ones on here... they work pretty well.

The most efficient way to trade, theoretically speaking, is to find some unique stuff and never ever say anything about it to anyone. Take the money and run.
  • #14
  • May 23, 2008 4:07pm May 23, 2008 4:07pm
The retail market is hardly considered "everybody" the retail market only makes up 5% of the daily turnover.
  • #15
  • May 23, 2008 7:41pm May 23, 2008 7:41pm
Quoting kluster1999
Obviously.. I'm talking about a VERY LARGE number of people, not the entire world...
To me, EVERYBODY, is not the same thing as a VERY LARGE number of people.The entire world does not trade on the fx market.

I wish you the very best of luck with your trading.
  • #16
  • Jun 5, 2008 12:44am Jun 5, 2008 12:44am
But still it would be cool.. if we could influence the market
  • #17
  • Jun 5, 2008 1:00am Jun 5, 2008 1:00am
Unless your broker is an ECN your money is stuck in your retail broker's (read bucketshop) pocket and doesnt go near the actual counterparty market. Such retail traders dont affect the interbank, ie the real market at all.
Lemming Forex! The Way to Trade....
  • #18
  • Jul 20, 2008 8:58am Jul 20, 2008 8:58am
Putto, retail traders do counter significant exposure to the market by placing real orders in the market. Obviously they do this on a collective basis - not on individual trades - but certainly the better regulated ones are forced to limit their exposure if their overall position is skewed to one side of the market or the other.
  • #19
  • Jul 20, 2008 9:50am Jul 20, 2008 9:50am
Good post but just remember the big fish will always eat the smaller ones?Retial traders will never be able to see the big picture fully
  • #20
  • Jul 20, 2008 10:06am Jul 20, 2008 10:06am
Quoting leo9
sounds like a good idea. Even if we push 5-10 pips successfully everytime, that will be great !!!

people talk about making 5 pips, 10 pips, 15 pips, 20 pips. Are these succesful traders at all ? or maybe they are constant scalpers, then i would have no say. Most important, imagine the long waves made by the yen pairs this last week and many other times, wave that could be as much as 150-400pips. All this people telling me they are ok with this ridiculously low number of pips all the times, does it mean they cannot catch up with all these waves?
To me its a nuisance talking 5 pips, 10 pips , 15 pips "AS MY EVERYDAY PHENOMENON", becuase what would those ones do to buid my account. i have many times traded all this waves making 100-250pips though with small lot sizes in relation to my account size. if i would have to have it as part of me that 5pips, 10 pips,15pips as my target evryday, i am sorry its a nuisance when i know there could be long waves during the week.
know thy edge and abide by it ! 4 in it shall thou be successful !
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