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Part Time Wealth Building Trading System - Daily Scalping

  • #1,821
  • Jun 20, 2007 4:53am Jun 20, 2007 4:53am
i really think there must be something messed up with your results, because i agree that the 2nd trade is usually a loser if the first one was a loser. so i am not sure why you find the 2nd trade to add so much to the profit. can someone else say something about this. because i really made the experience that the 2nd trade is what makes you lose.
how did you test this? there are numerous problems with backtesting, especially when it comes to daily stuff. so i doubt that these results are actually correct when it comes to live trading
  • #1,822
  • Jun 20, 2007 5:04am Jun 20, 2007 5:04am
I do my testing on IBFX live account. I scroll back to normally 12 months and then use the step-by-step function on the 15 min chart.

Now may i ask if you have backtested this? If you have then you will notice that you might get stopped out on the first order but the second one might give you some positive pips, wich will increase your nett profit.

Example
10 May 2007 was buy order. Got stopped out and sell order gave app 168 pips.

If you have not tested this, then please test and lets compare results.

Eben
  • #1,823
  • Jun 20, 2007 5:10am Jun 20, 2007 5:10am
i have only forward tested this live for several months. had i not used the 2nd trade the entire time i would have made much more profit than i have now.
  • #1,824
  • Jun 20, 2007 5:27am Jun 20, 2007 5:27am
I have tested this method extensively. Up to 6 trades a day. Even tested the Martingale MM. The best result was the paramaters i am using now. I have been testing variables for 3 months and only started trading it live on my micro acc today. I will post daily results here wich i have started today.

IMO you should backtest first with various variables until you find paramaters that suits you and with wich you are comfortable with. Then trade it on micro acc as part of forward test. Also remember to include your brokers spread to TP and SL. Over a period of 1 year this could mean a substantial difference in profit.

Eben
  • #1,825
  • Jun 20, 2007 5:28am Jun 20, 2007 5:28am
This is my 5th week of trading a real mini account and with out the 2nd (and sometimes 3rd) trade of the day I would be about 500 pips better off. I actually stopped taking the 2nd trade 2 weeks ago. I might add I'm losing money but mostly due to my own stupidity, I have diffculty following the rules! For example I was long on the GBP/USD from a day ago, I read some fundamental reports on the BOE meeting last week and convinced myself (with a little help from the experts) that the majority voted to leave IR's alone yet the reality was quite different 5-4 i.e an increase in IR's is more than likely so skywards went the cable again.
  • #1,826
  • Jun 20, 2007 5:45am Jun 20, 2007 5:45am
Could you please post your exact rules here? We can then discuss. It might be that we have one small difference in our approach and hence the mixed results
  • #1,827
  • Jun 20, 2007 5:51am Jun 20, 2007 5:51am
Quoting Ebenst
I have tested this method extensively. Up to 6 trades a day. Even tested the Martingale MM. The best result was the paramaters i am using now. I have been testing variables for 3 months and only started trading it live on my micro acc today. I will post daily results here wich i have started today.

IMO you should backtest first with various variables until you find paramaters that suits you and with wich you are comfortable with. Then trade it on micro acc as part of forward test. Also remember to include your brokers spread to TP and SL. Over a period of 1 year this could mean a substantial difference in profit.

Eben
I agree with you. Two trades a day will win over a long time.

I am doing little different thing. I put my SL to breakeven once profit is 50 pips and change the other pending order also 50 pips up. I am trading 2 losing trades in a day. So if any one trade is stopped out at breakeven then I will another two trades for the day.

MQ
"Those who see Invisible can do Impossible." -Rev. Dadaji
  • #1,828
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:01am Jun 20, 2007 6:01am
Quoting Ebenst
Could you please post your exact rules here? We can then discuss. It might be that we have one small difference in our approach and hence the mixed results
I am writing here my rules here exactly how I am trading.

I am trading only GBP/USD.

Rules:

1. Enter the trade at 00:00 GMT as per the direction of previous days candle.
2. I draw 25 LMA and if price is above the moving average and I am trading long then I use 50 pips SL. If price is above the moving average and I am trading short then I use 40 pips SL. Viceversa.
3. I enter one pending order in the reverse direction as well.
4. Whenever price move 50 pips profit, I move my SL to breakeven (NO more trailing). At the same time I move pending order to 50 pips as well.
5. Two losing trades per day. That means if one trade is breakeven then I will trade total 3 trades per day.
6. Close all open and pending orders at the end of the day.

MQ
"Those who see Invisible can do Impossible." -Rev. Dadaji
  • #1,829
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:08am Jun 20, 2007 6:08am
I know that you trade gu. I will look at the gj to set to b/e after 50 pips. I also know that a third or fourth trade can give you profit after 2 stopouts. In fact it might be happening on gj at this moment.
Right now i am tetsting another method and will most likely only post this test results on gj next week
  • #1,830
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:08am Jun 20, 2007 6:08am
as far as profitability with 2 vs. 1 trade a day goes maybe we should make sure we separate GY and GU very carefully......maybe it works on GU with two trades but GY def. is a loser if you trade with 2
  • #1,831
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:10am Jun 20, 2007 6:10am
Quoting moneyquest
I am writing here my rules here exactly how I am trading.

I am trading only GBP/USD.

Rules:

1. Enter the trade at 00:00 GMT as per the direction of previous days candle.
2. I draw 25 LMA and if price is above the moving average and I am trading long then I use 50 pips SL. If price is above the moving average and I am trading short then I use 40 pips SL. Viceversa.
3. I enter one pending order in the reverse direction as well.
4. Whenever price move 50 pips profit, I move my SL to breakeven (NO more trailing). At the same time I move pending order to 50 pips as well.
5. Two losing trades per day. That means if one trade is breakeven then I will trade total 3 trades per day.
6. Close all open and pending orders at the end of the day.

MQ
Does your S/L include spread ?
  • #1,832
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:11am Jun 20, 2007 6:11am
Quoting Ebenst
I know that you trade gu. I will look at the gj to set to b/e after 50 pips. I also know that a third or fourth trade can give you profit after 2 stopouts. In fact it might be happening on gj at this moment.
Right now i am tetsting another method and will most likely only post this test results on gj next week
Your results are awaited for both G/J and G/U.

Thanks in advance,

MQ
"Those who see Invisible can do Impossible." -Rev. Dadaji
  • #1,833
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:12am Jun 20, 2007 6:12am
Quoting Ebenst
Does your S/L include spread ?
Yes SL include spread.
"Those who see Invisible can do Impossible." -Rev. Dadaji
  • #1,834
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:12am Jun 20, 2007 6:12am
Quoting pipbunny
as far as profitability with 2 vs. 1 trade a day goes maybe we should make sure we separate GY and GU very carefully......maybe it works on GU with two trades but GY def. is a loser if you trade with 2
I only tested GBP/JPY. The results i have given is on this pair.
  • #1,835
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:15am Jun 20, 2007 6:15am
I trade the original rules without taking the 2nd trade or reversing the direction after 3 candles the same. I also take a 50pip profit on g/u and 60pip profit on g/y.I try to enter as close to 1700 est as possible.Of course I roll over with out closing if the direction is right.
The problem with the backtesting results you've given is that I don't know if they represent the actual price action of the day i.e if the result is generated on the o/h/l/c of the daily candle it doesn't account for when the high or low occured and hence when stop outs occured.
  • #1,836
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:15am Jun 20, 2007 6:15am
Quoting moneyquest
Your results are awaited for both G/J and G/U.

Thanks in advance,

MQ
Who said anything on G/U LOL. I was actually testing G/U but got distracted by another idea. So i quess i have to finish it now
  • #1,837
  • Jun 20, 2007 6:28am Jun 20, 2007 6:28am
Quoting edge540
I trade the original rules without taking the 2nd trade or reversing the direction after 3 candles the same. I also take a 50pip profit on g/u and 60pip profit on g/y.I try to enter as close to 1700 est as possible.Of course I roll over with out closing if the direction is right.
The problem with the backtesting results you've given is that I don't know if they represent the actual price action of the day i.e if the result is generated on the o/h/l/c of the daily candle it doesn't account for when the high or low occured and hence when stop outs occured.
There are a few difference the way you trade this system and how i tested it.

1. I don't think the original rules are relevant anymore. Its been said many times that you can personalise this system. However i will only trade if profitable. If its not according to my personality, i will leave my personality at the door and pick it up again after i made some money.
2. The tests are done without TP. All trades are closed @ close of 23:00 gmt candle
3. If previous day was long and new day also long a new position is opened.
4. The tests was done on 15 min chart on live acc( better data than demo acc) and represented daily price action as far as 15 min chart will.

IMHO there are two many difference the we trade this strategy and will therefore never get the same results. I am sure if i test the way you tade i will most likely mirror your results and vice versa>
  • #1,838
  • Jun 20, 2007 7:44pm Jun 20, 2007 7:44pm
Today's result: (20th June 2007)

GBP/USD: +40 pips

Result of June so far=+295 pips
"Those who see Invisible can do Impossible." -Rev. Dadaji
  • #1,839
  • Jun 21, 2007 2:39am Jun 21, 2007 2:39am
I still think that the main reason for which u guys are losing (Pipbunny mainly) is that you are trading mechanically. I stopped thinking that a 50 pips or 40 pips stop would save me. What saves you in an uptrend are Fib levels. Instead of blindly entering at 00 GMT with a 50 pips stop, why not better pull out a Fib of the last up wave and see where the REAL support level for this movement. What if it is 10 pips below your 50 pips stop - it hits you and it reverses and then u say, damn this method doesnt work. See the attached picture: yesterday during the range period it dipped down to the 50 fib retrace and the Fib S2, before jumping back right up. Isnt it frustrating to see u stopped out and then the trade going your way?

I entered as usual at the opening of the day, around 245.25, and I decided to widen my stop, seeing the support was around 244.50. It would really have been a bad idea to use a tight stop during this range. GY doesnt make ranges of 50 pips, but of 100 or more. Then you know what happened.

Today the same story - I entered around 246, stop 245.50 - this was perfect stop because it concludes with our 50 pips usual stop and besides its is below the Fib levels of danger and below the 34 MA of Al_Have. Now way to go up, this trend isnt over in my opinion.

This approach saves you from entering at an exact time - market doesnt make appointments - i.e. at 24 GMT it will start going up and at 1 GMT it starts a downtrend. And it helps you enter at the RIGHT levels.

Try to use a little discretion, only my 2 cents. GBP JPY has been really easy to trade these last days. And those people who are claiming making profits these days are right - because they take the right approach. Losers expect they enter mechanically at 24:00 GMT, put a stop and then go and drink a juice and expect to have 100 pips in the pocket by the end of the day. Well its not that easy, you have to use your brain a little, to earn those pips.

Wish you guys all the best.
Attached Image
We leave no soldier behind.
  • #1,840
  • Jun 21, 2007 2:51am Jun 21, 2007 2:51am
Quoting moneyquest
Today's result: (20th June 2007)

GBP/USD: +40 pips

Result of June so far=+295 pips
way to go moneyquest - all my respect for you for being steady and confident and not complaining about the market, but only trying to improve your trading. Im sure that with your approach you will be as consistent live as you are on demo.

What I learned in these months is that the most important thing you need is to have the right mind set, do not complain about the market, but about yourself. If you keep losing its your fault, not the market's fault. The losses are the price you pay for your education in Forex and when you stop having more losses than profits, it means you successfully graduated the Forex university.
We leave no soldier behind.
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