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  • #961
  • Edited 10:11pm Apr 20, 2008 9:58pm | Edited 10:11pm
Well, I've given them the benefit of the doubt long enough now.

I was with PS as from the beginning and remember very well how the 2 brohta's from another motha were together because : They have the same trading style...... they work well together..... then 2 months later Jason comes up and tells us that they had to end their relationship because they come from different backgrounds and different trading styles???

I was silly enough to pay for a 6 month subscription based on what I saw in Januaray and February.

Then J dumps on in Hosea's room and and keeps us up to date in a skype room!?! Not exactly what I paid for.

Then again I have no hopes for a refund, I am not US based so it would be very hard for me to start a legal procedure against him.

One thing our Saint Jay can be sure off, if he ever makes it to my side of the world he'll go back to the US in a wheelchair and that goes for Kinn as well.

Anway the best of luck for all of you who got or will get a refund, I'll just write my 1800 USD off as a bad business decision on my part and sincerely hope that one day or another they'll get what they deserve.

As for Hosea, he still has the benefit of the doubt but if he is under Jason's "guidance" it won't last long before he also falls in the PS grave.
Enter Signature
  • #962
  • Edited 10:59pm Apr 20, 2008 10:50pm | Edited 10:59pm
IMHO....

Bad trading?...Yes!
Bad business planning?....Yes!
A-hole attitude?...Yes! OMG YES!
Screwed over a lot of people?...Yes!
Scam?....Not really by my definition...

My main point...if he said that he wasnt going to give you a refund and you signed a paper saying that...kinda dishonest to demand a refund and threaten sue or to kill his cat if you dont get it....you can ask but you agreed, regardless of anything else....sucks but still...

Granted, its easy for me to stand on principle in this...I only lost 1 month payment and (but i did lose 1k of trading money) with Jason. But i think Johninthai is right just to write it off as a bad business expense. In the future...do what you can to protect yourself and watch what you agree too...and we all need to get trading working for ourselves so we arent dependent on these guys!

Another point...everyone has bad trading months. I have a friend who has a trading business for 20 years almost and he has had BAD losing months but he makes a VERY good living off trading nonetheless. Its not about winning every trade, its about being profitable OVERALL!



Lastly, BEWARE of Hosea! His Risk to Reward is HORRIBLE... Please, go through EVERY trade he has called this month and you will see that it is a losing month if you did exactly as he says. As others have said he inflates his Take PRofit far beyond what he will usually get and when you get your stop loss hit, it wipes out your all your wins and then some.

Just my opinion guys...but what do i know, im a bootlicker
  • #963
  • Apr 20, 2008 11:32pm Apr 20, 2008 11:32pm
Quoting radicalboy
IMHO....

Bad trading?...Yes!
Bad business planning?....Yes!
A-hole attitude?...Yes! OMG YES!
Screwed over a lot of people?...Yes!
Scam?....Not really by my definition...

My main point...if he said that he wasnt going to give you a refund and you signed a paper saying that...kinda dishonest to demand a refund and threaten sue or to kill his cat if you dont get it....you can ask but you agreed, regardless of anything else....sucks but still...

......
And following that logic is the reason why this guy is still scamming people. This guy needs to be put out of business once and forever.

I'm thankful I didn't sign up for his scam, but I was close.
  • #964
  • Apr 21, 2008 6:11am Apr 21, 2008 6:11am
Well, i didn't take hosea's last 2 150-200 pips loss each trade. I did take the one from london...entered for Long right above 205 and a 70 pips SL.. WELL JUST GOT STOPPED...the good thing is he had 3 entries....high 205 and medium 205 im glad i got in low 205 so i only lost 70 pips...some poeple lost 150 pips....The other good thing is i did 1 mini...so no big deal...but i don't think ill even want to rejoin for the 85.00 it used to be...
  • #965
  • Apr 21, 2008 6:32am Apr 21, 2008 6:32am
Quoting radicalboy
IMHO....

Bad trading?...Yes!
Bad business planning?....Yes!
A-hole attitude?...Yes! OMG YES!
Screwed over a lot of people?...Yes!
Scam?....Not really by my definition...

My main point...if he said that he wasnt going to give you a refund and you signed a paper saying that...kinda dishonest to demand a refund and threaten sue or to kill his cat if you dont get it....you can ask but you agreed, regardless of anything else....sucks but still...
I see your point but must say I disagree. I believe that subscribers paid for a service and had every reason to expect that service be delivered. I don't want to rehash all the reasons why this service was at best 'underdelivered' - and I'm not referring to the losing trades.
For the money we paid I think we deseved exemplary service, instead we received a circus of big egos, squabbling, arrogance and lies. For the last week there was virtually nothing (remember the chatwatchers joke) - Jane has since told us that they were trading their own accounts - further insult to injury!
I believe signing the waiver protected Pipsnipers from issuing refunds due to trading losses; and let's face the reality - people did not subscribe $325/month to 'observe' other traders taking trades. This would easily be proved in a court of law. People subscribed to a trading room that provided a signal service. The question is 'was this service provided?' - arguably to an extent it was, however I would say it was akin to a horrible meal with terrible service at an expensive restaurant, or a night in a 5 star motel and you discover nothing works in your room and it smells of smoke and the bed sags or whatever. You wouldn't pay for either of these would you? I don't think something has to be a SCAM before you are entitled to a refund.
  • #966
  • Apr 21, 2008 9:14am Apr 21, 2008 9:14am
Quoting afflock
Well, i didn't take hosea's last 2 150-200 pips loss each trade. I did take the one from london...entered for Long right above 205 and a 70 pips SL.. WELL JUST GOT STOPPED...the good thing is he had 3 entries....high 205 and medium 205 im glad i got in low 205 so i only lost 70 pips...some poeple lost 150 pips....The other good thing is i did 1 mini...so no big deal...but i don't think ill even want to rejoin for the 85.00 it used to be...
i missed london's call and i'm glad i did! what did he talk about last night about his trades? i missed that too. now he's talking about a comfort level of 1-10 and this was a 4-5? whats that all about?

he should stick to his confident, higher probability trades and pass on the riskier ones. he's lost on all of them

i agree about rejoining, even at 100, i doubt i would
  • #967
  • Apr 21, 2008 9:19am Apr 21, 2008 9:19am
Quoting radicalboy
IMHO....

Bad trading?...Yes!
Bad business planning?....Yes!
A-hole attitude?...Yes! OMG YES!
Screwed over a lot of people?...Yes!
Scam?....Not really by my definition...

My main point...if he said that he wasnt going to give you a refund and you signed a paper saying that...kinda dishonest to demand a refund and threaten sue or to kill his cat if you dont get it....you can ask but you agreed, regardless of anything else....sucks but still...

Granted, its easy for me to stand on principle in this...I only lost 1 month payment and (but i did lose 1k of trading money) with Jason. But i think Johninthai is right just to write it off as a bad business expense. In the future...do what you can to protect yourself and watch what you agree too...and we all need to get trading working for ourselves so we arent dependent on these guys!

Another point...everyone has bad trading months. I have a friend who has a trading business for 20 years almost and he has had BAD losing months but he makes a VERY good living off trading nonetheless. Its not about winning every trade, its about being profitable OVERALL!



Lastly, BEWARE of Hosea! His Risk to Reward is HORRIBLE... Please, go through EVERY trade he has called this month and you will see that it is a losing month if you did exactly as he says. As others have said he inflates his Take PRofit far beyond what he will usually get and when you get your stop loss hit, it wipes out your all your wins and then some.

Just my opinion guys...but what do i know, im a bootlicker

... and of the worst kind. It is people like you who encouraged Jason & Co. by contantly crawling up his backside and indirectly prolonged the scamming activity. Shame on you "buddy"!
  • #968
  • Apr 21, 2008 10:35am Apr 21, 2008 10:35am
Quoting afflock
Well, i didn't take hosea's last 2 150-200 pips loss each trade. I did take the one from london...entered for Long right above 205 and a 70 pips SL.. WELL JUST GOT STOPPED...the good thing is he had 3 entries....high 205 and medium 205 im glad i got in low 205 so i only lost 70 pips...some poeple lost 150 pips....The other good thing is i did 1 mini...so no big deal...but i don't think ill even want to rejoin for the 85.00 it used to be...

looks like Jason's karma is setting in?
  • #969
  • Apr 21, 2008 10:39am Apr 21, 2008 10:39am
Quoting radicalboy
IMHO....

Bad trading?...Yes!
Bad business planning?....Yes!
A-hole attitude?...Yes! OMG YES!
Screwed over a lot of people?...Yes!
Scam?....Not really by my definition...

My main point...if he said that he wasnt going to give you a refund and you signed a paper saying that...kinda dishonest to demand a refund and threaten sue or to kill his cat if you dont get it....you can ask but you agreed, regardless of anything else....sucks but still...

Granted, its easy for me to stand on principle in this...I only lost 1 month payment and (but i did lose 1k of trading money) with Jason. But i think Johninthai is right just to write it off as a bad business expense. In the future...do what you can to protect yourself and watch what you agree too...and we all need to get trading working for ourselves so we arent dependent on these guys!

Another point...everyone has bad trading months. I have a friend who has a trading business for 20 years almost and he has had BAD losing months but he makes a VERY good living off trading nonetheless. Its not about winning every trade, its about being profitable OVERALL!



Lastly, BEWARE of Hosea! His Risk to Reward is HORRIBLE... Please, go through EVERY trade he has called this month and you will see that it is a losing month if you did exactly as he says. As others have said he inflates his Take PRofit far beyond what he will usually get and when you get your stop loss hit, it wipes out your all your wins and then some.

Just my opinion guys...but what do i know, im a bootlicker
if you dont like the word scamm then call it fraud, because that's what it was! we did not join for jason only but kinn as well. we did not join to trade in our demo with people we never heard of. we did not join so he could tell us to be patient while 700 pips went by while he traded his account behind the scenes. we were told bad months would be 500 pips. that is fraudulent my friend, IMO
  • #970
  • Apr 21, 2008 12:31pm Apr 21, 2008 12:31pm
Quoting pippers
i missed london's call and i'm glad i did! what did he talk about last night about his trades? i missed that too. now he's talking about a comfort level of 1-10 and this was a 4-5? whats that all about?

he should stick to his confident, higher probability trades and pass on the riskier ones. he's lost on all of them

i agree about rejoining, even at 100, i doubt i would
My trading partner and I were talking about this last week. Be patient and hear me out. Would it be possible that Hosea called a few good smaller trades and now is dumping really horrible ones on us so that we WILL NOT re-sign for next month. That way, he got a lot of hook-line-and-sinkers to fall for his own trading training at 3k per person (first training was what, 1 hour long on Friday). He's made his money for the year so he's calling bad trades so we'll all leave and he can forget about having to be "on call" for the rest of us. Just a thought!

I took two horrible losses from those two trades from last week. Lost all my profits with Hosea to date. If anyone who can read a stochastic and knows anything about big moves looked at the charts today when Hosea called a BUY trade, you would have known that sucker was going down. But then again, I think that these guys prey on those who do NOT know how to properly analyze charts and who do NOT understand the premise behind the call in the first place. Make sense?

I won't be taking Hosea's service for May. Those who do sign up will have to make money (I hope for your sakes) without me. I'll be trading with my trading partner. Meanwhile, there is a core group of us on here that seems to have some pretty high morals and standards. We might consider privately sharing skype i.d.'s and trading together. You know, friends helping friends...for FREE!!!! I'd be down for that!

On the PS issue - I heard from the Australian police. They said that each of us needs to file a police report with our local police department about the PS scam, provide all the documentation possible, and demand an investigation. From that point, the local authorities are supposed to contact the Australian police and they will then provide relief for us. Australian police also said that we really REALLY need to follow up with the FBI on a "white collar crime" claim against Jason, also naming Kinn and then the FBI can get the Australian authorities involved on a federal level. I have already filed my claim with the IC3 and I would hope that each of you do also. That is the only way we will ever be able to bring these crooks to justice.

Take care gang! Be safe traders! Make loads of $$$!
  • #971
  • Apr 21, 2008 1:44pm Apr 21, 2008 1:44pm
Quoting Dxeechk
On the PS issue - I heard from the Australian police. They said that each of us needs to file a police report with our local police department about the PS scam, provide all the documentation possible, and demand an investigation. From that point, the local authorities are supposed to contact the Australian police and they will then provide relief for us. Australian police also said that we really REALLY need to follow up with the FBI on a "white collar crime" claim against Jason, also naming Kinn and then the FBI can get the Australian authorities involved on a federal level. I have already filed my claim with the IC3 and I would hope that each of you do also. That is the only way we will ever be able to bring these crooks to justice.

Take care gang! Be safe traders! Make loads of $$$!
Here is the website that the Australian authorities told me to take a look at and report to: http://www.scamwatch.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/693900
  • #972
  • Apr 21, 2008 7:01pm Apr 21, 2008 7:01pm
Quoting lazytrader
Like I said last week, the only silver lining to this sorry mess was the opportunity to cross paths with some bright and sincere people.
Merino's idea is a just an example of that. Like they say, "When life hands you a lemon, make lemonade"

I'm currently evaluating two such rooms so please put me on the list.

P.S.
Tatton has my vote as well

I'll go on that list...My trading partner and I have created a new chart format and are testing it ourselves for the next few days. I'll keep you posted, but it actually relies heavily on fib ema's and the candles are gone. You just use it along WITH a candle chart. So far, it's really pretty accurate!
  • #973
  • Apr 21, 2008 8:45pm Apr 21, 2008 8:45pm
Quoting merino
I had the idea for all expipsnipers that maybe interested in still looking for that elusive Holy Grail Trading Signal Callroom.
We each pick a room that "Sounds"promising and pay and test it out for the month(Dont know if that is long enough?)We then can get together in our group and see whether it was good or another crap deal,pun intended.
This way we all dont have to pay for each room by ourselves as Im addicted.
So far Ive contacted Johninthai and Tatton and they like the idea and are already in several different rooms.
Im thinking if you arent recognized by our group then you wont be included,saves someone sneaking in and promoting their rubbish.
As part of the results we can also come up with those rooms that maybe teaching their method as well.
Any feedback welcome as well as any ideas on how to communicate or get this together if anyone else interested.
Just an afterthought,if theres enough of us, maybe 2 or 3
can put into one signal room,bit of organising though.
I vote for tatton haha
Dont forget,this is for those who are interested,dont want any sermons thanks.
Hi
I like your idea. You can put me on your list also.
I'm in a few different rooms at the moment.
New rooms seem to be popping up every day after the PS debacle...
Things you should know.
  • #974
  • Apr 21, 2008 9:23pm Apr 21, 2008 9:23pm
Hey guys, this situation is horrible i hope everyone get their money back.


As a community we need to come together and help each other, no man is an island, evaluating different services, trading methods and help each other keep their pips and full the bank account is what our goal should be, my money goes mainly to helping others, lets come together and try to put this horrible situation behind us and be a blessing to many.


May the Lord bless you all.

([email protected]) or MSN ([email protected])
  • #975
  • Apr 22, 2008 7:42am Apr 22, 2008 7:42am
Well, back to back trades that i didn't take....they where both good trades. More like it. He actually can over IM and said im in atXXX price. That was good at least he told everyone what price he got in...but he hardly calls his exits so don't know how they will manage the pip count
  • #976
  • Apr 22, 2008 8:25am Apr 22, 2008 8:25am
Hi All,
Count me in on the community for the trading room evaluation. Great idea and a way to truly help each other. PM me and I will send you my email. Right now I am only in Hosea's room, but do not intend to continue for May. Let me know what I can do for the group. Thanks.
  • #977
  • Apr 22, 2008 12:36pm Apr 22, 2008 12:36pm
sounds like you guys are having fun. Hope you all get what you want.


Pipmachine
  • #978
  • Apr 23, 2008 5:25am Apr 23, 2008 5:25am
A WHOPPING 6 TRADES AND -15 PIPS THIS MORNING. THIS GUY IS AWESOME. I'LL PAY FOR THAT SERVICE!!!
  • #979
  • Apr 23, 2008 10:47am Apr 23, 2008 10:47am
I looked at Kinn's trades and even with an ECN broker you have to pay 2 pips commission on average on top of the spread to be at break even, so what does that live the participants with? It is a tough call to follow where the average profitable trade is under 10 pips. in April there were 145 trades taken X 2( for the 2 pips commission per trade )that is -290pips just for commissions..... Seems like the risk factor is out of control 75 pips profit for 145 trades..WOW It seems a bit risky.
  • #980
  • Apr 23, 2008 11:39am Apr 23, 2008 11:39am
Quoting timewilltell
i hope that it is true!
2nd that....I hope Mr. Integrity gets whats coming to him...but to be honest I wasn't surprised with the outcome once things fell apart considering the fact that this so called trader was former car salesman....everything that came out of his mouth were sales pitch
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