Trying scalping with a 1000 bucks - Scalping is expensive! | Page 2 | Forex Factory

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Trying scalping with a 1000 bucks - Scalping is expensive!

  • #21
  • Jul 25, 2020 7:39pm Jul 25, 2020 7:39pm
Quoting LDFX
{quote} Agree. Expecting a positive expectancy with such small pips is truly insane for retail traders, even if it is the size of the stop, which will very often be hit with slippage most of the time. So it has to be traded with a lot of skill, low risk per trade and most importantly high r:r ratio. Even then you will be giving probably half of your profit to the broker, but if you have a high daily distribution coupled with a win rate over 50% with an average win higher than your average loss, you should be ok. On a very large sample of trades...
My expectancy is to win at all costs.

Every trade I expect to get pips even 1 is a win for me.

I have yet to experience a full hit of my stop loss in 100 trades.

I don't play RR. I play get out quick. I play move to BE as quick as possible. If price hits BE, no problem, next one. If price drops for 20, great, luck. No emotion. Because when I am in I don't know what will happen next.

At least that scalping to me.
  • #22
  • Jul 25, 2020 7:39pm Jul 25, 2020 7:39pm
Quoting LDFX
{quote} Well perhaps you do have the skill to do that, if that then I congratulate you. But Forex factory is like prison, everybody in Prison is innocent, in forex factory everybody is successful..., which doesn’t mean a thing unless you can prove otherwise.

Where do I send you my tax returns? Maybe upload them here? I really want to prove myself infront of you! Can't wait doing so! Please instruct me!
Maadik Hugiis. IQ 69.
  • #23
  • Jul 25, 2020 7:51pm Jul 25, 2020 7:51pm
pa18 - I've never had much luck with scalping, so I try to focus on better entry points and then set a fixed stop. I try to let the point where I take profit range as far as it can but that's always the challenge. Reviewing past trades I always leave some money on the table.
  • #24
  • Edited 8:34pm Jul 25, 2020 8:13pm | Edited 8:34pm
Quoting ondskap
pa18 - I've never had much luck with scalping, so I try to focus on better entry points and then set a fixed stop. I try to let the point where I take profit range as far as it can but that's always the challenge. Reviewing past trades I always leave some money on the table.
It's mindset bud, in and out fast. Greed is what kills you.

Everyone talks about the system, it's actually not. For scalping and other types of trading. It's your mind.
  • #25
  • Jul 25, 2020 8:43pm Jul 25, 2020 8:43pm
Before using $1,000, try your "system" on a smaller account, why not $100? If you really have a good way that is consistent, then prove it with a tiny account. If you feel it's not enough because it isn't worth it, then consider if your attraction to trading is addiction and greed. Those motivations are going to be counter productive to the motivation of proving a good method and having the right mind set and attitude. If you think that tiny 0.01 lots are not attractive to trade, then you're in it for the money, which means that you aren't in it for the discipline and method and proof of your long term ability. How do I know this? Because I did it for too many years for the wrong reason and I paid for it with more than I care to discuss.
big money makes big moves and then hides during small money chasing.
  • #26
  • Edited 10:18pm Jul 25, 2020 10:02pm | Edited 10:18pm
Quoting corrman
Before using $1,000, try your "system" on a smaller account, why not $100? If you really have a good way that is consistent, then prove it with a tiny account. If you feel it's not enough because it isn't worth it, then consider if your attraction to trading is addiction and greed. Those motivations are going to be counter productive to the motivation of proving a good method and having the right mind set and attitude. If you think that tiny 0.01 lots are not attractive to trade, then you're in it for the money, which means that you aren't in it...
This is not even my question. I didnt even mention my system. My system is fine, thanks.
  • #27
  • Jul 25, 2020 11:16pm Jul 25, 2020 11:16pm
Quoting pa18
{quote} It's mindset bud, in and out fast. Greed is what kills you. Everyone talks about the system, it's actually not. For scalping and other types of trading. It's your mind.
No, its about trading systems because our minds only take wild guesses.
Without months and months of back testing on a proven strategy, you are only guessing if you use your mind.

If you are worried about trading costs, you have just proven your mind is compromised.

Here is an ideal where to scalp - based on a data intense strategy backed tested over a couple of years on a few brokers data.
Scalping should not be based on mindset, rather historical data.
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Trading thin liquidity at the boundary of the charts
  • #28
  • Jul 26, 2020 12:21am Jul 26, 2020 12:21am
Quoting RickM
{quote} No, its about trading systems because our minds only take wild guesses. Without months and months of back testing on a proven strategy, you are only guessing if you use your mind. If you are worried about trading costs, you have just proven your mind is compromised. Here is an ideal where to scalp - based on a data intense strategy backed tested over a couple of years on a few brokers data. Scalping should not be based on mindset, rather historical data. {image}
If it is not mindset then why do only 5% of retail traders succeed? In the long run?

Love to hear this one...
  • #29
  • Jul 26, 2020 12:25am Jul 26, 2020 12:25am
Quoting RickM
{quote} No, its about trading systems because our minds only take wild guesses. Without months and months of back testing on a proven strategy, you are only guessing if you use your mind. If you are worried about trading costs, you have just proven your mind is compromised. Here is an ideal where to scalp - based on a data intense strategy backed tested over a couple of years on a few brokers data. Scalping should not be based on mindset, rather historical data. {image}
So many retail traders here, with so many systems and so much backtesting.

But only 5% succeed??
  • #30
  • Jul 26, 2020 1:09am Jul 26, 2020 1:09am
Quoting pa18
{quote} So many retail traders here, with so many systems and so much backtesting. But only 5% succeed??
Hey, how did you find out this figure? ... this way?

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  • #31
  • Jul 26, 2020 1:42am Jul 26, 2020 1:42am
Quoting LDFX
{quote} That is great pricing, care to share the broker and your average loss and win in pips in order to enlighten pa18 ? Cheers,
If interrested pm me, I do not want to be accused of pushing a broker. But it is a well known broker.
In terms of yield (pips) it depends on many variables, i.e. instrument, time frame, strategy, spread.
Return To Disorder
  • #32
  • Jul 26, 2020 3:06am Jul 26, 2020 3:06am
Quoting pa18
{quote} So many retail traders here, with so many systems and so much backtesting. But only 5% succeed??
First of all 25% of traders succeed if you do the research. That 5% story is a lie to make the profitable traders feel good about themselves.

Most traders who do a lot of back testing on their strategy's fall victim to fraud.
The data offered by brokers in the MT4 tester or other testing platforms is faulty on purpose. Its designed to be different from real live data so when traders trade a strategy based on their back testing results, they often find the drawn down levels and profit results are not even close to those testing results.
Also the draw down figures that come out of the MT4 tester are about double when used on real data.

So the best chance of being a profitable trader is to learn how to back testing correctly - always considering that a sizeable amount of error with test results will always exist.

As for mindset - that is something developed out of confidence
Trading thin liquidity at the boundary of the charts
  • #33
  • Jul 26, 2020 8:25am Jul 26, 2020 8:25am
In general, it seems to me that any highly dynamic strategy, which implies that you need to work with several positions at once, requires quite large capital. Because if you don't, it turns into some kind of lucky game. And of course, working with this approach is something that will not allow you to build a real business and a real job. Of course, many traders do not welcome such risky approaches, but for some of them - these are real prospects, which bring income. So, as for me, you can use what you like, but you need to do it thoughtfully, calmly, with a certain plan of action. You can't just risk it. Well, on the whole, you can. But then you have to be prepared for the consequences.
  • #34
  • Jul 26, 2020 12:03pm Jul 26, 2020 12:03pm
Quoting RickM
{quote} First of all 25% of traders succeed if you do the research. That 5% story is a lie to make the profitable traders feel good about themselves. Most traders who do a lot of back testing on their strategy's fall victim to fraud. The data offered by brokers in the MT4 tester or other testing platforms is faulty on purpose. Its designed to be different from real live data so when traders trade a strategy based on their back testing results, they often find the drawn down levels and profit results are not even close to those testing results. Also...
I thought it was something like 25% after the first month and 5% after the third...
  • #35
  • Jul 26, 2020 5:39pm Jul 26, 2020 5:39pm
Quoting LDFX
{quote} I just erased my previous post answering to your post because I might have misunderstood yours. What do you mean by “this myth” ?
That you lose more than you win because of comissions..

As soon as you place a trade you are negative because the brokers charges you upfront with the cost of the trade (be it spread or fixed comission, whatever) THIS IS WHERE BID/ASK COMES INTO PLAY !! IF you really win 3 pips those 3 pips are pure profit because you won those 3 pips + the cost of the trade

and you can win 3 million trades like this, win 3 million dollars, pay X % in costs and STILL make a shit load of money !! just chose an instrument that have the smallest spread and you are set

thats why its a myth that you end up "paying more" in comission this way.. and the cost its lot/contract size dependent too but if the noobs dont understand the first part, then for sure they wont understand the second lol
  • #36
  • Jul 26, 2020 11:43pm Jul 26, 2020 11:43pm
Quoting pa18
Trading with pepperstone. Looks like 75 cents for a mini lot and if my average trade is to capture 3 pips with 2% risk per trade, seems pretty expensive. Am I doing this right?? Is this normal? For a standard lot, I capture 3 pips with 2 % risk, 30 dollars ...commission is 7-8 dollars RT. That's a huge chunk out of my profit?? Seems like if I have a small account it's going to be struggle. Any cheaper solid brokers for scalping out there? {image}

I'd say you need to know first how much are your expenses for trade. Usually trade costs are from 1-2 pips (spread + commission).Anything more expensive it's not worth scalping small pips.So you'd have to aim for 5 pips instead of 3 to get better results. Like RickM mentioned above.
Whether you think you can, or you think you can't,you're right. H.F.
  • #37
  • Jul 27, 2020 12:29am Jul 27, 2020 12:29am
Quoting Darkseeker
In general, it seems to me that any highly dynamic strategy, which implies that you need to work with several positions at once, requires quite large capital. Because if you don't, it turns into some kind of lucky game. And of course, working with this approach is something that will not allow you to build a real business and a real job. Of course, many traders do not welcome such risky approaches, but for some of them - these are real prospects, which bring income. So, as for me, you can use what you like, but you need to do it thoughtfully, calmly,...
Hmm, not sure I agree with this logic. Taking a larger position on one trade is really no different risk wise than taking, for example, 5 trades concurrently that each have risk equivalent to 1/5th of the larger position. it's all about managing risk one way or another.
  • #38
  • Aug 10, 2020 3:14pm Aug 10, 2020 3:14pm
Quoting havo
if you dont know wth its bid/ask and how the targets gets affected by that you will always gona cry the wolf its coming and the brokers are the bad guys.. this "myth" that you lost more in comissions in the long run needs to end, level up already !!
The bid/ask vary on days, vary on at-a-time order flow, depend on the time of market, even with ECN account trade spread for EURUSD is not 0.1 like broker promises, and when you joint you sign contract with term and conditions clearly state god will or natural, uncontrollable event bank holiday, night time counted here ... you sign what ever broker gives you wont complaint, or you get used to it and will be quiet after some reply with nonsense emails

About spread and commission Do you ever realise the commission on UCAD is or +7$ a lot, for EU 5$, some common market sometimes at night has over 15 to 20 times higher spread, good luck when your cap is tight, your margin is taken high,

So for me I see the only way to discuss is how to make more profit than the expense, and to make it consistent
  • #39
  • Edited 10:28pm Aug 20, 2021 7:29pm | Edited 10:28pm
Quoting LDFX
{quote} Well perhaps you do have the skill to do that, if that then I congratulate you. But Forex factory is like prison, everybody in Prison is innocent, in forex factory everybody is successful..., which doesn’t mean a thing unless you can prove otherwise. Nevertheless you said a right thing, “3 to 13 pips” which is very important, not like a 3 pips tp, which is by the way only relative to the stop loss and hit rate, which pa18 never mentioned. I hope his stop is at max 3 pips also, but even then giving the relative high cost of commission and...
How do you trade my friend?
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  • #40
  • Last Post: Jul 2, 2022 1:04am Jul 2, 2022 1:04am
Rick: "Unskilled traders fuss about spread/ commissions while professionals scalpers fuss about hitting profit targets"

Absolutely right! The better you trade, the less you are interested in one or two cents more spread or not.
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