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PlanetX Indicator - can this indi be used for trading?

  • #121
  • Mar 4, 2022 10:47am Mar 4, 2022 10:47am
Quoting dokopy
{quote} I have the original fiber indicator on 28 pairs of H4. I only use white and red rings, which are in the same places in newer versions. The shortcomings are manifested when comparing the history with the backtest, or with real data after a certain time. I don't think there's anything you can do about it. But I'm not an encoder. I use it to confirm entries. In time, I will see its usefulness.
I know there isn't anything anybody can do about it, unless somebody knows how to program the future.
Yes, it is a useful indicator, if trader can read the chart and if trader can be consistent in holding Stop Loss and profiting more than they lost. If trader goes long and gets Stop Loss, and indicator shows short, trader should go short.
.ex4/.ex5 files can't be fixed or modified / I'm not a coder!
  • #122
  • Mar 4, 2022 10:54am Mar 4, 2022 10:54am
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} The markers use MT4 dynamic buffers. MT4 manages markers on a chart. As the chart advances MT4 is responsible for drawing markers. This is not an algorithm issue -- it's an MT4 charting issue. When volatility is low then circle markers on bars [0], [1], [2] may flutter. But we know not to open trades when volatility is low and there really is no trend. This is discretionary trading -- we also have to use our brain. Haven't I stated numerous times that it is important to look at the height of the histogram bars? They reflect momentum. If...
Ok, then you can program a minimum volatility value and plot markers only when volatility is greater than this value, correct? Or provide an input parameter for trader to input the value. Or calculate the value for the specific instrument, somehow?

I wrote EA for one person based on Awesome Oscillator. He works on 20+ pairs, and he figures out minimum + and - values of AO where EA opens and closes positions. He just switches EA On and Off.
.ex4/.ex5 files can't be fixed or modified / I'm not a coder!
  • #123
  • Mar 4, 2022 10:57am Mar 4, 2022 10:57am
Quoting trailanx
{quote} meaning it replaints?
You haven't been reading and are late to the party. Please don't waste electrons posting lame comments...
  • #124
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:01am Mar 4, 2022 11:01am
Quoting shiva
{quote} Great looking indicator mate! Thanks for sharing, I am not able to locate the on-chart version of this though, please repost if possible. Thanks.
Yes -- thanks for the reminder. I will post that either later today or this weekend.

An important drawback with the OnChart version is it won't include histogram bar height -- i.e. it will be missing that momentum element (which is an important part of the PlanetX indi).
  • #125
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:03am Mar 4, 2022 11:03am
Quoting BestTraderEv
{quote} I can do that, create indi by using iCustom with Alert, Message, and even other options, but I must have permission from @ohitsyou. @ohitsyou: Do you give me permission to create extensions of your indicators on other people requests?
Absolutely!! Please do. Thank you @BestTraderEv. Your alias could also be BestMemberEv...
  • #126
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:13am Mar 4, 2022 11:13am
Quoting BestTraderEv
{quote} Ok, then you can program a minimum volatility value and plot markers only when volatility is greater than this value, correct? Or provide an input parameter for trader to input the value. Or calculate the value for the specific instrument, somehow? I wrote EA for one person based on Awesome Oscillator. He works on 20+ pairs, and he figures out minimum + and - values of AO where EA opens and closes positions. He just switches EA On and Off.
Right. That occurred to me. But then who defines what constitutes volatility? And what should the default setting be? And what if that default setting is different for different pairs in different timeframes under different market conditions. Since this thread is about discretionary trading then I think it's okay to use our brain and take in addition clues. This is a really simple indicator to interpret, right? If someone can't bring themselves to look at the histogram's bar height then maybe they are in over their head.

There are many discretionary clues available to us. A good trader also has to be a good detective. I like creating simple indicators that reveal one or two clues. People are free to attach other indicators to the chart if they feel they reveal other clues. A volatility indicator might make sense. But again, I think that focusing on bar height is one of the most important clues.
  • #127
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:16am Mar 4, 2022 11:16am
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} Right. That occurred to me. But then who defines what constitutes volatility? And what should the default setting be? And what if that default setting is different for different pairs in different timeframes under different market conditions. Since this thread is about discretionary trading then I think it's okay to use our brain and take in addition clues. This is a really simple indicator to interpret, right? If someone can't bring themselves to look at the histogram's bar height then maybe they are in over their head. There are many discretionary...
Sure, so the markers are, simply, useless, and we are better not seeing them!
.ex4/.ex5 files can't be fixed or modified / I'm not a coder!
  • #128
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:30am Mar 4, 2022 11:30am
Quoting BestTraderEv
{quote} Sure, so the markers are, simply, useless, and we are better not seeing them!
With all due respect, I would disagree. I see them as additional clues or "highlights". When I glance at a chart from a distance I can see there is a transition and that attracts my attention to look closer. Consider it like a visual Alert to take a closer look. Transitions are important -- really important -- but they are rare events. And you really don't want to miss them if you don't have to. But they are not guarantees -- just wake-up calls.

Some people find sound and email alerts helpful -- I don't use them but I understand why others would. These red / white circles detect transitions -- but with the caveat their accuracy may be limited when the market is flat. But our brain should be able to see when that is the case.

If you are thinking of using PlanetX transitions in an EA then you would need a filter to help distinguish between "significant vs non-significant" transitions. And if you are thinking of going that route then, please, be my guest.
  • #129
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:34am Mar 4, 2022 11:34am
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} With all due respect, I would disagree. I see them as additional clues or "highlights". When I glance at a chart from a distance I can see there is a transition and that attracts my attention to look closer. Consider it like a visual Alert to take a closer look. Transitions are important -- really important -- but they are rare events. And you really don't want to miss them if you don't have to. But they are not guarantees -- just wake-up calls. Some people find sound and email alerts helpful -- I don't use them but I understand why others...
Going back to discretionary trading, the first thought that comes to mind at filtering false signals (Which seems to be other members biggest concerns with MT4's limited abilities) is simply waiting for price to break the high/low of the transition candle. Treating the transition candle as ground zero, if you're looking to go long price must break that candles high before entry is taken and must not break the low. Food for thought?
  • #130
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:42am Mar 4, 2022 11:42am
Quoting YoungET
{quote} Going back to discretionary trading, the first thought that comes to mind at filtering false signals (Which seems to be other members biggest concerns with MT4's limited abilities) is simply waiting for price to break the high/low of the transition candle. Treating the transition candle as ground zero, if you're looking to go long price must break that candles high before entry is taken and must not break the low. Food for thought?
Can you illustrate the idea with chart example?
.ex4/.ex5 files can't be fixed or modified / I'm not a coder!
  • #131
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:46am Mar 4, 2022 11:46am
Quoting YoungET
{quote} Going back to discretionary trading, the first thought that comes to mind at filtering false signals (Which seems to be other members biggest concerns with MT4's limited abilities) is simply waiting for price to break the high/low of the transition candle. Treating the transition candle as ground zero, if you're looking to go long price must break that candles high before entry is taken and must not break the low. Food for thought?
@YoungET -- nice -- I like it, another excellent clue. Thank you...
  • #132
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:53am Mar 4, 2022 11:53am
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} With all due respect, I would disagree. I see them as additional clues or "highlights". When I glance at a chart from a distance I can see there is a transition and that attracts my attention to look closer. Consider it like a visual Alert to take a closer look. Transitions are important -- really important -- but they are rare events. And you really don't want to miss them if you don't have to. But they are not guarantees -- just wake-up calls. Some people find sound and email alerts helpful -- I don't use them but I understand why others...
I don't know about you, but I am looking for the best price I can get and already have enough information about possible swing. That is the role of a good indicator. If an indicator can not provide me that, it is just another average indicator. I tell you what I see, and your markers are too often bugging, too often for me. I still see value in the hybrid we created together, and I am working to try to make it better.
.ex4/.ex5 files can't be fixed or modified / I'm not a coder!
  • #133
  • Mar 4, 2022 12:16pm Mar 4, 2022 12:16pm
Quoting BestTraderEv
{quote} I don't know about you, but I am looking for the best price I can get and already have enough information about possible swing. That is the role of a good indicator. If an indicator can not provide me that, it is just another average indicator. I tell you what I see, and your markers are too often bugging, too often for me. I still see value in the hybrid we created together, and I am working to try to make it better.
Fair enough. I just now created a new version (v3) that differs from the previous version only in that it exposes the dynamic buffers in the Data Window. I understand you've already figured it out, but since I'm still fiddling with the indicator then buffer IDs might change and then it would break your software. So, from this moment on I will (a) expose the buffer IDs, and (b) won't change them for a particular version. In other words, you are guaranteed that the buffer IDs for v3 won't change.

Attached File(s)
File Type: ex4 OIY-PlanetX-Hist-v3.0.ex4   53 KB | 314 downloads
  • #134
  • Mar 4, 2022 2:05pm Mar 4, 2022 2:05pm
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} Yes -- thanks for the reminder. I will post that either later today or this weekend. An important drawback with the OnChart version is it won't include histogram bar height -- i.e. it will be missing that momentum element (which is an important part of the PlanetX indi).
Thank you for the reply man, yes I get that point.
  • #135
  • Mar 4, 2022 3:13pm Mar 4, 2022 3:13pm
Quoting shiva
{quote} Thank you for the reply man, yes I get that point.
Here is the "OnChart" version. You can see from the image below that the transition markers (red/white circles) provide a valuable visual clue, especially when displayed within the context of price bars.

Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: PlanetX-OnChart.png Size: 36 KB

Attached File(s)
File Type: ex4 OIY-PlanetX-OnChart.ex4   74 KB | 370 downloads

And @shiva, I know you get the point but it is worth repeating for others -- the 'OnChart' version lacks momentum clues that are inherent within the height of the histogram bars of the 'Histogram' version of the indicator.
  • #136
  • Mar 4, 2022 3:58pm Mar 4, 2022 3:58pm
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} Here is the "OnChart" version. You can see from the image below that the transition markers (red/white circles) provide a valuable visual clue, especially when displayed within the context of price bars. {image} {file} And @shiva, I know you get the point but it is worth repeating for others -- the 'OnChart' version lacks momentum clues that are inherent within the height of the histogram bars of the 'Histogram' version of the indicator.
Oh, cool, thanks, I was just going to code myself those on chart signals. I don't need the oscillator at all if I have this. This is all anybody needs to be a succesful trader. Of course, I will be looking at it all next week.
.ex4/.ex5 files can't be fixed or modified / I'm not a coder!
  • #137
  • Mar 4, 2022 7:15pm Mar 4, 2022 7:15pm
Quoting BestTraderEv
{quote} Oh, cool, thanks, I was just going to code myself those on chart signals. I don't need the oscillator at all if I have this. This is all anybody needs to be a succesful trader. Of course, I will be looking at it all next week.
As you've noted, the PlanetX indicator really is not much different than most other indicators -- it is not a magic bullet. However, it does appear to be more accurate than other indicators I've used, and if it gets you in and out of a trade a bar or two earlier then that can be yuuuge...
  • #138
  • Mar 4, 2022 11:26pm Mar 4, 2022 11:26pm
Quoting ohitsyou
{quote} As you've noted, the PlanetX indicator really is not much different than most other indicators -- it is not a magic bullet. However, it does appear to be more accurate than other indicators I've used, and if it gets you in and out of a trade a bar or two earlier then that can be yuuuge...
I took the histov2 indie for a spin yesterday, and agree with BestTraderEv's observations... I didnt find it usable in its earlier state.

I have now loaded up the OnChart version and look forward to trying it next week. I compared the OnChart version to PSAR (default) and HullMA (10) and they are all reasonably close. PSAR is generally less sensitive whereas the Hull MA is more sensitive... so PlanetX must be just right!

Will let you know how it goes next week.
  • #139
  • Mar 5, 2022 4:29am Mar 5, 2022 4:29am
Quoting BestTraderEv
{quote} Oh, cool, thanks, I was just going to code myself those on chart signals. I don't need the oscillator at all if I have this. This is all anybody needs to be a succesful trader. Of course, I will be looking at it all next week.
For what it is worth, when it comes to EAs here is my observation...

Trend-trading strategies can be broken down into the following sub-categories based on the number of bars between transitions:

1. Swing trading -- approximately 3-8 bars
2. Short-trend trading -- approximately 20 bars
3. Trend trading -- approximately 20 - 40 bars
4. Super-trend trading -- greater than 40 bars

No one trading strategy is better than another. Also, market conditions play a role.

I believe there is a "sweet spot" between accuracy and responsiveness. If an algorithm is too accurate then it tends to be overly responsive and falls for head-fakes. But if the algorithm relaxes its stringency then signals are delayed, winrates decline and drawdowns go up. The "sweet spot" is achieved by a combination of the indicator's algorithm and settings.

For discretionary trading I definitely prefer swing trading. It suits my schedule and desire to trade. Longer trends are too boring for me. However, I've never been successful developing a swing trading EA. I think it is because the short trade duration makes it more difficult to discover a strategy whose "sweet spot" between
accuracy and responsiveness fits with this style of trading.

With short-trend trading then EAs begin to shine, and this is because the longer intervals between transitions make it easier to find the "sweet spot".

PlanetX lends itself to swing trading. I've tested an EA but its stats and performance weren't anything to write home about. I'll be curious how it works for you. If you find that it works well as an EA then I may revisit it.
  • #140
  • Mar 5, 2022 11:50am Mar 5, 2022 11:50am
Hello,
First of all, thanks to the creator of the thread and for his kindness in giving out tools for other traders.
Regarding EA strategy , as i am usual to work with Renko chart, i was looking at the usage of PlanetX in a Renko Chart, and by visual backtesting a very simple strategy the results are awesome, yesterday in gbpusd there were 41 winner and 1 loss trade,the "problems" that comes in are 2 :
- The indicator shows "clean" signals if the chart doesn't receive data, in other words if there are no new bars, as soon a new bar comes in , the indicator starts to mess up and it also messes up past bars ( picture ).
Attached Image (click to enlarge)
Click to Enlarge Name: screenshot.png Size: 51 KB

I tried putting a "fresh" planetx indicator on the chart as soon a new bar formed to avoid the "messed" signals, and it seemed to be a good deal.
Unfortunately i've then backtested the indi with normal chart, and tried to do the same thing ( replacing a "fresh" indi on every new bar ) and discovered the second "problem" ,which is that sometimes, there are delayed / unreliable signal ,meaning signal that are plotted on the bar [2] making the signals unreliable ( at least for an EA strategy ) ,in that sense it can also happen that a signal on the [1] candle , after the [0] bar closes , the signal of the [1] disappears . You can see better in the video what i have just spoken about .

I don't know if this issues can be fixed somehow with the code or by adding some kind of filter to avoid fake signals plotted on the [1] bar.
Another thing that could be implemented is a NumBar function in the input to let people see more histo data on the chart for backtesting strategy .

Thanks for all the work.
Attached File(s)
File Type: zip delayedsignal.zip   8.8 MB | 294 downloads
File Type: zip unrealiable signals onbar1.zip   4.9 MB | 284 downloads
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