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How many full time traders here and other questions?

  • #1
  • First Post: Oct 11, 2007 3:11am Oct 11, 2007 3:11am
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
make some money, have some fun, leave some footprints
  • #2
  • Oct 11, 2007 3:31am Oct 11, 2007 3:31am
I am trading full time. I tried once before a few years ago (U.S. securities), and failed early due to my lack of discipline. This time I'm trading FX, and I couldn't be happier about gapless mornings. Also I'm older and wiser

If you intend to trade full time, you need to be able to afford to do so. Everyone has bills. If you plan to take the time away from a paying job to develop your methods, then you've got to be able to afford to do so. If you already have a profitable method (or methods) which you've developed working on it part time (which I would say is very hard to do), then go for it as long as you've got a hold of all the business factors of actually running your own business. Trading is a business like any other business in the sense that you have to risk capatial and time, that you have to strive for the best margins, and that you have to manage your books well... while hoping for return on your investment. If you've never managed anything (people, or a business of another kind), you may find some of the above challenging.

The uncertainty of the income can be difficult. It's not very different than a comish based sales job in that sense, but even with sales you generally have some level of pay that you get no matter what. Not so with trading.

Trading is also a job where you can LOSE money. You don't find that in too many other types of jobs. Conversely, trading also rewards you for how hard you work (in terms of learning, testing, etc.). Many jobs will pay you whatever they pay you, and while there are bonuses, trading can reward you at a level much higher than your typical bonus structure ever would... based on your hard work.

Trading is a lonley gig at times. My wife will observe and provide comments and thoughts at times. Most importantly she'll listen to me bloviate about the most recent cool thing I've learned or worked our in my methods . Even still, it's me and the charts. It's stuff to read and study, and endless more stuff to read and study. It's also nice ot be able to work from home and be with my family though. My kid can sit on my lap while I work. Hard to beat that. I can blast Mortification, Extol, Crowbar, Hatebreed, 50 cent, etc as loud as I want and no boss is going to come tell me to turn it down So there are certaily many perks.

Trading can be rough mentally. You will think you've got it nailed down 1000 different times. The good news is that with each successive disappointment, if you take it the right way and learn from it, it gets easier to take the disappointment.... and each time you get smarter. Dilligence is a much if you want to trade full time.

So that's my 2 pips. Take care.
  • #3
  • Oct 11, 2007 3:41am Oct 11, 2007 3:41am
Thx a lot Pip Hunter! You mentioned hardwork many times. I'll note that down, and business-mind.
Thank you and good trading!
make some money, have some fun, leave some footprints
  • #4
  • Oct 16, 2007 3:03am Oct 16, 2007 3:03am
I was (as I'm sure you were) hoping to hear from other full time traders. I suppose I am the only one then
  • #5
  • Oct 16, 2007 5:57am Oct 16, 2007 5:57am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
Hi boostrade,

I WAS a full time trader - now I am back at work but hopefully you can learn something from my experience.

I will go into a little more detail but the whole experience can be summed up as follows: I left work and over the course of a few months lost all my money. I went back to work and since being back in the office I have managed to recoup all my losses and make a huge deal more in the process.

The reasons for my failure as a full time trader was that I left work with no strategy. I knew this at the time - the reason I left was to focus my full attention on the market and hopefully build a strategy. The mistake was that even though I had this in mind, I was expecting to make a living in the process.

What happened is that with no income, I got more and more stressed over how I was going to pay bills and took excessive risk as time went by and also ended up taking trades that didn't have a high probability of working because I became desperate.

I also battled with a few other problems being a full time trader. The things you should be aware of are:

1. It is a very lonely job. I have made friends on forums that I speak too on a daily basis but invariably I found that if we spoke of the markets (which of course our conversation turned too) then we would often have different opinions which could distract me badly from my goals - especially when I was still without a clear strategy/plan in mind. So speaking to them wasn't always a good idea. My main friends were at in their full time jobs and while some were on email/msn - there was always that feeling that I was on my own. There was no one else around to properly talk too. I am 28 and I am not married with no children plus I lived on my own at the time which I guess didn't help things either.

2. It is very easy to end up trading to combat boredom. It is vital that you structure your day. I would find myself sitting down to my desk with my morning coffee and then pulling up the charts and looking for a trade. If I didn't find one in the forex markets, I would start looking at other markets such as stocks or commodities. It is human nature to feel like you are working for your money and to feel that you are doing something. But as traders, the real money is to be made waiting on the sidelines for that profitable opportunity. If you are a day trader then this might not be so much of an issue but if you are a position trader like I was this could be a real problem.

When I went back to work full time, I had a stable income which meant I could wait for decent setups - I didn't need to make money urgently. I had my actual work (journalism and IT) to concentrate on so I wasn't sitting there looking for a position to combat boredom. I had the benefit of social interaction which helps if you want to talk to someone about something other than the markets.

On the downside - it's an office job and I hate it. But as far as my trading goes it is the best thing at the moment.

Of course the advantages of being self employed speak for themselves so I don't think I need to go into that.

I hope this helps you and I wish you all the best in your career.

Wiz
  • #6
  • Oct 16, 2007 5:57am Oct 16, 2007 5:57am
I earn enough from trading to live in recent months, but it's not my sole source of income. I have many other investments as well. Stocks, Real estate, bonds, etc

I would be careful if you want to solely rely on FX for your living. You will need a big bank and need to be a good trader. You will also have to be sure you can feed yourself and perhaps your family when going through a losing streak.

When trading is your sole income, this may put extra pressure on your trading, Will you be able to cope with this pressure and not make mistakes?
  • #7
  • Oct 16, 2007 6:29am Oct 16, 2007 6:29am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
My friend, I admire your enthusiam. I have been trading full-time since March of this year and have truly enjoyed it. I did have some other business interests that I have phased out completely as of Early Sept. It has been a baptism by fire to put it mildly. I do enjoy being home with the family and yes trading can be a lonely job. but if you study hard and take a systematic approach there is no reason not to trade full time. The only thing I look for anymore is something to liquidate so I can filter that money through my trading account for an exponential return. Hope I have helped in some small way.
Energy and persistence conquer all things! Ben Franklin
  • #8
  • Oct 16, 2007 6:36am Oct 16, 2007 6:36am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Yes, we have a small fund that pays a return of 2% every month on capital.
Are you currently profitable?
Yes.
How's your typical trading day look like?
I live in Australia and trade from home. This allows me to spend the daytime (Asian session) with my family and also looking after personal matters, well most of the time anyway. Mostly I work after dinner and through until 1-2am. During this time I'm either trading or researching.
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Reading reading and more reading.
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Married. My wife knows when the alert goes off on my PC, I have to stop what I'm doing and do some work. Other than that, because I mostly trade late at night, it has little effect on my family (apart from the extra $$$ of course )
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
I went through some very tough times early on in my trading career when I lost quite a lot of money (for me anyway). I found it very difficult. If this could be avoided by you on your journey then I would recommend trading.
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Discipline.
Thank you very much!
Hope this helps.
  • #9
  • Oct 16, 2007 6:36am Oct 16, 2007 6:36am
Quoting Iron-man
My friend, I admire your enthusiam. I have been trading full-time since March of this year and have truly enjoyed it. I did have some other business interests that I have phased out completely as of Early Sept. It has been a baptism by fire to put it mildly. I do enjoy being home with the family and yes trading can be a lonely job. but if you study hard and take a systematic approach there is no reason not to trade full time. The only thing I look for anymore is something to liquidate so I can filter that money through my trading account for an exponential return. Hope I have helped in some small way.
Iron-man,

I love the Ben Franklin quote. True Genius, that man.
  • #10
  • Oct 16, 2007 7:10am Oct 16, 2007 7:10am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
I've traded full time since just before 911.

Yes. Although I had a period in September where the dramatic increase in volatility in Asia dropped me into the red and I had to revise slightly to adapt.

I spend a bit of time in the morning and then start seriously watching the market at 11:45. I trade from 12:00-2:30 and then take a two hour break before trading again from 16:30 to 18:00.

Married. Trading has generally been beneficial (vs being out of the house from 7am until 6:30pm most days).

Essentials: Learn to trade with relatively little pressure. It will take longer than you think, maybe much longer. Become a fantastic paper trader before going to cash and discovering you're not nearly as good. Start small. Build up slowly. Read (and work on) Mark Douglas, Ari Kiev and Denise Shull. Read Steenbarger on training ... many traders become damaged by not training enough (see his latest book) which is why I think so few succeed.
  • #11
  • Oct 16, 2007 7:46am Oct 16, 2007 7:46am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
Hi all,

I started trading full time since July this year, and was in red in July but managed to have little gains in August and September, largerly because I became more careful and just tried some high probability trades. But I still have the discipline problem while trading alone without superivsion, and I also fear loss while making decisions on entries and exits. I hope I can do better in time.

I usually only trade in Asian session for 4-5 hours, and then stay with kids and my family afterward. This is one of the major aims of not working full time but trading full time at home. I usually look at the markets from time to time but not trade during London / New York sessions, as it is the family time at home and I just can't concentrate (as we live in Asia).

I also agree with the more experienced traders here that you have to be free from financial stress if you want to trade for full time. You can't be worried about money for your living. As for my case, I plan to spend two years to have a try to be a full time forex trader. If I can't be profitable consistently after 2 years, I may consider doing some other things instead.
  • #12
  • Oct 17, 2007 9:54am Oct 17, 2007 9:54am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
In february 2008 I have been trading the currency market for a living 5 years. This is my second year trading for myself from my own livingroom. I trade 4-5 hours per day sometimes I skip a day but then I make it up the next day trading 8 hours or when profit target is reached I stop. I trade during london or after us opening, it depends if I do something else in the morning or afternoon. When I trade I sit tight infront the screen 4-5 hours, I have a bicycle next to my desk if I feel really bored. I am a single parent and a dog owner. Sure at times trading can be boring but it comes with the job. Financially life is good but the most important is I can spend time with my son. If you want to be with your family go for it! No regrets.
  • #13
  • Oct 17, 2007 10:08am Oct 17, 2007 10:08am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
I am a parttime trader. Parttime traders can trade for a living too

Are you currently profitable?
Yes, currently +210% ROE since 1 january 2007.

How's your typical trading day look like?
I trade on London and NY session in a classroom, in the train or at home. 45 minutes a day!

How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
I am a still student . I still enjoy my life. FOREX is only 45 minutes a day work. Compared to the full time jobs, this is nothing.

Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
I am single, but I dont think trading will influence my social life.

Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
I dont recommed full time trading, because it is very boring to watch 8 hours a day to the charts.

What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Lots of Discipline

Thank you very much!
Np bro.
  • #14
  • Oct 17, 2007 10:24am Oct 17, 2007 10:24am
Quoting dunningduke
Iron-man,

I love the Ben Franklin quote. True Genius, that man.
Ben Franklin was a self made millionaire in a time when money was actually worth something. I can't help but admire that my friend. Take care.
Energy and persistence conquer all things! Ben Franklin
  • #15
  • Oct 17, 2007 12:28pm Oct 17, 2007 12:28pm
It's very great to see my compatriot here.

Having been trading for 1.5 years, I am still a dwarf compard to those gurus in this market. Had blowed up one account, I gradually build the sense that Money Management is the Key to survive, then prosper.

Hope you enjoy your journey and be successful.

regards,
Mike
Trading is a business
  • #16
  • Oct 17, 2007 12:36pm Oct 17, 2007 12:36pm
Deal All Traders,

Thanks a lot for sharing ur stories, ur experiences and such helpful suggestions! Really appreciate it.
I find my personality actually quite fit for an independent trader. i dun discuss with friends or bbs mates about trades, but do my own analysis, trade my own plan.
i think discipline maybe my no. 1 enemy in trading...and hesitation...the emotional involvement with the trades i did...pride and fear...that kills me...so I think i gotta first learn to be disattached with the trades and i need more discipline. I'll work on. but being an independent trader is sth I pursue in my life. 'coz i find the market the only near perfect fair playing field. no masks to put on, no unwanted social life, no hidden cost, no environmental pollution
i'll work hard, yes readings and real trading, and i'll be there.
make some money, have some fun, leave some footprints
  • #17
  • Nov 28, 2007 12:13am Nov 28, 2007 12:13am
Hi,
I am a full time trader, graduated? from S@P's to Forex, been trading since 1997.

It's a tough game but can be very rewarding. Here's how to give yourself the best chance of succeeding. Disregard everything you hear, get rid of ALL indicators, they are all crap, not only will they not work over time they will send you broke.

Most of the brokers and platforms out there are gunning for your money, e-book system sellers should all be in prison with one or two exceptions.

There is no golden bullet, holy grail etc. Money management is the key, trying to find the balance between stops that are too tight and stops that are too big is a problem. Forget all that crap about the trend is your friend, try and get with the rythymn of the market. Try and figure out in your head what the big bank traders are doing and be alert for the oil rich sheik in Dubai who likes to trade forex for fun and who gets up in the morning bored and decides to sell $555 million Euro when you are long the Euro. So much for trading with the trend!

Good luck, don't ask me for my system, I don't have one, I have a plan that enables me to survive and play again tomorrow. Forget yesterday, don't think about tomorrow, try and trade the best you can today.

Cheers from Australia.
  • #18
  • Nov 28, 2007 12:29am Nov 28, 2007 12:29am
Quoting Middlecamp
Hi,
I am a full time trader, graduated? from S@P's to Forex, been trading since 1997.

It's a tough game but can be very rewarding. Here's how to give yourself the best chance of succeeding. Disregard everything you hear, get rid of ALL indicators, they are all crap, not only will they not work over time they will send you broke.

Most of the brokers and platforms out there are gunning for your money, e-book system sellers should all be in prison with one or two exceptions.

There is no golden bullet, holy grail etc. Money management is the key, trying to find the balance between stops that are too tight and stops that are too big is a problem. Forget all that crap about the trend is your friend, try and get with the rythymn of the market. Try and figure out in your head what the big bank traders are doing and be alert for the oil rich sheik in Dubai who likes to trade forex for fun and who gets up in the morning bored and decides to sell $555 million Euro when you are long the Euro. So much for trading with the trend!

Good luck, don't ask me for my system, I don't have one, I have a plan that enables me to survive and play again tomorrow. Forget yesterday, don't think about tomorrow, try and trade the best you can today.

Cheers from Australia.
The world is not the way they tell us it is. Adam Smith The Money Game. Read this book!
  • #19
  • Dec 1, 2007 5:39am Dec 1, 2007 5:39am
Quoting Middlecamp
Forget yesterday, don't think about tomorrow, try and trade the best you can today.
I like it. Trading full-time is not an easy business. I am trying not to think about too much after trading, especially having a loss.
  • #20
  • Last Post: Dec 1, 2007 9:20am Dec 1, 2007 9:20am
Quoting boostrade
Dear all, I'm thinking to trade for a living, before I start, I'd like to have your opinions and suggestions. I have a couple of questions and I appreciate your answers.
Are you a full time traders? meaning you trade for a living.
Are you currently profitable?
How's your typical trading day look like?
How do you spend your time when market doesn't seem to move any where?
Are you married or single? How does trading influence your family life?
Do you recommend full time trading? trade for a living?
What things are essential if one is going to trade for a living?
Thank you very much!
Full time for just over a year.

Not profitable long term - improving exponentially as of late. I'm close.

I get up when I'm rested, whether that's 1 am or 5 am. I analyze charts and wait for trades. I eat when I'm hungry, take a nap if I'm sleepy! If I hit my daily target, I stop and go play. If not, I have lunch at the tube and trade the afternoons. That's usually a no-no but the yen pairs have been doing well in the afternoons lately.

Reading, training, studying, and.... forums. Less and less on the forums.

Single.

I read and tried everything I could get my hands on, most of the time with real money - very small positions. This may not have been the fastest way to learn, but was probably the fastest way for me - I have to see for myself, that's just the way I am.

Quoting Middlecamp
Forget yesterday, don't think about tomorrow, try and trade the best you can today
This comes under "focus". Look at the trade you're in, and only the trade. I've always had such thoughts as, "if I can get 60 pips I'll be back in profit for the week" or "I need 35 pips on this one to make my target for the day". NONE of THAT has anything to do with THIS trade. You have to do what makes sense for THIS trade based on your system and what is happening NOW. Shut everything else out.

As for systems, develop your own. Take courses, read, try systems and learn everything you can from all that, but it's ultimately going to boil down to YOU doing what makes sense to you according to your experience. You'll learn it in time, but KNOW this NOW, you HAVE your own trade style -- trade it and let it evolve over time with what you learn.

Good luck.
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