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FTMO - For serious traders

  • #4,081
  • Oct 11, 2020 7:24am Oct 11, 2020 7:24am
Quoting Trader4818
I bet they really hook you up to a 20k account why even bother fund someone with 100k if you can only ever loose 5k in a day and 10k ever, that's 90k sitting there doing f all. Doesn't make sense.
It’s a marketing trick to make the guy think they really gave him 20k to trade while actually they just fund the necessary margin in agreement with the broker.
I would bet these kind of companies make only money with the subscription fees from the wannabe pro traders. If they can show their financial reports, we can confirm that but I don’t they would do it.
Don't give up on your dreams. Keep sleeping.
  • #4,082
  • Oct 11, 2020 8:04am Oct 11, 2020 8:04am
Here is how prostitution works.

There is a market where services are exchanged for money. There are Johns with money, there are prostitutes with ehm...services and usually there are pimps who arrange the meetings and take a portion of the money.

All the firms posted earlier. I think almost 30 of them are pimps. The market is the whore house and the traders willing to do anything for money are the girls.

Who said there is anything wrong with that model? It has been around forever. The oldest business around. Someone discovered that they can do the same thing with the financial markets because all elements are present to make it work. There are tired and broke and desperate traders who have spent so much on plastic surgery and make up and lingerie but all they get to do is look at themselves in the mirror and admire themselves for being so hot while the Johns are loaded with cash but think they will pick up diseases or get their pockets picked by the hookers, so nothing happens.

Then comes the pimp. He wants the girls to do things just a certain way that makes the Johns trust them. The pimp really has no talent and never has known how to impress the way the girls do but has found a niche to get his pockets lined via the actions of others. The girls sign up, perform and the pimp gives them a portion of the cash they earned just cause he arranged the meet. The girl gets fired if she doesn't perform well because there are always willing girls looking for money.

If it was only like that, it would be totally relatable but it is worse.

In the funding model, the trader (the prostitute) needs to pay the pimp money upfront to get to sit on the casting couch. She gets well examined by the pimp to see if she has got the assets and can perform under stress and still keep herself sexy night after night and if she passes all the probes and evaluation apparatuses, she is given a client. I doubt in the real world that an attractive model would have to pay upfront to be browsed. In fact, some of them would easily be able to demand a signing bonus.

In the real world, the prostitute maybe sees one, two...ten???? Johns a night and knows who she is entertaining. In the funding model, they make it look like the trader is doing one John (his allocated 100K or whatever) but in fact the pimp can multiply the girl's services and give them to a slew of Johns all unzipped waiting for the warm touch of the trader across the board. The poor girl has no idea how many Johns she is servicing and how much the pimp is pocketing from every single act she puts out because her lusciousness is duplicated by several folds tru a virtual reality backend software that she doesn't even know about. As long as she does one John well, she gets paid for it but she is doing 100's of Johns without pay.

In the real world, if she messes up or gets into an argument with the John or just doesn't want to go that far, she might get a scolding or the occasional beating from the pimp but there is always a chance that a bit of humanity and consideration is still present because after all, they can look each other in the eye and have a face to face conversation and patch things up and then she is right back doing her services. In the funding model, one screw up and she is dead. No argument, no appeal, nothing. She can claw her way back in tho by paying the fee for the casting couch again and submit to probing and tests of skills to see if she has the vigor to take it again and if she pleases enough, she can continue service until she messes up slightly like if she drops her lipstick while being used and can't keep her lips well painted to please the Johns.

There are a lot more parodies I can draw but since everyone already knows how both business models work, I'll leave some of the parallels and some of the divergences from the business model to your imagination.
  • #4,083
  • Oct 11, 2020 8:17am Oct 11, 2020 8:17am
Quoting OutThere
Here is how prostitution works. There is a market where services are exchanged for money. There are Johns with money, there are prostitutes with ehm...services and usually there are pimps who arrange the meetings and take a portion of the money. All the firms posted earlier. I think almost 30 of them are pimps. The market is the whore house and the traders willing to do anything for money are the girls. Who said there is anything wrong with that model? It has been around forever. The oldest business around. Someone discovered that they can do the...
Funny "read' on Sunday morning. You are forgetting one thing. As long as whore gets paid, the whore is happy and life is beautiful again, ready to continue whoring. Who cares what went into the pimp or john pockets?
  • #4,084
  • Oct 11, 2020 8:44am Oct 11, 2020 8:44am
Quoting Dmh
{quote} Good story, but don’t forget that nothing stops you from trading on your personal account with the money you made with FTMO so you can escape the step drum and still keep generating treats. Also don’t forget that the vast majority of the people on this planet are in a step drum anyways but they generate generally less treats then you can get with FTMO's step drum. FTMO is a good opportunity to raise capital quickly. It is psychologically difficult for many traders to grow a small account into a big one without taking too big risks, even...
This is exactly what I've been saying. Most(including myself), do not have the disposable income to throw at a forex account. So you trade a small account, and even if you are very good (7-10% monthly), you don't make life changing money. You still have your full time job and the work put in doesn't seem worth it, so you increase your trade sizes to make the income worth it. Of course when you do that, it is now constant stress as you are over-leveraged and a couple of losses bring you all the way back to square one. FTMO offers the income that one should earn with above average trading skills. It is not easy and we should be paid well for it. I , for one, do not care how large the account is they are copying my trades into, nor do I care if they are copying at all. I am with FTMO to earn the income I feel I deserve for my skills and am not able to generate on my own. With their scaling plan, I will earn more than I need. I may also diversify into other prop firms as well. One thing I will not do is put my profits into my own account. I will never trade my own money again. I am in the US, if a forex broker goes belly up in the US, you lose all of your money. There is no protection or insurance whatsoever. Not to mention, a black swan event, although rare, can wipe out any size account, as price will blow right through your stops. If that were to happen, worse case scenario, I start the process over with FTMO. $600 vs. losing potentially hundreds of thousands of dollars. To me, it's a no brainer and i really have a hard time seeing how anyone at all can argue against it, there are no legitimate rebuttals. To each their own I guess.
  • #4,085
  • Edited 9:34am Oct 11, 2020 8:49am | Edited 9:34am
Quoting driven18
{quote} Funny "read' on Sunday morning. You are forgetting one thing. As long as whore gets paid, the whore is happy and life is beautiful again, ready to continue whoring. Who cares what went into the pimp or john pockets?
Thanks. I should be in church right now soliciting funds for trading. No kidding. In 80's I worked for a guy with huge affiliation with a large church. he handed me the Market's Wizards book and said these are the type of guys we are looking for. My job was to call a huge number of listed traders and ask them their fees, markets they traded, commissions, etc. and program the info in a database. My qualification was that I had taken high school computer science courses and knew Dos and Dbase or whatever existed at the time. He raised millions from the church patrons and the first thing him and his several partners did was to buy themselves the latest of Audi cars. I remember how he was showing off the imbedded seat heating that no other cars had yet.

Meanwhile he bought a house since he had a fancy title in his company along with his partners and started the high life. Within a year or two, they blew all the funds they had collected and got away with everything because the church members considered them honest guys who were just trying to make all the church members rich. He tried and failed at the task but still kept going to that church. He was forgiven and the members surrounded him and put their hands on his shoulders and prayed for him too. That's how things work.

Nowadays instead of you looking for talent and ask them how much they charge for their work, you can set up a passive website, charge the potential market wizards and if passed, put them to work. It's not like the 80's wizards ever had to use their own money or anything. They were sought after for their unique abilities and loaded with funds to trade it the way they knew how. Nowadays traders are dime a dozen. Disposable literally as shit. Each trader is just like a bot that either plugs into the system and produces or gets yanked out into the garbage and replaced by another modular bot. I guess the new generation only has known the website and disposability of the gig culture. You are just as good as your last gig otherwise you are a waste.

Anyways, I am not dissing a whore's life. As long as one wants to be one and doesn't care how she gets used, it is fine I guess. Unfortunately a lot of these financial whores think they are traders and somewhat of a Gordon Gecko when indeed the pimp is sitting on their faces. I think it is Okay tho to take the money one needs to start their own small business as soon as they can and leave the prostitution world and make something of themselves. They should be able to make it on their own since they are so pretty and at the same time they can type 100wpm while a tornado is hitting (just another trading day) but no....they have to go beg a pimp to get them hooked up. Whatever man....
  • #4,086
  • Oct 11, 2020 8:52am Oct 11, 2020 8:52am
Quoting driven18
{quote} Funny "read' on Sunday morning. You are forgetting one thing. As long as whore gets paid, the whore is happy and life is beautiful again, ready to continue whoring. Who cares what went into the pimp or john pockets?
Beautifully said. I am one happy whore.
  • #4,087
  • Edited 9:24am Oct 11, 2020 8:59am | Edited 9:24am
Happily giving a piece of her to the John and another to the pimp. Born to do this I guess.
The money made out of this should be able to buy a lot of makeup to cover the bruises and tattoo over the scars.

It kinda sucks for a trader to spend a lifetime honing the skills of being a shrewd trader and become the wolf of the Wall Street just to come up to a pimp and ask for employment under given conditions. Shuda just studied pimping all along. Pimp with nothing to sell to make money from except you because you are a good item to sell. I'm in the wrrrrooonnngggg business.
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  • #4,088
  • Oct 11, 2020 9:23am Oct 11, 2020 9:23am
Quoting GodRa
FTMO, when will you change the rules to allow us to hold over the weekend?
Are you funded trader?
If yes, FTMO does not allow holding over week ends. Not for others
Intraday only.
  • #4,089
  • Oct 11, 2020 9:57am Oct 11, 2020 9:57am
Quoting OutThere
Happily giving a piece of her to the John and another to the pimp. Born to do this I guess. The money made out of this should be able to buy a lot of makeup to cover the bruises and tattoo over the scars. It kinda sucks for a trader to spend a lifetime honing the skills of being a shrewd trader and become the wolf of the Wall Street just to come up to a pimp and ask for employment under given conditions. Shuda just studied pimping all along. Pimp with nothing to sell to make money from except you because you are a good item to sell. I'm in the wrrrrooonnngggg...
All of your arguments aside, here is the bottom line......
Unless you are trading a $210,000(70% of 300K) account for yourself, assuming we are of equal skill level...... I AM EARNING MORE MONEY THAN YOU TRADING. If you are trading $210K plus, than great for you, I personally would never do that even if I had it.
  • #4,090
  • Edited 11:56am Oct 11, 2020 11:24am | Edited 11:56am
Quoting navk
{quote} Are you funded trader? If yes, FTMO does not allow holding over week ends. Not for others
Not only that, they think if you use limit or stop orders, you are up to something nasty. They have accumulated a few techniques that use those entries and deemed them bad because according to them, they work only in demos and not in real trading. I think they may allow them if it is not around news time but I am not sure. If you really read, you'll see that they don't really know what they are talking about and can't place trades or exit them successfully themselves, hence none traders telling you how to trade and how not to trade.

Some other outlets even have more restrictive rules. I forget who it was but one of them says you place your entries within their office hours. So, something like 9 to 5 their time and all orders must be closed by the time they close up shop and go home. Another outlet lets you place a maximum of .05 lots total for every 10K. Another needs 15 pip SL on all trades and so on. One slip and there goes your deposit or monthly fee or your beloved 10K of their money that they have let you trade after passing months of scrutiny. Very picky pimps. You really need to be a pimp pleaser to get a job making them rich right after you have proven to yourself that you can trade and as such you don't need to bow your head and hold out your hand to an employer any more because you've figured out the market.

It is demeaning work but who claimed there was a lack of prostitutes ever?
  • #4,091
  • Oct 11, 2020 12:37pm Oct 11, 2020 12:37pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Not only that, they think if you use limit or stop orders, you are up to something nasty. They have accumulated a few techniques that use those entries and deemed them bad because according to them, they work only in demos and not in real trading. I think they may allow them if it is not around news time but I am not sure. If you really read, you'll see that they don't really know what they are talking about and can't place trades or exit them successfully themselves, hence none traders telling you how to trade and how not to trade. Some...

Might want to copy/paste your latest comments onto the 5'ers thread.
If you are going to post here, might as well keep it fair and post there.
Or is it just FTMO that you have beef with?
  • #4,092
  • Oct 11, 2020 12:45pm Oct 11, 2020 12:45pm
Quoting moodybot
{quote} Might want to copy/paste your latest comments onto the 5'ers thread. If you are going to post here, might as well keep it fair and post there. Or is it just FTMO that you have beef with?
No, it's all of them. It applies to whoever uses the pimp/prostitute/John model. They know who they are.
Sorry, I have no obligation to be fair and copy this onto all similar threads.
For that I charge a fee and it includes the asking party's promoter to partner with me as a monkey in a master and monkey show.
I put down a hat, crowds gather, the monkey dances and flips and I collect the donated cash.
If the monkey doesn't do as trained, he won't get his banana that day.
  • #4,093
  • Oct 11, 2020 12:51pm Oct 11, 2020 12:51pm
What a shit storm!!!!
on a postive roll...
  • #4,094
  • Oct 11, 2020 12:56pm Oct 11, 2020 12:56pm
Attached Image
Anything above the line is an uptrend, below the line is a downtrend.
  • #4,095
  • Oct 11, 2020 1:21pm Oct 11, 2020 1:21pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} No, it's all of them. It applies to whoever uses the pimp/prostitute/John model. They know who they are. Sorry, I have no obligation to be fair and copy this onto all similar threads. For that I charge a fee and it includes the asking party's promoter to partner with me as a monkey in a master and monkey show. I put down a hat, crowds gather, the monkey dances and flips and I collect the donated cash. If the monkey doesn't do as trained, he won't get his banana that day.
Interesting run of comments.
But each to their own.
  • #4,096
  • Oct 11, 2020 1:33pm Oct 11, 2020 1:33pm
I checked their rules again. Yes, it’s definitely a gold old scam, refined one but still one.
Of course, I didn’t do the exact maths to assess the probability for a trader to recover his subscription fee and make money with them. It’s still possible of course. But, it’s unlikely to last more than a couple of months imho.
Basically, you have to pay and then win on a 1:1 W/L with an additional restriction of 0.5 max loss per day to pass the challenge and not lose your fee. The big majority of traders will fail of course (the odds are heavily against them) but the few who succeed and recover their subscription fees will be allowed to lose only 10% of the supposed funded capital before hey get booted out. If you get ‘’funded’’ 10000 bucks, they could only 1000...All the rest is marketing trick.

But the most sneaky trick is that even if they keep going, they would be allowed to lose only 5% of the INITIAL ‘’funded” capital PER DAY. That means even if they are very lucky and their capital keeps growing, their allowed INTRADAY drawdown will get smaller and smaller in percentage which means they would be booted out sooner or later, more likely sooner than they think and then they will have to pay the subscription fees again...

Anyone who have some experience in trading knows that the market can go against you at any given time, even if you have stop losses and even if you are the best trade in the world. Just some unexpected news and some slippage and you will exceed those 5% of INITIAL capital...And then, you will see :

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Don't give up on your dreams. Keep sleeping.
  • #4,097
  • Oct 11, 2020 1:38pm Oct 11, 2020 1:38pm
Quoting moodybot
{quote} Interesting run of comments. But each to their own.
Yes I know.
You've got to be subservient to work in that arrangement.
I don't fit in the Master/Sub relationships.
It takes a certain kind who likes it that way and yes there are plenty working in that industry.
  • #4,098
  • Oct 11, 2020 1:46pm Oct 11, 2020 1:46pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Yes I know. You've got to be subservient to work in that arrangement. I don't fit in the Master/Sub relationships. It takes a certain kind who likes it that way and yes there are plenty working in that industry.
You seem to have quite an interest in “that” industry but as I said, each to their own.
  • #4,099
  • Oct 11, 2020 1:55pm Oct 11, 2020 1:55pm
Quoting moodybot
{quote} You seem to have quite an interest in “that” industry but as I said, each to their own.
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  • #4,100
  • Oct 11, 2020 2:40pm Oct 11, 2020 2:40pm
All interesting good points ! And a few good stories, thanks for that, great laughs !

But, as we all know, there are 2 sides to the coin.

Yes the challenge is a &!*$(#&!

But they are looking for the exceptional.

After the challenge, the deal is reasonable for specific type of strategies and a good disciplined trader who knows perfectly a perfect MoneyMngmt adapted to his diversified array of strategies, brave combined forces to take on the conflicting movements of the market blabliblalballbalb

let me take my breath

NOW. After the challenge. No profit target, because they know sometimes its dd or pipi time.

Max loss per day 5%, 10% max in all. If you know what you re doing and have a system that fits the bill, AND live in place where cost of life isnt so high, you got a winner!!!

70% of profits are yours. Not risking your own money! In some countries, this is a dream come true.

Many systems bring in around 3-10% a month for drawdown that never gets close to 10%, actually not even 5%.

I personally know a trader that makes minimum double the monthly drawdown per month ! But hes an exceptional monster, but still not one of a kind !

And 5% loss a day? If you are trading with that much risk daily, I wouldnt give you a penny either to trade !

Thats up to 10000 a month, for someone who really knows what hes doing.

TIPS

Carefully plan the time you will take the challenge. Based on many pasts experiences, when is it most favourable time for your system to tackle this challenge?

DONT aim for the 10% recklessly, REMEMBER as long as you're in profit at the end of the month, your still in.

If you only have a trend strategy, develop a range and/or counter-trend one, and vice-vice-versa-versa. The market will always surprise us with a long period of just one or the other and we cant afford it to be happening during this time, plus they complement each other and DD stays even lower while returns get bigger

Finally, its not for all, but far from being a scam. If someone has not done their homework to figure out that this was not possible with their trading on the long-term, than they are to blame, no?
If I don't mention SL and/or TP = longer-term setup possibly in the works!
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