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The word DISCIPLINE is overused

  • #41
  • Aug 11, 2019 10:25am Aug 11, 2019 10:25am
Quoting OutThere
{quote} My passion leads to discipline kind of automatically. That's why it's no effort. It's a pleasure actually. No one has to give me instructions how to be passionate. It comes from the heart. It works the other way around, then you have found a way to make things work for you.
Yes You Are Correct..

"There is a driving force, more powerful than steam and electricity and atomic energy: the will."

Albert Einstein


You need to find ways to survive in the financial market ... and be willing to obey the rules of what works for you



If you love what you do is no more effort but a pleasure
  • #42
  • Aug 11, 2019 11:08am Aug 11, 2019 11:08am
a normal average person who is not a gambler has enough discipline.
this issue of discipline is just exaggerated.
this is not rocket science.
you just have to follow the rules of the system that we employ.
whether your system is good or not is another question.
  • #43
  • Aug 11, 2019 11:42am Aug 11, 2019 11:42am
Quoting tiborf71
a normal average person who is not a gambler has enough discipline. this issue of discipline is just exaggerated. this is not rocket science. you just have to follow the rules of the system that we employ. whether your system is good or not is another question.
Yah, Buy low, sell high isn't rocket science either.
At one point or another, the market breaks all rules.
It's like floating on a sail boat on a beautiful sunny day just off the coast.
The boat follows the physics rules and is completely harmonized with the nature to function as it does.
Was it rocket science to design the boat?

The boat is floating at the mercy of the nature.
I don't need to paint a picture how things could go wrong with that scenario.
No one will hear your screams if a storm blows out of nowhere.
It happens all the time.
Just today a normal average person who was not a gambler met his/her destiny on a boat somewhere...
  • #44
  • Aug 11, 2019 2:04pm Aug 11, 2019 2:04pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Yah, Buy low, sell high isn't rocket science either. At one point or another, the market breaks all rules. It's like floating on a sail boat on a beautiful sunny day just off the coast. The boat follows the physics rules and is completely harmonized with the nature to function as it does. Was it rocket science to design the boat? The boat is floating at the mercy of the nature. I don't need to paint a picture how things could go wrong with that scenario. No one will hear your screams if a storm blows out of nowhere. It happens all the time....
Wow, I had just decided to skip making a post on this thread, then you said this.

Your comments lead me to believe that you are failing as a trader, and from a previous post, I'm going to guess that you just experienced a margin call after stupidly watching a trade erase your trading account. In your world, you believe you were disciplined in letting your account blow up, and as such, you are not to blame for the loss (can only assume you have also failed at learning enough about trading since you use a trading approach that allows you to sit back and watch as a trade destroys you). You have bravely placed that blame squarely on the shoulders of everyone who has ever stated the importance of being disciplined. Now, you've provided a little analogy of the sail boat which, just like you, is the victim of an imaginary villain (nature) which jumped up and destroyed your little boat. But wait, the boat is not sailing out at sea all alone and totally vulnerable to nature. If the boat's captain had his head pulled out of his ass, he'd see the dark sky forming, and begin to make preparations to move to shore. Or, when the storm approached, he'd lower the sail and turn on the motor to move to safety. Maybe he would have a radio turned on to listen to the weather forecast and developments. The point is, the boat's survival is more often than not, the responsibility of the captain of the boat, and not a victim of random acts of nature. A stupid, undisciplined captain will sink his boat, a disciplined captain will be parked at a dock as the storm passes. But even if a disciplined captain is unexpectedly caught in a storm, that captain will fight like hell to save his ship, and not be a victim of randomness. He'll keep his head and rely on his training and discipline to save his boat, and not just sit on his ass watching the boat sink.

People like you want to blame anything and everything for your failure, rather than admit that you have failed because you aren't good enough, or disciplined enough to trade the forex. Unlike the stupid, undisciplined captain of the sinking boat, who's screams go unnoticed, you have found FF where you can share your screams of failure with us all, which in retrospect, should be expected, since you have no discipline in trading, it follows you would have no discipline in your personal life as well.

If you want to be a successful trader, figure our how discipline plays a roll in all aspects of becoming a trader. People who are successful in life, in any and all aspects of like, know the importance of being disciplined. There are no random, undisciplined, flexible paths to success.
  • #45
  • Aug 11, 2019 2:37pm Aug 11, 2019 2:37pm
Quoting GEfx
{quote} Wow, I had just decided to skip making a post on this thread, then you said this. Your comments lead me to believe that you are failing as a trader, and from a previous post, I'm going to guess that you just experienced a margin call after stupidly watching a trade erase your trading account. In your world, you believe you were disciplined in letting your account blow up, and as such, you are not to blame for the loss (can only assume you have also failed at learning enough about trading since you use a trading approach that allows you to...

Ya bla bla bla....I am glad that you gave up your discipline to stay away and jumped in to collect your jollies from an attack on me because this clearly shows what you are made of. We are discussing guru trading advice here and not my personal trading record. Why don't you attack the guru quote maker for his trading record? Ah, because he didn't give you anything to jump on other than go be disciplined. I have been around since 2003 less a few years of absence due to family situations and yes I admit, I have blown accounts unlike you mr know it all. Currently I am trading a few accounts in different ranges of gain and dd but my bigger accounts are the ones with about 60% gain. The smaller ones in dd are experimental and I am certain they will come back soon. I am not so perfect as you are tho. One day you will blow your first account and you then can aim your remarks at yourself but from the tone of your response it will never happen. Say hi to Bill Gates and Bezos at Playboy parties from me since you are in a position to run shoulders with them Captain GEfx. Thanks.
  • #46
  • Aug 11, 2019 3:25pm Aug 11, 2019 3:25pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Ya bla bla bla....I am glad that you gave up your discipline to stay away and jumped in to collect your jollies from an attack on me because this clearly shows what you are made of.We are discussing guru trading advice here and not my personal trading record. Why don't you attack the guru quote maker for his trading record? Ah, because he didn't give you anything to jump on other than go be disciplined. I have been around since 2003 less a few years of absence due to family situations and yes I admit, I have blown accounts unlike...
I've read most of the posts on the thread. Regarding the highlighted statement above, you are definitely talking about your personal experiences in your posts. You clearly have an emotional connection to everything you've said. I would not jump on anyone who gives good, reasonable advice like "trade with discipline". Perhaps you could explain how you were trading with discipline when you watched your account blow up? Your trading approach really said to take no action or set a stop to prevent a large loss? Or, more likely, it was a lack of discipline that caused the loss, one where discipline is overwhelmed by greed or ego? You see, discipline is the rational mind controlling your emotions. Is a margin call more likely to occur after you exercise some discipline and set a reasonable stop, or after your ego takes control and you turn off the stop, because your ego can't handle a 20 pip loss? Maybe we could take a vote here: is it more likely that OutThere experienced a margin call due to his ego or due to being disciplined?
  • #47
  • Aug 11, 2019 3:35pm Aug 11, 2019 3:35pm
Quoting GEfx
{quote} I've read most of the posts on the thread. Regarding the highlighted statement above, you are definitely talking about your personal experiences in your posts. You clearly have an emotional connection to everything you've said. I would not jump on anyone who gives good, reasonable advice like "trade with discipline". Perhaps you could explain how you were trading with discipline when you watched your account blow up? Your trading approach really said to take no action or set a stop to prevent a large loss? Or, more likely, it was a lack...
wo wo wo...slow down sailor. Of course I speak based on my personal experience unlike the gurus that impress you with copy and paste material.

I am not on trial here. I see that you are from US. Since you have such good boat navigational skills, why don't you approach your clown in chief and teach him some lessons on navigating his navy ships so they don't collide with other boats all over the place. I reckon they have state of the art equipment and satellite and who knows what else and they still fail....so embarrassing for them. Maybe they just started sailing their boats or something.
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  • #48
  • Aug 11, 2019 3:56pm Aug 11, 2019 3:56pm
Quoting OutThere
{quote} wo wo wo...slow down sailor. Of course I speak based on my personal experience unlike the gurus that impress you with copy and paste material. I am not on trial here. I see that you are from US. Since you have such good boat navigational skills, why don't you approach your clown in chief and teach him some lessons on navigating his navy ships so they don't collide with other boats all over the place. I reckon they have state of the art equipment and satellite and who knows what else and they still fail....so embarrassing for them. Maybe...
Sorry, I'm not talking about or defending any gurus, nor do I know any gurus. I'm just saying that anyone who says, be disciplined in your trading, is not to blame for your problems. If you are hating on, or attacking those who call themselves, or are held out by people like you to be, guru, that's just fine with me. Could care less. But saying that being disciplined can result in failure is just stupid. And please don't deflect the discussion by throwing hate on the US Navy. Try to stay focused and disciplined in this discussion by staying on topic. Again, is it discipline or ego that kills trading accounts?
  • #49
  • Aug 11, 2019 4:01pm Aug 11, 2019 4:01pm
Quoting GEfx
{quote} Sorry, I'm not talking about or defending any gurus, nor do I know any gurus. I'm just saying that anyone who says, be disciplined in your trading, is not to blame for your problems. If you are hating on, or attacking those who call themselves, or are held out by people like you to be, guru, that's just fine with me. Could care less. But saying that being disciplined can result in failure is just stupid. And please don't deflect the discussion by throwing hate on the US Navy. Try to stay focused and disciplined in this discussion by staying...
You are saying some stupid things like I am blaming some gurus for my failure etc. It's getting as mangled and twisted as the shipwreck above. Refer to your post 44 how you think with sticking your head out the window you can prevent incidents at sea and then look at the wreckage. You are obviously unable to connect concepts and whatever you are connecting is a manifestation of your brain or shall I borrow your term and call it ego?

I am not dealing with you any more but as a departing gift, here is a screenshot of my accounts since May1. Now go away before I shut your ability to post in this thread since you have nothing useful to add.
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  • #50
  • Aug 11, 2019 5:41pm Aug 11, 2019 5:41pm
Quoting GEfx
{quote} I've read most of the posts on the thread. Regarding the highlighted statement above, you are definitely talking about your personal experiences in your posts. You clearly have an emotional connection to everything you've said. I would not jump on anyone who gives good, reasonable advice like "trade with discipline". Perhaps you could explain how you were trading with discipline when you watched your account blow up? Your trading approach really said to take no action or set a stop to prevent a large loss? Or, more likely, it was a lack...
I am just curious about those captains you are referring. Can you name few institutional "captains" that year in year out bringing their ships in harbour in one piece without any speculation. Have you ever seen a bank dealing desk when market crashes? As per your statements can we assume Lehman Brothers employ 25000 stupid people to manage their 639 billion dollar assets yet they bankrupt in 2008 financial crisis? How dumb do you think they were that they cannot see that storm you are always prepared?

My humble suggestion to you is to keep sailing on your lazer boat in the lake but dont make estimations of a sea life.
  • #52
  • Aug 11, 2019 8:26pm Aug 11, 2019 8:26pm
Here is an scenario where being disciplined sucks. You have a trading system that works well and has for a long time. Why? Because you are disciplined and follow it like a freaking perfectionist. The market goes against you and you don't waver just like the many times that it has and you were disciplined. The market goes against you even more but you know to be disciplined and follow the rules of your perfect system. The market goes even more against you and like how you know, you hold on (Ok, don't confuse that with holding a losing trade forever. You are not just holding, you are trading with various trading steps you know to work). Then boom...the dreaded margin call comes and you were so disciplined...weren't you?


nonsense..

discipline with bad rules of course destroys accounts.
Excessive expectations of one idiot trade and you call it discipline? so discipline must be blamed? one trade that makes the account destroyed, seriously man???
  • #53
  • Aug 11, 2019 9:21pm Aug 11, 2019 9:21pm
Quoting better23
Here is an scenario where being disciplined sucks. You have a trading system that works well and has for a long time. Why? Because you are disciplined and follow it like a freaking perfectionist. The market goes against you and you don't waver just like the many times that it has and you were disciplined. The market goes against you even more but you know to be disciplined and follow the rules of your perfect system. The market goes even more against you and like how you know, you hold on (Ok, don't confuse that with holding a losing trade forever....
one idiot trade?

No, hundreds of such trades that worked before by using the same rules. If I was to not be disciplined, there wouldn't be hundreds of prior trades that worked. Where do you draw the line at abandoning your system? After one trade? 10? 50? 100?
What you are saying is the antithesis of being disciplined.
But ya go listen to the guru that says be disciplined if it works for you while you are not disciplined enough to follow your rules systematically if it works for you.
Also, that was a general example and there is not enough detail for you to draw your one idiot trade conclusion.
  • #54
  • Aug 11, 2019 11:53pm Aug 11, 2019 11:53pm
Quoting OutThere
There are trader inspiring quotes going around encouraging or outright ordering traders to be disciplined and it seems like anything with that word in it gets liked a lot. It is as if discipline was an objective thing like the sun. Stay out of the sun. Put on sunscreen when playing in the sun. Look at that nice sunset...Yes, we all know what the sun is and how it looks like and how it feels on our skins and how it makes everything look like. What is discipline exactly? Discipline, no matter how you want to define it, is subjective. No two people...
You do realize that you are using discipline and success as synonyms? They are not.

Discipline equals doing something as designed. Karate is a discipline.
Self discipline is YOU doing a specific task as designed. Like waking up for work on time, or brushing your teeth 3 times a day, or not eating sugar filled foods that are unhealthy.

Success in trading requires SELF discipline. But discipline does not ensure success in trading.

For example, let's say you were disciplined trader in 2014, and always bought EURCHF at 1.2020 and always covered at 1.2060. You Had tremendous discipline and success. But Jan 2015 took all your money.

You were a disciplined trader and yet you were wiped out.

Discipline is following the plan as designed. A flawed plan will fail. A disciple of a proven discipline will only fail when they do not follow a proven plan as designed.
Ecclesiastes 1:9
  • #55
  • Edited 12:26am Aug 12, 2019 12:15am | Edited 12:26am
Quoting newbegger
{quote} You do realize that you are using discipline and success as synonyms? They are not. Discipline equals doing something as designed. Karate is a discipline. Self discipline is YOU doing a specific task as designed. Like waking up for work on time, or brushing your teeth 3 times a day, or not eating sugar filled foods that are unhealthy. Success in trading requires SELF discipline. But discipline does not ensure success in trading. For example, let's say you were disciplined trader in 2014, and always bought EURCHF at 1.2020 and always covered...
Well said.

This is the quote that started it all: https://www.forexfactory.com/showthr...9#post12419989

Since you so eloquently differentiated discipline from self discipline, how does that quote fit in with your explanation?
  • #56
  • Aug 12, 2019 12:35am Aug 12, 2019 12:35am
Quoting OutThere
{quote} Well said. This is the quote that started it all: https://www.forexfactory.com/showthr...9#post12419989 How does that quote fit in with your explanation?
Yes and no. That quote is from someone trying to influence the patience and Discipline that we as traders need. But the word seductive is a tell that this is a seller preying on greed and fear to sell an idea.

To learn how to trade, you must learn how to trade.
Ecclesiastes 1:9
  • #57
  • Aug 12, 2019 12:50am Aug 12, 2019 12:50am
Quoting tropical_g
{quote} does Trump tweeting about 10 percent hikes on remaining exports have a random outcome? does the rbnz cutting rates by 50 basis points rather than the 25 expected give a random outcome. does global slowdown and lower demand for oil have a random outcome for the prices of oil? the only thing random about the market is people that solely focus on technical analysis for their primary form of analysis. you are so far in the camp of randomness that it is obvious you are one of them because you wouldnt have that opinion if you really knew what's...
The beauty of market news... the effect is not random due to the fact that on average the market does the opposite of what it should be doing. To trade the news in a logical manner i.e to bet on the expected outcome - is foolish and should not be considered.

TA ==> Totally Asinine
Fundamental Analysis ==> Funny Mental Analysis
  • #58
  • Aug 12, 2019 1:00am Aug 12, 2019 1:00am
Quoting Mingary
{quote} The beauty of market news... the effect is not random due to the fact that on average the market does the opposite of what it should be doing. To trade the news in a logical manner i.e to bet on the expected outcome - is idiotic and should not be considered. TA ==> Totally Asinine Fundamental Analysis ==> Funny Mental Analysis
oh but you said trading is random now you are admitting it's not all random yet with a caveat of expectations. clearly you don't know how to trade them because you assume it's betting upfront on expectations. quit now before you go insane
  • #59
  • Aug 12, 2019 1:25am Aug 12, 2019 1:25am
Quoting tropical_g
{quote} oh but you said trading is random now you are admitting it's not all random yet with a caveat of expectations. clearly you don't know how to trade them because you assume it's betting upfront on expectations. quit now before you go insane
It's random to the extend that over time the same type of news in the past provides no clue about the direction in the future.
The market can very well go in the expected direction, or it can go the opposite way. Same type of news; different outcome

So Mr. Trump spews out another one of his beautiful tweets -- After careful analysis you believe that Gold is going to go up....

Good luck with your trading (;
  • #60
  • Aug 12, 2019 1:28am Aug 12, 2019 1:28am
generally, the problem is not discipline, but rather that many do not find a good strategy.
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