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Why can't I post on Soultrader's clinic? 2 replies

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Soultrader's Clinic :)

  • #41
  • Oct 3, 2007 8:10am Oct 3, 2007 8:10am
Quoting soultrader
can anyone else understand what i'm saying here that the money management should match the strategy and be a hard and fast 2% no matter what?
I actually agree that it shouldn't be a mindless 2% but most traders lack the ability and software to determine the exact amount to risk, and testing on a variety of systems has shown that the optimal value is around 2-4%. Many laymen expect it to be much higher and they deserve to know that it is a comprimise between growth and drawdown. Maybe it would be helpful for your people to understand exactly how you arrive at your % risk and what your drawdown tolerances might be.
  • #42
  • Oct 3, 2007 8:18am Oct 3, 2007 8:18am
forget it, just found out im arguing with a newbie lol

why is it someone with much less experience feels they have to tell the more experienced that they are wrong???

always happens.

ok, i give in, you're right.

think i'll change my signature line.
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #43
  • Oct 3, 2007 8:59am Oct 3, 2007 8:59am
Quoting soultrader
forget it, just found out im arguing with a newbie lol

why is it someone with much less experience feels they have to tell the more experienced that they are wrong???

always happens.

ok, i give in, you're right.

think i'll change my signature line.
Are you really saying Phil is newbie?
  • #44
  • Oct 3, 2007 9:05am Oct 3, 2007 9:05am
anything less than 3 years is a newbie IMO - dont get me wrong, getting close to two years is good cos about 80% dont get there - but of those who do less than 10% make it to 5 years.

so yes, he's a newbie. still an awful lot to learn.

as have I, only six years under my belt.
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #45
  • Oct 3, 2007 9:08am Oct 3, 2007 9:08am
Quoting soultrader
anything less than 3 years is a newbie IMO - dont get me wrong, getting close to two years is good cos about 80% dont get there - but of those who do less than 10% make it to 5 years.

so yes, he's a newbie. still an awful lot to learn.

as have I, only six years under my belt.
He may at times be abrupt and opinionated, but I would doubt newbie... LOL

I have never read anything that would suggest that. Sorry, cannot agree with you here.

Wow, that blows my mind... I guess there is not anything more to say...

Good luck with that.
  • #46
  • Oct 3, 2007 9:10am Oct 3, 2007 9:10am
Quoting soultrader
anything less than 3 years is a newbie IMO - dont get me wrong, getting close to two years is good cos about 80% dont get there - but of those who do less than 10% make it to 5 years.

so yes, he's a newbie. still an awful lot to learn.

as have I, only six years under my belt.
I've been trading since 1985 which is longer than some people on this forum have been alive. The difference between us is that I don't flaunt my experience and I have data to back up what I say. And yes, I have a lot to learn, but I'm smart enough to know who to study. Have you reduced this discussion to name calling? You could get this thread back on track by discussing how you arrive at your percent risk.
  • #47
  • Edited 10:03am Oct 3, 2007 9:35am | Edited 10:03am
post withdrawn - acting like an asshole, sorry.

i have a bad ear infection, am drugged up to the eyes, sugar is out of control and i dont know what im doing!!

Phil, greatest respect for you, i know youve been around years. Pete, ignore me.

everyone else, catch me when im better
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #48
  • Oct 3, 2007 10:42am Oct 3, 2007 10:42am
Quoting soultrader
post withdrawn
At least put the list back up! I've often thought about the common traits of a successful trader versus those who were still seeking success. I thought you summarized the differences quite well.

My favorites have always been people who talk about their trades and those who put more than a couple indicators on their charts. And yes, 2 moving averages count as 2.

Get well soon. We have so much more to discuss!
  • #49
  • Edited 11:44am Oct 3, 2007 11:31am | Edited 11:44am
ok, i just deleted the thing and i'm going to have to try and remember them.

but this is written with a smile this time rather than a frown - we will discuss the MM thing when i feel better.

bear in mind that the reason I know all these things is because I did them.

How to spot a relative newbie

  1. They think this time they have cracked it for real.
  2. They have a closed mind to anything outside their comfort zone of 'systems trading'
  3. They trade the lower timeframe charts (1,5,15,30,60)
  4. They tend to specialise in one or two pairs
  5. They LOVE Moving averages and ocillators and use them predictively
  6. They are system 'whores' flitting from one to another weekly
  7. At the END of a rangebound market they start to trade ranges
  8. At the END of a trending market they start to trade trends
  9. They know when all the news is and think it matters
  10. They are overley cautious and then overly exhuberant
  11. They chase bottoms and tops
  12. They sell strength and buy weakness
  13. They often Martingale to get back losses
  14. They chase breakeven
  15. They are idle when it comes to testing
  16. They rely on stops for exits
  17. They cut their winners and let the losers run
  18. They don't keep records very well
  19. They blame anything else but themselves for poor trades - they need a reason it didnt work
  20. They try to predict the market direction
  21. They have 2854 indicators
  22. They like to teach 'the basics' and may even write a book
  23. They are part of many forums and chat rooms
  24. They have masses of e-books and can quote from Douglas, Elder, Livermore and many more - they know the lessons BUT HAVENT LEARNED THEM YET
  25. They think they can beat the learning curve
  26. They post their trades one by one looking for approval
  27. they develop and share lots of systems

How to spot a Veteran

  1. They know they have not 'cracked it for real' ... ever
  2. They are open to new ideas and thoughts
  3. They trade the higher timeframes (4h,D,W,M)
  4. They trade any tradable asset
  5. They use indicators in a different way to most
  6. They are consistent in their method through bad times and good
  7. They use price as their main trading tool
  8. They trade the same method whether the market is trending or rangebound
  9. They take into account the general mood of the fundamentals but not individual reports
  10. They are consistent in their money management regardless of recent history
  11. They buy strength and sell weakness.
  12. They are meticulous in testing.
  13. They keep tidy records but they still get lost
  14. They take full responsibility for trade exits - stops are for emergency use
  15. They let profits run and cut losers short
  16. They accept you can't win em all, take the hit and move on
  17. They do not predict the market they play an edge
  18. They are often part of an elite group of traders
  19. They have 3 billion indicators (from when they were learning ) but price is the main driver
  20. They are individuals with their own mind
  21. Money find's them - they tend to manage money for others.
  22. They will often live on a shoestring rather than take out of their account
  23. They are generally untidy people (honest!)
  24. They keep their methods to themselves

I'm sure there are many more - suggestions from anyone else?

https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #50
  • Oct 3, 2007 12:03pm Oct 3, 2007 12:03pm
Quoting soultrader
How to spot ..

And what if you got a lot from one side(but not all / not all apply), but 1 or 2 from the other still?
Trust price. Know yourself.
  • #51
  • Oct 3, 2007 12:50pm Oct 3, 2007 12:50pm
Quoting soultrader
ok, i just deleted the thing and i'm going to have to try and remember them.

but this is written with a smile this time rather than a frown - we will discuss the MM thing when i feel better.

bear in mind that the reason I know all these things is because I did them.

How to spot a relative newbie

  1. They think this time they have cracked it for real.
  2. They have a closed mind to anything outside their comfort zone of 'systems trading'
  3. They trade the lower timeframe charts (1,5,15,30,60)
  4. They tend to specialise in one or two pairs
  5. They LOVE Moving averages and ocillators and use them predictively
  6. They are system 'whores' flitting from one to another weekly
  7. At the END of a rangebound market they start to trade ranges
  8. At the END of a trending market they start to trade trends
  9. They know when all the news is and think it matters
  10. They are overley cautious and then overly exhuberant
  11. They chase bottoms and tops
  12. They sell strength and buy weakness
  13. They often Martingale to get back losses
  14. They chase breakeven
  15. They are idle when it comes to testing
  16. They rely on stops for exits
  17. They cut their winners and let the losers run
  18. They don't keep records very well
  19. They blame anything else but themselves for poor trades - they need a reason it didnt work
  20. They try to predict the market direction
  21. They have 2854 indicators
  22. They like to teach 'the basics' and may even write a book
  23. They are part of many forums and chat rooms
  24. They have masses of e-books and can quote from Douglas, Elder, Livermore and many more - they know the lessons BUT HAVENT LEARNED THEM YET
  25. They think they can beat the learning curve
  26. They post their trades one by one looking for approval
  27. they develop and share lots of systems

How to spot a Veteran

  1. They know they have not 'cracked it for real' ... ever
  2. They are open to new ideas and thoughts
  3. They trade the higher timeframes (4h,D,W,M)
  4. They trade any tradable asset
  5. They use indicators in a different way to most
  6. They are consistent in their method through bad times and good
  7. They use price as their main trading tool
  8. They trade the same method whether the market is trending or rangebound
  9. They take into account the general mood of the fundamentals but not individual reports
  10. They are consistent in their money management regardless of recent history
  11. They buy strength and sell weakness.
  12. They are meticulous in testing.
  13. They keep tidy records but they still get lost
  14. They take full responsibility for trade exits - stops are for emergency use
  15. They let profits run and cut losers short
  16. They accept you can't win em all, take the hit and move on
  17. They do not predict the market they play an edge
  18. They are often part of an elite group of traders
  19. They have 3 billion indicators (from when they were learning ) but price is the main driver
  20. They are individuals with their own mind
  21. Money find's them - they tend to manage money for others.
  22. They will often live on a shoestring rather than take out of their account
  23. They are generally untidy people (honest!)
  24. They keep their methods to themselves

I'm sure there are many more - suggestions from anyone else?

Man, I sure got a long way to go.. thank you sir for this!!
Check Mate GAME OVER
  • #52
  • Oct 3, 2007 1:24pm Oct 3, 2007 1:24pm
I would probably add the word supercilious to the veteran list.
  • #53
  • Oct 3, 2007 1:46pm Oct 3, 2007 1:46pm
How about a "shortlist":

Newbies tend to externalize / shift things from them: it wasn't the chart / them, it was market makers, brokers, a big bank, cnbc, bloomberg, the stupid system, a bad signal, etc pp, how about you what do you think did you hear can you tell me etc => everything is "external" to them and the chart.

Experienced people(or those with the potential to become thusly) look to the chart and themselves: What did I overlook? Was I emotional? Did I follow my rules strictly? Was there a zone or trendline I missed? What is this new information telling me that I was unwilling to see before? Can I learn something from this?
What am I missing to make a complete judgement?

And any variation / related theme likewise. "Perspective".
Trust price. Know yourself.
  • #54
  • Oct 3, 2007 1:58pm Oct 3, 2007 1:58pm
I would add

 

  1. verterans don't blame their broker or the internet for a bad trade
  2. verterans have their broker's phone number programmed in all their phones
  3. verterans don't care why the market moved or will move, only that their system will allow them to participate
  4. veterans rarely disuss their positions
  5. veterans have little regard for the market opinions of others

  • #55
  • Oct 3, 2007 2:48pm Oct 3, 2007 2:48pm
Soultrader,

You don't happen to be the same Soultrader from the Tradestation forums, who designed the auto-pivot indicator, are you?
  • #56
  • Oct 3, 2007 3:24pm Oct 3, 2007 3:24pm
I'd add this one up:

- Veterans stay 90% of the time out of the market, stalking the trade. Newbies stay 90% in the market, chasing the trade
  • #57
  • Oct 4, 2007 3:16am Oct 4, 2007 3:16am
Quoting WTB
I'd add this one up:

- Veterans stay 90% of the time out of the market, stalking the trade. Newbies stay 90% in the market, chasing the trade
not sure I agree with this - i'm nearly always in the market - but then i trade any pair going - i can go for weeks without a trade in any single pair - but generally there is always at least one in.

No, im not the fake soultrader from the tradestation forums i'm the original) but yes, ive programmed pivot indicators before (ones that dont screw up on a monday)
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
  • #58
  • Edited 10:33pm Oct 4, 2007 3:52pm | Edited 10:33pm
I have to disagree strongly with the notion that veterans do not trade shorter time frames. In fact, many vets have day trading accounts AND swing accounts.

Also, it is ridiculous to say that it is somehow a bad thing for any type of trader to know what macro events are on the table for a given day. It would be wholly amateurish to ignore these events and to not factor in their individual idiosyncratic influence they can have on market conditions.

As for trading only two pairs, there are some fantastic equity traders that specialize in trading only 2-3 stocks and they do so year in and year out. If you trade too many things then it becomes extremely difficult to comprehend the nuance of every instrument you are trading. Honestly, there is more than enough volatility in the market to be able to make money trading just a single currency pair.
  • #59
  • Oct 4, 2007 7:21pm Oct 4, 2007 7:21pm
How to spot a relative newbie

They trade the lower timeframe charts (1,5,15,30,60)

I quite don't agree with this. I know a few professional daytraders who trade emini futures and make a fortune year in year out.

They tend to specialise in one or two pairs

Same as above. It depends on what your trading style is and what you are looking for. I am a former FX trader and I agree that trading different pairs might work out in FOREX, especially if you are a swing-position trader. Today I am a emini futures daytrader and I am only focused on the instrument I trade. Of course I monitor tons of other mkts, but I only trade 1 instrument and that's more than enough for me.

They know when all the news is and think it matters

Again, it depends on your time horizon. If you are a daytrader, you better keep an economic calendar on your desk and even put alarms for when news are about to be released! News are market movers, so as a daytrader I am very concerned about it. On the other hand, if you are a medium-long term trader that goes for large moves, I agree that an economic calendar is not necessary.

They are part of many forums and chat rooms

Aren't yourself part of many forums, blogs etc??? :

How to spot a Veteran

They trade the higher timeframes (4h,D,W,M)

See comments above.

They trade the same method whether the market is trending or rangebound

It depends on whether it's a mechanical method or a discretionary method. For mechanical systems with rules written in stone, I agree.

For discretionary traders instead, I don't agree. I myself am a discretionary trader and it's my job to determine what type of market I am trading and adjust my trading accordingly. The more flexible I am the better, simply because I can quickly adapt to changing market conditions.

They take full responsibility for trade exits - stops are for emergency use

Strongly agree. ACCOUNTABILITY is one of the most precious assets a trader can possess.

Money find's them - they tend to manage money for others.

Not all private traders who become successful want or can manage other people's money. One of the most successful traders I know with 20+ yrs of experience decided to manage another person's money - very small amount like 20K - late in 2006. Guess what happened? The first week of managing this person's money he had his worst week in years and decided to stop the experiment. I talked to this trader and he explained how he was affected psychologically by feeling responsible for someone else's money. Hence, I don't think all successful private traders can manage other people's money.
  • #60
  • Oct 4, 2007 11:13pm Oct 4, 2007 11:13pm
Thanks for the comments folks

as to the last two post I agree, there are always exceptions and the list was meant as a generalisation.

Traders who make money year in year out on low timeframes (esp 5 min) are like rocking horse shit - you cant find a real one. if there is one on here that can show a consistent 10 months out of 12 profitable trading 5 minute charts i'll be very suprised. Im sure there are some .... somewhere. Many say they are but there's lots of BS in this game because of the ego.

also they trade the timeframe to match their account size - someone with $500 is unlikely to trade a 4 hour chart because of the stop size needed - they cut their cloth so to speak.

I think the reason most veterans go for higher timeframes is that they just cant be bothered with the shorter ones and like to pay less commissions / spreads. - i couldnt imagine ever again sitting here staring at 5 min charts all day long - would drive me batty.

it's also true that many vets have DT accounts also - I have one too, but I only use it when i get that 'itch' to daytrade - saves my main account from being eaten away

the managing money thing - i'm not saying that they all manage money, just that money does find them and they have the opportunity.

with both the last 2 posts you talk about the one or two pairs thing - then refer to stocks. im talking forex only vets - they don't stick to one or two pairs. they don't need to know what you call 'nuances' - it doesnt matter because a good strategy works on most things you throw it on.

I mean there arent 10 e-mini's are there, or 10 s&p indexes etc but there are many fxpairs - see what i mean.

stocks and shares are very different as they have an inherent bias to the upside - every company wants their shares to rise. this isnt so in forex, in fact the world economy would die if this happened! - can you imagine if the pound just kept going up!

Daily news? amateurish to ignore these events? well that must be me then - i couldnt care less about any individual news event or any individual day, I dont know what's out from one day to the next apart from the biggies like NFP - even then I don't allow it to change anything i do. Most days when it's 8:30 in the US i'm out having lunch.

They pay analysts a fortune to try and predict the news and they get it right about as much as my cat so what chance have i got? none, so why bother? whatever the news is it won't effect my strategy which is wholly technical in nature.

I do look from a global macro view though at the overall view of the world but never on a micro level but can you imagine a hedge fund trader with billions in the market watching ALL his positions just because the latest GDP is about to be announced? - it just doesn't happen.

Can I ask, are you Vet's? - how long in the game?
https://linktr.ee/Soultrader
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