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(binned per thread starter’s request) MM (Money Maker) Detective

  • #3,721
  • Jun 25, 2019 8:44pm Jun 25, 2019 8:44pm
Quoting Robot Trader
{quote} It is excellent news that you have improved your trading ability, but sharing is caring and therefore your post is worthless, because you do not wish to divulge anything, the point of a trading discussion thread is the interaction of ideas, not just to post Eureka type comments which don't give any real value to the readers.
Does Steve share his coding (scripts)? And if no, why not?
  • #3,722
  • Jun 25, 2019 8:47pm Jun 25, 2019 8:47pm
Quoting Pumi
{quote} Does Steve share his coding (scripts)? And if no, why not?
I dared said I have had MASTERED the art of SIR GEORGE 100% but not sharing.
  • #3,723
  • Jun 25, 2019 8:53pm Jun 25, 2019 8:53pm
Quoting Pumi
{quote} Does Steve share his coding (scripts)? And if no, why not?
Why is that important, if R4M shares the EA and that works great.

Also the EA will come with parameters requiring many manual inputs, so lets say that I find good inputs that work and show a profit, but for everyone else the EA is crap and shows no profit, should I share my settings or keep them private and let everyone else work it out for themselves?
Some people say I'm lucky, but the more I practice the luckier I get
  • #3,724
  • Jun 25, 2019 8:55pm Jun 25, 2019 8:55pm
Quoting Robot Trader
{quote} Why is that important, if R4M shares the EA and that works great. Also the EA will come with parameters requiring many manual inputs, so lets say that I find good inputs that work and show a profit, but for everyone else the EA is crap and shows no profit, should I share my settings or keep them private and let everyone else work it out for themselves?
I will share the settings.
  • #3,725
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:05pm Jun 25, 2019 9:05pm
Quoting Robot Trader
{quote} Why is that important, if R4M shares the EA and that works great. Also the EA will come with parameters requiring many manual inputs, so lets say that I find good inputs that work and show a profit, but for everyone else the EA is crap and shows no profit, should I share my settings or keep them private and let everyone else work it out for themselves?
Like I said, I am not starting a debate. We just have to look at things at both sides (positive and negative). If what I just shared is trash then it should be easy for you to put it in the bin. Someone else might see it differently and re-look at the information that George shared, with a different mindset.

Ever asked yourself why some few are getting it? Perhaps by nature there has to be a 95% and 5%. If you are happy to be in the comfort zone then that's good for you.
  • #3,726
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:13pm Jun 25, 2019 9:13pm
Quoting Pumi
{quote} Like I said, I am not starting a debate. We just have to look at things at both sides (positive and negative). If what I just shared is trash then it should be easy for you to put it in the bin. Someone else might see it differently and re-look at the information that George shared, with a different mindset. Ever asked yourself why some few are getting it? Perhaps by nature there has to be a 95% and 5%. If you are happy to be in the comfort zone then that's good for you.
I have tried, but its just water off a ducks back and we just go around in ever widening circles.

Green pips to you.
Some people say I'm lucky, but the more I practice the luckier I get
  • #3,727
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:26pm Jun 25, 2019 9:26pm
Quoting bishopdotun
Spikehunter Review Each new release gets better and better. Great job R4M. I overlay spikehunter on NIH98 TMA with the settings displayed {image} {image} If you agree with me, then you see that they are pretty much the same. But I do not entirely agree with the exits printed. The entries are almost the same but could be better. Consider the proposal below. If it's an overload, you may minimise the post. Entries & Exits {image} I marked my entries above. Works similar on M5 and M15 Long Entry - Wait for price to go below the blue outer band - Wait...
@bishopdotun -- thanks so much for your post and feedback. I couldn't ask for better.

You bring up many good points -- let me address a few, in no particular order. And please don't hesitate to repost the ones I don't address in this response.

In the latest release I chose to go with the centered TMA envelopes -- so, I'm glad to see they overlay nicely with @Nih98's indicator. You have interpolation set to 'false' since it's easier to see things using steps. I'm choosing to enable interpolation so the envelopes are rounded and continuous. Visually it may not be as appealing, but I think from a computational standpoint it's best to treat bands as curves rather than steps.

Regarding Exits -- excellent point -- I'm glad you brought it up. You are correct -- Entries look better than Exits. And there are reasons (plural) why.
a. Entries are really easy to detect, right? You don't need an indicator. The rule for detecting an Entry is if a spike pokes it's head above or below a band.
b. Exits are not so simple to detect -- in fact, I wouldn't even say they are detected. For SpikeHunter, I've chosen to use a momentum-type indicator to guesstimate (i.e. compute)an Exit.
c. For SpikeHunter I'm also using an Exit to protect the stop-loss. As a result, the Exit will leave pips on the table. Given the choice of going for as many pips as possible versus closing the trade the moment it looks like it is going against us, I've chosen the more conservative route.

Regarding better Entries -- I believe your markings come from fractals. The arrows on your chart are not drawn in real-time -- i.e. are not drawn at the current bar -- rather, they are drawn 3-5 afterwards. When reversal trading the window for entering trades is very narrow -- we don't have the luxury of waiting 3-5 bars for a fractal to form.

More on Exits -- I'm using a Stochatics + RVI (Relative Vigor Index) indicator that computes momentum. I think it works well for what we need it for. Also, its algebra is completely different than what is used to create the bands. Your suggestion uses bands for both Entry and Exit -- which is fine, except under conditions the bands get it wrong (like repainting) then both Entry and Exit are bad. Using different indicators that use different algebra but, in the end, work well together, seems like a more robust way to go. However, I don't have proof one way or another -- it's mostly my intuition.

Regarding StopLoss:

a. X% of Daily ATR distance above the open price for each trade
Yes, this is what is currently implemented

b. Or Last swing high on H4
I don't want to go the route of relying on multiple time frames. Plus, I have a feeling this might be dependent on which pair is currently being traded. Also, would you always use H4 even if the current chart is M15, M30, H1, H4? I mean, it might work -- but I would need to see some evidence as to why H4 is special.

c. Or No stop loss
Sorry -- no way.

d. Apply stop loss to each trade separately
Sorry -- no. I'm headed in the direction of an EA that does not require trader intervention. Each trade's stop loss is treated differently in the sense that a stoploss is applied as a %ADR offset from each trades open price.


@bishopdotun -- your post is one of the most helpful yet. If some of my responses come across a bit blunt I apologize -- it's not my intent. I'm rushing through some responses and my wife is calling me for dinner and my dog wants to go outside.

Please keep the feedback coming. The overall take home message I get from you is that things don't look so bad.

Again -- thank you. Regards,
Steve
  • #3,728
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:33pm Jun 25, 2019 9:33pm
Quoting Pumi
{quote} Does Steve share his coding (scripts)? And if no, why not?
@Pumi -- my last response to you. I give you my indicator / EA for free. You don't need the source code to use my software that I developed and give to you freely. Not only do you not need the source code, you wouldn't know what to do with it. The only reason why someone would ask for the source code is:

a. They want to improve on the software -- but you're not a programmer
b. They wish to steal the code and re-brand it as their own

Please go away. It's over. It's not your job to defend @George. He and the predators have done a tremendous disservice to many traders. There's no way you can make up for it all by yourself.

@George closed his project but reopened a new one with the predators. That's the thread where you belong -- not here.
  • #3,729
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:36pm Jun 25, 2019 9:36pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Tbf George can be more clearer with his explanations instead of his hint, hint, hint. His purpose is to help struggling traders whom by nature is not expected to understand those hints. Has he not considered how much he plans to share at the start of his thread that is sufficient to help his targeted group of traders ?
The thing is throughout our lives we had many different teachers who teach and convey the same information differently. You also have to adapt according to that teacher. Pay attention to Andy, Zoltan and Kevin's posts. Their style of conveying the message is different. They make it look simple.

There is absolutely nothing wrong to the way George conveys the message. He wants us to work, work and work so this knowledge can be deep rooted in our minds. He wants us to create our own template and not George's template. I liken George's way of sharing his knowledge like that of a lecturer at university (being lectured at varsity is different to being taught at high school).
  • #3,730
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:39pm Jun 25, 2019 9:39pm
Quoting robots4me
{quote} @Pumi -- my last response to you. I give you my indicator / EA for free. You don't need the source code to use my software that I developed and give to you freely. Not only do you not need the source code, you wouldn't know what to do with it. The only reason why someone would ask for the source code is: a. They want to improve on the software -- but you're not a programmer b. They wish to steal the code and re-brand it as their own Please go away. It's over. It's not your job to defend @George. He and the predators have done a tremendous...
No problem Steve. I will go away. I'm out!

PS: By the way I was a programmer (Pascal, C++, Java, you name it)
  • #3,731
  • Edited 10:13pm Jun 25, 2019 9:42pm | Edited 10:13pm
Quoting Pumi
{quote} The thing is throughout our lives we had many different teachers who teach and convey the same information differently. You also have to adapt according to that teacher. Pay attention to Andy, Zoltan and Kevin's posts. Their style of conveying the message is different. They make it look simple. There is absolutely nothing wrong to the way George conveys the message. He wants us to work, work and work so this knowledge can be deep rooted in our minds. He wants us to create our own template and not George's template. I liken George's way of...
His intended target group of struggling traders are not students for graduate program in forex trading. The style of presentation is a clear mismatch imo.

Tbh I am sure he reads these posts and hopefully for their sakes respond to take appropriate steps to remedy this situation.
  • #3,732
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:46pm Jun 25, 2019 9:46pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Tbf George can be clearer with his explanations instead of his hint, hint, hint. His purpose is to help struggling traders whom by nature is not expected to understand those hints. Has he not considered how much he plans to share at the start of his thread that is sufficient to help his targeted group of traders ? Has he not considered that since he is not willing to spend time typing text and post charts of his trades to seek other avenues to present his ideas other than skype sessions, like suggested podcast that was proposed earlier by...
@skyway -- I was about to respond to @LongBTC but I just have to say something.

Please stop with the passive / aggressive posts. You start many posts by first complimenting or acknowledging @George and his predators, followed by the point you wish to make. You must understand they are not interested in your point. You've repeated the same points many times. They will never address your points. All they see are the passive words at the beginning and that is seen as weakness and an opening to start things up again.

You're a nice fellow and it seems gentlemanly to first acknowledge the person you are responding to. It's not that they don't have eyes and ears -- they don't care!

Has @George or his predators ever acknowledged anything you've ever written? Of course not -- the predators can spot a passive / aggressive response from a mile away and will take advantage.

Case in point -- a couple of days ago @TimeTells wrote a very nice post and we all agreed to let things go. I acknowledged him and agreed to hold my tongue. Less than an hour later @George and the predators started a new thread solely for the purpose of mocking me and this thread. So much for reconciliation. They saw my acknowledgement of @TimeTells as a weakness and interpreted it to mean I was tired and wished for things to end. So, what do they do? They ratchet things up another level. You can never reconcile with a predator. These are bad actors and will always be bad actors.
  • #3,733
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:50pm Jun 25, 2019 9:50pm
Quoting robots4me
{quote} @skyway -- I was about to respond to @LongBTC but I just have to say something. Please stop with the passive / aggressive posts. You start many posts by first complimenting or acknowledging @George and his predators, followed by the point you wish to make. You must understand they are not interested in your point. You've repeated the same points many times. They will never address your points. All they see are the passive words at the beginning and that is seen as weakness and an opening to start things up again. You're a nice fellow and...
Lets just say I try very hard before I totally give up. Perhaps it's time to stop trying. I will delete my post in here not to clutter the main purpose of your thread. And thanks very much for allowing me to post them on here.
  • #3,734
  • Jun 25, 2019 9:52pm Jun 25, 2019 9:52pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Lets just say I try very hard before I totally give up. Perhaps it's time to stop trying. I will delete my post in here not to clutter the main purpose of your thread. And thanks very much for allowing me to post them on here.
@skyway -- wait -- please don't delete it. It leaves a paper trail and is all part of the journey.
  • #3,735
  • Jun 25, 2019 10:00pm Jun 25, 2019 10:00pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Lets just say I try very hard before I totally give up. Perhaps it's time to stop trying. I will delete my post in here not to clutter the main purpose of your thread. And thanks very much for allowing me to post them on here.
Quote
Lets just say I try very hard before I totally give up.
Yes -- I understand. You know I see a lot of myself in you. I can see the passive / aggressive tendencies -- that's what I do.

I don't want you to delete anything. For your own sake I'm suggesting you see them for what they are. They are not going to change. They don't even read your comments. This is not their first rodeo. I don't know about @George, but this is how @moodybot and @bluesteele have operated here at FF for many years. It's exactly how @parisboy described a number of posts back. Prior to @George they spent years trolling -- zero threads. They found a home with @George and took advantage.
  • #3,736
  • Jun 25, 2019 10:19pm Jun 25, 2019 10:19pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Coco the clown is me, you can be rest assured. Lets not look back at that again now your excellent work here has left that far behind. Not worth your time. Sidenote - apologise my earlier post left out LongBTC's excellent post from another angle.

Skyway, no need for apologies, you responded with a couple of very good questions for me to think about and to improve the accuracy of the trend reversal strategy we would all like to apply.
  • #3,737
  • Jun 25, 2019 10:33pm Jun 25, 2019 10:33pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Lets just say I try very hard before I totally give up. Perhaps it's time to stop trying. I will delete my post in here not to clutter the main purpose of your thread. And thanks very much for allowing me to post them on here.
dont give up mate i closed the thread to get back to trading like a pro but you never know it could reopen when i get bored
people leave, but this thread will go on for ever
  • #3,738
  • Jun 25, 2019 10:49pm Jun 25, 2019 10:49pm
Quoting robots4me
{quote}...b. Exits are not so simple to detect -- in fact, I wouldn't even say they are detected. For SpikeHunter, I've chosen to use a momentum-type indicator to guesstimate (i.e. compute)an Exit. c. For SpikeHunter I'm also using an Exit to protect the stop-loss. As a result, the Exit will leave pips on the table. Given the choice of going for as many pips as possible versus closing the trade the moment it looks like it is going against us, I've chosen the more conservative route.
Lets start with your executive choice for this version1 watch it's performance, then come back to this exit topic in later versions.
  • #3,739
  • Jun 25, 2019 11:09pm Jun 25, 2019 11:09pm
Quoting skyway
{quote} Lets start with your executive choice for this version1 watch it's performance, then come back to this exit topic in later versions.
@skyway -- now you're thinking like a programmer...
  • #3,740
  • Jun 25, 2019 11:35pm Jun 25, 2019 11:35pm
Quoting LongBTC
Hey Steve, First of all thanks for another update, it's inspiring to see someone who dedicates so much time to coding and learning how to trade. I feel like we are on the same page regarding the discipline that's needed to be able to succeed in Forex, we at least share the same passion and both put in a crazy amount of hours to make this all work. One thing I don't really agree on for the moment is the route we are going with the repainting bands. I very much understand that when we execute trades at this exact moment that we will get profitable...
Hey @LongBTC -- what can I say? You know I appreciate this.

Like @bishopdotun you bring up good points.

With regards to repainting bands...
It is not carved in stone which bands we use. As I've written previously, I am dubious about using repainting algorithms for trading. Since the thread was becoming unwieldy I decided it was time to "place a stake in the sand" and, so, decided to go with Centered TMA. It repaints, but the repainted results look nice. It would take me 30 seconds to edit the code to use a different envelope-type. I also use MT4 Strategy Tester a lot and, yes, repainting indicators are problematical. However, when we move on to the EA then repainting becomes secondary -- because an EA typically doesn't show all the markings like an indicator. When back testing an EA, all that matters is Entries (and Exits) at the current bar. So I suggest to hang tight until we can test the EA and determine one way or another whether repainting Centered TMA bands pose a problem. If they do, then I'll switch to a non-repainting envelope and we can test that as well.

With regards to the MM Detective indicator -- I do like it and have revisited it on multiple occasions to see how it could be incorporated. Yes -- sometimes it marks a reversal really well and other times the price doesn't retrace. I would be most pleased to be able to use it -- I mean, it would make SpikeHunter very unique. But I haven't found a way to distinguish between the true and false signals it generates. It sounds like you use a tight stoploss to "filter" the false positives. Also, how have you been Exiting? Based on your experience, I will take another look at using MM Detective.

Quote
I hope you don't mind me spitting my thoughts out and wanting to keep your attention on the indicators that you previously coded,
@LongBTC -- are you kidding? I am honored and flattered you spend time helping me / us. Thank you...
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